New players in Six nations 2013

Based on last years club performances and junior world cup. What is your prediction for players playing there first Six nations?
For Scotland I'd have:
Certain:
Grant
Visser
Ryder
Likely:
Harley
MacInally
Dunbar
Brown
Possible:
Fusaro
Gilchrist
MacKenzie
Long-shot:
Bennett
Farndale
Leonard

Certain- Joe Launchbury
Alex Goode
Tom Youngs
Joe Marler

Likely- Miles Benjamin
Anthony Allen
Jonathan Joseph
Tom Johnson

Possible- Johnny May
Freddie Burns
George Lowe
Christian Wade
Cal Fearns
Jordan Crane
Jonathan Twelvetrees
Matt Kvesic

Long Shot- Kyle Sickler
Charlie Matthews
George Skivington
Luke Wallace

I don't think we will see any new players in the Welsh set up more the continued development of the likes of Beck, Tipuric, Shingler and Owens and hopefully one of the T/Heads.

Possibly if (and I hope he does) show some form for us down at Dave then maybe Prydie might get back into the fold.

Wales

Probably

Ashley Beck
Andreus Pretorious
Liam Williams
Harry Robinson

Possible

Jason Tovey
Dan Biggar
Adam Hughes
Rhodri Jones (depending on Craig Mitchell's return)
Tom Prydie

Cant see Pretorious getting a shot but did forget about Williams and Robinson.

I hope both Biggar and Tovey get some proper game time in the AIs and 6 Nations

Tovey and possibly Sampson Lee if he goes well are most likely.

Pretorious is a big outsider, for one he is a South Frican and two there are three or four players ahead of him.

maestegmafia wrote:Tovey and possibly Sampson Lee if he goes well are most likely.

Pretorious is a big outsider, for one he is a South Frican and two there are three or four players ahead of him.

At no8? Faletau and Ryan Jones are the only ones I can think of, and Ryan will be called in at 6 or lock if there are injuries.

ChequeredJersey wrote:Certain- Joe Launchbury
Alex Goode
Tom Youngs
Joe Marler

Likely- Miles Benjamin
Anthony Allen
Jonathan Joseph
Tom Johnson

Possible- Johnny May
Freddie Burns
George Lowe
Christian Wade
Cal Fearns
Jordan Crane
Jonathan Twelvetrees
Matt Kvesic

Long Shot- Kyle Sickler
Charlie Matthews
George Skivington
Luke Wallace

As long shots go, that's a pretty substantial one! Sinkler will only get a shot if Dan Cole, Rupert Harden, David Wilson, Paul Doran-Jones, Matt Stevens are out. He's probably behind Premiership clubmen like Dan Murphy or Tom Mercey. I'd probably put Henry Thomas ahead of Sinckler in the TH long shot stakes.

wales606 wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Tovey and possibly Sampson Lee if he goes well are most likely.

Pretorious is a big outsider, for one he is a South Frican and two there are three or four players ahead of him.

At no8? Faletau and Ryan Jones are the only ones I can think of, and Ryan will be called in at 6 or lock if there are injuries.

I think Gilbert looks good at Scarlets, the Blues have Hamilton too.

Pretorious is a good player but has had a long layoff with injury.

Gilbert has been let go by Scarlets, they have Murphy though i suppose. McCusker could be an option as well, since he's captain he will most likely start and 8 looks like the open position at the Scarlets. I don't think Hamilton will be anything more than a solid regional player, and he's more of a 6 in my books. Andy Powell is always an option. The O's have Morgan Allen who's hardly played, but like Hamilton i think he'll just be a regional player... if that.

We really are struggling for number 8's in Wales, never mind good ones and remember that Howley said he was interested in Pretorius, so if he's in good form there is every chance he will be selected.

Yeah I got carried away in the realms of possibility

From a Welsh point of view I would guess expect Liam Williams, Harry Robinson, Ashley Beck, and Rhodri Jones to be involved in the squad, and probably get some game time. I would also think that Tom Prydie may make a return to the squad, and it is also possible that Samson Lee and possibly Luke Hamilton (or Keiran Murphy if he gets game time) will be called up to train with the squad and see how they would fit in etc.

For Ireland:

Simon Zebo, Dan Tuohy, Declan Fitzpatrick and perhaps Richardt Strauss. Chris Henry and Darren Cave maybe. Dave Kearney maybe too but much will depend on injuries.

ChequeredJersey wrote:Yeah I got carried away in the realms of ptossibility

For what it is worth, I think there is a good chance that he will 'do a Marler'. I certainly think he'll feature a lot more for Quins in the coming season. It's good that Johnson is around though, it should take some of the pressure off him.

Cumbrian wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:Certain- Joe Launchbury
Alex Goode
Tom Youngs
Joe Marler

Likely- Miles Benjamin
Anthony Allen
Jonathan Joseph
Tom Johnson

Possible- Johnny May
Freddie Burns
George Lowe
Christian Wade
Cal Fearns
Jordan Crane
Jonathan Twelvetrees
Matt Kvesic

Long Shot- Kyle Sickler
Charlie Matthews
George Skivington
Luke Wallace

As long shots go, that's a pretty substantial one! Sinkler will only get a shot if Dan Cole, Rupert Harden, David Wilson, Paul Doran-Jones, Matt Stevens are out. He's probably behind Premiership clubmen like Dan Murphy or Tom Mercey. I'd probably put Henry Thomas ahead of Sinkler in the TH long shot stakes.

And can we please clarify now what his name is? (particulalry if it is about to be bandied about on these boards with gay abandon while naming our dream teams)

So far i have read Sickler, Sinkler and Snickler.

Personally i like Snickler because it brings to mind a real pilferer or snaveller of loose ball at the break down.

"Oh! That Kyle Snickler has snickled the ball again! What a player!"

also who is " jonathan twelvetrees"?

Chequered: George Skivington is a funny choice to put down. What makes you think he could be in with a long shot? I like all your other choices though, and agree with pretty much all of them. May deserves a start, and I would love to see Lowe line up too. He looked excellent against the Southern SA BArbarians before he went off.

rodders wrote:For Ireland:

Simon Zebo, Dan Tuohy, Declan Fitzpatrick and perhaps Richardt Strauss. Chris Henry and Darren Cave maybe. Dave Kearney maybe too but much will depend on injuries.

The problem with Ireland is that under Kidney none of these players will be likely in the starting 15, barring injuries. Tuohy and Fitzpatrick should definitely get minutes from the bench, Strauss won't see the bench with Best and Cronin in front of him, Henry will more than likely be in a race with POM for his seat, and Zebo, Kearney Jnr and Cave all depend on who is available.

I would love to see a fresh face in the match day squad, a Madigan, Spence, Henderson, D Ryan or Hanrahan. Of course, there's a lot of rugby to be played before the 6 nations so it all depends on if they see game time and actually preform in the Rabo/Hcup.

Triangulation wrote:also who is " jonathan twelvetrees"?

Well Billy is so good that they cloned him and called him Jonathan

Gretgael1 wrote:

rodders wrote:For Ireland:

Simon Zebo, Dan Tuohy, Declan Fitzpatrick and perhaps Richardt Strauss. Chris Henry and Darren Cave maybe. Dave Kearney maybe too but much will depend on injuries.

The problem with Ireland is that under Kidney none of these players will be likely in the starting 15, barring injuries. Tuohy and Fitzpatrick should definitely get minutes from the bench, Strauss won't see the bench with Best and Cronin in front of him, Henry will more than likely be in a race with POM for his seat, and Zebo, Kearney Jnr and Cave all depend on who is available.

I would love to see a fresh face in the match day squad, a Madigan, Spence, Henderson, D Ryan or Hanrahan. Of course, there's a lot of rugby to be played before the 6 nations so it all depends on if they see game time and actually preform in the Rabo/Hcup.

Oh god spare me !

killer938 wrote:

Triangulation wrote:also who is " jonathan twelvetrees"?

Well Billy is so good that they cloned him and called him Jonathan

and there are another dozen threads on the way about how fantastic he is.

Some English names not mentioned.

Long shots for England but possible:

Jamie George - hooker

Rob Miller - full back

Henry Thomas - prop

Anthony Watson - wing

James Short - wing

George Ford - fly half

Henry Trinder - centre

James Short is a brilliant shout Beshocked. He is such a great little player- you see him in the 7s?? Unbelievable performace. I would love to see him given crack actually, replacing Ashton possibly. He's fast and agile, but is also so tenacios, it's great. England could do with some physciality on the wings, and he might be the man for the job.

Triangulation wrote:

Gretgael1 wrote:

rodders wrote:For Ireland:

Simon Zebo, Dan Tuohy, Declan Fitzpatrick and perhaps Richardt Strauss. Chris Henry and Darren Cave maybe. Dave Kearney maybe too but much will depend on injuries.

The problem with Ireland is that under Kidney none of these players will be likely in the starting 15, barring injuries. Tuohy and Fitzpatrick should definitely get minutes from the bench, Strauss won't see the bench with Best and Cronin in front of him, Henry will more than likely be in a race with POM for his seat, and Zebo, Kearney Jnr and Cave all depend on who is available.

I would love to see a fresh face in the match day squad, a Madigan, Spence, Henderson, D Ryan or Hanrahan. Of course, there's a lot of rugby to be played before the 6 nations so it all depends on if they see game time and actually preform in the Rabo/Hcup.

Oh god spare me !

?

Watson is a little young for 2013 duty i think. I'd love to see Tom Homer get a chance though.

On topic, I think it is difficult to know who will come in, particularly in places like the back-row. Take Carl Fearns, his inclusion it will very much depend on the fitness of Croft, Dowson and Wood. The squad is getting to be fairly settled and I wouldn't expect there to be a massive number of changes.


Definite:

Joe Marler
Alex Goode

Likely:

Thomas Waldrom (Don't think he has played in the 6N?)
Carl Fearns
Jon Joseph
Charlie Sharples
Anthony Allen
Tom Youngs

Long Shots: (I've included a lot, but I'm thinking it will be one or two of them at the most, to account for injuries)

Henry Thomas
Christian Wade
Rob Miller
Billy Twelvetrees
Graham Kitchener
Matt Kvesic
Jamie Gibson
Jonny May
Tom Biggs
Miles Benjamin
Nick Abendanon
George Ford


I've stuck to picking players from the EPS and Saxons. When you seriously look at the Saxons, you really realise how many young/ new caps we've got in there!

People should probably stick to picking guys that are in the EPS/ Saxons, the coach's arms are tied with it.

Very true bluestonevedder. Yes I saw him in the 7s. He really seems to thrive.

Watching a replay of Short's try on Sarries TV vs London Irish just shows it all.

http://www.saracens.com/sarriestv/#

Fast forward to 9:30

Goes past virtually the entire LI sevens side. Hands off Gray and outpaces Tagicakibau and O Leary.

Don't forget there's a wing spot up for grabs.

The guys I listed are potential bolters IMO if they can string some big performances.

As an aside, I believe Short has got to be close to a call up. He's in a perfect position to compete with Strettle and show that he is worthy of it.

I was disappointed with Jamie Gibson over the summer to be honest. I think it was clear that although he definitely has potential, he is currently way off the mark. A little more premiership rugby under his belt, and he'll be there. I don't think we'll see him progress to the EPS for a while.

Very true Cumbrian. On the subject of that England wing I feel it's very open.

Anthony Watson is young true but he's got a lot of potential. Surely he'll start on one wing at London Irish with Tagicakibau on the other?

Marland Yarde would be worth a look for England as well.

Triangulation wrote:

Cumbrian wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:Certain- Joe Launchbury
Alex Goode
Tom Youngs
Joe Marler

Likely- Miles Benjamin
Anthony Allen
Jonathan Joseph
Tom Johnson

Possible- Johnny May
Freddie Burns
George Lowe
Christian Wade
Cal Fearns
Jordan Crane
Jonathan Twelvetrees
Matt Kvesic

Long Shot- Kyle Sickler
Charlie Matthews
George Skivington
Luke Wallace

As long shots go, that's a pretty substantial one! Sinkler will only get a shot if Dan Cole, Rupert Harden, David Wilson, Paul Doran-Jones, Matt Stevens are out. He's probably behind Premiership clubmen like Dan Murphy or Tom Mercey. I'd probably put Henry Thomas ahead of Sinkler in the TH long shot stakes.

And can we please clarify now what his name is? (particulalry if it is about to be bandied about on these boards with gay abandon while naming our dream teams)

So far i have read Sickler, Sinkler and Snickler.

Personally i like Snickler because it brings to mind a real pilferer or snaveller of loose ball at the break down.

"Oh! That Kyle Snickler has snickled the ball again! What a player!"

It's Sinckler. I wrote the post in a rush on my phone, that's why I got Twelvetrees' name wrong too. Sorry

Triangulation wrote:

Gretgael1 wrote:

rodders wrote:For Ireland:

Simon Zebo, Dan Tuohy, Declan Fitzpatrick and perhaps Richardt Strauss. Chris Henry and Darren Cave maybe. Dave Kearney maybe too but much will depend on injuries.

The problem with Ireland is that under Kidney none of these players will be likely in the starting 15, barring injuries. Tuohy and Fitzpatrick should definitely get minutes from the bench, Strauss won't see the bench with Best and Cronin in front of him, Henry will more than likely be in a race with POM for his seat, and Zebo, Kearney Jnr and Cave all depend on who is available.

I would love to see a fresh face in the match day squad, a Madigan, Spence, Henderson, D Ryan or Hanrahan. Of course, there's a lot of rugby to be played before the 6 nations so it all depends on if they see game time and actually preform in the Rabo/Hcup.

Oh god spare me !

What is wrong with Spence?

bluestonevedder wrote:James Short is a brilliant shout Beshocked. He is such a great little player- you see him in the 7s?? Unbelievable performace. I would love to see him given crack actually, replacing Ashton possibly. He's fast and agile, but is also so tenacios, it's great. England could do with some physciality on the wings, and he might be the man for the job.

Carpe Diem wrote:

bluestonevedder wrote:James Short is a brilliant shout Beshocked. He is such a great little player- you see him in the 7s?? Unbelievable performace. I would love to see him given crack actually, replacing Ashton possibly. He's fast and agile, but is also so tenacios, it's great. England could do with some physciality on the wings, and he might be the man for the job.

Never new that was sports enhancing

Cumbrian wrote:On topic, I think it is difficult to know who will come in, particularly in places like the back-row. Take Carl Fearns, his inclusion it will very much depend on the fitness of Croft, Dowson and Wood. The squad is getting to be fairly settled and I wouldn't expect there to be a massive number of changes.


Definite:

Joe Marler
Alex Goode

Likely:

Thomas Waldrom (Don't think he has played in the 6N?)
Carl Fearns
Jon Joseph
Charlie Sharples
Anthony Allen
Tom Youngs

Long Shots: (I've included a lot, but I'm thinking it will be one or two of them at the most, to account for injuries)

Henry Thomas
Christian Wade
Rob Miller
Billy Twelvetrees
Graham Kitchener
Matt Kvesic
Jamie Gibson
Jonny May
Tom Biggs
Miles Benjamin
Nick Abendanon
George Ford


I've stuck to picking players from the EPS and Saxons. When you seriously look at the Saxons, you really realise how many young/ new caps we've got in there!

Marra i think it could be down to his own fitness aswell. He looks totally unconditioned...hopefully a good pre season and regular games will sort that out.

I agree totally with you about youngsters...we have introduced a whole host recently...and now we're looking for even more...

Lets give this batch a go first...then maybe look at fringe players like May, Wade etc...

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Carpe Diem wrote:

bluestonevedder wrote:James Short is a brilliant shout Beshocked. He is such a great little player- you see him in the 7s?? Unbelievable performace. I would love to see him given crack actually, replacing Ashton possibly. He's fast and agile, but is also so tenacios, it's great. England could do with some physciality on the wings, and he might be the man for the job.

Never new that was sports enhancing

It adds a sense of Cooper-esque unpredictability

GeordieFalcon wrote:

Cumbrian wrote:On topic, I think it is difficult to know who will come in, particularly in places like the back-row. Take Carl Fearns, his inclusion it will very much depend on the fitness of Croft, Dowson and Wood. The squad is getting to be fairly settled and I wouldn't expect there to be a massive number of changes.


Definite:

Joe Marler
Alex Goode

Likely:

Thomas Waldrom (Don't think he has played in the 6N?)
Carl Fearns
Jon Joseph
Charlie Sharples
Anthony Allen
Tom Youngs

Long Shots: (I've included a lot, but I'm thinking it will be one or two of them at the most, to account for injuries)

Henry Thomas
Christian Wade
Rob Miller
Billy Twelvetrees
Graham Kitchener
Matt Kvesic
Jamie Gibson
Jonny May
Tom Biggs
Miles Benjamin
Nick Abendanon
George Ford


I've stuck to picking players from the EPS and Saxons. When you seriously look at the Saxons, you really realise how many young/ new caps we've got in there!

Marra i think it could be down to his own fitness aswell. He looks totally unconditioned...hopefully a good pre season and regular games will sort that out.

I agree totally with you about youngsters...we have introduced a whole host recently...and now we're looking for even more...

Lets give this batch a go first...then maybe look at fringe players like May, Wade etc...

True that, hopefully Gold will get in there and beast him!

Triangulation wrote:

Gretgael1 wrote:

rodders wrote:For Ireland:

Simon Zebo, Dan Tuohy, Declan Fitzpatrick and perhaps Richardt Strauss. Chris Henry and Darren Cave maybe. Dave Kearney maybe too but much will depend on injuries.

The problem with Ireland is that under Kidney none of these players will be likely in the starting 15, barring injuries. Tuohy and Fitzpatrick should definitely get minutes from the bench, Strauss won't see the bench with Best and Cronin in front of him, Henry will more than likely be in a race with POM for his seat, and Zebo, Kearney Jnr and Cave all depend on who is available.

I would love to see a fresh face in the match day squad, a Madigan, Spence, Henderson, D Ryan or Hanrahan. Of course, there's a lot of rugby to be played before the 6 nations so it all depends on if they see game time and actually preform in the Rabo/Hcup.

Oh god spare me !

You still having nightmares about Nevin Spents Tri?

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Carpe Diem wrote:

bluestonevedder wrote:James Short is a brilliant shout Beshocked. He is such a great little player- you see him in the 7s?? Unbelievable performace. I would love to see him given crack actually, replacing Ashton possibly. He's fast and agile, but is also so tenacios, it's great. England could do with some physciality on the wings, and he might be the man for the job.

Never new that was sports enhancing

Oops, just come back and seen this! Obviously, I'm hoping he doesn't take pre-season dietry training tips from Matt Stevens. But, I would like to see him given a decent run in an England shirt!

GeordieFalcon wrote:

Cumbrian wrote:On topic, I think it is difficult to know who will come in, particularly in places like the back-row. Take Carl Fearns, his inclusion it will very much depend on the fitness of Croft, Dowson and Wood. The squad is getting to be fairly settled and I wouldn't expect there to be a massive number of changes.


Definite:

Joe Marler
Alex Goode

Likely:

Thomas Waldrom (Don't think he has played in the 6N?)
Carl Fearns
Jon Joseph
Charlie Sharples
Anthony Allen
Tom Youngs

Long Shots: (I've included a lot, but I'm thinking it will be one or two of them at the most, to account for injuries)

Henry Thomas
Christian Wade
Rob Miller
Billy Twelvetrees
Graham Kitchener
Matt Kvesic
Jamie Gibson
Jonny May
Tom Biggs
Miles Benjamin
Nick Abendanon
George Ford


I've stuck to picking players from the EPS and Saxons. When you seriously look at the Saxons, you really realise how many young/ new caps we've got in there!

Marra i think it could be down to his own fitness aswell. He looks totally unconditioned...hopefully a good pre season and regular games will sort that out.

I agree totally with you about youngsters...we have introduced a whole host recently...and now we're looking for even more...

Lets give this batch a go first...then maybe look at fringe players like May, Wade etc...

Where o where are our big smashemback locks?

When will we resemble an England rugby side again as opposed to a poor man's australian side?

England do have some great young guys coming through, though more backs than forwards...however the question is do we have the selectorial wit to pick the players with the ability/potential and the required coaches with the vision to hang it all together? The jury is out but personally I think massive progress has to be made over the next 9 games or the top man should go.

Seperately to all that guff I am interested to see how the two league boys, Tomkins & Eastmond do, not that I expect either to force they way into international contention - Saxons maybe.

Key for England will be the Premiership performances of the second rows:

Attwood, Lawes, Parling, Robson, Kitchener, Slater, Palmer, Matthews, Launchbury.
Even players like Olly Kohn ...who always seem to do well...adding the bulk to compliment Robson.

123456789 wrote:Based on last years club performances and junior world cup. What is your prediction for players playing there first Six nations?
For Scotland I'd have:
Certain:
Grant
Visser
Ryder
Likely:
Harley
MacInally
Dunbar
Brown
Possible:
Fusaro
Gilchrist
MacKenzie
Long-shot:
Bennett
Farndale
Leonard

Numbahs generally a good shout, have to disagree about Ryder being certain though. Think AR will stick with his 3 established second rows unless there is an injury.

Ryder will also face challenge from Gilchrist and Swinson so I agree isn't a certain.

Don't think we'll see McInally in a Scotland jersey this season. Denton, Talei and the new Georgian chap will probably limit his chances in an Edinburgh jersey this season.

I'd promote Dunbar to a likely. I think he'll provide a stern challenge to Scott this season as an option at 12, provided Toonie doesn't plonk Morrison there.

I think MacInally could really push Talei this year and isn't Detnon a 6 for Edinbrugh?

I thought Talei wasn't playing for Edinburgh next season?

Rory_Gallagher wrote:I thought Talei wasn't playing for Edinburgh next season?

First I've heard of it if that's true.

123456789 wrote:I think MacInally could really push Talei this year and isn't Detnon a 6 for Edinbrugh?

Denton is only a 6 because Talei was outstanding at 8 last season. Denton is a top class 8 in his own right, as he's shown for Scotland.

If Talei is injured, I think either Denton or Basilia would play 8 ahead of McInally. You could have McInally at 6, but for Scotland both Kelly Brown and Ali Strokosch (after a mighty summer tour) will be ahead of him.