Most overrated players

First topic message reminder :

Think of the most overrated players you have ever seen and share them.
I cannot stand when a player is massively overrated and gets credit all the time despite the fact they have done little to deserve it.

Many come to mind but I'm sure you guys have some that just make your skin crawl.

Biltong wrote:Well AWOP, consider this.

Retired.

Props
Guthro steenkamp
CJ v d Linde
Hookers
John Smit
Locks
Bakkies Botha
Victor Matfield
Backrow
Danie Rossouw
Halfback
Fourie du Preez
Flyhalf
Butch James
Centres
Jaque Fourie


Injuries
Bismarck
Coenie Oosthuizen
Schalk Burger
Brussow
Juan Smith
Pierre Spies
JP Pietersen
B Basson

Jaaaaysus

It's amazing that you can still put together a team of reasonable calibre when faced with all these injuries. A good testament to your strength of depth. I guess that one major positive is that some of the younger players get great experience.

It was 2009 AWOP. NZ won the 3N in 08, nilling SA in SA in the process. We lost games in Aussie and in NZ to SA, and I think most Kiwis would think that SA were the better side in 08, which is probably why I myself enjoyed winning the 3N so much that year.

Things certainly changed 12 months later when SA got their act together.

The ABs are certainly good learners in defeat. SA in the amateur era and Australia in the 90s early noughties had a hold over us but generally we've reacted well to failure and come back stronger.

It seems some teams against the ABs get masochistic about defeats and want more of the same dished out the following time they meet.

What irks me about it though is the media of said countries at times. Don't get me wrong, NZ are the ABs' harshest critics and that's how it should be. But they judge NZ by NZ standards. The NH press also judge NZ by NZ standards which is odd and annoying. Wins which, if achieved by a NH team, like the 22-0 result, or the demolition of Ireland, would have been storied in the years/decades to come. But you just can't please certain journos. I'm not saying all of them, but there are a couple that spew out the same broken record. I don't want an All Black lovefest. That leads to complacency and complacency leads to losses. But I would like to see certain NH journos be constructive about the negatives of All Black play and not just antagonistic.

Mind you if we still pay Chris Rattue I suppose we deserve it...

Defo agree about that Aussie hex eh Kia. Was infuriating-and similar to what we have now. There haven't been that many hidings, rather a lot of close games where Aussie let it slip.

What did Stephen Jones have to say after the weekend? I bet he was spitting blood.

anotherworldofpain wrote:What did Stephen Jones have to say after the weekend?

Who cares?

Because it's hilarious when he gets wound up.

Nice list there Biltong. A lot of brawn, heavy bones and steel missing - which no doubt is a huge loss.

I had a think about our tattered team too. Since the RWC it's around 25 players either injured, retired or 'AWOL'.

OK, you can argue a few of the following players are uncapped and therefore unproven at International level but for a tiny little country like ours - that's all we bloody got!

Front Row:
Sekope Kepu
Selesi Ma’afu
Tatafu Polota-Nau

Locks/Flankers/No 8s:
James Horwill
Dan Vickerman [R]
Ben McCalman
David Pocock
Matt Hodgson
Pat McCutcheon
Jake Schatz
Rocky Elsom [AWOL/R]
Wycliff Palu

Halves:
Christian Lealiifano
Matt Toomua
Nic White

Centres/Wingers/Fullbacks:
James O’Connor
Drew Mitchell
LachieTurner
Pat McCabe
Cooper Vuna
Joseph Tomane
Dom Shipperly
Nick Cummins
Rod Davies
Bernard Foley
Ben Lucas

The 'good news' is our 2 replacements:

Paddy Ryan (prop), Mitch Inman (centre)

ffs, if we can scrape another win against Pakistan in the cricket in Abu Dhabi... I'll be slightly happier.

Didn't read it but I imagine Stephen Jones wrote something like inept display by ABs who spilled too much ball and failed to impose themselves on a dreadfully depleted and substandard Wallaby side. Typical basketball shenanigans from SBW and his team mates seemed to catch the inconceivable need to make those ill-advised offloads. Thankfully the game might return to normal now that he's off to Japan.

Meanwhile England will be rubbing their hands knowing that no SH powerhouse team looks anywhere near half way decent. Argentina showed them what decent forwards can do to these teams schooled on powderpuff forward play in the Super 15. It really does look like a clean sweep for England come November.

Or dribble to that effect.

Linebreaker, a few questions if you don't mind:

What on earth has happened to Rocky Elsom?

What's wrong with Micthell? I saw him take a nasty strike to the knee in the NZ game close to a ruck....?

What's wrong with Pat McCabe?

bluestonevedder wrote:
What's wrong with Pat McCabe?

That should be obvious to anyone who's seen him play.

Nice one AWOP.

Mitchell has ruptured his tendon properly now. It was done by one of our own players by accident. Nearly fractured his fibula but the achilles tendon failed instead. He's waiting on a donor. (makes me feel a little sad that) He's out for a year. So we simply have to forget him and move on.

McCabe has got some kind of foot injury but might be back in a few weeks.

Elsom got put on the outer by NSW and Robbie Deans; so has taken up a contract in Japan. He's also got a shoulder problem and has never really looked the player he was for Leinster.

AWOP: haha, that's actually quite funny. I do like McCabe though, I like his style of play.

That's terrible about Mitchell- I had no idea. It looked bad when it happened, but that's such awful luck for the guy.

Who do you see replacing him on the wing?

just checked, and it's saying his career is under threat??

Best of luck to him for the recovery.

Either Dom Shipperly or Luke Morahan.

Has to be Andy fatman Goode !!

I remember being in Brive when Leinster beat them.. even the Brive fans were slagging him off for being fat and useless !!!!

bluestonevedder wrote:AWOP: haha, that's actually quite funny. I do like McCabe though, I like his style of play.

That's terrible about Mitchell- I had no idea. It looked bad when it happened, but that's such awful luck for the guy.

Who do you see replacing him on the wing?

Kimami Sitauti

anotherworldofpain wrote:

bluestonevedder wrote:AWOP: haha, that's actually quite funny. I do like McCabe though, I like his style of play.

That's terrible about Mitchell- I had no idea. It looked bad when it happened, but that's such awful luck for the guy.

Who do you see replacing him on the wing?

Kimami Sitauti

Has he played any club games yet AWOP?!

Duigers wrote:Has to be Andy fatman Goode !!

I remember being in Brive when Leinster beat them.. even the Brive fans were slagging him off for being fat and useless !!!!

Given that Goode takes a lot of stick (mostly for being a bit chubby and having dodgy hair) I'm not sure if he's ever been overrated. Underrated if anything.

He's won several Premiership titles, two Heineken Cups, is the all-time highest points scorer in the English Premiership (and was second highest in T14 when at Brive in his first season) so he's doing something right even if he is a bit rotund!

He might not have been a great international, but he's been a very good (and very successful club player).

[quote="sugarNspikes"]

Duigers wrote:Has to be Andy fatman Goode !!

I remember being in Brive when Leinster beat them.. even the Brive fans were slagging him off for being fat and useless !!!!

Given that Goode takes a lot of stick (mostly for being a bit chubby and having dodgy hair) I'm not sure if he's ever been overrated. Underrated if anything.

He's won several Premiership titles, two Heineken Cups, is the all-time highest points scorer in the English Premiership (and was second highest in T14 when at Brive in his first season) so he's doing something right even if he is a bit rotund!

[b]He might not have been a great international, but he's been a very good (and very successful club player).[quote]

+1. He was very successful at Leicester

And when he played for England they scored tries, so not sure why he was labelled an outcast.

Morgannwg wrote:And when he played for England they scored tries, so not sure why he was labelled an outcast.

Yuck. Why would we want a FH who facilitates tries? Everyone knows rugby is a 10 man game

He was an unreliable place-kicking for England, but at the time they had Delon Armitage in the team who was the kicker at London Irish.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Didn't read it but I imagine Stephen Jones wrote something like inept display by ABs who spilled too much ball and failed to impose themselves on a dreadfully depleted and substandard Wallaby side. Typical basketball shenanigans from SBW and his team mates seemed to catch the inconceivable need to make those ill-advised offloads. Thankfully the game might return to normal now that he's off to Japan.

Meanwhile England will be rubbing their hands knowing that no SH powerhouse team looks anywhere near half way decent. Argentina showed them what decent forwards can do to these teams schooled on powderpuff forward play in the Super 15. It really does look like a clean sweep for England come November.

Or dribble to that effect.

You forgot the words arrogant and preening mate. As well as choking and poaching. These games don't count remember. And neither does the WC because we bought Joubert. Mind you the best of the brown boys to break through is actually Maori so I bet he'll be all flustered with that one. Oh wait. NZ is made up of Pacific Islanders so of course we are pillaging the Pacific Islands in our unfair and tedious quest to have the world take notice of this hideous backwater of a country using the only means possible: rugby.

disneychilly wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Didn't read it but I imagine Stephen Jones wrote something like inept display by ABs who spilled too much ball and failed to impose themselves on a dreadfully depleted and substandard Wallaby side. Typical basketball shenanigans from SBW and his team mates seemed to catch the inconceivable need to make those ill-advised offloads. Thankfully the game might return to normal now that he's off to Japan.

Meanwhile England will be rubbing their hands knowing that no SH powerhouse team looks anywhere near half way decent. Argentina showed them what decent forwards can do to these teams schooled on powderpuff forward play in the Super 15. It really does look like a clean sweep for England come November.

Or dribble to that effect.

You forgot the words arrogant and preening mate. As well as choking and poaching. These games don't count remember. And neither does the WC because we bought Joubert. Mind you the best of the brown boys to break through is actually Maori so I bet he'll be all flustered with that one. Oh wait. NZ is made up of Pacific Islanders so of course we are pillaging the Pacific Islands in our unfair and tedious quest to have the world take notice of this hideous backwater of a country using the only means possible: rugby.

If you're just going to copy and paste his article you should at least give the credit!

anotherworldofpain wrote:

disneychilly wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Didn't read it but I imagine Stephen Jones wrote something like inept display by ABs who spilled too much ball and failed to impose themselves on a dreadfully depleted and substandard Wallaby side. Typical basketball shenanigans from SBW and his team mates seemed to catch the inconceivable need to make those ill-advised offloads. Thankfully the game might return to normal now that he's off to Japan.

Meanwhile England will be rubbing their hands knowing that no SH powerhouse team looks anywhere near half way decent. Argentina showed them what decent forwards can do to these teams schooled on powderpuff forward play in the Super 15. It really does look like a clean sweep for England come November.

Or dribble to that effect.

You forgot the words arrogant and preening mate. As well as choking and poaching. These games don't count remember. And neither does the WC because we bought Joubert. Mind you the best of the brown boys to break through is actually Maori so I bet he'll be all flustered with that one. Oh wait. NZ is made up of Pacific Islanders so of course we are pillaging the Pacific Islands in our unfair and tedious quest to have the world take notice of this hideous backwater of a country using the only means possible: rugby.

If you're just going to copy and paste his article you should at least give the credit!

You brilliant bar stids,so true.....Kia ora.

aucklandlaurie wrote:

anotherworldofpain wrote:

disneychilly wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Didn't read it but I imagine Stephen Jones wrote something like inept display by ABs who spilled too much ball and failed to impose themselves on a dreadfully depleted and substandard Wallaby side. Typical basketball shenanigans from SBW and his team mates seemed to catch the inconceivable need to make those ill-advised offloads. Thankfully the game might return to normal now that he's off to Japan.

Meanwhile England will be rubbing their hands knowing that no SH powerhouse team looks anywhere near half way decent. Argentina showed them what decent forwards can do to these teams schooled on powderpuff forward play in the Super 15. It really does look like a clean sweep for England come November.

Or dribble to that effect.

You forgot the words arrogant and preening mate. As well as choking and poaching. These games don't count remember. And neither does the WC because we bought Joubert. Mind you the best of the brown boys to break through is actually Maori so I bet he'll be all flustered with that one. Oh wait. NZ is made up of Pacific Islanders so of course we are pillaging the Pacific Islands in our unfair and tedious quest to have the world take notice of this hideous backwater of a country using the only means possible: rugby.

If you're just going to copy and paste his article you should at least give the credit!

You brilliant bar stids,so true.....Kia ora.

Right, that does it!! I'm pi$$ed off now, where's the nearest Welshman?

I dread to mentions GS, but he always springs to mind when i hear the word "overrated".

I'm english and I can agree to a point regards Courtney Lawes. He's not consistent enough, although he's been unlucky with injuries

I think James Hook is overrated. He can be brilliant, but other times, total pants. Great players need to be great 95% of the time.

Duigers wrote:Has to be Andy fatman Goode !!

I remember being in Brive when Leinster beat them.. even the Brive fans were slagging him off for being fat and useless !!!!

I don't think Andy Goode was ever hyped up or over-rated. I think that exists in your own mind - or you have misunderstood the exam question.

Goode took a lot of 'pie-eating' stick, but he was a very relaible and solid player, his record speaks for itself.

ebop wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:

anotherworldofpain wrote:

disneychilly wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Didn't read it but I imagine Stephen Jones wrote something like inept display by ABs who spilled too much ball and failed to impose themselves on a dreadfully depleted and substandard Wallaby side. Typical basketball shenanigans from SBW and his team mates seemed to catch the inconceivable need to make those ill-advised offloads. Thankfully the game might return to normal now that he's off to Japan.

Meanwhile England will be rubbing their hands knowing that no SH powerhouse team looks anywhere near half way decent. Argentina showed them what decent forwards can do to these teams schooled on powderpuff forward play in the Super 15. It really does look like a clean sweep for England come November.

Or dribble to that effect.

You forgot the words arrogant and preening mate. As well as choking and poaching. These games don't count remember. And neither does the WC because we bought Joubert. Mind you the best of the brown boys to break through is actually Maori so I bet he'll be all flustered with that one. Oh wait. NZ is made up of Pacific Islanders so of course we are pillaging the Pacific Islands in our unfair and tedious quest to have the world take notice of this hideous backwater of a country using the only means possible: rugby.

If you're just going to copy and paste his article you should at least give the credit!

You brilliant bar stids,so true.....Kia ora.

Right, that does it!! I'm pi$$ed off now, where's the nearest Welshman?

I am actually tempted to sign up for Times Online just to compare his thoughts with this, but I realise that would be falling into his trap. What he need is an easy led popularist, simple minded, misguided anglo/welsh fan with too much money, muddled brain and tory sympathies to sign up and check the article. Anybody know if Rugbydreamer votes tory?

If Stephen Jones were to read this he'd realise his work was done

anotherworldofpain wrote: Anybody know if Rugbydreamer votes tory?

Why don't you ask her? She was in the Pub a minute ago. I'm sure she'd love to hear from you.

https://www.606v2.com/t34157p450-the-dew-drop-inn-virtual-rugby-pub-sea-of-tranquility-luna

Because I'm scarred Linebreaker. Every time I am in the same thread I end up with a ban.

That was a grand entrance if ever I've seen one.
You won't get a ban.................................................................. from me.

AWOP, just litter your posts with smiley faces and you can say what you like.

red_stag wrote:AWOP, just litter your posts with smiley faces and you can say what you like.

You need to use the appropriate ones though, see how I edited Stag's post.

So, RD is out. Her minder implied that she doesn't vote Tory and that I should move the conversation on from politics.

Can anyone think of a rabid Welsh fan that smells like they have too much cash?

I'd go black and blue trying to think of one....

anotherworldofpain wrote:So, RD is out. Her minder employer implied that she doesn't vote Tory and that I should move the conversation on from politics.

Can anyone think of a rabid Welsh fan that smells like they have too much cash?

Aside from Stephen Jones of the Times you mean?

Linebreaker wrote:I'd go black and blue trying to think of one....

Say it aint so! He's too funny to be a Tory surely. Mind you, that John Major was a bit of a dark horse wasn't he.
I picture our hero drinking home made whiskey from a pint glass, roasting fox over his fireplace whilst arguing the place of organised religion in modern society with his taxidermed uncle dressed in school uniform sitting in a baked bean bath.
I have these scenarios for all of you.

Submachine wrote:

Linebreaker wrote:I'd go black and blue trying to think of one....

Say it aint so! He's too funny to be a Tory surely. Mind you, that John Major was a bit of a dark horse wasn't he.
I picture our hero drinking home made whiskey from a pint glass, roasting fox over his fireplace whilst arguing the place of organised religion in modern society with his taxidermed uncle dressed in school uniform sitting in a baked bean bath.
I have these scenarios for all of you.

So a normal, down-to-earth, run-of-the-mill, average Jones in other words?

What we'd call in Ireland an Independent candidate.

Or Andy Howell

Darius Boyd.

ooops, sorry. Wrong code.

Submachine wrote:

Linebreaker wrote:I'd go black and blue trying to think of one....

Say it aint so! He's too funny to be a Tory surely. Mind you, that John Major was a bit of a dark horse wasn't he.
I picture our hero drinking home made whiskey from a pint glass, roasting fox over his fireplace whilst arguing the place of organised religion in modern society with his taxidermed uncle dressed in school uniform sitting in a baked bean bath.
I have these scenarios for all of you.

I would laughing about it but I worry you are serious

It all starts in a couple of hours ,i really can't wait for the new season.