Frank Warren on Cleverly

First topic message reminder :

https://www.youtube.com/frankwarren#p/u/1/rx523ciHsDs

Listen to 8:00 to 12:00

While none of us exactly trust Frank it is true what he says about the mentality of some peoples attitude towards Nathan who has held the WBO Title just over a year yet everyone expects world domination straight away other than that you are just a stay at home bum bla bla


Regards

Steffan

Any of Dawson, Hopkins, Cloud, Pascal, Diaconu, Shumenov or Sillakh would be a good start rather than Karpency or Bellew.

total garbage from warren, and the fact that hes defending cleverlys fights suggests there are plenty more of the same to come.
only been champion for a year?? i guess having a fight against a world class operator is far too much to ask.

Even someone like Erdei, Campillo or Mack would be a huge step up from his recent opposition.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Any of Dawson, Hopkins, Cloud, Pascal, Diaconu, Shumenov or Sillakh. Erdei, Campillo or Mack

Ok il note that if one of them gets arranged this year

Steffan wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Any of Dawson, Hopkins, Cloud, Pascal, Diaconu, Shumenov or Sillakh. Erdei, Campillo or Mack

Ok il note that if one of them gets arranged this year

I'm very realistic about situations Steffan so realise that the Americans do have bigger fish to fry where a fight with Cleverly offers them nothing which means any fight with a world ranked contender is legitimate.

Shut you up hasn't it....

Nazario vs Whittaker...
Minter vs Hagler
Braddock v Louis

but Cleverly has only been champion a year!!!

This is 2012 and it's crazy!!!!

Well Warren said he wants the next fight in June in the Cardiff City Stadium

Lets see who he can get for this one

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Shut you up hasn't it....

Such aggression tut tut...

be a couple more easy fights, whilst warren tries to give enzo a couple of wins, then that will be the big showdown for nathan. then another couple of easy fights, then another homecoming. maybe in two years he will fight a top contender

Not aggressive...Just a little tired of you not rebutting posts...

You are so so childish for a University student...

You make unsubstantiated statements and when you get owned resort to tedious..

Hit and run......

Parkey-Holyfield..........
Tucker-Tyson
Ramirez - Camacho
Maussa - Hatton
Douglas - Holyfield
Bruno - Tyson........etc etc................

"Clev has only been champ a year".......

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:You are so so childish for a University student...

Are you serious? They way some of them act after a few beers I am like a pillar of society in comparison

Amongst all drinking, drugs, 'casual-mixing' etc that goes on I think a bit of 'Trussing' on 606 is hardly the worst thing a student can do

Nothing wrong with any of that Steffan, the best part of Uni life.

I went to University in a foreign Country and was pretty much engaged to be married.....

Why I'm such a paragon of value!!!

Mate do "Trussing" by all means but If you're going to look for debate...

try debating!! You'll like it!!

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Nothing wrong with any of that Steffan, the best part of Uni life.

I know. Problem is I went to Uni at 30 so there isnt anything that lot do that I havnt done already anyway

I can still wreck them all on the beer and spirits though. Drink tolerance is build up over many years

You've just made me feel better...

If you're 30 then I'm 21!!!

Steffan wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Nothing wrong with any of that Steffan, the best part of Uni life.

I know. Problem is I went to Uni at 30 so there isnt anything that lot do that I havnt done already anyway

I can still wreck them all on the beer and spirits though. Drink tolerance is build up over many years

I was a wee nipper when I went, best years of my life.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:You've just made me feel better...

If you're 30 then I'm 21!!!

Im not 30 though sorry

Im 31

What made you study archaeology anyway...No money in that!!

Were you stuck between a "rock" and a "hard place"!!

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:What made you study archaeology anyway...No money in that!!

Were you stuck between a "rock" and a "hard place"!!

I studied history years ago but never went to Uni so while during this economic situation decided to go back now while jobs are poor and im still young enough. History on its own is a bit too general so decided to to something with a bit more speciality hence archaeology came in

Agree not much money in it but work in Wales and the rest of UK is pretty good in this sector

Money has never been much of an objective ever since I did a sales job where I was earning more money than I could spend but hated every minute of the job

I did a sales job......

Those street-corners get cold in Winter??

still you've got plenty of old-fossils on here..to study!

I would have no trouble with him if he said I have a way to go, but we keep hearing about how he's ready for Hopkins or Dawson or Froch and then fights a nobody. If they were honest and say he is still wet behind the ears, I would have more respect for him

It's boxing which is to blame rather than Cleverly, in my opinion.

Before we had 108 variants of a world title in 109 weight classes, British and European titles actually meant something. Nowadays, by comparison, they have no currency value whatsoever.

Had Cleverly - or any other young prospect - been operating a few years ago he would have been able to follow the tried and tested route of British and Commonwealth title, European title, and then get a shot at the big one. Nowadays a young prospect can't afford to follow this route because he will be left behind. Only 'world' titles matter.

Cleverly absolutely is not a proven world 'champion' yet. Maybe he will, eventually, prove himself the man in the division, but in the meantime he needs to develop, learn and mature.

I really don't see how he can be blamed for the silly scenario whereby he does so while, ostensibly, being a 'world' champion.

HumanWindmill wrote:
Cleverly absolutely is not a proven world 'champion' yet. Maybe he will, eventually, prove himself the man in the division, but in the meantime he needs to develop, learn and mature.

I really don't see how he can be blamed for the silly scenario whereby he does so while, ostensibly, being a 'world' champion.

Totally agree and this is the point I was trying to make Windy that Clev does need a few more fights before he hits the big stage and that its not really his fault that he holds the WBO belt as naturally he wants to progress and still has to do what his promoter says to a certain extent but in came Truss with his usual:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Why isn't it his fault??????

Didn't have to pick up a world title he wasn't ready for!!

Listen to yourself!!!!

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:I've written to Warren asking him If I can have a WBO title strap (money is no object)...

and I'm not ready for it either!!

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Maussa gets Hatton 1st up............
Nazario gets Pernell Whittaker first up........
Parkey gets Holyfield first up.........
Ramirez gets camacho 1st up...........
Braddock gets Louis first up..........


But hey Cleverly has only been champ for a year!!

If that's the case you then can't call him britains only world champion.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:If that's the case you then can't call him britains only world champion.

But he is Britains only world champion. Thats the irony Windy was trying to point out

If you wish to call him a world champion then he should facing the best, can't have it both ways.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:If you wish to call him a world champion then he should facing the best, can't have it both ways.

There is only one champion in any weight class for me. And thats The Ring champion

Steffan wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:If you wish to call him a world champion then he should facing the best, can't have it both ways.

There is only one champion in any weight class for me. And thats The Ring champion

In which case Britain has no world champions then.

Some fighters are Warren fighters and some are fighters with a great love of the game..it's history and want a place in it...

Hatton wanted a legacy and should be applauded for leaving FW...

End of the day it's down to Cleverly..He stays and it's bum of the month....or he goes and tries to find a legacy...

Either way Warren can only pull wool over non-Boxing fans eyes..

We all know what he's about!!

That a little unfair Alma - Steffan can't stop talking about Froch and he's as english as they come.

Steffan biased!! No never..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Not aggressive...Just a little tired of you not rebutting posts...

You are so so childish for a University student...

You make unsubstantiated statements and when you get owned resort to tedious..

Hit and run......

Parkey-Holyfield..........
Tucker-Tyson
Ramirez - Camacho
Maussa - Hatton
Douglas - Holyfield
Bruno - Tyson........etc etc................

"Clev has only been champ a year".......

In fairness though Truss a lot of the fights mentioned would have been wanted by both fighters and would generate both fighters a lot of money.

Most of the top US fighters wouldn't want to take a fight against Clev in Wales, Clev wouldn't be a big enough name in the US to be the headliner (which he is here).

A fight in the US would have to be on the US fighters terms regardless of the fact Clev has a strap.

Clev needs to up his level of opposition, I'm in complete agreement with that. However in order to get a fight against the bigger names on what would be better terms he would need to pad his record a little and get a couple of faded US names on that record.

Yes it devalues the title but the alternative is that it devalues the earning potential of the champion if he has to make so many sacrifices in order to get a fight made that he would probably lose a close fight against a hometown hero.

huw wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Not aggressive...Just a little tired of you not rebutting posts...

You are so so childish for a University student...

You make unsubstantiated statements and when you get owned resort to tedious..

Hit and run......

Parkey-Holyfield..........
Tucker-Tyson
Ramirez - Camacho
Maussa - Hatton
Douglas - Holyfield
Bruno - Tyson........etc etc................

"Clev has only been champ a year".......

In fairness though Truss a lot of the fights mentioned would have been wanted by both fighters and would generate both fighters a lot of money.

Most of the top US fighters wouldn't want to take a fight against Clev in Wales, Clev wouldn't be a big enough name in the US to be the headliner (which he is here).

A fight in the US would have to be on the US fighters terms regardless of the fact Clev has a strap.

Clev needs to up his level of opposition, I'm in complete agreement with that. However in order to get a fight against the bigger names on what would be better terms he would need to pad his record a little and get a couple of faded US names on that record.

Yes it devalues the title but the alternative is that it devalues the earning potential of the champion if he has to make so many sacrifices in order to get a fight made that he would probably lose a close fight against a hometown hero.

Really is no excuse for this fight, although a Calzaghe esque 'domination' is what I expect.

I know boxrec has its flaws, but these British fighters are ahead of him in the world rankings...

Enzo Mac
Bellew
Mcintosh
Dodson
Ajisafe
Mckenzie
Jeffries

Some boy this Karpency.

Yup, think boxrec have him somewhere near 80th, which is appalling really... He has done ABSOLUTELY, ABSOLUTELY, ABSOLUTELY nothing to even think about a title shot. Quite literally, appalling.

He's made for Clev to knock out, which he most probably will, to be honest, even though Clev is apparently our only world Champion on these shores right now, I don't think I'll be bothering to tune in.

There is an advert for the fight in the current boxing news, Karpency is not even mentioned on the advert! Kind of suggests even Warren realises this is beyond the pale.

I've just noticed that he hasn't fought for a year as well, even though he won that fight with a first round knockout. This can't bold well and does make any talk of Cleverley stepping up in class sound a bit ridiculous. Time to move away from Warren to find some decent opposition

AlexHuckerby wrote:Clev is apparently our only world Champion on these shores right now, I don't think I'll be bothering to tune in.

Well it involves boxing so why should you be interested...

Because maybe he has principles............

Problem here is the Bellew fight....It was only made bec ause he and everybody else thought Clev wins easily...

I scored it a draw..........

Warren had to reassess Clev's future after he was exposed as being ordinary..

Which unfortunately he is.......

The bright side for Warren is that there are plenty of Steffan types about..who'd pay a subscription to see Clev defend against a gym punchbag..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:The bright side for Warren is that there are plenty of Steffan types about..who'd pay a subscription to see Clev defend against a gym punchbag..

I have no subscription to Boxnation though

Steffan wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:The bright side for Warren is that there are plenty of Steffan types about..who'd pay a subscription to see Clev defend against a gym punchbag..

I have no subscription to Boxnation though

You're going though Steffan so have hardly disproven his point, quite the opposite really.

Don't see why boxnation gets such a hard time. It shows some decent fights, like the Mathews one, and shows alot more up and coming fighters. £10 a month to watch 8 or 9 fights a month? Bargin imo.

Anyway, people having a go at Clev, would you be moaning if Hatton or Lewis did this? Not sure how the Bellew fight made him look ordinary either, Bellew is not slouch and has a very good boxing brain, I have no doubts he'll get a world title.

rowley wrote:

Steffan wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:The bright side for Warren is that there are plenty of Steffan types about..who'd pay a subscription to see Clev defend against a gym punchbag..

I have no subscription to Boxnation though

You're going though Steffan so have hardly disproven his point, quite the opposite really.

Paying £10 a month for a rubbish channel is totally different

I appreciate you think its wrong me going to watch live boxing with my brother (its the same week as my birthday as well) and then having a few beers afterwards

Maybe where you come from watching the sport you love with a mate/family member is frowned upon but here its quite normal

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Warren had to reassess Clev's future after he was exposed as being ordinary..

Which unfortunately he is.......

You could just as easily say that it proved Bellew was far better than we thought, rather than Cleverly is ordinary.

Made him look ordinary..because Bellew is ordinary.........

If I just wanted to watch fights I'd sit in my car outside the blue oyster at throwing out time.....(My Mrs can be aggressive when she's had a drink)

No I like fights to mean something.....

Have you seen enough of Bellew to say he's ordinary though Truss? You don't win 3 ABA titles by being ordinary imo.

Todd Foster fought in the Seoul Olympics...........

I have no problem at all with you going Steffan, what you do with your money is very much your business. However think the point Truss was making was for as long as there are enough people willing to shell out, be it on tickets or boxnation subscriptions for fights like this he is hardly likely to risk Clev with something more challenging, my point was and remains that by attending you come closer to proving his point than disproving it.

hampo171 wrote:Don't see why boxnation gets such a hard time. It shows some decent fights, like the Mathews one, and shows alot more up and coming fighters. £10 a month to watch 8 or 9 fights a month? Bargin imo.

It gets a hard time as it marginalises the sport even more, at a time when it doesn't need much help shooting itself in the foot. The money and quality of fights is irrelevant to the long term health of the sport of which Boxnation is detrimental. By your very presense on this board, you are a perfect fit for the channel, but for attracting 'new' fans and encouraging growth within boxing, it offers little help.

Anyway, not the debate for this thread so my apologies to the OP.

Well said Tina

Still getting back to the original concept.......Warren moans about the mentality of some people when Cleverly has only been WORLD champion for a year!!!

Sad thing to say that because he doesn't realise what an indictment that is to Boxing these days.....

Salvador Sanchez (23.. RIP).......Beat the Danny Lopez twice....Wilfredo Gomez. Pat Cowdell and Azumah Nelson...

Disgrace that......Just think If the baby Sanchez had been fed quality after he won the title..

how good would his legacy have been???