Scotland - front row crisis for AIs

With the nasty looking injury to Murray Low playing for the Warriors last night we (Scotland (& The Warriors))now have 4 front row players out - not including Fergus Thompson who retired through injury last season. It means that Robinson will have to play Geoff Cross at t/head and probably Jacobsen at loose (old pals act as usual with him). Geoff will no doubt be glad its only the ABs and the Boks he has to face rather than the destructive power of the Romanians who took him apart at RWC 11. With His Holiness Murray still not playing on Sunday we could be in deep do do here - I of course mean even deeper do do than if Low and co were fit.

loose head prop we are ok for Scotland as there is chunk, ryan grant and a few others but i'd agree if Low is injured then it is a bit worrying for the all blacks game. With it being a sunday it rules murray out so probable tight head bench spot will be Kalman i'd think unless they went for Bruce Douglas.

It's a situation completely of the SRU's own making and one that anyone with any sense would have avoided. They'll be capping me before you know it. That or repeating Hadden's master stroke of starting Dickinson at tight-head. I guess Scotland having a set-piece doesn't really matter seeing as de Luca will shriek like a girl and throw the ball into the stand the second the ball comes near him.

Cryptoyourisan wrote:It's a situation completely of the SRU's own making and one that anyone with any sense would have avoided.

Ah yes, I forgot that Dodson hired a hit man to injure all of our props.

Ryan Grant, Ross Ford and Geoff Cross are the incumbents. I dont see whats wrong with that front row. Sure Cross isnt known as the best scrummager around, but on the few instances he hasnt had the ruck inspector kellock providing "power" from behind, hes shown himself to be solid enough.

But of course, I forgot that the scottish contingent on this forum have become the tin foil hat wearing brigade. Its all some ploy by Robinson in his dastardly plan... get a grip.

edit: should add that cross has been part of a dominant scrum this season.

21st actually i dont think that Low's injury makes things much worse as Robinson has clearly decided he isnt up to playing for Scotland. Remember he was the only member of the world cup squad that never pulled on a jersey let along got one minute of playing time.

I now fully expect Al Dickinson who is a a vital part of the worst scrum in the AP at Sale to be on the bench for the AB's. Never foget that Hadden told us that he could play tight head cause he wasnt killed by the scrum machine!

How he actually managed to live through that test in Paris is still a mystery to me. Also remember that Robinson took Dickinson ahead of Ryan Grant to New Zealand who had enjoyed an excellent season with Glasgow because Dickinson had experience, well experience of being mince.

Because Dickinson can allegedly play both sides of the scrum he will be the bench prop for the AI's. It still sends a shudder down my spine when i think about the one scrum in the Argentina match that Dickinson played at three.

Jon Welsh would now be competing for the 3 shirt if he hadnt got injured in the summer.
As for the previous comment about Cross being a part of a dominant Edinburgh scrum. The main part he plays is cheering on WP Nell from the bench.

He was part of one of our penalty tries, and started during the mullering of cardiff. A wee bit more than cheering from the bench, but of course dont let facts get in the way!

sensisball wrote:Because Dickinson can allegedly play both sides of the scrum he will be the bench prop for the AI's. It still sends a shudder down my spine when i think about the one scrum in the Argentina match that Dickinson played at three.

I thought that from the new season so now in NH, January in SH, matchday squads for Internationals are now 23 - so a full front row on the bench.

Still the fact is Cross was utter gash at RWC 11

Yep the Match day squads at international level is now 23 man squads with 2 props so will have a specialist loose head and specialist tight head on the bench. Chunk will probably be the specialist loose head but if low is out then not sure who will fill in, Ed Kalman i'd imagine.

Kalman is also injured at present ffs

And also remember Cross made one world class selection - as tight head for the merde team of the tournament RWC 11 - courtesy of the late lamented blood and mud !!!!

I had forgotten about two props on the bench this season. I would expect Robinson to start Cross and Jacobsen with Grant and Dickinson on the bench. With Low and Kalman both injured and Murray in church there is no-one else, or do we have any other recent International props i forgot about?

Oh and please forgive me re Cross i forgot he was part of the humbling of the mighty Cardiff scrum, he will of course continue to be the first choice 3 at Embro as Nell is clearly an inferior scrummager.

Jeez the Embra front row - we are doomed, doomed ah tell ye !!!!

Crypto - should have mentioned the other Scot in the merde team of RWC 11 was - you guessed it Knock on Nick De Luca

Surely this says a lot about the glasgow front row aswell then? The only two players from the west that should be anywhere near the Scotland side are Grant and Welsh.

Moray Low was never really in contention anyway, hes regressed since 2009, so im really not sure what point youre trying to make other than your usual attention seeking conspiracy theories.

I don't think our first choice front row will be affected much, it's purely the reserve tighthead against New Zealand that is the worry.

Against New Zealand it will be Chunk/Grant, Ford, Cross which not many people would have argued against with Murray being out. Chunk or Grant on the bench is good loose head cover.

South Africa we can bring Murray in if we need to.

So who benches at tightdhead against the best team in the world then? I'd probably rather an actual tighthead over Dickinson playing, even if it is Ed Kalman or whichever Glasgow tightead is fit....!

Imperialbigdave wrote:

Cryptoyourisan wrote:It's a situation completely of the SRU's own making and one that anyone with any sense would have avoided.

Ah yes, I forgot that Dodson hired a hit man to injure all of our props.

And to hire players who aren't eligible for Scotland to compete for places in Scotland's two professional teams at a time when Scottish front-row representation in English and French clubs is negligible so as to possibly expand our options for three years' time, i.e. a bit late in the day to be developing the RWC 2015 team anyway. Prudent man-management techniques at the SRU prevail once again.

RDW_Scotland wrote:I don't think our first choice front row will be affected much, it's purely the reserve tighthead against New Zealand that is the worry.

Against New Zealand it will be Chunk/Grant, Ford, Cross which not many people would have argued against with Murray being out. Chunk or Grant on the bench is good loose head cover.

South Africa we can bring Murray in if we need to.

So who benches at tightdhead against the best team in the world then? I'd probably rather an actual tighthead over Dickinson playing, even if it is Ed Kalman or whichever Glasgow tightead is fit....!

Kalman is out injured. It shouldn't be Dickinson, has he played at all for Sale this season? Simply have to tell Cross he's playing 80 minutes

Cryptoyourisan wrote:

Imperialbigdave wrote:

Cryptoyourisan wrote:It's a situation completely of the SRU's own making and one that anyone with any sense would have avoided.

Ah yes, I forgot that Dodson hired a hit man to injure all of our props.

And to hire players who aren't eligible for Scotland to compete for places in Scotland's two professional teams at a time when Scottish front-row representation in English and French clubs is negligible so as to possibly expand our options for three years' time, i.e. a bit late in the day to be developing the RWC 2015 team anyway. Prudent man-management techniques at the SRU prevail once again.

Because we have so many pro12 standard scottish props sitting twiddling their thumbs...

Agreed - yes Edinburgh have brought in a Saffer tighthead but who is the 3rd choice? Lewis Niven who, although still young ish (24) is average at best at Rabbo standard.

Having also seen him on nights our reekin and smoking he's obviously not a finely tuned athlete either!

You can tell Cross he's playing 80 minutes all you want until McCaw ends him and he goes off injured!

Imperialbigdave wrote:

Cryptoyourisan wrote:

Imperialbigdave wrote:

Cryptoyourisan wrote:It's a situation completely of the SRU's own making and one that anyone with any sense would have avoided.

Ah yes, I forgot that Dodson hired a hit man to injure all of our props.

And to hire players who aren't eligible for Scotland to compete for places in Scotland's two professional teams at a time when Scottish front-row representation in English and French clubs is negligible so as to possibly expand our options for three years' time, i.e. a bit late in the day to be developing the RWC 2015 team anyway. Prudent man-management techniques at the SRU prevail once again.

Because we have so many pro12 standard scottish props sitting twiddling their thumbs...

We're not going to develop more by ignoring the problem and bringing in nth-rate foreigners. The Pro12 is the weakest, major professional league in the world for front-row play so, if anything, it is probably a better place to blood inexperienced and younger players than competing leagues. Additionally, the Welsh teams are bleeding quality props to England and France and the Irish teams hardly need to field a full-strength XV to be dominant in the Pro12. I don't really see the long-term benefit in giving John Yapp, Mike Cusack, WP Nel and Andy Titterall game time when places are so few.

Fair enough Cusack was the best prop in Scotland last season but by the time he qualifies for Scotland he'll be 29-30. Nel will be a similar age. Scotland will be lucky to get a few years each of out them. Is bringing in a no-name Tongan prop really more constructive than giving a shot to a club player?