A Golfer's view of the Rugby World Cup

With the group stages of the Rugby world cup drawing to a close and we approach the sharp end of the tournament, I wonder how many people here are avidly following it

I know we have a rugby section here on V2 and it's pretty lively at the moment but I've noticed many golfers also seem to be keen on Rugby. I know at my club there are an awful lot of rugby fans and the big games get a large crowd to watch at the club - we even have a four nations weekend with matches between England Ireland Scotland and Wales

So who here is watching the RWC and who are we supporting?

I'm trying to work out my schedule for Saturday morning with the England/Scotland group decider at 8:30am and a tee-time at 11:10 - debating with myself whether I should watch the game at home, down the pub for breakfast or even have the (superior) breakfast at the club but then have perhaps an hour to kill before my tee-time!

I'm of the opinion it's a bit of a gay game. Can't see the appeal of forced male to male contact.

We have a dress down day on the last Friday of the month so I'm currently sat here in my Scotland tee shirt, getting all sorts of abuse from the locals.

One can only hope that I'll be the one with the big smile on my face tomorrow afternoon.....not holding out too much hope though.....

Oh dear s_r - you do seem to like to stir things up don't you?

To be honest I find rugby a pretty boring game, even though a friend is pro rugby league player i can't even stand going to watch him play and thats with free box seat tickets.

Just don't get the point of a game where you have to pass the ball backwards to go forwards! Queue everyone laying into Mav saying its a mans game etc.....

yeah, just stirring a bit Davie, but there are certain elements to the game which I deem utterley pointless.

For example the pointless balletic and always squint lineout and the squint scrum put in.

I haven't seen a straight throw or put in for years, so why bother having them.

I'd certainly agree with you about the squint scrum put-ins s_r but the lineouts seem to be fairly well policed these days (though the legalised lifting and supporting in the lineouts does seem a little strange)

The only match I have watched so far was the aussie v ireland game. I am not normally a rugger fan but that was a great sporting occasion whether you like the game or not. It seemed like the best possible atmosphere in the stadium.

It just seems however that the vast majority of the games are non starters. There are about 10 quality teams in world rugby, which you would not think is enough to hold a tournament in the format they do.

Even the better teams seem to produce bore fests these days, the game sacrificed watchability for muscle mass. It has never been a particularly skilful or difficult game so why make it worse?

I get up at all times of the night to watch F1 but even an 8.30 start on a Saturday is too early for a rugger march.

I agree with SR on this one plus I don't see the skill element of it and to me it's a private schoolboys game with a wannabe upper class fan following.

The problem with the RWC is that there are only a minute number of teams who play the game to a decent standard, so there are a lot of pointless games. Therefore calling it a World Cup lacks a bit of credibility.

Mac, you sleep in past 8:30 on a Saturday? I haven't slept that late in years.

I'm off in a medal at 8.52 thank god. I very quickly lose interest in team sports where my nation persistently punches (or even girlie slaps) well below it's weight.

Rugby is beginning to go the same way as football I.e. Money is ruining it.
Just happened to watch Stroke of genius last night (the Bobby Jones Story) and O.B. Keeler (Jones' biographer) said the same way back in 1930. Jones turned down millions by staying amateur and just playing for the love of the game. I honestly enjoyed rugby better when it was played by farmers, miners, lawyers, lorry drivers and policemen rather than the cloned specimens that play it now.

Don't think any game has changed so much in the past 30 years than Rugby, structurally, rules, pro/amateur, the whole spectacle.
Completely unrecognisable from the game I used to play (sometimes).

Love a bit of international rugby, hope we stuff the Scots on Saturday and send them home. When it comes down to home nations teams its gloves are off as far as Im concerned. A 12 point win for England and another final appearance...then probably a stuffing from the All Blacks unfortunately.

Incidentally, my 11:10 tee time on Saturday is with a couple of Scottish guys

super_realist wrote:The problem with the RWC is that there are only a minute number of teams who play the game to a decent standard, so there are a lot of pointless games. Therefore calling it a World Cup lacks a bit of credibility.
.

That is basically true for virtually any team sport in the world. Name some others high profile team sports that have a large number of countries that are on a relatively equal level at the top, bar football it just doesnt happen.

F1 diggers is actually quite equal, the team in 10th is probably less than 1% worse than a team at the top who are dominating.

Mac, F1 isn't a sport, it's an engineering competition, in any event it isn't competing nations.

I watch rugby union occasionally, but find it pretty frustrating viewing TBH ... although that's primarily down to being Scottish! If there was a championship for turning the ball over in promising positions then we'd be unbeatable!

Generally I find it way too stop, start ... a bit like Sky's golf coverage with the constant ad breaks. For the few matches I've been interested in watching, I've recorded them and done a x30 through the dross. You can watch a game in no time that way! I lose the will to live waiting for scrums to be taken properly. The Pool stages have very few decent match ups as well. Should be better from here on in though.

Don't hold out too much hope for us Scots tomorrow in all honesty, although here's hoping for a miracle.

All my office are big on Rugby one of them played for one of the big teams
youth set up.I watch it but could never play the game due to the rules.On your feet,off your feet,hands in,offsides,crossing.Seems to me the whole course of the match for two decent sides is decided by which side of bed the ref got out off.
Anyway 7.55 tee off tomorrow for a glorious mornings golf.lets go out and make some bogeys!

Im not to sure that golfers can really complain too much about another sport having daft rules and conventions.

super_realist wrote:Mac, F1 isn't a sport

It's motorsport.

McLaren wrote:...It has never been a particularly skilful or difficult game so why make it worse?

I hope that was a wind up. If not, you really are a plank, particularly in light of your recent postings re. intelligence in sport. Yes, there are some dullards with big physiques who play but they don't last long at the top or even, often, get there. Dolt.


I'm a big fan although with Sky acquiring most of the television rights and the advent of increasingly playbook rugby a la NFL, I'm finding I'm losing interest. Many of the modern players can't play what's actually happening in front of them and some can't even give or take a sympathetic pass. Idiotic rule changes/enforcement (i.e. squint scrum feeds and crooked lineouts etc) don't help either

As for the RWC, I'm watching occasional games mainly covering England's progress and I'll get up for some of the other big(gish) clashes. Should be more explosive match-ups in the KO phases to whet the appetite.

Mercurio wrote:It's motorsport.

No, it's a procession decided usually by management decisions and fast pit crews. Used to like F1 but loathe it these days. Give me Moto GP or Touring cars any day.

The thing about rugby is that:

1. On the whole it requires less skill when compared to most other sports (obviously this depends on your position / role - eg penalty takers require a lot of skill).

2. The best team on the day always wins. The attritional nature of the game means that the team that performs best wins. Upsets are therefore very rare, and only occur when an underdog team really performs above its level while the superior team plays poorly. This makes it too predictable.

The world cup only becomes interesting once the group stages are over.

Digs .I always feel that decisions in Rugby Union are often a matter of opinion rather than fact.3 points given away cos of opinion?

Dyna, as long as the opinion is consistent (which normally just comes down to northern or southern hemisphere reffing) then both teams should know wherte they stand really. And it usually is consistent, its rare that teams have a huge go at the ref after a big rugby match...unlike say with football where the refs are hammered by the managers after every game. You can equally say that the giving of a foul or a penalty is a matter of the refs opinion and its not an opinion the two managers will ever both agree with at the same time.

Fair comment.Not going to change anything having a moan and I get the impression the players try to get on the right side of the official.I will enjoy watching it when possible probably just do not understand the rules well enough.Incidentally my mates wife was Manu Tuilagi's art teacher and apparently whatever they were asked to draw/paint he would always manage to turn it into some rugby scene.Asked to paint a bowl of flowers and there was always a rugby match in the background.

Navy

If I wanted to I could perfect all the skills required for rugby, in fact I was quite good as a youth without even liking or taking the game seriously.

I could spend 8 hours a day with the best coaches in the world playing football, F1, golf, tennis etc and never get better than good. Passing and catching a ball is not difficult.

McLaren wrote:Navy

If I wanted to I could perfect all the skills required for rugby, in fact I was quite good as a youth without even liking or taking the game seriously.

I could spend 8 hours a day with the best coaches in the world playing football, F1, golf, tennis etc and never get better than good. Passing and catching a ball is not difficult.

So working with your theory, everyone who plays pro rugby should be as good as each other as they all train every week to perfect simple skills.
Which obviously leads to the next question....why are they not all of the same standard. How can players like Dan Carter be head and shoulders over say Toby Flood who is equally head and shoulders over the vast majority of other players?
Please enlighten us Mac.

Mac,
Is that the "thinking man's" view or just your instinct?
Think you're on pretty thin ice there.

Keen rugby fan here - I attend as many international, Heinenken and Magners League games as I can, although I'd rather play golf than spectate at any sport really. As previous posts would indicate, I support Ulster and Ireland.

We have an even mix of soccer and rugby fans at my club - it's a great place to be after a round when there is a rugby game on though.

We have a couple of ex-pat Scottish members... they take a bit of stick

I'm loathe to defend Mac here, but I think what he is saying is that the basic skills of Rugby are easier to pick up and learn than the fine hand-eye coordination of something like golf or tennis which require on a degree of natural talent.

Golf is played with a static ball, Id say it was way easier to learn than most other ball games. Its just a simple matter of practise and a repetitive stroke. The circumstances for each shot really dont change that much at all compared to other sports.
Try chipping a ball when you have 19 stone of back row forward about to squash you, Im sure it might instill a bit of panic.

So by your assumption Mac and bearing in mind i'm not a rugby fan but have friends who played tri-services and one of those now pro rugby league, your saying that if i learn to catch and throw a ball to a decent standard which I can already do i should be as good as any pro... You have excelled yourself this time my dear fellow.

I'd love nothing more to see you perfect these skills you say anyone can do at the required level then see my good friend Ben come running at you like a steam train my bet is you'd freeze on the spot and end up in A&E

Watch some of the games . Supporting Ireland so hope they can do well.

Wales v South Africa and Scots v Argies and Eng v Argies, Ire v aus were all
close and exciting games. So when the group stages are over , it should get
better as the tournament goes on.

Hopefully Ireland can beat Italy and go on but they are bad at being favourites.

If golf was so easy to learn why are the vast majority of people absolutely terrible at it?
I don't disagree that Rugby is a skillful sport though, I just think it's an easier sport in general to be good at.

As an aside, what do people think is the hardest sport in terms of technical ability?

Terrible is all relative, the vast majority of people are far from terrible compared to people who pick up a club for the first time or play once or twice a year. Also most people who are terrible dont practise and also dont ever have any lessons so its hardly a suprise that they will not improve past a certain standard, this will be true of any sport.
Again withing rugby there are huge differences in levels of ability so its patently obvious that you cannot just perfect the skill of catching and passing and be a brilliant player.

super_realist wrote:If golf was so easy to learn why are the vast majority of people absolutely terrible at it?
I don't disagree that Rugby is a skillful sport though, I just think it's an easier sport in general to be good at.

As an aside, what do people think is the hardest sport in terms of technical ability?

That would be a sport that combines two very different sports, that are in themselves difficult. So if one were to take say, hockey, and combine it with, for example, ice skating, you would create one monster of a difficult sport

EmmDee57 wrote:I agree with SR on this one plus I don't see the skill element of it and to me it's a private schoolboys game with a wannabe upper class fan following.

EmmDee - that might be the case with teams like Bath, but I can assure you if ever you've stood in 'The Shed' at Gloucester, it's very much a working man's game, because Glos is very much a working class city.

Must admit, a lot of the changes in the game seem to be to the detriment of entertainment; lifting in the lineout, constantly being off-side, big bruising blokes charging into eachother. A while back I watched that absolute classic All Blacks versus Barabarians game from the 70s, when the Welsh were in their pomp and you had the likes of David Duckham weaving his way through the NZ defence. Far more finesse in those days imho - and they all had full-time professions too

I am not sure I am on thin ice, there is no way anyone can argue that the basis skills for rugby are anywhere near as difficult or hard to master compared to those of most other sports.

This is not a dig at rugby unless people think sports need to be complex to be enjoyed. It does not even mean anyone could do it, as you would of course need to condition your body first for the game.

I played rugby for my school region, despite my less than rugby frame, and at the same time football to a similar level. I can assure people the skills on display on the football pitch far outstripped those on the rugger field.

Try a side step in rugby then a Renaldo chop with a football, i know which one is 100 times harder.

super_realist wrote:If golf was so easy to learn why are the vast majority of people absolutely terrible at it?
I don't disagree that Rugby is a skillful sport though, I just think it's an easier sport in general to be good at.

As an aside, what do people think is the hardest sport in terms of technical ability?

For precision and mental strain, I reckon snooker has got to be up there Super. At least with golf you have a chance to play your own ball - in snooker someone could fluke a red off the break and you don't even get out of your seat! You don't see many snooker players performing at the top level after they hit 40 either, whereas (as Darren Clark has shown recently) it's not beyond the realms for golfers to carry on competing well into their 40s and 50s

I guarantee that everyone would be a better first time rugby player than a first time golfer.







Bit of a sport for people not coordinated enough to play football and who like feeling each others testicles

navyblueshorts wrote:

Mercurio wrote:It's motorsport.

No, it's a procession decided usually by management decisions and fast pit crews. Used to like F1 but loathe it these days. Give me Moto GP or Touring cars any day.

It's still motorsport.

Mercurio wrote:

navyblueshorts wrote:

Mercurio wrote:It's motorsport.

No, it's a procession decided usually by management decisions and fast pit crews. Used to like F1 but loathe it these days. Give me Moto GP or Touring cars any day.

It's still motorsport.

and shagging is bedsport, but it's not a sport.

super_realist wrote:

Mercurio wrote:

navyblueshorts wrote:

Mercurio wrote:It's motorsport.

No, it's a procession decided usually by management decisions and fast pit crews. Used to like F1 but loathe it these days. Give me Moto GP or Touring cars any day.

It's still motorsport.

and shagging is bedsport, but it's not a sport.

How many beds shag?

F1 is a motorsport. The clue is in the name.

Yeah it's motorsport, but it's dreary and dismal.

super_realist wrote:Yeah it's motorsport, but it's dreary and dismal.

It doesn't matter what you think of it, it is a sport.

Hardest first time sports to learn or participate in that can be 2 very different things. Hard to get to grasp or hard to actually go through with and do.

Hard to pick up and play decently something like Darts and Snooker but i'd class them as games not sports. Tennis with the variety of shots and when to play them much like golf really.

the hardest sport for most to take up and participate in is Boxing or MMA, because it's one thing learning the moves and training hard enough to be an expert exponent it's another thing to enter the ring/octagon and actually do it though

Super

Most skilled sport is being an F1 driver.

Here is something to think about.

next time you are taking off in a plane try to pick a mark about 50 yards ahead of you, then imagine timing hitting the brake peddle just the right amount and then reducing your speed by 120 miles per hour in less than 50 meters and then trying to take a corner on the perfect line? Then you have to judge the throttle to perfection to ensure 750 hp is efficiently used to accelerate out the corner. Not to mention all the strategy to think about and things like tyre wear.

Then do that or harder 15 times a minute for 2 hours.

Mercurio wrote:

super_realist wrote:Yeah it's motorsport, but it's dreary and dismal.

It doesn't matter what you think of it, it is a sport.

Engineering competition first, sport a very distant second.

drive4show wrote:We have a dress down day on the last Friday of the month so I'm currently sat here in my Scotland tee shirt, getting all sorts of abuse from the locals.

One can only hope that I'll be the one with the big smile on my face tomorrow afternoon.....not holding out too much hope though.....

are you scottish too d4s, good man