The First Test Team

The first test is nearly three weeks away and there will be a couple of games before that as well but I'm intrigued to see what side will be picked.

The penned players IMO will be:

Strauss
Cook
Trott
Pietersen
Bell
Prior
Broad
Swann
Anderson

This leaves two more places and a few options/players.

Another spinner and a seamer - Monty - Finn or Bresnan?
A batting allrounder (I use that term loosely) - Bopara or Patel and a spinner/seamer, depending on the former?
Two seamers - Finn and Bresnan?

Galle is apparently a spinners paradise which leads me to believe Monty may come in, especially as he bowled well last up. With him, I can see Bopara, as he will be the third seam option.

Do others agree or see something different?

I suspect Bopara for Morgan will be the only change from the last Test, so yep I agree with your assumptions Stella.

I would have thought Finn has pushed himself ahead of Bresnan if they went for 3 seamers, but Bresnan's batting ability may be key. As it is, I don't think it'll matter much as there'll be 2 spinners and 2 seamers.

I would suggest that Monty and Bresnan might fill up the last two places on your team Stella.

I think we can expect this to be the team for the first Test:

Strauss (c)
Cook
Trott
Pietersen
Bell
Bopara
Prior (wk)
Broad
Swann
Anderson
Panesar

With Gooch being given a full time job Bopara must be a front runner.

England will want either Panessar OR Patel in the side ( but surely not both?)

If it looks spin friendly Panessar/Bopara, if it looks like theres some pace Finn or Bresnan plus Patel.

I think England will put in Bopara at 6, then depending on conditions Finn or Panesar (most likely the latter) for the final bowling spot.

Well Im looking back to the last time England toured there.
In all but the first innings of the first test they struggled to take wickets. Thats was with 3 seamers plus Pannesar, and support from Collingwood/Bopara (and Vaughan). The blame at the time was put on a lack of a second proper spinner and variety.

So from that you could say ...well surely 5 bowlers?
But England never play 5 bowlers any more ( I dont think Flower has ever picked that? top of my head ) .
Then theres what happened in Pakistan. 4 bowlers could take wickets ( defiantley when they had the second attacking spin option) but the batting was an abomination. Would you risk weakening it further?

The theres the make up of the squad. Four spinners says to me they want to play a left armer alongside Swann. Two Batsmen who can bowl suggests they want to be able to play 4 out and out bowlers but have someone who can chip in for rotation with vairety, Patel if they arent playing Pannesar, Bopara if they are.

Spot on, PSW, but if you ask me Panesar is almost guaranteed selection given his success in the UAE and the undoubted advantage that DRS brings to left arm spinners these days.

to be mildly pedantic PSW England did play five bowlers in the second test of the tour to Bangladesh a couple of years ago or so (after struggling to take 20 wickets in the first). Trott moved up to open (Strauss sat the tour out). Other than that I agree with the general consensus, England are unlikely to leave Panesar out after his efforts in UAE.

I think most of us agree that we will play two spinners, being Monty and Swann and most probably six batsmen, given Monty is a ferret. Both Bresnan and Finn will be back this summer but may not see much action in Sri-Lanka.

As mentioned before, it's nice to have so many very good bowlers to call upon.

I am not sure about Anderson on the wickets in the sub continent to be honest.

eirebilly wrote:I am not sure about Anderson on the wickets in the sub continent to be honest.

They said that about Anderson in Australia. You would have thought that Bresnan may be better but if Anderson can get the length right and obtain a bit of swing then he should do ok.
Hoggard remember took 7 wickets in an innings a few years ago.

eirebilly wrote:I am not sure about Anderson on the wickets in the sub continent to be honest.

did pretty well in UAE didn't he (not great but still averaged about 27 or so, which is good). Also bowled really well last winter in Oz, which are pretty flat. I think he'll be fine.

Aus won in SL last year, with an attack of Copeland, Harris, Johnson and Lyons; which doesn't exactly set the world alight, but it got the job done. The key thing to note is that they won with one spinner. It could be argued that if they had a second decent spinner he would have played, but they won with one so it proves it is not a necessity to have two spinners to win in the sub continent. That said, I would stick with the same side that finished in the UAE, with Panesar, jus replace Morgan with Bops for now and if England are chasing a win at any point then they bring Finn/Bresnan in.

Hmm interestingly last time it was only Harmisson who fared really well out there, maybe the case for Finn grows!

It may just be me but i simply dont think that Anderson is the best bowler in the sub continent conditions. Finn or Bresnan would be my choice.

strauss
cook
Trott
KP
bell
prior
bresnan
swann
broad
anderson
monty

finny just missing out

1. Strauss
2. Cook
3. Trott
4. KP
5. Bell
6. Prior
7. Bresnan
8. Swann
9. Broad
10. Anderson
11. Finn

Long tail but if the top order score runs then the lower order can throw the bat, something particularly Broad and Swann do well. Bresnan is a solid 7 IMO. Good technique, times the ball nicely and has a good temperament. Can easily score some decent runs. Finn just has to play for me. England need to reward people such as Finn, who could have easily gone off the rails a little after being dropped from the Ashes team after becoming the leading wicket taker in the series. But no, he went back to county cricket, worked on his technique, added another yard of pace to his bowling without having to force his arm through in order to do so, England have a bowler who can bowl 88-90mph consistantly, bowls good lines and lengths, and is in terrific form on flat wickets. He has to be rewarded, he is the future for England along with Broad, and needs to regain his test place. There's no outstanding no.6 to come in so Prior as we all know is well capable of moving up to 6.

I know I'm usually a big believer in "the man in possession" but honestly I think the potential Finn has showed blows that out of the water. For me it is a case of "how can England get Finn into the side?": two obvious ways:
- pick 5 bowlers, which given the batting troubles recently may represent a bit of a gamble (although Sri Lanka's attack is far weaker than Pakistan's)
- Drop Panesar (but the squad picked suggests not).

On the whole I'd probably go with 5 bowlers. Just.

Mike,

Theres an argument for that but it would leave England with a ridiculous tail, unless as you say they only go with one spinner. Then you have 4 bowlers sharing the workload of 3 and only becoming relevant if the innings gets bogged down, at which time theyd be really wishing they had some left arm spin variety rather than 4 right arm fast mediums.
The other option would be to drop Anderson for him. I just dont see that happening.

I know. I think if you pushed me I'd go all out attack and pick Anderson, Broad, Finn, Panesar and Swann. But I'd probably be wrong about it.

The reasoning is just that I think Finn's been bowling too well recently to leave out.

As you say, no way will England drop Anderson, or Broad, or Swann for that matter. It's a tough choice.

My feeling is given the squad that's been picked, and Flower's selections until now that England will go for Bopara and Panesar.

Cook Strauss Trott Pietersen Bell Patel Prior Broad Swann Finn Anderson

Why cant England swap Finn for Anderson? Anderson is a fine bowler without a doubt but i feel that Finn will be more effective against Sri Lanka.

1. Strauss
2. Cook
3. Trott
4. KP
5. Bell
6. Prior
7. Bresnan
8. Swann
9. Broad
10. Panesar
11. Finn

This would be my team.

Anderson is the leader of the attack. His position in the team is as safe as anyones bar Strauss and Cook.

eirebilly wrote:Why cant England swap Finn for Anderson? Anderson is a fine bowler without a doubt but i feel that Finn will be more effective against Sri Lanka.

Because he's England's best bowler, and leads the attack. You don't chop and change a side at will, just because someone may be more effective in some certain conditions. You need to balance that with continuity.

I think the answer is England wont rather than cant.
The debate on whether they should or shouldnt is different.


I wouldnt really be comforatble with Finn in a 4 man attack, hes been prone to be expensive and is best used in short bursts. Previously his endurance has been questioned as well.
England are expecting slow low flat wickets. Whilst Finn has that " get anyone out on anything" x factor Anderson has shown over the last few years he can adapt his game and take wickets anywhere.

I'd play Bresnan IF we were to play five bowlers. He may well suit these wickets and he can hold a bat and give our tail a bit of bite.

Jimmy is the main strike bowler, i am a fan but sometimes even the best have to sit down if the conditions are not right for them. I never said anything about chopping and changing at all, i simply feel that Finn maybe a better option in Sri Lankan conditions. I would have no problems picking a player because i think that he would be a better option over an established player for a 2 test series. Why not, you want to win and winning means you pick your best side for the conditions? I may be wrong but i may also be right.

Finn may be expensive but he does get the players playing shots and gets wickets.

eirebilly wrote:Jimmy is the main strike bowler, i am a fan but sometimes even the best have to sit down if the conditions are not right for them.

I disagree on two points:
1) Anderson actually has a very decent record in the subcontinent (he won a game against India there back in 2006 or 07).
2) You don't drop your best bowler. It really is that simple.

Yep your right. I shall agree with you

Can't agree with you about Finn/Anderson , billy

Finn has been bowling very well in ODIs and deserves another go in the Test arena , when a spot is open. But Anderson has been consistently England's best bowler for the last couple of years , and you don't drop such a player on a whim...

True , Jimmy's past record in Sri Lanka (two matches , I think , on two different tours ) isn't good. But he hasn't been there since about 2007 and he has improved a bit

It is a bit like the discussions before the last Ashes tour to Australia : there were a number of people pointing to Anderson's poor record on the 2006/7 tour as a reason to doubt his place this time round ... five Tests later they'd all gone very quiet...

I do like Finn , but if he plays in Sri Lanka , it will be instead of Panesar. And it surely won't be in Galle.

if we play 5 bowlers, it will mean 2 spinners.

cricketfan90 wrote:if we play 5 bowlers, it will mean 2 spinners.

Probably true.

But that could be Patel and Swann. In which case Finn may well be included.

I would not get carried away with the idea that England should rely heavily on spin to do the damage , just because it is in Sri Lanka. After all , the Sri Lankans generally play spin bowling much better than Pakistan - in fact arguably better than anyone bar India. Not to say spinners won't take wickets against them , but England's strength is in pace bowling and this will still have to play a large part.
It has already been pointed out that Australia won a series there recently with only one full-time spin bowler , and that a newcomer.
And when England won back in 2001 , Giles and Croft certainly contributed , but the bulk of the wickets were taken by Gough and Caddick.

Galle is rarely kind to pace bowlers , so I'd expect two regular spin bowlers to play there , but Colombo may see more emphasis on the pace attack.

its very good signs for the future, that we have all these selection dilemmas, it means we have a very good pool of players!

The more I think about it the more I think the team will be:

Strauss
Cook
Trott
KP
Bell
Bopara
Prior
Broad
Swann
Anderson
Panesar

Fists of Fury wrote:I think we can expect this to be the team for the first Test:

Strauss (c)
Cook
Trott
Pietersen
Bell
Bopara
Prior (wk)
Broad
Swann
Anderson
Panesar

I also fully expect this to be the team but would prefer Bresnan instead of Bopara.