Non Irish, Irish Surname 15

Just a bit of fun:

1 Clark Dermody
2 Sean Fitzpatrick, Phil Kearns
3 Tom Donnelly
4
5 Nick Kennedy
6 Owen Finnegan
7 Jerry Collins
8 Dean Ryan
9 Byron Kellegher/George Gregan
10 Michael Lynagh/Owen Farrell/Stephen Larkham/Elton Flatley
11 James O’Connor
12 Tim Horan
13 Pat McCabe
14 John Kirwan/Nick Cummins
15 Matt Burke/Christian Cullen

So what do all of the above have in common? They all have Irish surnames* and they were all really good players, most of them anyway. Many of them aren’t even second generation Irish and a few of them probably don’t even realise they have Irish ancestry however they all do.


-*McCabe and Donnelly could also be Scottish.
-Mostly Kiwis and Aussies.
-A few Englishmen
-Didn't chose any Scots on purpose as their names can be very similar.
-I’d imagine a English diaspora would do well. Matfield, Carter etc.

Anyone know another lock that has an Irish surname but played for a country other than Ireland?

Owen Finegan?

I already have him Rodders.

Wade Dooley

(Or, going by some of the names playing for the provinces at the moment ...
Bakkies Botha )

You could also have Aaron Mauger and John Gallagher in the backs

Put Jamie Gibson at 6 then move Finegan to lock.

Nathan Hines. Not sure on your rules but apparently it's just an anglicized version of the Irish Ó hEidhin

Can you not find a place for the world record test try scorer?

Daisuke O'Hata

LeinsterFan4life wrote:Put Jamie Gibson at 6 then move Finegan to lock.

Could do that alright.

Well this is educational. I always thought Kennedy, Collins, Farrell, Gibson and a couple others there were English...

Andrew Sheridan.

If Tim Horan declared for Ireland we could have had himself and BOD as a center combination.

You could putshane geraghty at 4,might be fun to watch he would be easy enough to lift.

You could add "everyone in New York city" to that list.

Morgannwg wrote:Well this is educational. I always thought Kennedy, Collins, Farrell, Gibson and a couple others there were English...

Wow Morgan! John F Kennedy..... And you thought that was English? Shame on you

Michael Collins! Mike Gibson! Colin Farrell...... Yeah we're not sure we want to claim him actually

Larkham I would have let you away with. Sounds English to me.

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:Wade Dooley

(Or, going by some of the names playing for the provinces at the moment ...
Bakkies Botha )

You could also have Aaron Mauger and John Gallagher in the backs

John Gallagher WAS Irish. Just like Dave Gallagher from Donegal. Captain of the Original All Blacks. (His family dropped the g because all the Kiwis were pronouncing it)

Mauger though....... Defo an English name. Must have been Irish through his Ma....

Larkham, Gibson and Mauger are not Irish names. Either is Heaslip!

I conceed on Larkham but I didnt include Gibson and Mauger. Was aware Heaslip, Strauss, Best, Sexton, Trimble etc. are more than likely not Irish names. Though some families may have English surnames but no English heritage as they adopted Anglicised versions of Irish names.

Tana O'Maga? Prince O'Bolensky? Chris O'Ti? Ug O'Monye?

profitius wrote:Larkham, Gibson and Mauger are not Irish names. Either is Heaslip!

I have already agreed on Larkham and Mauger.

Gibsons have been in Ireland for many years though. I think originally Scottish, but then again the Scots part of Scotland (as opposed to the picts) came from Ireland about 1400 years ago anyway.

Cunningham is another one of those that is Scottish but has existed in Ireland for the bones of 1000 years.

Many people settled in Ireland and became "more Irish than the Irish themselves" A lot of people came over with the Normans. Walshes, any name beginning with Fitz for example.

A good later (Post reformation) example is the Kickhams. Originally from Lancashire, came over as farriers in the army of the dreaded Cromwell 1n the 1650s, and were granted lands in Tipperary.

They settled down and eventually converted to Catholicism, (although not all, they were on both sides in 1798) Charles Kickham fought in the 1848 rebellion and was one of the founders of the Fenian Movement, to this day there are GAA teams all over the country called after him. As well as an army barracks and several roads.

How Irish do you want?

Welsh names?

Probyn (son of Robin)
Anybody called Wallace or Walsh
Kellock (Cockerel)
Anybody called Evans
Tom Rees
Leon Lloyd
Ben Kay
Dewi Morris

Glas a du wrote:Welsh names?

Probyn (son of Robin)
Anybody called Wallace or Walsh
Kellock (Cockerel)
Anybody called Evans
Tom Rees
Leon Lloyd
Ben Kay
Dewi Morris

Could think of a good few few Jones' that have played for NZ.

Yes Jones, Davies, Thomas and Williams are common in Wales but are not actually Welsh. Evans is similar but is cymrisised.

Glas a du wrote:Yes Jones, Davies, Thomas and Williams are common in Wales but are not actually Welsh. Evans is similar but is cymrisised.

Can you give me an example of a Welsh Surname?

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

profitius wrote:Larkham, Gibson and Mauger are not Irish names. Either is Heaslip!

I have already agreed on Larkham and Mauger.

Gibsons have been in Ireland for many years though. I think originally Scottish, but then again the Scots part of Scotland (as opposed to the picts) came from Ireland about 1400 years ago anyway.

Cunningham is another one of those that is Scottish but has existed in Ireland for the bones of 1000 years.

Many people settled in Ireland and became "more Irish than the Irish themselves" A lot of people came over with the Normans. Walshes, any name beginning with Fitz for example.

A good later (Post reformation) example is the Kickhams. Originally from Lancashire, came over as farriers in the army of the dreaded Cromwell 1n the 1650s, and were granted lands in Tipperary.

They settled down and eventually converted to Catholicism, (although not all, they were on both sides in 1798) Charles Kickham fought in the 1848 rebellion and was one of the founders of the Fenian Movement, to this day there are GAA teams all over the country called after him. As well as an army barracks and several roads.

How Irish do you want?

Well I'll be, I've spent 27 years thinking Kickham was a verb...

Lloyd - grey
Voyle - bald
Gough, Gooch - Red or ginger
Rees - from Rhys
Pierce, Price - son of Rhys
Probert, Pritchard, Powell, Probyn, Protheroe, Pugh, Penri etc from Ap ... Son of.
Vaughn, Buchan - small
Clough - lame

Glas a du wrote:Lloyd - grey
Voyle - bald
Gough, Gooch - Red or ginger
Rees - from Rhys
Pierce, Price - son of Rhys
Probert, Pritchard, Powell, Probyn, Protheroe, Pugh, Penri etc from Ap ... Son of.
Vaughn, Buchan - small
Clough - lame

Does this mean that most people that play for wales bar maybe Andy Powell and Matthew Rhys are actually English?

Tell me Jenkins and Quinnell are Welsh names?

If ever there was a person who played for the wrong country it was Percy Montgomery.....how English is that? Sounds like a friend of Biggles

Quinell is English. In fact I think Derek's dad was from England.

Jenkins is son of Jenkin, another English name. There is no J or Q in Welsh.

mr_stonelea wrote:If ever there was a person who played for the wrong country it was Percy Montgomery.....how English is that? Sounds like a friend of Biggles

French you mean (or Norman to be precise)

mr_stonelea wrote:If ever there was a person who played for the wrong country it was Percy Montgomery.....how English is that? Sounds like a friend of Biggles

brilliant!!

GunsGerms wrote:

mr_stonelea wrote:If ever there was a person who played for the wrong country it was Percy Montgomery.....how English is that? Sounds like a friend of Biggles

brilliant!!

The name I'm most wowed by is Napoleon Einstein, such a shame he's only been good enough to play a handful of one-day cricket matches for India.

There's a new kid in the NZ 7s squad for the Wellington 7s this weekend, he's half Fijian Indian and half Rotuman Islander (and I'd never heard of Rotuman before yesterday either) - Rocky Khan definitely ticks the "cool name" box

If people were forced to play for the country of their name, Nigel Farage would play for France....kind of ironic that

Josh Van Der Flier is a young player in the Leinster accademy. He plays in the back row but there is a national petition to have him converted to the wing

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:

mr_stonelea wrote:If ever there was a person who played for the wrong country it was Percy Montgomery.....how English is that? Sounds like a friend of Biggles

brilliant!!

The name I'm most wowed by is Napoleon Einstein, such a shame he's only been good enough to play a handful of one-day cricket matches for India.

There's a new kid in the NZ 7s squad for the Wellington 7s this weekend, he's half Fijian Indian and half Rotuman Islander (and I'd never heard of Rotuman before yesterday either) - Rocky Khan definitely ticks the "cool name" box

I always liked Rico Gear for a couple of reasons:

If he didnt make it in rugby he has an ideal name for porn.
Secondly if he ever launches a rugby clothing line like Fran Cotton he could just call it Rico Gear. Id buy it.
Finally as a speedster there are plenty of puns to draw on, hes in top gear now etc.

In an ironic twist I hear his kit bag smells delightful

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

Morgannwg wrote:Well this is educational. I always thought Kennedy, Collins, Farrell, Gibson and a couple others there were English...

Wow Morgan! John F Kennedy..... And you thought that was English? Shame on you

Michael Collins! Mike Gibson! Colin Farrell...... Yeah we're not sure we want to claim him actually

Larkham I would have let you away with. Sounds English to me.

To be fair the likes of these are mostly Anglo-Irish, so could be English or Irish, I'm sure there are plently of English Collins and plenty of irish Collins ,

Its like de Burgh and later changed to Burke Norman-Irish/Norman-English name, its hard to say if a lot of these names are English or Irish, as Normans invaded both and left a legacy of names.

Gibson is Norman as well, I believe,

With the Normans invading both England and Ireland, its hard to say if the surnames they left are English or Irish now, add in the Anglo-Irish that came over and some of these surnames are common in Ireland and England.

Then you get someone like Seán Óg Ó hAilpín who's definatally got a very Irish name despite being born in Fiji and half Fijian.

Surely Brendan Laney would get a game

I know a boere in South Africa called Quentin Duckworth.

I don't even know anyone in the UK with a more English name than that but this guy would be lucky to string 5 words together in the language (slight exaggeration but still).

But like all new world people the paternal line counts.

Without knowing his lineage in full detail I believe somewhere down the line a Brit (probably in the mid 19th Century) came over and married a local girl and had a son, who had a son, who had a son etc etc.

In the last 7 odd generations he's probably had only a handful of Brits in the line out of the 252 ancestors... yet the name sticks.

Is he British... I think he would kick my head in if I suggested so.

Post is a bit anal I know.. I apologise!!! Enjoyed the blog though just made me think of my mate.

fa0019 wrote:I know a boere in South Africa called Quentin Duckworth.

I don't even know anyone in the UK with a more English name than that but this guy would be lucky to string 5 words together in the language (slight exaggeration but still).

But like all new world people the paternal line counts.

Without knowing his lineage in full detail I believe somewhere down the line a Brit (probably in the mid 19th Century) came over and married a local girl and had a son, who had a son, who had a son etc etc.

In the last 7 odd generations he's probably had only a handful of Brits in the line out of the 252 ancestors... yet the name sticks.

Is he British... I think he would kick my head in if I suggested so.

It happens like that on occasion. In my home province most members of the local Maori iwi have either the surname "Joseph" (as in Jamie) or MacDonald (as in Leon).

Pete

Yeah it can lead to some awkward conversations when you meet people.... I once was introduced to a guy at work called Johan van Niekerk and I started to converse standard greetings and conversations in Afrikaans.

He stopped me right there and said... uh, sorry I'm not Afrikaans and I don't speak it that well... can you speak English please.

re assuming people's nationality from their names, I had just arrived in the UK and was starting work when I was introduced to one of the directors called mike pelosi.

After the chat I said to my boss geesh he has a real Italian accent. My boss replied, na, he is glaswegian, and that was my first introduction to a real hardcore glaswegian accent!!!

just shows though, you hear an italian name, heard an accent and assumed it was italian!! Well I did..

that would go down well in Glasgow!!!!

Seems there are a lot of Italians in Scotland.

Nick DeLuca
Charlene Spiteri etc.

Scotland could have a decent team full of New Zealanders

123456789 wrote:Scotland could have a decent team full of New Zealanders

Scotland has had a decent team full of New Zealanders on occasion hasn't it?


I couldn't resist