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India Do Not Want Referral System in England Test Series

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Post by Duty281 Fri 10 Jun 2011, 10:23 am

First topic message reminder :

Just disgraceful really. I really hope a couple of wrong decision go against them, I really do. And India wonder why they're disliked the world over! Come on England, we can beat those whingeing Indians!


The Board for Cricket Control in India sent official notification to the England and Wales Cricket Board that it does not want the system to be used in the four-Test series.

Under International Cricket Council regulations the system can only be used with the consent of both boards. India’s senior men, including Sachin Tendulkar and MS Dhoni, have made it clear they do not trust the technology, enabling the BCCI to flex its considerable political muscle and win a concession for its leading stars.

It is a blow for Graeme Swann, who acknowledged during last winter’s Ashes tour the benefit he has gained from the technology. Of his 138 wickets, 29.71 per cent have been lbw, the second highest proportion of any bowler in Test history.

In the past, traditional finger spinners would have been lucky to get one lbw decision in every 20 appeals. Now with the DRS system consistently proving umpires incorrect when giving not-out decisions, that ratio has changed to about one in five.

India’s batsmen have grown up thinking they can kick away off-spinners on turning pitches without the fear of being given out lbw. But with Andrew Strauss now far more astute with his use of appeals, that tactic would have been dangerous this summer with the DRS system.

“The reason India do not want it is because it will favour our bowlers,” said John Emburey, the former England off-spinner. “It [DRS] has been massive for spinners because they are now getting wickets against batsmen playing on the front foot coming forward. It’s a massive advantage to the spinner. The system has shown balls would go on to hit the stumps and umpires have now got it in their minds that they can now give batsmen out.”

Emburey’s own career statistics show how the pre-DRS generation of off-spinners had little joy with umpires. He took 147 Test wickets but only 16 were lbw, some 10.88 per cent of his total dismissals.

“What DRS has done is make batsmen play with their bat rather than hide behind the pad which gives bowlers more chances of edges and catches because they have to play at the ball,” he said.

In May the ICC’s cricket committee recommended the use of DRS in all forms of the game. There are moves for this to be implemented at the board’s annual meeting later in June but convincing India will be tough.

Dhoni has been vocal in his opposition, particularly after Ian Bell was given not out by DRS during a World Cup match in Bangalore. Hawk-Eye showed the ball hitting the stumps but Bell was more than 2.5 metres down the pitch when he was hit, at which point the tracking system is deemed unreliable and the on-field umpire makes the call. Dhoni was baffled by the decision. “The adulteration of technology with human thinking meant we didn’t get that wicket,” he said.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricket/international/england/8566816/India-block-umpire-decision-review-system-in-Test-series-in-England.html



Last edited by Duty281 on Fri 10 Jun 2011, 10:24 am; edited 2 times in total

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Post by legendkillar Fri 10 Jun 2011, 11:02 pm

By all the means they do. I am a fan of the DRS, I think it should be adopted worldwide. I think they need a strong enough case to oppose it's use.

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Post by CaledonianCraig Fri 10 Jun 2011, 11:14 pm

It rules out any doubt for a start. Perhaps the Indians like it because it gives them an excuse if things don't go their way. I mean they can still moan that decisions never went there way that should have done.
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Post by eirebilly Sat 11 Jun 2011, 11:44 am

I am personally for the use of DRS but i also understand the Indians not wanting to use it. I also miss the old days when players accepted the decision of the umpire, good or bad. People should'nt condem India as a nation or its supporters simply because they dont want to use it.

Sonic is not representative of a nation of cricket lovers.
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Post by Liam_Main Sat 11 Jun 2011, 11:59 am

I don't understand why India don't want the DRS surely they want wrong decisions being put right.
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Post by eirebilly Sat 11 Jun 2011, 12:02 pm

Maybe they feel that the game should be kept pure and have no technology or maybe they dont have faith in the system Liam. I am not sure but we have to respect their wishes.
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Post by ReallyReal Sat 11 Jun 2011, 4:42 pm

Justice will be served when India have BIG decisions go against them, causing them to whinge, moan and attack everything English, much as sonic_boom10 does

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Post by msp83 Sat 11 Jun 2011, 7:40 pm

in the West Indies, Virat Kohli, India's most consistent ODI performer alongside Sachin and MSD, has just got an absolute shocker!. very sad, but I just love it!. its time the sensible thing gets done. a few more shockers, and then I hope there will be fan pressure. I don't see the BCCI otherwise acting with sense on this.

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Post by Guest Sat 11 Jun 2011, 9:02 pm

msp, as an Indian fan (assuming this anyway) what is your standpoint on this?

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Post by activereactive Sat 11 Jun 2011, 9:31 pm

Its up to Indians, as they are allowed to opt out. But are they forgetting it was UDRS that helped India win the world cup, imagine Sachin given out (how many times?) against Pakistan in the semi.

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Post by Guest Sat 11 Jun 2011, 9:33 pm

That's what we've been saying active, it's such an odd call, considering they've participated under it.

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Post by activereactive Sat 11 Jun 2011, 9:55 pm

Sainty wrote:That's what we've been saying active, it's such an odd call, considering they've participated under it.

I fear India will be a loser....

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Post by msp83 Sun 12 Jun 2011, 9:01 am

Sainty, I am all for it. don't think all Indian supporters are against the UDRS. For that matter, not even all the players are against it. Gautam Gambhir has gone on record supporting it. I don't think the Indian spinners would mind it either. its a section of the players and the BCCI who are against it. During the Lankan tour in which it was tried, India had lots of trouble with the UDRS, and that has turned some of the players against the system.
I think the ICC should fund it, and same technology should be used everywhere. every possible modes of technology, including HotSpot should be made use of.

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Post by Cowshot Sun 12 Jun 2011, 9:32 am

msp83: Ah. Thank you. I wondered why India are against the review system, and if they had trouble with it on an earlier tour that would explain matters.

Worth noting though that it doesn't solve all issues - catches where the fielder's hands are in the grass when the ball arrives are tending not to be given and I understand there is (or was - maybe it has been sorted by now) some dissatisfaction over the issue. There is also the problem that technology can fail or be too sensitive. I have wondered for example if hotspot might sometimes pick up the heat generated by a very near miss of bat and ball.

I'm in favour of technology though. Not that it matters - Pandora's box cannot be closed.

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Post by legendkillar Sun 12 Jun 2011, 11:11 am

Wonder if the Indians will change their minds. Did anyone see the last one dayer where Yuvraj Singh was given out LBW first ball and yet on referral showed it pitched outside the line and was missing the stumps? Yet he complained at the umpire. Intriguing.

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Post by Guest Sun 12 Jun 2011, 11:20 am

its ridiclous that india dont want the referral system

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Post by activereactive Sun 12 Jun 2011, 1:29 pm

You all may be aware India and England gonna play 100th test match, imagine in that 100th test match Sachin trying to get his 100th century without any help of UDRS, poor Sachin might lose out. Sad

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Post by hokeye_on sticky wicket Sun 12 Jun 2011, 6:44 pm

I don't understand BCCI's problem.Wasn't UDRS a resounding success in the recent worldcup co-hosted by India.

Technology is there to improve human decision.It may not be 100% accurate but it does give empires an extra tool to come to a decision.

Where is the problem?Are we saying human empire decision are more accurate?

Grow up BCCI...
Very Happy

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Post by msp83 Sun 12 Jun 2011, 6:45 pm

Symply attacking India won't solve the issue. Even India's objection has a point. We have had situations where different countries use different kind of technology. Sometimes there is HotSpot, for some countries its too expensive. All available technology should be made available, and the process has to be funded by ICC at least up to the point where all boards, after their present broadcasting deals gets over, can place the necessary stipulations on the TV companies. So there should be action from all, not just from India. Some of India's concerns are simplistic, but some others are important enough to be addressed for the review system to be more effective.

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Post by LivinginItaly Sun 12 Jun 2011, 8:07 pm

It is very true that UDRS needs to be utilized to the same extent in all countries, and that the ICC should help fund this to enable all countries to benefit from the same technology. However, the point remains that this is not a valid reason for refusing to use the UDRS system altogether.

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Post by Guest Sun 12 Jun 2011, 8:29 pm

why dont the ICC just stand up to BCCI, ICC is the boss, lorgat needs to grow a pair.

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Post by msp83 Thu 16 Jun 2011, 2:01 pm

The Paranavitana decision in the ongoing Eng-SL test makes it very clear as to why should all available technology be used. There was nothing much clear on HotSpot, but Snicko showed him nicking it through. But since Snicko wasn't in use, England unfairly ended up not only being denied a wicket, but also losing a review.

incidents will only play into the hands of the critiques of the review system.

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Post by Cowshot Thu 16 Jun 2011, 11:28 pm

msp83 wrote:The Paranavitana decision in the ongoing Eng-SL test makes it very clear as to why should all available technology be used. There was nothing much clear on HotSpot, but Snicko showed him nicking it through. But since Snicko wasn't in use, England unfairly ended up not only being denied a wicket, but also losing a review.

incidents will only play into the hands of the critiques of the review system.

Indeed they will. My answer woulld be to say we need to integrate all the technology as soon as possible. But that's money and time, whatever happens. The BCCI holding out might actually encourage rapid improvement in the technology.

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Post by sonic_boom10 Thu 16 Jun 2011, 11:34 pm

Cowshot wrote:
msp83 wrote:The Paranavitana decision in the ongoing Eng-SL test makes it very clear as to why should all available technology be used. There was nothing much clear on HotSpot, but Snicko showed him nicking it through. But since Snicko wasn't in use, England unfairly ended up not only being denied a wicket, but also losing a review.

incidents will only play into the hands of the critiques of the review system.

Indeed they will. My answer woulld be to say we need to integrate all the technology as soon as possible. But that's money and time, whatever happens. The BCCI holding out might actually encourage rapid improvement in the technology.
With all modern technology, you'd think someone could speed up the snicko process.

Then everyone's a winner.

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Post by Cowshot Thu 16 Jun 2011, 11:40 pm


With all modern technology, you'd think someone could speed up the snicko process.

Then everyone's a winner..

Not sure who, if anyone, is responsible. As far as I know the whole thing was started by Hawkeye, which was created by some cricket fans more or less as a hobby. I'm sure it's fully commercial now, which means money could buy a solution. It'll still take time, though.


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