Hensons inclusion - your thoughts please

There is already a Wales squad announcement thread elsewhere but the obvious name that is going to get people talking is the inclusion of Gavin Henson.

I was talking to Ian Gough about it on Twitter and he asked what the general reaction to it was.

AS opposed to turning the squad thread into a Henson debate, I thought I would single him out for discussion on here.

So I would like to know your thoughts on his inclusion and his playing career generally.

For me, I think he gets an unbelievably hard time - yes he has done a few reality shows but he isnt a rebel rouser so to speak. He has wasted a lot of his playing career but I would still have him in my squad. The Henson Haters (c) seem to be those who are jealous of his exposure. Its not his fault he gets picked. He got into the squad due to talent and although he has been injured over the last few years, his pre World Cup match where he sustained the wrist injury, was showing that he still has it.

Unfair to pick him over some talents but its about the strength of the squad and the versatility of the players in it. He ticks those boxes and deserves a chance to prove himself in my books.

So lets hear why I am wrong (or hopefully why I am right!). Henson ......discuss!

Who's Gavin Henson?

Building for the future,picking players on form & no Matthew Morgan

Nothing wrong with seeing how he does in training - he seemed to be doing fine until his injury.

You can't really judge his games with Blues as Dan Parks is useless at using his backs.

Pitty about Matthew Morgan - I'm sure if he keeps working on his tackling he'll get a call up in the Summer

He is a talented player and Wales need strength and depth to be as prominent as possible. I firmly believe that he will advance as player quicker with the Welsh Squad than with the Blues.

A rumour I posted earlier after chatting to a friend of mine in the shop, who is a physio at Llandarcy and now the Vale too is that Gatland thinks many players fitness has regressed dramatically post world cup, Gavin Henson was named as an example.

I have mixed feelings about it. There is a lot of rubbish spouted about Henson, including that he he has only done a couple of things like the Tait tackle. I think he is still likely to be able to bring something to the Wales midfield that no-one else around can. On the other hand, he is not being picked on current form, and it must feel like a bit of a slap in the face to younger players trying to break into the squad. It is a gamble; with that size of squad, in my book, probably one worth making, at least for now.

i am a fan of henson and it was for that reason that i would not have selected him for the wales squad. it would be more benificial to henson, and wales, if henson had a good run of regional games. with the blues sending 1/2p and roberts to wales henson would have had a great opportunity to build match fitness and play himslef into form.

i dont think he will get the same chace with wales, not during the 6n inanycase.

however, a stint with wales will help to smooth over any bad feeling there may have been towards him. maybe gats thinks it is better to re-familiarise some of the squad with the orange one, to ease him back into the team.

perhaps the best outcome for henson, and wales, would be for him to have a week with the squad in poland and to then be released back to the blues to get that run of game.

hopefully henson will be well in contention for a place in the summer tour squad.

i think wales could really benifit from an on form, fit and firing henson. the question is how do we manage this player. i hope gatland gets it right for wales' sake and for the prodigal son, henson's sake

munkian wrote:Nothing wrong with seeing how he does in training - he seemed to be doing fine until his injury.

You can't really judge his games with Blues as Dan Parks is useless at using his backs.

So what do you judge him on?
His games in France or his games for Saracens?

The fact is he has produced nothing onthe pitch in the last however many years it is now to suggest hes genuinley worth a regular club spot le alone a place in thae national side.

Hes very lucky that Gatland has loyalty and believes in players who produced the goods for him in the past. His opportunities were limited, but he did used to be a very good player and a text book modern center. Gatland knows what hes about, and knows the guy so you have to trust his judgement, just like when he isnsisted on having James Hook in his side whatever based on his play in the grandslam years before.

Henson has had his share of bad luck and problems. Some of its self inflicted, Adam Id take issue at your comments regarding his behaviour...theres been several unsavoury drink related incidents reported involving him. He may very well not have got this chance if Gatland wasnt still in charge and it was a coach who had never worked with him before. Certainly leaving him out would have been the easy option. Good on him for doing what was asked and coming home, keeping himslef fit and trying to play rugby and prove hes worth a spot. Comparing that to Ciprianis witterings that he should be in the England squad despite staying down under and its possibel to have some more psoitive feelings toward Henson.

Hes shown the attitude and the desire, he know needs to prove he can produce consistently good rugby on the pitch. Id be very suprissed if ( injuries pending) he gets a spot in any of the 6 nations games, but Gatland clearly wants to rehabilitate him as quickly as possible and have direct control over that. Its a lot of faith to put in a player with psychological and injury issues, but Gatland has a reasonable track record with calculated gambles in recent times.

Adam D Henson gets a lot of stick because of the hype surrounding him. He is a very controversial figure. Seen as a god by Welsh fans, by the rest of us a talented but hugely flawed individual whose hype outweighs his ability.

You are highly naive if you think it is simply jealousy. When at Saracens he didn't have the tact to learn his team mates' first names. Could only name two or three. Threw his toys out of the pram when asked to play at 13. Shown up by Owen Farrell.

Henson has been picked for the Welsh squad because of the player he was over 3 years ago. The Welsh public and Gatland are hoping he will find his old form and some consistency. Picking a player on past glories and hype is not a smart way to go in my opinion.

It is disrespectful to other players. It essentially sends out the message that if you are well known you will waltz back into the Welsh squad irrespective of form and consistency.

Henson's attitude is not good. Cardiff Blues is Henson's 4th club in two years and even then he can barely string games together.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/8474742/Courting-controversy-Gavin-Hensons-highs-and-lows-on-and-off-the-field.html


If Wales want to pin all their hopes and dreams on tango man - good luck with that.

Since when has Henson been seen as God by Welsh fans?! by some sure, but not by many.

Henson has poor attitude, and he gets himself into too many difficult situations via drinking too much. His main problem, is that he doesn't learn from any of it. He just makes the same mistakes over and over.

Personally I wouldn't have him in the squad, for all his talent, he hasn't played enough or at a high enough standard for me. For other players playing week in, week out and really applying themselves, this selection of Henson must be a huge smack in the face.

Glad he is in there.

That means Scotland can get Shinglers Qualification sorted before Wales try to cap him at snr Level.

What talent? When has he ever done anything?

Think most posters here are missing a trick. With Gav in the squad it means you can have him on the billboards advertising the competition. Ergo guaranteed ticket sales to the reality tv brigade. Very savvy!

I'd have picked him for the extended squad. Gives Gatland the chance to test him in Poland and get his fitness up to scratch.

He isn't going to start in the Wales XV, but I can't think of anyone particularly good who has missed out at centre. Worth having a look at Henson I reckon. Gatland can always cut him from the main squad if he doesn't like what he sees.

Carpe Diem wrote:Think most posters here are missing a trick. With Gav in the squad it means you can have him on the billboards advertising the competition. Ergo guaranteed ticket sales to the reality tv brigade. Very savvy!

I wonder if we'll get sponsorship money from Tango and Orange Mobiles for promoting them during the 6Ns...

rugbydreamer wrote:Since when has Henson been seen as God by Welsh fans?! by some sure, but not by many.

Henson has poor attitude, and he gets himself into too many difficult situations via drinking too much. His main problem, is that he doesn't learn from any of it. He just makes the same mistakes over and over.

Personally I wouldn't have him in the squad, for all his talent, he hasn't played enough or at a high enough standard for me. For other players playing week in, week out and really applying themselves, this selection of Henson must be a huge smack in the face.

+1.

The Welsh squad behaved impeccably and their spirit was fantastic at the RWC. It was clear to see - on the field and off it. Gatlands taking them away from the media glare and isolating them in a freezer in Poland - worked. Henson is divisive. He has a natural propensity to screw-up. Im surprised that Gatland is risking all that now.

Its also - as Dreamer says, a slap in the face for all that young Welsh talent coming through.

I don't think he's ready for the 6N's and would hate for someone like Beck to miss out for Henson now - but looking at the training squad nobody has really missed out because Henson has been included and it will be a good chance for Gats to see how Henson can handle 2 weeks of gruelling training before deciding whether he's upto scratch or not.

Best case IMO like dogtooth says is for Henson to go to the training camp, get his fitness and physicality up, then come back to the Blues play regularly at centre in place of Roberts (or Halfpenny or Parks) against teams missing their internationals and string a good load of games together and he should then be ready for the Summer Internationals, by that time he should also be up to speed enough to have had a few cracks at OH as well as centre.

Quiet day. Visitor numbers were down, and the snakey old founder pops up with a Henson thread. I feel like such a sheep for even clicking on it.

Gibson wrote:

rugbydreamer wrote:Since when has Henson been seen as God by Welsh fans?! by some sure, but not by many.

Henson has poor attitude, and he gets himself into too many difficult situations via drinking too much. His main problem, is that he doesn't learn from any of it. He just makes the same mistakes over and over.

Personally I wouldn't have him in the squad, for all his talent, he hasn't played enough or at a high enough standard for me. For other players playing week in, week out and really applying themselves, this selection of Henson must be a huge smack in the face.

+1.

The Welsh squad behaved impeccably and their spirit was fantastic at the RWC. It was clear to see - on the field and off it. Gatlands taking them away from the media glare and isolating them in a freezer in Poland - worked. Henson is divisive. He has a natural propensity to screw-up. Im surprised that Gatland is risking all that now.

Its also - as Dreamer says, a slap in the face for all that young Welsh talent coming through.

I am not surprised he's taking him and I don't think its that big a slap in the face BUT I don't think the management will take any of his crap. If his heads in the right place he still has the ability, if its not then he will be foubd out in Poland.

Henson doesn't drink a lot hes just really really thick
He's too professional and cares too much about his body to be a heavy drinker.

Regarding him being selected. I don't mind it, he's a good player and i want the best players to be selected for Wales. Im not sure if now is the right time though. He's usually at his best after a solid 2 months or so of continuous rugby, i would have thought him playing with the Blues then being selected for the summer tour would have been the best pathway for him but Gatland knows his stuff so we'll see.
He's never had problems with Gatland or when he's been involved with the Welsh squad and coaches who have coached him repeatedly say that he's one of the most professional players they've encountered so no problems there.
All he needs is an injury free run and a coach that has confidence in his ability (Lyn Jones, Gatland) and he'll be fine.

go,

You're spot on with regards to coahces. Lyn Jones is the only Regional coach to have gotten anything out of Henson and likewsie Gatland in 05

Hmmmm. I am disappointed, but we all knew Gatland would pick him.
However like many on here I am hoping the guy is back to his best, (except against england) because he can play some truly beautiful rugby.

Think he'll go on the training camp but not make the final cut - assuming he does well at the camp he'll be told to go and get some game time and out himself into contention for the summer tour.

More impressed by the call up for Lou Reed - looking forward to "Gatland Takes Walk on the Wild Side", "Welshman in Furs", "Red light/red heat", "Perfect Day (for Wales)", "Vicious Wales", etc

Irish Londoner wrote:
More impressed by the call up for Lou Reed - looking forward to "Gatland Takes Walk on the Wild Side", "Welshman in Furs", "Red light/red heat", "Perfect Day (for Wales)", "Vicious Wales", etc

Classic - I really hope that choice doesn't mean the team are going (velvet) underground (we need a facepalm for cracks like that...)

bedfordwelsh wrote:go,

You're spot on with regards to coahces. Lyn Jones is the only Regional coach to have gotten anything out of Henson and likewsie Gatland in 05

Surely you mean Ruddock in 05 or Gats 08

Lyn Jones for the Ospreys from 05 to 08

Gats in 08 and Ruddock in 05 for Wales

I would not of thought that Henson was match fit enough to warrant a place in the national squad.

I guess like many folks on here it was a certanty that Gatland would pick at the first opportunity.

Does he deserve it? who knows? Gatland has every respect for him. If he shows well in poland then he may well get a chance to play in the 6ns, maybe not a starting role but coming off the bench.

But also like many on here i would of thought that Henson would have been better staying with the Blues, and getting some much neededgame time.

majesticimperialman wrote:I would not of thought that Henson was match fit enough to warrant a place in the national squad.

I guess like many folks on here it was a certanty that Gatland would pick at the first opportunity.

Does he deserve it? who knows? Gatland has every respect for him. If he shows well in poland then he may well get a chance to play in the 6ns, maybe not a starting role but coming off the bench.

But also like many on here i would of thought that Henson would have been better staying with the Blues, and getting some much neededgame time.

You're forgetting Madge, that Henson has pictures of the WRU board members playing naked golf with Satan, using this leverage he's able to be continually re-selected for the national squad whenever he's not on a celebrity reality TV programme or busy with a reality TV star.

Gatland loves him, maybe the chance to coach a great side wasn't the only reason he left his wife and kids behind in NZ

Knowsit17 wrote:Gatland loves him, maybe the chance to coach a great side wasn't the only reason he left his wife and kids behind in NZ

libelous

Gibson wrote:

rugbydreamer wrote:Since when has Henson been seen as God by Welsh fans?! by some sure, but not by many.

Henson has poor attitude, and he gets himself into too many difficult situations via drinking too much. His main problem, is that he doesn't learn from any of it. He just makes the same mistakes over and over.

Personally I wouldn't have him in the squad, for all his talent, he hasn't played enough or at a high enough standard for me. For other players playing week in, week out and really applying themselves, this selection of Henson must be a huge smack in the face.

+1.

The Welsh squad behaved impeccably and their spirit was fantastic at the RWC. It was clear to see - on the field and off it. Gatlands taking them away from the media glare and isolating them in a freezer in Poland - worked. Henson is divisive. He has a natural propensity to screw-up. Im surprised that Gatland is risking all that now.

Its also - as Dreamer says, a slap in the face for all that young Welsh talent coming through.

Henson was there for at least one of the Spala trips though. I wouldn't say he was divisive really. Jason Tovey spoke pretty highly of him.

As an aside, who would people have picked over him?

Madge, the chances are he and the other squad members will get more realistic match fitness from training with Wales than playing in the Magners or LV cup.

I would certaintly take him to Poland. What do we lose by it? He'll be in a professional environment where the players won't drink again (I expect) and if he doesn't show up well fitness wise etc, then he won't play. He had to go though.

Gibson wrote:

rugbydreamer wrote:Since when has Henson been seen as God by Welsh fans?! by some sure, but not by many.

Henson has poor attitude, and he gets himself into too many difficult situations via drinking too much. His main problem, is that he doesn't learn from any of it. He just makes the same mistakes over and over.

Personally I wouldn't have him in the squad, for all his talent, he hasn't played enough or at a high enough standard for me. For other players playing week in, week out and really applying themselves, this selection of Henson must be a huge smack in the face.

+1.

The Welsh squad behaved impeccably and their spirit was fantastic at the RWC. It was clear to see - on the field and off it. Gatlands taking them away from the media glare and isolating them in a freezer in Poland - worked. Henson is divisive. He has a natural propensity to screw-up. Im surprised that Gatland is risking all that now.

Its also - as Dreamer says, a slap in the face for all that young Welsh talent coming through.

Agree 100%

Happy he is involved with training he is a real asset to Wales,so glad to see Rhys Gill and Mitchell in the squad and not Scott Andrews.
Very impressed with the pack over all some real good ball carriers.

Strange not to see Steven Jones, Shane Williams and Martyn Williams in a Wales six nations squad.

Off the top of my head players of note missing Alyn Wyn, Charteris,Morgan Stoddard,Josh Turnbull , LLoyd Burns and Hibbard, with around a dozen of standard but okay players along the lines of Biggar,Brew etc.. not been selected.
Over all Wales depth looking stronger by each season.

How is it a slap in the face for the young Welsh centres? the only young Welsh centre who has played consistently well is Beck and he has been selected,
with the other two fantastic Welsh centres Roberts and Davies being te obvious forst choice for Wales anyway.

who says Henson has gone as a centre, view?

Smirnoffpriest wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:go,

You're spot on with regards to coahces. Lyn Jones is the only Regional coach to have gotten anything out of Henson and likewsie Gatland in 05

Surely you mean Ruddock in 05 or Gats 08

I do

I am guessing Hook and Priestland are the 10s what with no Biggar or Jones.

With Byrne, Williams and the Xvs, though I would still have Halfpenny as first choice.

If Henson plays then I hope its at centre, certainly not XV and definately not 10

maestegmafia wrote:He is a talented player and Wales need strength and depth to be as prominent as possible. I firmly believe that he will advance as player quicker with the Welsh Squad than with the Blues.

A rumour I posted earlier after chatting to a friend of mine in the shop, who is a physio at Llandarcy and now the Vale too is that Gatland thinks many players fitness has regressed dramatically post world cup, Gavin Henson was named as an example.

An interesting issue for the Welsh. Was the Polish prep chamber a short term gain for the RWC but has it had the effect of wearing down the players bodies sooner in the season?

Jim Henson created The Muppets but Gavin Henson has allowed Jim's work to live on after his death. I say on with the show and let´s include the Fanta Menace in the squad. In these dark times, we all need a laugh.

pack the fake tan?

For me Henson does not deserve a place in the squad on current form. He has apparently been dropped for Cardiff's next HC match in favour of Gavin Evans who gives "100% work rate" according to Cardiff's coach.That sounds to me a dig at Henson's own work rate/ motivation.
However I am delighted he is in the training squad. It gives all concerned an opportunity to test Henson's resolve. Does Henson really have the desire to play at a world class level again (he hasn't since 2008) ? How committed is he to Cardiff Blues and Wales? Does he still have what it takes? We may find out the answers in the next few weeks.

The argument that he is divisive member of the squad is speculative at best, I'll go with Gatland's judgement thanks.
How on earth is his selection a slap in the face to these unnamed up and coming players who play so well week in week out? Who are they? This is a training squad, Gatland could name any number of players plus Henson.

Messy,

Pretty much spot on really. By all accounts the last Poland camp wasn't for the faint hearted so it may well 'make or break' him.

If he comes through it and comes through it well then I have no doubt Gatland will pick him but if he can't hack it then I just hope Gatland has the minerals to cut him from the squad.

drinking too much? charlotte says gavs problem is he cant handle it (unlike her! ) two pints and he's wasted.

poor attitude? lyn jones says gav was 'the best reader of the game and the most knowledgeable player he had worked with' his attitude is poor with players who treat training and fitness as a pain and something you put up with rather than a necessity.

waltzing into the squad? he's been picked, would you say NO !

not learning players names( what sh.t is that !) from what i heard he's just ok with everyone , but knows he has to keep his mouth shut with other players or he'll be quoted in the press.

LETS FACE IT, THE GUYS GOT IT, I HOPE HE MAKES IT THROUGH TO THE 6NS
GO GAV !

fancy hook is back! he's played less than gav lately

bedfordwelsh wrote:Messy,

Pretty much spot on really. By all accounts the last Poland camp wasn't for the faint hearted so it may well 'make or break' him.

If he comes through it and comes through it well then I have no doubt Gatland will pick him but if he can't hack it then I just hope Gatland has the minerals to cut him from the squad.

Henson did pretty well in the last Poland camp, apparently, and got a start against England prior to the world cup. For me the odds are stacked against him now. The world cup is a long way ahead. I don't think Henson has it in him to follow long term goals. I hope I am wrong as I would love to see him play for Wales and the Lions again.
I think Gatland has all the 'minerals' he needs to drop Henson. If he does, I doubt Henson will be a professional rugby next season, at least outside of Japan!

Look its a win win situation for me.

1) Once fit there is no doubting that he is one of the best centres around and offers us versatility at the back. He played half an hour against England in a warm up and many including myself believed that on that performance alone he warranted a place at the WC.

2) If he regains his fitness and shows the coaches form that he showed pre '09, then Wales have one of their best centres back in form going into the six nations, one that could do the O'driscoll role that we saw on the Lions tour with Roberts. That though, coming off the bench, as for me, Jon Davies and Roberts make an excellent pairing

3) Coaches decide to get involved in the squad set up again, get him up to test match fitness, release him and let him play week in-week out at 12 for the Blues whilst other Internationals are away, then include him for the big tour down under in June I believe

At the end of the day the guy get's allot of stick for doing his reality stuff. The guy was down after injury after injury and wanted to make some decent money whilst letting his body recover. I don't have a problem with that. He's back playing Rugby and that's the main thing. Blue would be mad to not include him for the Racing game, a game in which they need tries so why would they bring in Gavin Evans, who does a decent job, but isn't going produce something special, which is what the Blues need. I say good luck to the lad, and hopefully we see him play the rugby we know he can, get to full fitness and stay injury free.

On balance,when you consider England have persevered with Tindall who likes a drop and is as mobile as a lamppost and invest hopes in a South Sea Islander who jumps off ferries when in his cups,perhaps Mr Tango can see off the local opposition.

Adam D wrote:There is already a Wales squad announcement thread elsewhere but the obvious name that is going to get people talking is the inclusion of Gavin Henson.

I was talking to Ian Gough about it on Twitter and he asked what the general reaction to it was.

AS opposed to turning the squad thread into a Henson debate, I thought I would single him out for discussion on here.

So I would like to know your thoughts on his inclusion and his playing career generally.

For me, I think he gets an unbelievably hard time - yes he has done a few reality shows but he isnt a rebel rouser so to speak. He has wasted a lot of his playing career but I would still have him in my squad. The Henson Haters (c) seem to be those who are jealous of his exposure. Its not his fault he gets picked. He got into the squad due to talent and although he has been injured over the last few years, his pre World Cup match where he sustained the wrist injury, was showing that he still has it.

Unfair to pick him over some talents but its about the strength of the squad and the versatility of the players in it. He ticks those boxes and deserves a chance to prove himself in my books.

So lets hear why I am wrong (or hopefully why I am right!). Henson ......discuss!

I was excited when I heard Henson had moved to the Blues and I thought he a very good debut, however since then he has played less than average, certainly was at fault at FB for a soft try recently against the Ospreys (if I recall)

So for me I would agree with the likes of Emyr Lewis who think that on form Henson should not be selected ............ others who should feel agrieved with Hensons inclusion

15. Barry Davies - Ospreys - Some excellent games this season
13. Adam Warren - Scarlets 4 tries in 4 games (Edinburgh, Cardiff Blues, Ulster, and played well again Leicester)
12. Hughes - NGD - bags of potential
10 Biggar - Ospreys

So unfortunately like Hook (who didnt play at all against NGD) there are better players out there at the moment

Gatlands Law is still in operation

Gatland's law...so he doesn't just pick on form he picks on potential and class...and GH has both. He can turn a game, offer a moment of sublimity. Gethin is a case in point, having not played for the entire season Gatts kept the faith and was re paid in spades. Now i am not comparing Geth with Gavin as i feel Geth is World class and Gav could have been but isn't, but it shows you how he thinks.