Whats the 3 greatest wins in the Heavyweight History ?

In terms of importance, overall performance and the eventual result, what would be your 3 greatest wins in the heavyweight division ?

I'd have a go at

1. Joe Frazier WPTS Muhammad ALi
2. Joe Louis KO1 Max Schmeling
3. Muhammad Ali KO8 George Foreman


Do you have any order of merit that are the greatest wins in the Heavyweight division.

Cheers

Rodders [/b]

Morning Rodders, nice article mate.

Almost impossible to chose, putting Frazier-Ali 1971 at the top spot is very understandable but I'm not sure I'd give it such a high placing.

1. Joe Louis KO 1 Max Schmeling. Arguably the greatest Heavyweight of all time producing his greatest performance and moment, and erasing a few personal demons along the way. A fight which is yet to be equaled in terms of social and historical significance and importance.

2. Evander Holyfield TKO 11 Mike Tyson. Might surprise a few people that I've got this so high, but let's not forget that Holyfield was supposed to be totally shot, whereas Tyson seemed set for a new 'reign of terror.' More than any other, this is the fight which exploded the Tyson myth. One of the finest individual performances of all time, all things considered.

3. Muhammad Ali KO 8 George Foreman. Not much else to say about this fight which hasn't been said a million times already. Harry Mullan once wrote that 'the impossible was Ali's speciality' and no fight shows that better than this one. Culturally significant, too.

Rodney wrote:In terms of importance, overall performance and the eventual result, what would be your 3 greatest wins in the heavyweight division ?

I'd have a go at

1. Joe Frazier WPTS Muhammad ALi
2. Joe Louis KO1 Max Schmeling
3. Muhammad Ali KO8 George Foreman


Do you have any order of merit that are the greatest wins in the Heavyweight division.

Cheers

Rodders [/b]

Morning, Rodders.

If we're narrowing it down to three the margins are incredibly thin and I'd reckon your picks to be bang on.

However, with just a tiny bit of latitude and blurring of the tight margins I'd reckon Corbett v Sullivan, ( the new science over the old, ) and Clay v Liston I to be very much in the frame, based on your criteria. Dempsey v Willard, also. It's too easily forgotten that Willard was the Vitali of his day and was believed to be too strong, too tough and too big for Dempsey. Dempsey, probably the first heavy to combine speed, boxing ability, savagery and awesome punching power, had other ideas and in three blistering rounds he revolutionized heavyweight boxing and wrote an indelible chapter in its history.

Historically, of course, there are a couple of Johnson's fights, but these wouldn't necessarily satisfy all your criteria.

Thanks very much Chris, Windy some nice picks.

Rodders

Pretty much agree with OP, but also like to mention:

Tyson Douglas - great fight, great performance and colossal upset.

fearlessBamber wrote:Pretty much agree with OP, but also like to mention:

Tyson Douglas - great fight, great performance and colossal upset.

Great mention Bamber thanks, I think many sometimes tend to overlook how good Buster was that afternoon in Tokyo, maybes Tyson wasnt at his best but not only did he beat Tyson he hammered him for the duration of the fight.

Cheers

Rodders

1) Danny Williams stopping Tyson
2) Kevin McBride stopping Tyson
3) Lennox Lewis stopping Tyson



In all seriousness i'd go for Ali v Liston I, Foreman v Moorer and Douglas v Tyson in an underdog pick.

An excellent idea for an article Rodney, and some fine picks as well.

I'll have to agree with both Louis KO1 Schmelling, and Ali KO8 Foreman.

Both terrific performances and results.

Whilst Frazier W15 Ali is a great performance and result, I'd argue it wasn't on a par with the other two in terms of significance and unpredictability.

Holyfield TKO11 Tyson is a good shout as well, although hindsight has reduced the significance of that win ever so slightly. It was thought that Holy was shot and Tyson was back to his destructive best. Looking back, it is clear that Tyson was far, far from his best. The reason Holy was written off was due to his poor showing in his 3rd fight with Bowe, Holy has since claimed he was very unwell during the build up to that fight. Whilst mant boxers claim illness as an excuse, Holy did look ver weakened during that contest and I would argue that he was written off far too prematurely.

I actually think Douglas KO10 Tyson is one of the greatest performances, not only in heavyweight history, but boxing history in general. A 42-1 underdog, taking on and thoroughly hammering a prime, undefeated champ. Douglas' performance that night never ceases to amaze me. For about an hour he boxed like a true ATG.

I think most of the 'top tier' wins have, in some way, been mentioned already, but as an underrated one how about Floyd Patterson beating Ingemar Johansson in their second bout?

A beautiful knockout to finish it all, and Patterson showing great mental strength (not something attributed to him very often) to come back and convincingly beat the man who had given him an almighty hammering only one year earlier. Made him the first man to regain the Heavyweight title, to boot.

Perhaps Braddock v Baer? I know Max wasn't in great condition for the fight, but the significance of it surely makes it a great win. Seen as the ultimate underdog story, and a true example of triumphing over adversity.

Thanks very much Gentleman, not much to grumble about your fine mate, also Coxy Foreman v Moorer is a fine pick forgot all about that one, considering big George's age a remarkable win.

Cheers

Rodders

Will predictably go for Fitzsimmons beating Corbett, the smallest ever Heavyweight champion taking out the very skilled Corbett with the perfect Solar Plexus punch

It may have only been for the 'coloured' Heavyweight title, but I think Joe Jeannette's victory over Sam McVea in their second bout is worthy of consideration, simply because Jeannette had to get off the deck twenty-eight times to win, over 49 rounds, against a fighter as good as McVea. It may have been exhaustion which officially ended the bout, but Jeannette still deserves a world of credit for winning what must surely be one of the most gruelling battles in history.

I've never heard McVea described as anything but a banger though. Not as impressed by these feats of endurance as a boxing display as opposed to an athletic display. Otherwise you could say Williard over Johnson when in reality he was getting outboxed and just outlasted an old out of shape man.

I'm not sure that's an entirely fair comparison, Scott. Willard had been making serious inroads in to Johnson from the middle stages onwards, and even if he had been the lesser man before the knockout, he still hadn't had to peel himself off the canvas over and over the way that Jeannette had to. And forty-nine rounds is one hell of a long time to have to survive a 'banger' such as McVea.

Middle stages in a 40 round fight, he just outlasted a 38 year old who was out of shape. Good accomplishment by Jeannette and surviving so many knockdowns is incredible, just saying I prefer a triumph over a skilled boxer than a feat of endurance. Depends what you are looking for I guess.

I'll go for a composite of some of the above posts.
Sullivan /Corbett
Foreman /Moorer
Frazier/ Ali (first)
Cheers.

Ok, it was 'The fight of the century' and a great win, but Ali had been out for three years beforehand. I'd pick 'The thriller in manila'. Drama, skill, boxing, endurance, heart, comebacks - such a fight will probably be never seen again.

Dempsey vs Tunney 1 & 2, would need to be in there somewhere. Classic contests in boxing history.

1. Louis v Schmeling 2
2. Foreman v Moorer
3. Ali v Spinks 2

Just the first three to come to mind.

1) Louis vs Schmelling 2
2) Ali/Clay vsListon
3)= Ali vs Foreman
3)= Ali vs Frazier 1&3
3)= Foreman vs Moorer

Those are my top 3 wins and in order also.

1. Forman v Moorer
2. Douglas v Tyson
3. Johnson v Burns

I'll add Jack Johnson vs Great WHite Hope. Probably THE most important win in boxing.

1 Ali v Foreman
2 Frazier v Ali 1
3 Douglas vTyson
3 Holyfield v Tyson 1

Some of the obvious picks have been chosen but would probably put forward Fitz turning over Corbett as worthy of consideration. In an era where division hopping is prized, the achievement of a former middleweight champion winning the world heavyweight title against the one and only champion still stands out as a truly remarkable feat.

When one considers 100 + years on only Roy Jones has come close and that certainly was not against the man at the weight and the fact that Fitz weighed in at 151 in the ring for his middleweight title this fight still stands out as one of the most staggering feats in the history of the division.

1. Fitzsimmons v Corbett
2. Louis v Schmelling
3. Corbett v John L Sullivan

All three of these fights tick every box I think. I would have considered Jeffries v Johnson as maybe the single most significant fight but due to Jeffries condition I think its ranking under result and performance is lessened significantly.

azania wrote:I'll add Jack Johnson vs Great WHite Hope. Probably THE most important win in boxing.

Yeah I was just reading this thinking the same. Just reading Unforgivable Blackness at the moment, and surely either Johnson vs Burns or Johnson vs Jeffries HAS to be in any shortest? The Burns fight for the monumental impact it has-a black boxer winning the heavyweight championship of the world-and the Jeffries fight for putting to rest those critics who said Johnson hadn't beaten 'the real champ'. Certainly without the Burns fight boxing as we know it today, and possibly even global politics would be vastly different.

Johnson vs Burns/Jeffries were important events but greatest wins? A retired old man and a virtual Middleweight.

Look at the criteria: importance, performance and overall result. The Burns win was massively important in a way which transcended the sport. The performance, while not surprising, was significant in that Johnson asserted his superiority in such a way as to leave no doubts, and the overall result was one which change the face of boxing. Based on that, does it get much greater?

BALTIMORA wrote:Look at the criteria: importance, performance and overall result. The Burns win was massively important in a way which transcended the sport. The performance, while not surprising, was significant in that Johnson asserted his superiority in such a way as to leave no doubts, and the overall result was one which change the face of boxing. Based on that, does it get much greater?

Sold. Was just looking at it in terms of a performance rather than against the criteria.

On performance I agree with you-it was just another match won by the guy who was expected to.