Mark James - Does he get too much flak for Brookline???

10-6 going into the singles by outflanking Crenshaw....who looking back had one of the best US teams that I can remember....

Parnevik said to Monty over breakfast on singles morning "How do we get the points we need from these matches".......So let's face it, that suggests taking the three rookies out who would've been underdogs no matter who they played, they were the inferior time on paper anyway!!

James with an inferior team had given the Europeans a four point lead..a lead they had to have... to have a chance of winning!!

Let's also remember that Olazabal fell apart against Leonard when four up with seven to play which basically cost Europe the cup!!!

Maggert thrashed Clarke...Lehman - Westwood...Duval-Parnevik.....

Had the rookies played one game over the preceding days would they have done better????

James took a gamble against a stronger team and nearly succeeded...

History is way too unkind!!!

Does Mark James get any flak for Brookline?

He got plenty for not blooding his rookies....ie 10-6 = 10-9....

maybe you're too young to remember..

i'll forgive you.

Trussman

You post a decent enough thread and then you act like an arse. Maybe try sticking with the first bit but dropping second?

Forget it lads, this guy is just a clown who knows absolutely nothing about golf.

The title is wrong! It says does Mark James get too much flak for Brookline??? If it said "did" there might be a discussion, which I wouldn't waste my time on anyway, because it's ancient history!

I'm open to debate.......

Super-realist please move on..you're just a silly boy who abuses everyone.....go away you've no place on here..

As for golfer martin..he has been widely condemned for not playing the rookies ..

Van der velde
Faldo
Ballesteros and the media in general..have all moaned about him..

If you can't offer an opinion without abusing please grow up.

I'm generally surprised that their are so many posters on the golf board who's sole aim is to abuse...

expected better....

Truss, I've been on here since day one. You are just another johnny come lately who pops up from time to time, usually around majors/Ryder Cup with the sole purpose of trying to be a WUM, but just ends up showing how little he/she knows about Golf, or sport in general in your case. We used to have one under multiple pseudonyms called Max/Simba/Keizo. You sound like you are cut of precisely the same cloth.

If we're talking about silly boys, I'm not the one who sends provocative PM's to fellow forum members as you have just done to me. So if anyone is sad, lonely and has too much time on their hands, it's you, not I, and you that clearly needs to grow up.

Super, who cares how many posts a user has made or for how long they have been posting. This is a decent enough question so lets not get all protectionist and answer with a bit of respect. If TRUSS has sent you a PM, he is probably just at the same stage of exasperation with you that I was during the period I sent you PM's in the hope I could change your ways.


I have hear many well regarded posters like Kwini and prince question the wisdom of not playing the weaker players until the singles. So it seems fair enough to ask whether it is a legitimate strategy to leave some players on the bench until the last day. Maybe it makes no difference whether you play these players or not.

I would like to see stats on rookies performance in the singles after they have played/not played?

It probably has more to do with the quality of the rookie and depth of the team. If

Mac, No one, including you has any business PM'ing anyone in regard to their opinions/posts, even although I find yours particularly hilarious there simply is no place for it. You aren't a mod, so shouldn't be doing Mods business.

Truss (an amusing name) had said I should go home and that I had no place here. Hence why I said that I've been here since day one, so I'm clearly more established than he. That was the point especially as his agenda is as clear as his ravings are loopy.

Try reading what he's said before trying to hit me with the same brush or you are no better than he.

I think Andrew Coltart's pick was a mistake. When you've already got 6 rookies in your team, picking a 7th seems like a faux pas.

I do think some of these decisions though are hero if it goes right or plonker if it goes wrong. Is the order for the singles just in the lap of the gods? Some players are lauded for putting their big players out first. They all get hot, 3 points out of 4 and you're on your way. Send those top 4 out first and the putt don't drop, a few wild shops and you only get 0.5 and you've got your less guns, the rookies out on the course.

I imagine you would probably score a similiar number of points if you put 12 names in a hat and then put them out in the order you draw them than if you sat there for days delibarating the order.

No.He doesn't get enough stick in my opinion. He knackered out most of the team & alienated 3 others by the singles. The writing was on the wall.The Americans were always going to be pumped on that last day & the Europeans were totally unprepared. Worst Ryder Cup captain ever by a mile.

Only marginally worse than Faldo

I was expecting that S_R!

A better question may be do the Americans get enough flak for Brookline?

Joking aside, he may have taken a bit of stick at the time hes hardly still getting it though is he. That said, James and Faldo where utterly terrible captains.

Absolutely NOT the worst Ryder Cup ever. One of the best, IMO. Major comeback always makes for excellent drama.

I can't remember James getting the amount of stick Faldo got. Two reasons:-

1) The press hate Faldo & couldn't wait for him to slip up.

2) James's incompetence was overlooked because of the behaviour of certain US players & the crowd on the last day.

Had we won, James had been a freaking genious for playing his cards correctly.

James had no choice, he did have a very week team.
Coltard totally lost form between being picked and playing.
The eight players must have been tired and when the momentum swing nothing could stop it. We all kinow how that feels.
Very exciting match and great win for the US.

In my opinion he did have choices. He should have played all 3 of those rookies with someone more experienced in 4 ball. This way the rookie could have tasted the experience before the final day, he could relax a bit more & be aggressive as it was 4 ball, the other players would have had a break & not been so tired on that last day & the rookies may have been more prepared.
I think all 3 of those players were capable of getting birdies.
The way he went about things was an accident clearly waiting to happen & showed no tactical nouse at all. He has been part of many ryder cups & should have known :-

A) How much the whole week takes out of you

B) How different the whole experience is.

Those 3 rookies must have felt worthless going into the singles & probably felt 3 down before the start!

Faldono1fan wrote:...Those 3 rookies must have felt worthless going into the singles & probably felt 3 down before the start!

Indeed. Faldo was still pretty bad with his stint though .

....& he gets plenty of stick for it.....Most of it undeserved.

Seems ridiculous to pick coltart if he already had loadsa rookies. Who else was up for a pick?
Still nowhere near as bad as Faldo. James knew what countries the rookies were from at least!

Really? So when he picked Poulter above Monty & Poults scored the most points on either team that made him worse than a captain who made the worst strategic errors in ryder cup history? What can you do when players like Harrington,Garcia & Westy didn't even turn up?

Faldono1fan wrote:....& he gets plenty of stick for it.....Most of it undeserved.

He himself admits he made mistakes.. see Independent Article

Whether or not the degree of stick he got for making mistakes is justified, is a somewhat subjective measure, but suffice to say, his prickly relationship with the press prior to it didn't help his cause.

As for the original discussion re Mark James..same thing applies. If you put your head above the parapet, someone is likely to take a shot at you if you don't win.

Faldo's timing was terrible. He told Westwood he wouldn't be playing in the next game midway through his round with Hanson.

Faldo = Glenn Hoddle.

Surely James big faux pas was selecting Coltart over Langer and then excluding him? Langer might not have been at the top of his form but would surely have done better.

Think James ended up getting carried away with the early success, very funny lines in pressers etc. Then he turned back into a jerk in the space of six hours, having snatched defeat from victory. Too bad.

It's almost a good thing that James and Faldo failed as I doubt there would be much appetite for the Ryder Cup today, certainly from an American standpoint.

USA have won precious few Ryder Cups recently, so if they'd only won once since 1985 (which would have been the case if James and Faldo had succeded) would the event just be another tinpot Presidents Cup?

Lets face it its completely hypothetical that Faldos captaincy had any bearing on the result of the match. They came up against a very good home team who were fired up for a win. Would a different captain have changed that, maybe, maybe not.

"Would a different captain have changed that"

No, the captian makes no impact on the outcome of the match unless they make a very dumb assed captains pick.

I think it does make a difference if a team wants to win for the Captain. It maybe shouldn't because they are all professional golfers and pride in their own performance should be enough. But I don't think Faldo was able to get the team to play for him, for whatever reason. Conversely, in Celtic Manor the team really busted a gut when their backs were against the wall. Don't profess to understand the pschology of it, but it seems to be the case.. Olympians are always saying what a difference it makes when fellow team members start bringing medals back to the team HQ, it makes others want it more. Similar scenario.

I take your point Golfmartin but at Celtic Manor they also had huge home support cheering them on.......something else the Olympians commented on as helping them.....whereas Faldos team had a partisan American crowd to contend with which wouldnt have helped.

Maybe Sandy Lyle should have got in instead of Faldo that year?

McLaren wrote:"Would a different captain have changed that"

No, the captian makes no impact on the outcome of the match unless they make a very dumb assed captains pick.

Oh well, you won't mind if they put Gok Wan in charge of Manchester United then?

Oh well, you won't mind if they put Gok Wan in charge of Manchester United then?

Not sure ryder cup captain and football manager are comparable. But really anyone could have success with a player like Carrick in the team.

It hink its harsh to compare Gok Wan and Alex Ferguson. One of them is an intelligent, thoughtful amusing man and the other is......Alex Ferguson.

i think you meant this Diggers -

None of them is intelligent, thoughtful amusing

I dont mind Gok Wan, he's a bit out there (to say the least) but he seems like a decent enough bloke. Small doses only obviously.

Bit of a mincer though Diggers, (sorry, girlfriend)

What do you mean by mincer Super?


As I have said before I think Gok seems like a really nice guy and someone you could have a lot of fun with.

His over-acted effeminate affectations Mac, as annoying as a forced Jamaican Patwa on a middle class white boy or Tim Westwood's fake gansta accent.

If you are gay, just be gay. You don't have to mince it up for effect.

Constantly telling random women the have "great bangers" does get annoying

Who really cares if someone camps it up a bit, I dont even think he is that guilty of being overly mincey when he speaks. I know plenty of people who are the same with their accent, like every word they say has to scream look at me Im from Yourkshire or Wales or wherever. Cant really see why being gay is any different, its better than being Welsh anyway.

Always thought Bangers & Gash would be a good name for a top shelf mag.

super_realist wrote:Always thought Bangers & Gash would be a good name for a top shelf mag.

Sounds like it'd be one step down from Razzle, though. Or so I'm told.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:I'm generally surprised that their are so many posters on the golf board who's sole aim is to abuse...

expected better....

This was my first impression of the golf boards too.