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Parlez Vous Francais?

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break_in_the_fifth
Veejay
bogbrush
deeznu
stratocumulus
djlovesyou
Josiah Maiestas
hawkeye
laverfan
Mad for Chelsea
barrystar
Henman Bill
newballs
legendkillar
Simple_Analyst
Chydremion
Tenez
noleisthebest
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Post by noleisthebest Wed 08 Feb 2012, 10:30 am

First topic message reminder :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qUxcmH595s&feature=player_embedded

Where there is smoke, there is fire....or is it just a smokescreen?
Or none of the above....


What is going on?



Last edited by noleisthebest on Wed 08 Feb 2012, 1:52 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Guest Wed 08 Feb 2012, 3:18 pm

hawkeye wrote:Y I Man

Also if there is to be only one article on this topic why should it be the one that claims there is "no smoke without fire" rather than the one that puts the side of the wronged party?
If there are duplicate articles that cover the same thing they are merged. Its in our site rules.
Otherwise we get:

Article 1 - The youtube Clip
Article 2 - Thread about the Spanish taking action
Article 3 - Thread about the French TV response
Article 4 - What Rafa says about it
Article 5 - etc etc

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Post by hawkeye Wed 08 Feb 2012, 3:20 pm

Josiah Maiestas wrote:Seriously bad reply from RFET.

Suing them just tells people you feel guilt.

Ha ha! And not suing them means they are telling the truth. What was it when women were accused of being witches. They were dunked under water for three minutes. If they drowned they were innocent. If they didn't they were burnt to death as they must be a witch...

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Post by Mad for Chelsea Wed 08 Feb 2012, 3:20 pm

can't help but think that had the video not been insinuating what it is the Spanish Federation would have left it well alone though, so while the logo may be at the heart of the legal battle I don't think it's their primary concern.

barry makes some really good points about various sports vs drugs. Football is another example where I can't for the life of me remember a high profile doping case (Maradonna aside). Surely in such a money-spinning sport it stands to reason that people would be tempted to cheat to make themselves that bit better.

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Post by barrystar Wed 08 Feb 2012, 3:25 pm

Mad for Chelsea wrote:can't help but think that had the video not been insinuating what it is the Spanish Federation would have left it well alone though, so while the logo may be at the heart of the legal battle I don't think it's their primary concern.

barry makes some really good points about various sports vs drugs. Football is another example where I can't for the life of me remember a high profile doping case (Maradonna aside). Surely in such a money-spinning sport it stands to reason that people would be tempted to cheat to make themselves that bit better.

Football is stuffed with high-profile doping cases, they are just approached in a completely different fashion to athletics. On one level you can see why. Drugs give you a competitive advantage, but you can't drug yourself into a Messi, whereas in sports like cycling, swimming, and running where technique is not so apparent to the viewer, and probably drugs get you a bigger relative advantage, audiences tend to take drugs more seriously. As Tenez says, the direction of traffic in tennis is making the likelihood of more players wanting a competitive advantage increasing.

Rio Ferdinand - there was never any issue that there had been a technical doping violation in failing to provide a specimen, but he got a 9 month ban.

Juventus in the 1990's - a lot of stuff about giving pills to the players and so on
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Post by Mad for Chelsea Wed 08 Feb 2012, 3:28 pm

yes but how many high-profile footballers have been caught doping (ie positive test - Ferdinand wasn't). Like I said I only really recall Maradonna.

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Post by hawkeye Wed 08 Feb 2012, 3:30 pm

Y I Man wrote:
hawkeye wrote:Y I Man

Also if there is to be only one article on this topic why should it be the one that claims there is "no smoke without fire" rather than the one that puts the side of the wronged party?
If there are duplicate articles that cover the same thing they are merged. Its in our site rules.
Otherwise we get:

Article 1 - The youtube Clip
Article 2 - Thread about the Spanish taking action
Article 3 - Thread about the French TV response
Article 4 - What Rafa says about it
Article 5 - etc etc

Well obviously your the boss. But.. but. I do think they were different. A bit like one article giving reasons why Murray will win a slam and another giving reasons why Murray will never win a slam and maybe another saying Murray has won a slam... (sorry that last one was just a joke...) They will both attract different posters and different comments. I certainly have things to say on this topic but I don't think they belong on this thread. And if one is really boring it will attract no comments at all. What do you think?


Last edited by hawkeye on Wed 08 Feb 2012, 3:35 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Guest Wed 08 Feb 2012, 3:33 pm

It was already mentioned here Hawkeye:
https://www.606v2.com/t23516-parlez-vous-francais#938598

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Post by djlovesyou Wed 08 Feb 2012, 3:57 pm

A clean athlete (or a dirty athlete with no previous evidence against him) could easily sue for something like this.

These people know they can essentially say exactly what they want about certain people and get away scot free (hence the Spanish authorities only getting annoyed about the 'illegal use of the logo' in the clip).

Lance used to be very litigous, now he's not as plenty of people are willng to step up and testify, he just steamrollers them with his PR machine.

It's not in their best interests for something like this to go to court and another judge ruling that the Fuentes list be fully disclosed.

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Post by laverfan Wed 08 Feb 2012, 4:43 pm

The curious case of Odesnik and ITF is another in this saga. Odesnik was supposed to have turned a 'state' witness and name names, but nothing is publicly available or has been disclosed except this.

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/tennis/news/story?id=5087155

"Stuart Miller, who oversees the anti-doping program for the ITF, declined to say how Odesnik cooperated.

"It might compromise what we are doing," Miller said by phone from London on Wednesday.

The ITF's anti-doping program provides that up to 75% of an athlete's ban can be suspended "where the participant has provided substantial assistance" in uncovering other offenses.

Miller agreed that the provision resembles a plea bargain, in which a person provides helpful information in exchange for reduced sanctions.

"Mr. Odesnik has provided substantial assistance on this occasion," said Miller, who called the case "unusual." He could not recall a doping ban being mitigated under the same substantial assistance clause."


http://www.usatoday.com/sports/tennis/2010-12-22-odesnik-doping-ban_N.htm?loc=interstitialskip

What are WADA/ITF doing with this 'substantial information'? Erm

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Post by Tenez Wed 08 Feb 2012, 5:13 pm

laverfan wrote:The curious case of Odesnik and ITF is another in this saga. Odesnik was supposed to have turned a 'state' witness and name names, but nothing is publicly available or has been disclosed except this.

BUt we know perfectly that the reason Odesnik term was reduced was actually to prevent him from name naming! This is exactly how Greg got away with it as well in 2003(?).

"If you catch me, you better catch the other ones as well". Hence teh ATP preferred to blame themselves for the contaminated drinks...which turned out to be not contaminated.

A strange saga all that.

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Post by barrystar Wed 08 Feb 2012, 5:22 pm

Well they've got plenty of publicity and the video is now linked to the front page of the Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/tennis/rafaelnadal/9068986/Rafael-Nadal-sketch-on-Canal-prompts-Spanish-Tennis-Federation-to-sue-broadcaster-over-doping-allegations.html

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Post by Tenez Wed 08 Feb 2012, 5:29 pm

I like teh song.."...I can do what I like for the price of a smile......"

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Post by stratocumulus Wed 08 Feb 2012, 6:10 pm

There is no love lost between French and Spanish. Is this the reason that Tenez never liked Nadal Whistle

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Post by newballs Wed 08 Feb 2012, 6:24 pm

stratocumulus wrote:There is no love lost between French and Spanish. Is this the reason that Tenez never liked Nadal Whistle

If this is just a fraction of the stuff that could be thrown in Nadal's direction coming up to the French Open then it could be a very interesting fortnight. In the absence of any real evidence it might start looking more like sour grapes (whatever that is in French) should he win there again.

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Post by Guest Wed 08 Feb 2012, 6:25 pm

Rusedski's case I believe is a clear case of doping violation.

That horrible grinning monster... I hates it... I hates it..

He actually said: "If I'm guilty then so are half the players on the tour.."

To deny the existence of doping in tennis is naieve at best.

One only needs to look at the musculature of some of the athletes, particularly the female ones like Stosur. There is NO WAY that a female could be that muscular unless she spends hours in the gym at least 4-5 times a week. Where would she get the time to do that given all her other training, practice and playing comittments? Besides, with all the cardio that they do, I really don't think it would be possible to maintain that level of musculature by natural means.

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emancipator - universally renowned PED expert.

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Post by barrystar Wed 08 Feb 2012, 6:29 pm

Brilliant by the Spanish Federation - make a huge public stink before you've got your ducks in a row and a video which has been watched by about 50,000 people on Youtube and some French viewers (the original programe) is splashed all over world media for about 5 hours, reaching a huge audience before just minutes ago being withdrawn from Youtube by Canal+ and/or UMG on "copyright grounds".

A great lesson in damage limitation I'd say.
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Post by Guest Wed 08 Feb 2012, 6:34 pm

emancipator wrote:Rusedski's case I believe is a clear case of doping violation.

That horrible grinning monster... I hates it... I hates it..

He actually said: "If I'm guilty then so are half the players on the tour.."

To deny the existence of doping in tennis is naieve at best.

One only needs to look at the musculature of some of the athletes, particularly the female ones like Stosur. There is NO WAY that a female could be that muscular unless she spends hours in the gym at least 4-5 times a week. Where would she get the time to do that given all her other training, practice and playing comittments? Besides, with all the cardio that they do, I really don't think it would be possible to maintain that level of musculature by natural means.

ghost

emancipator - universally renowned PED expert.
I dont agree emancipator.
Look at the WWE wrestlers. Constantly on the road, training, fan access and matches. They are regularly tested and pass. They can keep that figure without the use of PEDs

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Post by Guest Wed 08 Feb 2012, 6:36 pm

Y I Man wrote:
emancipator wrote:Rusedski's case I believe is a clear case of doping violation.

That horrible grinning monster... I hates it... I hates it..

He actually said: "If I'm guilty then so are half the players on the tour.."

To deny the existence of doping in tennis is naieve at best.

One only needs to look at the musculature of some of the athletes, particularly the female ones like Stosur. There is NO WAY that a female could be that muscular unless she spends hours in the gym at least 4-5 times a week. Where would she get the time to do that given all her other training, practice and playing comittments? Besides, with all the cardio that they do, I really don't think it would be possible to maintain that level of musculature by natural means.

ghost

emancipator - universally renowned PED expert.
I dont agree emancipator.
Look at the WWE wrestlers. Constantly on the road, training, fan access and matches. They are regularly tested and pass. They can keep that figure without the use of PEDs

How much running do they do?

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Post by Guest Wed 08 Feb 2012, 6:42 pm

In training and in a match, I would say quite a bit

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Post by Guest Wed 08 Feb 2012, 6:48 pm

TBH I don't know too much about WWE but I'd imagine that their cardio each week is just a fraction of what tennis players do.

However, admittedly rugby players probably also do a lot of cardio and they're pretty muscular.

But some of those women on the WTA they just don't look normal.

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Post by Guest Wed 08 Feb 2012, 6:51 pm

emancipator wrote:TBH I don't know too much about WWE but I'd imagine that their cardio each week is just a fraction of what tennis players do.

However, admittedly rugby players probably also do a lot of cardio and they're pretty muscular.

But some of those women on the WTA they just don't look normal.
Dont let Polished_Man hear you say that Wink

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Post by Tenez Wed 08 Feb 2012, 6:52 pm

stratocumulus wrote:There is no love lost between French and Spanish. Is this the reason that Tenez never liked Nadal Whistle

Not really. Though as a principle we can say there is no love between any neighbouring countries.

I was a big fan of Indurain...but I am must say there is no spanish athletes or player I find particularly interesting....Lope maybe?

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Post by djlovesyou Thu 09 Feb 2012, 1:46 am

Y I Man wrote:

I dont agree emancipator.
Look at the WWE wrestlers. Constantly on the road, training, fan access and matches. They are regularly tested and pass. They can keep that figure without the use of PEDs

Did you honestly just seriously say that WWE wrestlers are:

a) Regularly tested - oh come on. These guys are entertainment figures (actors if you will) why would an organisation want to bust them for PEDs. The WWE governing body (or whatever it's called in what's basically a soap opera) probably administer them themselves. Have you got any numbers for IC and OOC testing in the WWE? Are they actually even subject to WADA law?

b) Not taking PEDs - See above - there's a reason why these guys drop dead young on a very regular basis.

Not being funny here, but do you actually believe that what they're doing is real? I'm slightly worried that perhaps you do.

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Post by deeznu Thu 09 Feb 2012, 1:52 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=OxJyMlxSnLE

Laugh

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Post by legendkillar Thu 09 Feb 2012, 8:06 am

djlovesyou wrote:
Y I Man wrote:

I dont agree emancipator.
Look at the WWE wrestlers. Constantly on the road, training, fan access and matches. They are regularly tested and pass. They can keep that figure without the use of PEDs

Did you honestly just seriously say that WWE wrestlers are:

a) Regularly tested - oh come on. These guys are entertainment figures (actors if you will) why would an organisation want to bust them for PEDs. The WWE governing body (or whatever it's called in what's basically a soap opera) probably administer them themselves. Have you got any numbers for IC and OOC testing in the WWE? Are they actually even subject to WADA law?

b) Not taking PEDs - See above - there's a reason why these guys drop dead young on a very regular basis.

Not being funny here, but do you actually believe that what they're doing is real? I'm slightly worried that perhaps you do.

Not being funny but have you ever heard of Adam Copeland?

Retired 'Sports Entertainer' due to Spinal Stenosis.

One of the laughable things I hear is 'it's not real'

The injuries are very real.

Steve Austin another who retired early due fragments from a broken neck in the ring which lead to his C3 C4 vertebrae being blown out.

Darren Dozdov who was paralysed by a running powerbomb that went wrong in the ring.

The risks and injuries are very real. Yes it is choreographed, but that is something that is not denied.

The whole 'fake' tag is rather an ignorance which is rather inaccurate.

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Post by Tenez Thu 09 Feb 2012, 8:37 am

legendkillar wrote:
djlovesyou wrote:
Y I Man wrote:

I dont agree emancipator.
Look at the WWE wrestlers. Constantly on the road, training, fan access and matches. They are regularly tested and pass. They can keep that figure without the use of PEDs

Did you honestly just seriously say that WWE wrestlers are:

a) Regularly tested - oh come on. These guys are entertainment figures (actors if you will) why would an organisation want to bust them for PEDs. The WWE governing body (or whatever it's called in what's basically a soap opera) probably administer them themselves. Have you got any numbers for IC and OOC testing in the WWE? Are they actually even subject to WADA law?

b) Not taking PEDs - See above - there's a reason why these guys drop dead young on a very regular basis.

Not being funny here, but do you actually believe that what they're doing is real? I'm slightly worried that perhaps you do.

Not being funny but have you ever heard of Adam Copeland?

Retired 'Sports Entertainer' due to Spinal Stenosis.

One of the laughable things I hear is 'it's not real'

The injuries are very real.

Steve Austin another who retired early due fragments from a broken neck in the ring which lead to his C3 C4 vertebrae being blown out.

Darren Dozdov who was paralysed by a running powerbomb that went wrong in the ring.

The risks and injuries are very real. Yes it is choreographed, but that is something that is not denied.

The whole 'fake' tag is rather an ignorance which is rather inaccurate.

Well if WWF was real, you would not have the odd injury...they 'd all be dead.

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Post by legendkillar Thu 09 Feb 2012, 8:41 am

Tenez wrote:
legendkillar wrote:
djlovesyou wrote:
Y I Man wrote:

I dont agree emancipator.
Look at the WWE wrestlers. Constantly on the road, training, fan access and matches. They are regularly tested and pass. They can keep that figure without the use of PEDs

Did you honestly just seriously say that WWE wrestlers are:

a) Regularly tested - oh come on. These guys are entertainment figures (actors if you will) why would an organisation want to bust them for PEDs. The WWE governing body (or whatever it's called in what's basically a soap opera) probably administer them themselves. Have you got any numbers for IC and OOC testing in the WWE? Are they actually even subject to WADA law?

b) Not taking PEDs - See above - there's a reason why these guys drop dead young on a very regular basis.

Not being funny here, but do you actually believe that what they're doing is real? I'm slightly worried that perhaps you do.

Not being funny but have you ever heard of Adam Copeland?

Retired 'Sports Entertainer' due to Spinal Stenosis.

One of the laughable things I hear is 'it's not real'

The injuries are very real.

Steve Austin another who retired early due fragments from a broken neck in the ring which lead to his C3 C4 vertebrae being blown out.

Darren Dozdov who was paralysed by a running powerbomb that went wrong in the ring.

The risks and injuries are very real. Yes it is choreographed, but that is something that is not denied.

The whole 'fake' tag is rather an ignorance which is rather inaccurate.

Well if WWF was real, you would not have the odd injury...they 'd all be dead.

Again many wrestlers have died.

Eddie Guerrero, Andrew Martin, Davey Boy Smith, Owen Hart, Brian Pillman.

All in their 30's.

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Post by Guest Thu 09 Feb 2012, 8:47 am

djlovesyou wrote:
Y I Man wrote:

I dont agree emancipator.
Look at the WWE wrestlers. Constantly on the road, training, fan access and matches. They are regularly tested and pass. They can keep that figure without the use of PEDs

Did you honestly just seriously say that WWE wrestlers are:

a) Regularly tested - oh come on. These guys are entertainment figures (actors if you will) why would an organisation want to bust them for PEDs. The WWE governing body (or whatever it's called in what's basically a soap opera) probably administer them themselves. Have you got any numbers for IC and OOC testing in the WWE? Are they actually even subject to WADA law?

b) Not taking PEDs - See above - there's a reason why these guys drop dead young on a very regular basis.

Not being funny here, but do you actually believe that what they're doing is real? I'm slightly worried that perhaps you do.
Yes they are regularly tested. I dont understand why you think they are not.

http://corporate.wwe.com/company/abuse_policy.jsp
http://www.wwe.com/inside/news/evan-bourne-suspended
http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_55403.shtml
http://www.wrestlingnewsworld.com/wwe/wwe-suspensions/

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Post by Tenez Thu 09 Feb 2012, 9:11 am

Looks like Canal + is not going to apologize! It's a war!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0Q7JlKU0nc&feature=related

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Post by Tenez Thu 09 Feb 2012, 9:15 am

From the other side:

Spain's Olympic committee president Alejandro Blanco: "The successes of Spanish sport are solely due to hard work, dedication and planning...We are the biggest defenders of cleanliness in sport and we can hold our head high...No country in the world can say it does more than us to fight doping."

More from Toni Nadal


Toni Nadal: "The French can wait forever (for Rafa to test positive)...There is no chance, the chance is zero. If they want to wait they can wait. It’s funny that they mess so much with Rafael and Spanish sport. All elite athletes pass the [doping] control tests, it is impossible to cheat. Rafael had 20 and I think some were a surprise, it is difficult to cheat."

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Post by noleisthebest Thu 09 Feb 2012, 9:35 am

Tenez wrote:Looks like Canal + is not going to apologize! It's a war!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0Q7JlKU0nc&feature=related

Told ya it was going to be fun Wink

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Post by barrystar Thu 09 Feb 2012, 10:00 am

Tenez wrote:
Spain's Olympic committee president Alejandro Blanco: "...No country in the world can say it does more than us to fight doping."

More from Toni Nadal


Toni Nadal: "All elite athletes pass the [doping] control tests, it is impossible to cheat. Rafael had 20 and I think some were a surprise, it is difficult to cheat."

What clumsy responses - it does not make them cheats but it's just clumsy. I am not saying that the UK is whiter than white, but Blanco cannot believe what he says about Spain's anti-drug efforts.

Toni can't believe that it's impossible to cheat either.

All they need to say is that it's a bitter smear not worthy of a response, and Toni needs to say no more than that Rafa is clean and that's all there is to say.
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Post by legendkillar Thu 09 Feb 2012, 10:45 am

Toni got wummed Laugh

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Post by laverfan Thu 09 Feb 2012, 12:25 pm

Tenez wrote:From the other side:

Spain's Olympic committee president Alejandro Blanco: "The successes of Spanish sport are solely due to hard work, dedication and planning...We are the biggest defenders of cleanliness in sport and we can hold our head high...No country in the world can say it does more than us to fight doping."


Why not document the Puerto lists and make them public as part of this campaign? Erm

Is that also a tacit admission that there is a high incidence of doping, to begin with?

Prosecution by media will turn very ugly. Sad

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Post by hawkeye Thu 09 Feb 2012, 12:37 pm

laverfan wrote:
Tenez wrote:From the other side:

Spain's Olympic committee president Alejandro Blanco: "The successes of Spanish sport are solely due to hard work, dedication and planning...We are the biggest defenders of cleanliness in sport and we can hold our head high...No country in the world can say it does more than us to fight doping."


Why not document the Puerto lists and make them public as part of this campaign? Parlez Vous Francais? - Page 2 57983

Is that also a tacit admission that there is a high incidence of doping, to begin with?

Prosecution by media will turn very ugly. Sad

That French video to me looked very ugly. Thats what various Spanish sources are responding to. Just because French TV has made an ugly video doesn't mean Spain has to do any more than complain or take legal action against the makers. In fact it doesn't even have to do that.

I would like to hear what some of the present French players have to say about the way tennis has been presented in such a way.

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Post by bogbrush Thu 09 Feb 2012, 12:51 pm

It's like a sewerage pipe that's been blocked up for ages because nobody likes the ocassional smelly discharge. At some point it will all come rushing out and I'll enjoy the spectacle, from a sensible distance of course.
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Post by Veejay Thu 09 Feb 2012, 1:23 pm

MADRID (AP)—The Spanish tennis federation is planning to sue Canal Plus France for using its logo in a video that poked fun at Rafael Nadal and other Spaniards’ alleged ties to doping.

In the video skit this week on Les Guignols (The Puppets) satirical program, a man wearing a Nadal puppet mask is shown urinating into his car’s gas tank before racing off at immense speed only to be pulled over by traffic police for speeding.

A message reading “Spanish athletes. They don’t win by chance,” then appears on the screen surrounded by the logos of the tennis federation and other Spanish federations such as those of cycling and football.

“This time they have gone way too far,” tennis federation president Jose Luis Escanuela said in the statement. “We at the tennis federation cannot tolerate the slander and damage to the prestige of our athletes.”

The Spanish federation received support from the International Tennis Federation, which viewed the joke about Nadal as an attack on its anti-doping program.

“The ITF condemns the unsubstantiated implications in the Canal Plus video in regard to one of our member national associations, Spain, one of the world’s top players, Rafael Nadal, and as a consequence the effectiveness of the Tennis Anti-Doping Programme,” ITF president Francesco Ricci Bitti said in a statement.

“We join with the RFET in asking Canal Plus to remove this video, and ask Canal Plus to issue an apology to all Spanish tennis players, who have been unfairly implicated.”

The video came hours after the Court of Arbitration for Sport issued a two-year ban against Spanish cyclist Alberto Contador for doping. Contador was also stripped of his 2010 Tour de France win.

Nadal’s coach and uncle, Toni Nadal, chose to downplay the sketch.

“Rafa hasn’t given it any importance,” Nadal was quoted as telling SER radio by sports daily AS. “It’s a comedy show, we don’t care. Rafa isn’t affected by it.”

Nadal has won the French Open six times since 2005.

The federation said it will provide details of the lawsuit Saturday during the Davis Cup match between Spain and Kazakhstan. It said the action will begin with a demand for Canal Plus France to withdraw the video, to abstain from using the federation’s logo improperly and compensation for having used it improperly.

http://bleacherreport.com/tb/bdTY7?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=tennis

Im wondering if this is a wise move..cause couldn't the French channel then go to the European High court and the seal thats been placed on the list of names of athletes who received treatments from Fuentes then be forced to be lifted? Ultimately they could be shooting themselves in the foot and Spain could possibly end up having to forfeit its Euro and World cup titles too

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Post by djlovesyou Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:15 pm

That's why they're suing them for using the logo improperely and not for implying that they're a bunch of dopers.

It becomes very difficult to start suing for things that are actually true.

Just like Nadal didn't sue the French newspaper for revealing that he was on the Fuentes list. Surely that would have been the simplest lawsuit of all time if he wasn't on the list.

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Post by laverfan Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:15 pm

Comedy of multiplying errors. Laugh

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Post by Mad for Chelsea Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:20 pm

daft over-reaction from the Spanish Federation IMO, it was a comedy sketch FFS, get a sense of humour already! Touchy bunch about the subject of doping, aren't they?

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Post by Tenez Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:22 pm

Is WADA going to join the protest or are they secretly smiling watching those clips.

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Post by Tenez Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:25 pm

bogbrush wrote:It's like a sewerage pipe that's been blocked up for ages because nobody likes the ocassional smelly discharge. At some point it will all come rushing out and I'll enjoy the spectacle, from a sensible distance of course.

Though Toni's confidence is disconcerting. Either Nadal is clean or he has full support of teh system (from Spanish Federation to ITF).

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Post by djlovesyou Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:26 pm

Y I Man wrote:

Yes they are regularly tested. I dont understand why you think they are not.

http://corporate.wwe.com/company/abuse_policy.jsp
http://www.wwe.com/inside/news/evan-bourne-suspended
http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_55403.shtml
http://www.wrestlingnewsworld.com/wwe/wwe-suspensions/

Because they're not regularly tested. The whole 'testing for PEDs' thing is a bit of an afterthought in that whole policy.

They're only tested when, essentially, they show signs or are suspected of recreational drug use.

These guys are, and always have been, steroid freaks. It's part of the entertainment. They wouldn't want normal sized people doing this sort of stuff, it just wouldn't have the same effect.

As long as the say 'don't do drugs kids' every now and again, it doesn't really matter because the drugs don't give them an advantage, it just makes the show more spectacular.

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Post by Tenez Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:27 pm

I must say I am a bit surprised to see a discussion about the authenticity of WWF amongst us grown ups.

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Post by barrystar Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:28 pm

It's like I said. Make the logo the legal basis of the action, which I would have thought is a slam-dunker since Canal+ can't use a logo like that without permission to poke Charlie at the organisation, then spin the 'victory' as a vindication of their alleged anti-doping credentials.

If the Spanish sporting authorities have any sense at all they won't go anywhere near putting their self-professed reputation as PED-busters up for grabs in a Court. As others have said, in any action which turns on whether they are enthusiastic PED-busters the first question to the first witness is "will you join with us in applying to the Spanish Court to release the Puerto names and information to WADA?". The second question would be "why not?"
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Post by djlovesyou Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:30 pm

Tenez wrote:

Though Toni's confidence is disconcerting. Either Nadal is clean or he has full support of teh system (from Spanish Federation to ITF).

He clearly does have full support from the system, hence the massive effort to cover up Puerto.

He's not doing EPO, so it's unlikely that he can be caught (unless caught in the act.)

They're so rarely blood tested so changes in hematocrit cannot be linked to anything dodgy.

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Post by break_in_the_fifth Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:34 pm

In boxing apparently urine tests are inadequate and it's blood tests that have the better chance of showing something up. I'd assume they'd use something similar in tennis and boxing if looking for an advantage. Anyhow they should lay off Nadal, I mean why now all of a sudden. They had his whole career to make noise if they felt it was worth it.

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Post by barrystar Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:38 pm

legendkillar wrote:
One of the laughable things I hear is 'it's not real'

The injuries are very real.

Steve Austin another who retired early due fragments from a broken neck in the ring which lead to his C3 C4 vertebrae being blown out.

Darren Dozdov who was paralysed by a running powerbomb that went wrong in the ring.

The risks and injuries are very real. Yes it is choreographed, but that is something that is not denied.

The whole 'fake' tag is rather an ignorance which is rather inaccurate.
Ballet is very real, and this shows that injuries sustained in Ballet are very real too - http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2000/10/001012074634.htm. Where ballet and its dancers have my unenduring respect and WWE or WWF or whatever the bull***** is called is worthy of nothing but total and utter derision is that ballet presents itself as what it is no more no less but WWE (unless it is dripping with well-concealed irony) puts up a tragicomic pretence at being associated with something that it quite patently has nothing in common with, namely competitive sport.

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Post by Guest Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:38 pm

djlovesyou wrote:
Y I Man wrote:

Yes they are regularly tested. I dont understand why you think they are not.

http://corporate.wwe.com/company/abuse_policy.jsp
http://www.wwe.com/inside/news/evan-bourne-suspended
http://pwtorch.com/artman2/publish/WWE_News_3/article_55403.shtml
http://www.wrestlingnewsworld.com/wwe/wwe-suspensions/

Because they're not regularly tested. The whole 'testing for PEDs' thing is a bit of an afterthought in that whole policy.

They're only tested when, essentially, they show signs or are suspected of recreational drug use.

These guys are, and always have been, steroid freaks. It's part of the entertainment. They wouldn't want normal sized people doing this sort of stuff, it just wouldn't have the same effect.

As long as the say 'don't do drugs kids' every now and again, it doesn't really matter because the drugs don't give them an advantage, it just makes the show more spectacular.
With respect to all substances prohibited by this Policy except for alcohol, which will be tested only if reasonable suspicion exists to do so, WWE Talent will be subject to unannounced testing at any time as determined by the PA. WWE may require WWE Talent to submit to a test or tests that include, without limitation, urine, blood, saliva and/or hair, as part of this random selection program. The random selection program conducted throughout the year is designed to result in all WWE Talent being tested at a minimum four (4) times annually, but may result in more frequent testing due to the random selection process.
But of course, that is all rubbish and they are lying. Rolling Eyes


Last edited by Y I Man on Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:38 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by djlovesyou Thu 09 Feb 2012, 2:38 pm

But Nadal is the big Spanish name they know is on 'the list'.

People have been kinda at him ever since that came out years ago.

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