Ding Ding! Round 2 (Jeff)

So this weekends match ups are:

Harlequins v Northampton Saints, The Stoop, London

Sale Sharks v London Irish, Edgeley Park, Stockport

Exeter Chiefs v Newcastle Falcons, Sandy Park

Gloucester Rugby v Worcester Warriors, Kingsholm, Gloucester

Bath Rugby v Saracens, Recreation Ground, Bath

London Wasps v Leicester Tigers, Adams Park, Wycombe


Some crackers this weekend as the Jeff rolls in to week two.

Quins will be looking to win their second game of the season at home to Saints. Last season Northampton managed to sneak it in a close affair but if Harlequins want to mix with the big boys in the league they need to be winning their home games.

Also we see every ones second team Exeter get a chance to make it two from two after stunning the Tigers at their fortress last weekend, can a wounded and frankly lamentable Newcastle travel to Sandy Park and get a win?

Lastly and in one of the biggest game of the season for these teams Wasps host Leicester at Admas Park, they'll be in high spirits after nobbling the current champions, can they pull another smash & grab on a Leicester team who've been pillaged by internationals and injuries?


My Predictions:
Quins by 5
London Irish by 10
Exeter by 12
Gloucester by 25
Saracens by 3
Wasps by 3

Your thoughts?

Lastly and in one of the biggest game of the season for these teams Wasps travel to Leicester in high spirits after nobbling the current champions, can they pull another smash & grab on a Leicester team who've been pillaged by internationals and injuries?

The game is at Adams Park so Tigers will be traveling to Wasps trying to get their first win of the season after a disappointing defensive showing at Welford Rd but at the same time plenty if attacking instinct was on show. The front five folded under the weight of a virtually full strength Chiefs pack so hopefully that won't be a problem vs a Wasps front five that is notoriously feather weight but seemingly ruling the skies at the lineout.

Cheers Sam amended now.

I was at the double header and fairly close by when Wasps had an attacking scrum 5 metres from Saracens line. They were completely pulverised and turned, then Saracens got the put in and did the same again, then again.

Leicester should have nothing to fear in the scrum but want to be careful about loose kicks as that was the main undoing of Saracens.

The tactical kicking has improved with Ford at 10 but he is an easy target as he won't ever smash anyone back in the tackle. The scrum isn't quite the strength it usually is either, Brookes is alright but he's not in the same league as the usual contenders Castro/Cole/White. Give him a season of brutal Tigers guidance and he will be a scrummaging machine but he isn't quite there yet.

Need Kitchener back to fitness though, need an enforcer type in the second row. Tigers always start slowly and the gain momentum so it's not unusual for us to play cack early doors, remember last season? We were woeful for the first few games including throwing away the game at Adam's Park.

Yappysnap was it a poor Wasps scrum or a strong Saracens one?

Saracens frontrow are underrated in my opinion. Nieto is one of the best props at scrummaging in my opinion. Gill isn't bad either.

Are they as good as a full strength Tigers or Saints frontrow but probably still 3rd best.

Wasps will be licking their lips in my opinion.

I worry that Saracens will struggle. It isn't a nice match to face now.

To be fair you've been woefull up till around Xmas these last 2/3 seasons I remember, but you always pull it all together for the new year home run. Much like Wasps of old actually.

I'd say you're missing Parling and White in particular for the set piece, at the moment.

but you should really learn to cope with these problems, just think all it means is that your current squad is now on a par with most other clubs first/second teams. Think of it as a character forming experience.

Any thoughts on any of the other matches then Sam?

Biased, but can't see Saracens winning at the Rec with a forward orientated game plan. Bath seriously beefed up on that front, and dangerous runners to return any kick-chase.

Beshocked, i'd say a bit of both. I think everyone knows Saracens now have a top scrum but Wasps were just woefull as well. Watching from where i was i had to question the lack of pens though.

I do now feel for you Saracens fans though. I sat through that match on Sat and bar a few breaks and a bit of livelyness in the last 10 when you suddenly realised you were going to lose it was god awful boring stuff.

I had a couple of saracens fans sat next to me and at the start they were well up for it and cheering the kicks and the pens, by the second half though every single kick seemed to be another dig in the guts for them.

If Saracens opt for Hodgson at 10 and look to utilise the tactical kicking alongside actually distrubting the ball then they could be excellent. Bath aren't the most dangerous of teams up front but with the intorduction of a couple of the bigger locks over the course of the summer they are no longer easy to bully up front. Sarries should still get some decent ball and probabley edge the set pieces though they must start making the most of it especially with the quality backline they have. If the play dull kicking rugby Bath might just edge it.

Quinns vs Saints will come down to the battle of the breakdown, normally I'd back Quinns but Myler seems to have spent a lot of time working on his weaknesses during the summer and seems to have the Saints backline moving. Young guns Nuttley and Clarke vs England hopefuls Robshaw and Skinner, that should be fun to watch with plenty of running rugby a distinct possibility.

Sam it's the lineout and the breakdown I am worried about.

The breakdown was a mess in my opinion, too many turnovers, ball was too slow. That was against a injury hit Wasps backrow too.

bathmad I agree but we have beaten you 4 times in a row - twice at the Rec so there is hope.

True yappysnap it was very boring. I was tearing my hair out when the Saracens players kicked the ball again and again and again......


I agree with the all of Yappysnap's prediction except unsure about the match - Bath vs Saracens which is too tough to call.

Quins have a real opportunity to make the most of the world cup absentees. So far so good with their win over London Irish. Onwards and upwards for them.

I think Sarries were caught cold by just how good the Pests line out was. Bath's won't be up to the same standard as they will certainly not field two line out locks and Hooper isn't the line out operator that Wentzel is. Sarries will certainly have to be more savvy at the breakdown though as Bath will not be gentle in that area, they signed two enforcers in the summer and will use them.

For what its worth, I think your predictions are pretty much the same as mine would be. All close games I think, with the exception of Gloucester and London Irish, who I think will score a fair few tries.

Being biased though, if Sarries come with a similar game plan to last week I think Bath can beat them. Whilst our lineout is not as good as Wasps (well Wentzel) our pack put on a good showing last weekend and if they do the same this saturday we might be able to edge it. Should be a good day, England in the morning and my first game of the season in the afternoon. Bring on the weekend!

England in the morning and my first game of the season in the afternoon

I hope the ground you play on is softer than what I endured last week. Was not that much fun playing fly half behind a defeated pack on concrete hard ground.

bathmad, you have beefed up your scrum, but not your front row and as beshocked says the Sarries pack is underated and Nieto is an awesome scrummager. Sarries will be licking their wounds and desperate to pick up a win, whereas without being disrepestful to Newcastle, Bath didn't have the hardest test last week. I can see Sarries just pipping Bath.

Yappy, I agree with all your predictions, but maybe the margins will be slightly different. I hope Glaws win by that margin, but the fact it is a local derby Wuss are always up for the match. I think the margin will be closer to 10 points.

It is a shame PDJ is playing LH at the moment, I would have enjoyed Marler v PDJ round 2! Saints will be sharper than last week as they did butcher a few overlaps, but I agree Quins will win this.

Ont he subject of PDJ, I thought he was very poor against Glaws last week. Appreciate he's not normally a LH, but his positioning and binding in the scrum were shocking. Gave away a couple of pens.

bathmad wrote:Ont he subject of PDJ, I thought he was very poor against Glaws last week. Appreciate he's not normally a LH, but his positioning and binding in the scrum were shocking. Gave away a couple of pens.

It is all part of a plan, you'll soon find out how rubbish Attwood is too!

On a serious note, PDJ started the game alirght winning a penalty at the scrum, but he just seemed to vanish after that and Glaws definitely finished with the strong scrum. It certainly wasn't his best game, but I'd expect him to start improving very soon as he has the potential to be very good.

Unless we improve dramatically...i cant see us get anything from Exeter....except a smack round the chops!

Is the big Saffa centre in the team for the weekend Geordie?

I get the impression that deal will still be another couple of weeks before being finalised Sam. We could really do with him now though.

One that has gone through is the signing of Richard Mayhews younger brother Michael who is a hooker.

Richard was man of the match last week at 8...in his first competitive match for us and is a physical kiwi......so i hope Michael brings the same in to our front row.

GF, I think it will be a close game at Sandy Park, not dissimilar to all our tussles last season, probably no more than a score in it come the final whistle

Well your boys played VERY well. And despite our showing last week (Mayhew aside, who was outstanding) i do think we are better than that.

I just hope we see a nice competitive game Aslong....with a marked improvement by ourselves.

I tend to think that the Tigers pack, even understrength, will at worst gain parity with Wasps' pack. Licking their lips? I doubt it.

Depends who we get back GW, I can see it going badly wrong unless we seriously improve on last weeks defensive effort from the forwards. On the radio last night they were saying Tigers only won 2 turnovers all game. That's just not good enough.

They will be hurting in training this week....

I should think Cockerill will be beasting them all in time honoured Tigers tradition. Think he will be careful not to break any of them though, Tigers were about 20 players short vs Exeter and will only have two or three of those available for the trip to Wasps so he won't want anymore injuries.

Will Tait be playing this week?

I know the real problems are in the forwards but i just can't help but ponder the backs. I hope we'll see something like Harrison and Ford at 9/10 and then Allan and Twelvetrees in the centres with Tait at Wing or Fullback.

Who are your other wingers? You seem to have a real weaknes there... I could name about 8 or 9 or us.

Back three players available for this week, definites; Smith, Hamilton, Morris, Forsyth, Robinson. Tait is a probable but there's no confirmation yet and Lewington could be recalled from his loan move at Notts if need be. We have got three at the RWC as well in Murphy, Agulla and Alesana Tuilagi.

The backs will likely line up;

9.Grindal (sigh)
10.Ford
11.Smith
12.Allen
13.Twelvetrees
14.Tait/Morris
15.Hamilton

Subs;
21.Young
22.Staunton
23.Morris/Forsyth

Grindall does my head in. I just don't 'get' how he's managed to remain on the books.

His contract runs out next summer. He was only signed as third choice and cover to Ellis and Youngs but following the premature retirement of Harry he has found himself more involved. Micky Young was signed to hopefully take over as back up scrummy to Benny but a knock at the start of pre season and Grindal playing his best ever game for the club against Lyon in pre season has seen Grindal get the nod at the start of the season. Hope Micky Young takes over soon and with a bit of luck Harrison will get some game time (he got rave reviews for a second half performance at 10 against Notts, maybe a French style half back in the making).

Well to be sure, he goes from the sublime to the ridiculous...

Good win for Sale, it sounds like their backplay has already come on leaps and bounds and their line-out has improved. With Vernon, Fourie, the two big centres, Cueto, Sheridan and Buckley to add I reckon they should be targeting 7th. A top class FH, a really big lock, and probably a replacement for Buckley (!) are all needed, but it is the first season of a rebuild and they are moving in the right direction.

Bath - Sarries was a decent game. I thought Farell was good. Yes he still executes too many up-and-unders, but his tactical kicking is highly impressive, his tackling for a 19 year old FH is incredible, and he can pass (he just seems under instructions not to do so). I think he may spend his career alternating between 10 and 12, and I'd like to see him start outside of Hodgson at some point as he's certainly got more his potential attacking game than Barritt. Generally I thought Bath were hgood. Like Sale they have started rebuilding and look a lot more physcial at the breakdown than before. Fearns is going to have a very long England career, eventually at 8 but probably before that at 6 or 7.

Easy win for Gloucester, predictable win for Exeter. Quins are going well, but I doubt their pack can compete against the better sides when they are back at full strength. Saints need more from their backline.

Tait pulled out late again

HammerofThunor wrote:Tait pulled out late again

Haha.

Quins game was a physical affair and I think they showed enough to look good for top 6, all depends on how much we try at the HC.

Game of the weekend for me was Wasps-Leicester. Awesome match with a bit of everything, aggression and big hits, proper scrums and rucks, running backs and very good kicking; it had it all! Wade and Twelvetrees both shone for their teams and Wasps suddenly looked the team of old with power and grit in spades.

You have to suspect though that if Leicester had had a couple more first team players back they could have snuck it. The Tigers seriously need some pacemen out wide, there was just zero threat for the Wasps wingers to have to deal with.

Twelvetrees kicking and running was brilliant, some of his shots at goal were incredible.

Wade made what could turn out to be the try of the season for me. Getting a hattrick against Leicester isn't too bad either.