More WRU money for some regions than for others?

I saw a clip of Roger Lewis speaking on telly this morning and I'm not happy at all with what I heard:

' All four regions currently receive £3.5m each for television and funding from the WRU.

But the accounts show they have all been losing money, partly because they have not been able to attract enough fans to games.

Chief executive Roger Lewis admitted the way regions were funded could change.

"You could have four different models, four different relationships with the WRU, and that is something that I have discussed informally with the regions over the last year," he said.

When asked whether this would mean three regions receiving equal funding, and a fourth region receiving less funding, Mr Lewis replied: "The permutations could be greater than that. It could be one and three, two and two or three and one.

"We've got to come up with the best solution for all of Welsh rugby." '

(Link: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-16919066 )

People have suggested in the past that the Dragons could become the development region, the 'Connacht' of Welsh rugby. Is this what we're going to see? If it is, how on earth is it fair? I'll remind you that soon after the regions were set up, the Dragons were runners up in the Celtic League. They have not always been the fourth-placed Welsh region (that was the Scarlets a couple of seasons ago, for example); but if the Dragons' funding is cut, they will be condemned to being the poor relation of the regions, with no chance of improving. That would be a disgrace.

I think they should fund them based on producing Welsh players. After all this is what they are there for.

So if the Blues want to have the 10 NWQ players they have then they should get very little funding for that, whereas say the Scarlets should get loads for producing the players they are at the moment.

It's the WRU, what do you expect? "Ireland have got three HC quarter finalists, let's copy them"



This model needs time now without the tinkering.

My point is that fortunes fluctuate. You can have a club or region flying high for a couple of seasons and a few seasons later find themselves struggling; conversely a team that's struggled can get on a roll and find itself battling for honours at the end of the season. That's why it would be unfair to take a snapshot of the league table and say: 'that's it, these are the good regions, these are the bad regions, we'll cut the funding to the bad ones." That's going to take away the hopes of those that find themselves at the wrong end of the table of ever moving up it.

One of the things the IRFU is trying to do is improve Connacht, up to an equalish level with the rest, they know they can't just throw money at them and hope it happens, they are building them up slowly, increaded funding from prevous years (though closer but not the same as the others) more NIQ spots, a proper board installed, and growing rugby in the whole of Connacht it's a long term plan, but th e only way it can be done properly. If the WRU cut funding to one region this is a backwards step not forwards.

If say it is Dragons, won Dragons fans keep going to RP to watch a team that loses (more than it currrently does) and a region that struggles in Welsh Derbies? I doubt it. Everyone wants to support a successsful team or at least one that has the potential to be successfull, no one wants to support a team that has little chance of ever being able to win anything.

Kingshu - absolutely right! It would be very counter productive if a team was turned into a development region. Crowd figures would definitely drop due to the team really having little hope of achieving anything and players being drafted in and out. So Lewis can't really complain about crowd figures then in another breath talk about cutting funds for a team.

However I couldn't read the link and are we making the wrong assumption? He does mention that the permutations can be different. So it could mean that as the Dragons have the lowest budget the WRU would look to increasing theirs in order to have all 4 regions on a more level playing field.

In regards to development, what's the Premiership for? Wasn't this the reason they are cutting it down to less teams and ring fencing it?

I could be jumping to conclusions, it's true. But I couldn't help fearing the worst when I saw the story on the news this morning.

TO be honest Luckless I would have thought that if any team is going to get extra funding then it would most likely be the team that is producing/feilding the more exciting young talent, in order for them to try and keep hold of the talent.

I don't really trust the WRU when it comes to things to do with money as I do think they are somewhat sneaky sods, who shaft us all, but then try to get us to snap at each other for being their favourites as opposed to snapping at them for being dodgey.

If they do turn a team into a development region or cut the funding of one to give to the others it will divide the nation further in the domestic game, and possibly the national game.

I'm waiting to see what happens on this one...

Does anyone know when they are releasing any info on this?

The article says that the independent review is going to be published next month. Any decisions would be made on the back of that.

ah cheers luckless

Out of interest, and I may well be wrong, but didn't/don't Connacht get extra funding over the other provinces?

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Out of interest, and I may well be wrong, but didn't/don't Connacht get extra funding over the other provinces?

not more funding than the others, just an increase on what they used to get, but still less than the others. they are allowed more NIQ players and the IRFU are directing thier resources for Connacht into rugby in Connacht itself and the acamady, plus making it easier for acamdy players that arn't getting gametime with thier home province to move to Connacht, to slowly build a self supporting province, there is a plan in place for them and hence they will be exempt from the new rules coming in for the other provinces. I think Connacht are already showing an improvement in the last year beacuse of this.

Cheers Kingshu, I was a bit confuddled about the whole thing

Maybe funding should be done on proportional representation in the Welsh squad?

So if each region get £3.5m (£14m) at the moment, then why not gurantee each region £2m (£8m), then give the other £6m based on proportional representation in the Welsh squad.

35 man squad announced.

9 Blues
2 Dragons
9 Ospreys
11 Scarlets
6 Other clubs.

£6m / 31 players = £193,548.38 per player
£193,548.38 per player / 52 weeks = £3722.08 per week.

Region get the money per week until the next squad is announced then the WRU can recalculate the finances.

So using this calculation the following region would be given X amount per week for their players being part of the national set up.
3 Welsh squads are announced per year, November series, 6 Nations, and June tour.

Scarlets = £2m basic
11 Wales players x £3,722.08 = £40942.92 a week, until the next Wales squad is announced in June for the Australia tour.

Ospreys = £2m basic
9 Wales players x £3,722.08 = £33,498.75 a week, until the next Wales squad is announced in June for the Australia tour.

Blues = £2m basic
9 Wales players x £3,722.08 = £33,498.75 a week, until the next Wales squad is announced in June for the Australia tour.

Dragons = £2m basic
2 Wales players x £3,722.08 =£7,444.16 a week, until the next Wales squad is announced in June for the Australia tour.

That would be the fairest way to do it, regions who produce Welsh players get the money.

The weakness of that plan is that a region could produce young talented players who only get selected for Wales once they move to another region. One region signs a player and gets the money, while the region that developed him gets nothing.

luckless_pedestrian wrote:The weakness of that plan is that a region could produce young talented players who only get selected for Wales once they move to another region. One region signs a player and gets the money, while the region that developed him gets nothing.

Hmmm, you shot me down there...

It's true though, isn't it?

luckless_pedestrian wrote:It's true though, isn't it?

Yes your right so I guess the only thing to do is to give the money to the region that developed the player, not the one he plays for?
That way even if a player is poached, i.e. Lee Bryne and Mike Phillips from the Scarlets, to the Ospreys, it will be the Scarlets who get the money inetad, as they gave the guy his start in professional rugby. so they get the reward for bringing the player through.

AlynDavies wrote:

luckless_pedestrian wrote:It's true though, isn't it?

Yes your right so I guess the only thing to do is to give the money to the region that developed the player, not the one he plays for?
That way even if a player is poached, i.e. Lee Bryne and Mike Phillips from the Scarlets, to the Ospreys, it will be the Scarlets who get the money inetad, as they gave the guy his start in professional rugby. so they get the reward for bringing the player through.

The £6m (£6.5m now I believe) is not actually a "reward" though is it?
More like compensation for when the players are on Wales duty and the international players don't come cheap, so this cash helps pay their wages. Also let's not forget those on the 7's circuit and possibly some of the U20's. They all count.