Pro 12, Round 10: Munster v Glasgow Warriors - build-up & match day thread

[George Carlin]

Right then: 5th place versus 3rd place

Munster Rugby v Glasgow Warriors

Saturday 1st December 2012, KO 19:45
Thomond Park Stadium

Form:

25/11/12 Munster 6 - 13 Scarlets
2/11/12 Blues 18 - 24 Munster
26/10/12 Munster 29 - 3 Zebre

23/11/12 Glasgow 0 - 6 Leinster
2/11/12 Glasgow 37 - 6 Dragons
27/10/12 Treviso 13 - 24 Glasgow

Teams:

Munster

F Jones
D Howlett capt
K Earls
J Downey
S Zebo
R O’Gara
D Williams
D Kilcoyne
M Sherry
BJ Botha
D O’Callaghan
D Ryan
CJ Stander
T O’Donnell
J Coughlan

Replacements:
D Varley
W du Preez
S Archer
B Holland
P Butler
P Stringer
I Keatley
C Laulala

Glasgow

15. Peter Murchie
14. Sean Lamont
13. Stuart Hogg
12. Peter Horne
11. DTH Van Der Merwe

10. Duncan Weir
9. Henry Pyrgos

1. Ryan Grant
2. Dougie Hall
3. Mike Cusack
4. Tim Swinson
5. Al Kellock (Capt.)
6. Rob Harley
7. John Barclay
8. Ryan Wilson

16. Pat MacArthur
17. Moray Low
18. Gordon Reid
19. Josh Strauss
20. James Eddie
21. Niko Matawalu
22. Scott Wight
23. Byron McGuigan

Waffle:

Both teams snapped winning streaks last week - Munster a 2 gamer and Glasgow a 6 gamer.

Large number of international players return for both sides this week:

(a) For Munster Keith Earls, Simon Zebo, Ronan O'Gara, Donncha O'Callaghan, Donncha Ryan, and the newest internationalist of all, Dave Kilcoyne drop into the starting line up.

(b) For Glasgow the most notable inclusions are Pyrgos, Grant and Kellock with Ryan Wilson's form enough to kick everyone's favourite beardy Mr Strauss to the bench. Duncan 'Meatball' Weir returns to fly half after the best part of three months out with injury.

[funnyExiledScot]

Big ask for Glasgow this, always is going to Munster, and I wonder whether Kellock, Lamont and Hogg will go back into the side. They may be rested, but I'm sure Munster may similarly miss the odd player here and there.

Would love to see Maitland involved.

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

Massive ask, but a fairly inexperienced Scarlets side has just shown the way - cant believe there won't be a backlash from the Munster players after last weekend tho

[Golden]

Has maitland played for Glasgow yet?

[Jenifer McLadyboy]

give him a chance. he only arived in the city today.

[123456789]

I'm hoping for:
15. Hogg
14. Van De Merwe
13. Bennett
12. Dunbar
11. Maitland
10. Weir
9. Matawulu
8. Strauss
7. Fusaro
6. Harley
5. Kellock
4. Ryder
3. Low
2. MacArthur
1. Grant

16. Reid
17. Hall
18. Cusack
19. Swinson
20. Barclay
21. Pyrgos
22. Jackson
23. Lamont
In reality I don't expect Bennett and Maitland to start, and I'm not sure if Grant and Weir are completely fit. Seeing all those players makes me think how good Glasgow would be if Richie Gray had stayed, I bet he's regretting leaving now.

Slightly off thread but would Glasgow's starting line up when all are fit and on form be the best of all Scottish professional teams ever?

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

Numbers, I think so

[123456789]

Makes you wonder how good they'd be if they'd kept Euan Murray, Johnnie Beattie, Kelly Brown and Richie Vernon. They'd probably be competing for the Heineken cup, or maybe just the Rabodirect

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

I would be surprised if Hogg, Lamont, Grant and Kellock are involved at all. Barclay, Hall and Pygros may make the trip but I would guess Hall might.

Maitland has just arrived and has been carrying an injury, I would give him a few weeks to get ready for his debut against Edinburgh. If he is fit and is added to the HC then maybe get him involved for the home HC match, to help the profile of that dead rubber. Bennett will be in the mix.

Weir should be back. Could we see the return of Rory Lamont?

[UlstermaninGlasgow]

In fairness Numbers they've done well to replace Brown with Big Bob, Murray with Low/Cusack, JB with Strauss and Vernon with Wilson... Not actually sure they're any weaker without them... Which is weird. I reckon if they had not had the injuries they suffered in the first month of the season they would be a lot closer to Saint/Ulster in the Heino. Next year?

[Scot Abroad]

What's the deal with the internationals playing this week. Are they allowed or do we have to wait another week? If not then it'll probably be

1 Reid
2 McArthur
3 Cooooo
4 Ryder
5 Swinson
6 Harley
7 Fusaro
8 Strauss
9 Niko
10 Wight
11 DTH
12 Horne
13 Dunbar
14 Seymour
15 Murchie

[UlstermaninGlasgow]

ScotAbroad

You'd have Clyde at TH?? Not that I'm saying he's not built for it but I have a funny suspicion he'll be working somewhere else that night... Like Crosshouse Hospital... Unless you meant Big Mike?

[George Carlin]

What do Staggy and all of the Munster folks think that their team will be?

Has there been a formal statement about whether the interntionalists will be returning or is this decided on a case by case basis?

I see that James Coughlan and Tommy O'Donnell are set to get a bench place at least and that Ronan O'Gara, Simon Zebo, Keith Earls, Dave Kilcoyne, Donncha O'Callaghan and Donnacha Ryan all trained at Thomond yesterday which means that they may well be involved.

Peter O'Mahony and Conor Murray were also there but apparently sat out the session.

[VinceWLB]

Makes you wonder how good they'd be if they'd kept Euan Murray, Johnnie Beattie, Kelly Brown and Richie Vernon. They'd probably be competing for the Heineken cup, or maybe just the Rabodirect

Sorry but what a stupid post, Wilson was ahead of Beattie last year, Harley is going to be as good if not better than Brown, and well Strauss and Cusack are twice the players that respectively Vernon and Murray are.

Maybe only Gray is a loss but i would argue he doesn't add much grunt up front something you expect from a big hard nosed 2nd row.

[Scot Abroad]

ScotAbroad

You'd have Clyde at TH?? Not that I'm saying he's not built for it but I have a funny suspicion he'll be working somewhere else that night... Like Crosshouse Hospital... Unless you meant Big Mike?

I was hoping he'd be available for this one as we could do with his horns in the scrum to put pressure on the Munster loosehead. If he's unavailable then I guess Mike will have to do.

Also hearing murmurings that Maitland is fit. Bench spot a possibility?

[pete (buachaill on eirne)]

I think with a big game against Saracens next week Munster will want to build up some momentum

Kilcoyne-Sherry-Botha
DOC-Ryan
Coughlan-TOD-Stander
Williams-ROG
Downey-Lualala
Zebo-Jones-Howlett

Not sure on that back row or hooker but would guess that would be the team

[123456789]

Makes you wonder how good they'd be if they'd kept Euan Murray, Johnnie Beattie, Kelly Brown and Richie Vernon. They'd probably be competing for the Heineken cup, or maybe just the Rabodirect

Sorry but what a stupid post, Wilson was ahead of Beattie last year, Harley is going to be as good if not better than Brown, and well Strauss and Cusack are twice the players that respectively Vernon and Murray are.

Maybe only Gray is a loss but i would argue he doesn't add much grunt up front something you expect from a big hard nosed 2nd row.

I was thinking from a squad depth perspective, Leinster are so good because of their depth and ability to rotate, they have a lot of quality in each position and if Glasgow didn't keep losing players as well as signing them then they could have one of Europe's top teams.

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

Makes you wonder how good they'd be if they'd kept Euan Murray, Johnnie Beattie, Kelly Brown and Richie Vernon. They'd probably be competing for the Heineken cup, or maybe just the Rabodirect

Sorry but what a stupid post, Wilson was ahead of Beattie last year, Harley is going to be as good if not better than Brown, and well Strauss and Cusack are twice the players that respectively Vernon and Murray are.

Maybe only Gray is a loss but i would argue he doesn't add much grunt up front something you expect from a big hard nosed 2nd row.

I was thinking from a squad depth perspective, Leinster are so good because of their depth and ability to rotate, they have a lot of quality in each position and if Glasgow didn't keep losing players as well as signing them then they could have one of Europe's top teams.

Agree about Struass v Vernon but not Cusack v Murray, certainly not by the amount you suggest.

Point is even with increased budgets had we kept Brown, Gray etc. We would not have kept or signed others.

Certainly glad Beattie is gone, his attitude is not missed! Vernon is a good example of someone who earned a number of caps and a good deal down South on the back of a few good games, fair play to him!

[George Carlin]

Dorothy - do you think that the internationalists will be back and we'll see Maitland get a hit out?

[George Carlin]

[ignore]

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

Don't think those who played 3 of the internstionals will play. Pygros and Hall could be on the bench.

Maitland is in contention for the bench.

[VinceWLB]

Makes you wonder how good they'd be if they'd kept Euan Murray, Johnnie Beattie, Kelly Brown and Richie Vernon. They'd probably be competing for the Heineken cup, or maybe just the Rabodirect

Sorry but what a stupid post, Wilson was ahead of Beattie last year, Harley is going to be as good if not better than Brown, and well Strauss and Cusack are twice the players that respectively Vernon and Murray are.

Maybe only Gray is a loss but i would argue he doesn't add much grunt up front something you expect from a big hard nosed 2nd row.

I was thinking from a squad depth perspective, Leinster are so good because of their depth and ability to rotate, they have a lot of quality in each position and if Glasgow didn't keep losing players as well as signing them then they could have one of Europe's top teams.

Fair enough.

Though in terms of forwards i think Glasgow have very good depth (not many teams has a 4th choice loosehead as good as Ofa!), except maybe in the 2nd row where they seems to have only three players (makes you wonder why Campbell doesn't get gametime really).

As for Cusack and Murray, on current form Cusack would walk into the Scottish team and i reckon he would be on the English squad if he was playing in the premiership.
I think Murray has become too erratic one scrum he will be great the next one horrible.

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

I thought Ofa was pretty poor in the scrum last week when he was on. Got pinged for a couple of pens and was lucky the ref did not penalise him a few times more.

Decent impact player, but can't see his contract being extended when Welsh is back.

[caz]

Teams up,

15, Murchie 14. Lamont 13. Hogg. 12. Horne. 11. DTH 10. Weir 9. Pyrgos

1. Grant 2. Hall 3. Cusack 4. Swinson 5. Kellock (capt.) 6. Harley 7. Barclay 8. Wilson

Subs: MacArthur, Low, Reid, Strauss, Eddie, Matawalu, Wight and McGuigan

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

Teams up,

15, Murchie 14. Lamont 13. Hogg. 12. Horne. 11. DTH 10. Weir 9. Pyrgos

1. Grant 2. Hall 3. Cusack 4. Swinson 5. Kellock (capt.) 6. Harley 7. Barclay 8. Wilson

Subs: MacArthur, Low, Reid, Strauss, Eddie, Matawalu, Wight and McGuigan

Surprised to see so many internationals playing, good show! Matawalu, MOM in his last Warriors match and is dropped!

[George Carlin]

Is it a burd?
Is it a plane?
No. It's the Return of the Meatball.

[Captain_Sensible]

That is a strong team. It's great to see Weir back, and I'm interested in how Hogg will get on at 13.

Still no proper lock cover on the bench, I see. Has Campbell peed in Toonie's cornflakes?

[caz]

Surprised to see so many internationals playing, good show!

It'll be interesting to see how they play this week.

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

That is a strong team. It's great to see Weir back, and I'm interested in how Hogg will get on at 13.

Still no proper lock cover on the bench, I see. Has Campbell peed in Toonie's cornflakes?

Not just Campbell, Ryder is missing as well and he is not listed as injured. Seems to be that coaches like having two back row options on the bench, with Eddie able to cover lock if injuries happen.

[George Carlin]

Jedi is looking increasingly pedestrian in that Glasgow squad.

Murchie needs a big game this week because he did feck all the last time he was on the pitch.

How much longer before Sick Note Lamont comes back to take the 15 jersey?

[EST]

Strong team, with good impact from the bench. Toonie freshening up the midfield, which has looked a bit stagnant of late. I would have been happier to have seen Dunbar at 12, for his added balast against Laulala and Downey.

Happy to start with Pyrgos and Wilson - Matawalu and Strauss offer huge impact from the bench.

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

How much longer before Sick Note Lamont comes back to take the 15 jersey?

Been back in light training for a couple of weeks. Doubt he will be back till the Edinburgh games.

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

Strong team, with good impact from the bench. Toonie freshening up the midfield, which has looked a bit stagnant of late. I would have been happier to have seen Dunbar at 12, for his added balast against Laulala and Downey.

Happy to start with Pyrgos and Wilson - Matawalu and Strauss offer huge impact from the bench.

Dunbar is injured.

[EST]

Strong team, with good impact from the bench. Toonie freshening up the midfield, which has looked a bit stagnant of late. I would have been happier to have seen Dunbar at 12, for his added balast against Laulala and Downey.

Happy to start with Pyrgos and Wilson - Matawalu and Strauss offer huge impact from the bench.

Dunbar is injured.

Cheers, DM. I have a feeling we might miss his physicality this week. Horne and Hogg are a pretty electric combination though.

[George Carlin]

OP amended to reflect the annoucement of both teams.

Internationalists well and truly back for both sides.

[funnyExiledScot]

Only 2 NSQs in that starting XV - pretty healthy.

Delighted to see Mr Weir return. He has a great opportunity to put in a run of games here, and win that 10 jersey for the 6 Nations. Basic competence is the threshold for selection currently!

[Jenifer McLadyboy]

Jaysus. What has happened to Munster 606 posters? I see about 4 Leinster posters on this thread and the rest Scots.

What's the fecken crack? It's a home game and everything.

[rodders]

Fairweather fans.....

Huge game for Munster here too. Lose this and they are looking down a barrel I think.

[Jenifer McLadyboy]

They won't lose this one..........surely.

[rodders]

I thought the same last week Jen.... make or break for Penney over the next few weeks I think.

Interesting comments by CJ Stander there in the Times about him wanting to play for Ireland....apparantly he was told he was too small to play backrow in SA!

[Jenifer McLadyboy]

He is. But I wouldn't tell him to his face.

[George Carlin]

Those O'Saffers are getting everywhere. /

[Jenifer McLadyboy]

Jaysus. What has happened to Munster 606 posters? I see about 4 Leinster posters on this thread and the rest Scots.

What's the fecken crack? It's a home game and everything.

Ahh. I've just learned that there was some class of a row here last week and all of the Munster posters and many others have legged it.
Pity. I think that it is good to have a broad spread of opinion from as many sources as possible.

[rodders]

Jaysus. What has happened to Munster 606 posters? I see about 4 Leinster posters on this thread and the rest Scots.

What's the fecken crack? It's a home game and everything.

Ahh. I've just learned that there was some class of a row here last week and all of the Munster posters and many others have legged it.
Pity. I think that it is good to have a broad spread of opinion from as many sources as possible.

Really Jen? I know there was a huge on Sunday but didn't think it would have involved the Munster boys? Thought it was about the Hore incident?

[Jenifer McLadyboy]

where are they then?

[rodders]

Well Staggy has been off for a while. Billser was in earlier in the week, Sin e popped in there briefly on the Ulster thread... the others no idea but to be honest the Munster threads have been quiet for a while now... its a shame really, the Munster lads are great craic.

[profitius]

Jaysus. What has happened to Munster 606 posters? I see about 4 Leinster posters on this thread and the rest Scots.

What's the fecken crack? It's a home game and everything.

Ahh. I've just learned that there was some class of a row here last week and all of the Munster posters and many others have legged it.
Pity. I think that it is good to have a broad spread of opinion from as many sources as possible.

I'm Munsters spokesperson.

What row took place? Don't they row everyday anyway.

I think the main reason theres a lack of fans lately is because theres nothing to talk about or get excited about. Its been all Ireland the past few weeks and last weeks game was a write off because of the weather. The HEC is starting up shortly too. I'm optimistic about where things are going under Rob Penney. He has Munster playing a brand of rugby thats miles better than last years even though some pundits have criticised it. Munster are still adapting to it and I think it'll take another few months at least and possibly another year for them to be comfortable with it.

The bookies have Munster at -10pts for this match. Glasgow are a tough team and it could be tight but I think Munster might cover the handicap. ROG and Dunca Williams at 9 and 10 offer Glasgow their best chance of a win.

[Jenifer McLadyboy]

GoodIn - hopefully, but unless some of those that have gone missing are going to return (and I mean the sensible ones) then I think it may be too little too late. After all nearly all the Munster fans have gone, there area only a handful fo the Scarlets fans left, a fair number of the sensible Ospreys fans are gone etc etc.

perhaps I mis interpreted this post. I rarely stray over to the intl forum.

[IanBru]

Nice start from Glasgow - good line speed in defence, and... interesting to see Ryan Grant rest his shoes on Donnacha Ryan who wasn't rolling away.

Weir nails the penalty. - 0-3 after three minutes.

[IanBru]

Again, more defensive pressure from Glasgow draws the knock on from Munster.

Glasgow scrum near half-way.

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