Woods confirms Ryder Cup captaincy ambitions.

28-0 to Europe.

That would be like John Terry being in charge of The Commission for Racial Equality or Shane Lowry in charge of Weight Watchers.

Not so sure....despite your loathing of TW. Whatever else he wants in life, he wants to win anything he enters.
May have a problem creating a positive team environment though!

Do you have a source I cant find a story to confirm this?

Mac, I heard it on Radio 5 Live this morning, it's not for 2014 though, just for a point in the future.


Navy, do you really think that one of the worst Ryder Cup players in the history of the event, who isn't a team player and by all accounts isn't a great communicator can really galvanise a team?

That is what is so funny about it. Generally Ryder Cup captains are inspirational characters, in Ryder Cup terms Woods is a nobody at best and a liability at worst.
Another Hal Sutton.

Not saying he'd do well at it at all. Just saying that he doesn't like doing things if he's losing. Therefore, he'd try his damnedest to make it work.

I don't think anyone likes losing do they?
I'm sure he tries hard when he's playing Ryder Cup, but it never works for him, so much so he's got one of the worst records in the history of the even and was shiversomely bad this year.

Can't see him being any better as a Captain, but American's always go for stature over substance so he probably will get it eventually, meaning Europe can play with a cigar on.

Sometimes you dont need a cuddly approach in leadership, you just need respect and the ability to get people to do what you tell them. Leadership comes in all sorts of shapes and sizes.

Usually you gain respect and guidance from someone who knows what they are doing though Diggers, and in Ryder Cup, Woods hasn't a clue. Can't see him galvanising or masterminding a team to play for him. Can you?

Could Woods have gee'd up a YOUESSAY team to do what Europe did last week? Probably the least inspirational speaker the world of golf has ever seen.

Be funny if it's Woods v Poulter as Captains. 28-0 to Europe.

I think Woods overall record is big enough for players to bypass his RC playing record and just accept they are being led by an all time great.
I think the whole inspirational speech stuff is a crock anyway, its how things happen on the day that matters.
By all accounts Ollie barely gave a speech and Poultry did all the gassing, so suprise there. Yet Ollie goes down as a great captain. Maybe Woods will have a mouthpiece in his team who will do the Poulter role while he just picks the sides.
Its all utter conjecture, who knows what the respective strengths of the sides will be.

Woods would be a great captain- highly intelligent, master strategist and oozing panache from every orifice, just what the Ryder cup captaincy calls for.

Being an all time great and major winner doesn't really make a difference in Ryder Cup though. America have about 5 times as many majors in every Ryder Cup team than Europe ever have but are virtually always on the losing end.

I think America need an inspirational, outspoken, opinionated Captain who gets on with everyone, not afraid to take risks, not a dreary, soulless, wooden, boring, monotone robot.

American sportsmen do tend to be a bit like Woods though, rather than passionate like Poulter or Seve.

I can't really think who would be a good American captain though. So many good players but no real outstanding canditates.

Of course Captains are inspriational. It's well known that Martin O Neill isn't great tactically or in training, but he knows how to get the best out of his players.

S_R for a man who lothes TW, you seem to be intent on talking about him a lot. Got a bit of a love-hate man chrush going on?

I'm not sure how he'd work out as a captain (and I don't know how many points won the captaincy actually impacts), but my first reaction would be "not good". However, I'm sure there would be lots of players who would declare themselves to be pumped, stoked and generally thank god for such an awesome captain.

incontinentia wrote:Woods would be a great captain- highly intelligent, master strategist and oozing panache from every orifice, just what the Ryder cup captaincy calls for.

I assume there's a large piece of tongue embedded firmly in some cheek with that remark?

incontinentia wrote:Woods would be a great captain- highly intelligent, master strategist and oozing panache from every orifice, just what the Ryder cup captaincy calls for.

Highly intelligent?
Master tactician? Yeah, his course management is brilliant. GUNG HO!!!!!
Oozing panache from every orifice? Well something oozes from his orifice, but it isn't panache. Oozes grey drizzle more like.

Roy Keane was a great player, crap manager though. Being a great player doesn't mean you'll be an "awesome" Captain of a Ryder Cup team.

[quote="super_realist"]

I think America need an inspirational, outspoken, opinionated Captain who gets on with everyone
quote]

Outspoken and opinionated people never get on with everyone.

Got to be said Super I don't think his RC playing record will have much of a bearing on his leadership potential. Ferguson & Mourinho hardly had distinguished playing careers did they? Whereas Maradona struggled in management to say the least!!

The yanks do look up to him because of his overall record and will be blinded by that. Also, I'm not sure if the persona presented to the media would be the same one that would come out in the team room. The one thing that is a given is that if offered it he would give it 120%. Having said that even that wouldn't be enough against a Poulter led Europe. We're probably talking about at least 2020 though.

No tongue in cheek whatsoever, the man has what it takes he just needs to use it in the right way.

Also with the Poulter thing, lets face it, where does his real inspiraion to the team come from.........on the course. Its not in the locker room, its by showing that a good but far from great player can raise his game to a different level than he manages most of the year. That makes other people think they can do the same.
Could well be that he becomes frustrated as a captain because he has no direct influence, who knows. The expectation would be Woods would be rubbish and Poulter would be great and that in itself could lead to problems.
Anyway be a nice match up if it happens.

JAS wrote:Got to be said Super I don't think his RC playing record will have much of a bearing on his leadership potential. Ferguson & Mourinho hardly had distinguished playing careers did they? Whereas Maradona struggled in management to say the least!!

The yanks do look up to him because of his overall record and will be blinded by that. Also, I'm not sure if the persona presented to the media would be the same one that would come out in the team room. The one thing that is a given is that if offered it he would give it 120%. Having said that even that wouldn't be enough against a Poulter led Europe. We're probably talking about at least 2020 though.

That's the thing though, people are thinking that simply because he's a good player he'll be a top captain, without realising he isn't exactly the team building type either and a pretty uninspiring personality. So not only is he a dreadful Ryder Cup player, he's a stinking character too, combined he could be a worse captain than Hal Sutton.

I believe after the RC he apologised to the rookies on the team for not bringing the points in. He didnt have to do that and it clearly shows whatever you thik of him SR he wanted to contribute more and he wanted to show the other players in the side that he cares.
Those rookies may well be senior players in 2020 and they will remember that kind of thing.

He's always stunk in the paired format, so the expectation he would pick up points is somewhat presumptious, so apologising for not bringing them in is rather a hollow gesture.

Woods and Stricker are the reason they lost the Ryder Cup. They should both get the spanish archer.

Diggers

Why are you entering this debate with super, he clearly cant talk about woods without loosing all sense of reality?

I'm perfectly rational Mac, I just think that putting Woods in charge of a Ryder Cup team would be as bad as putting Jimmy Saville in charge of a youth disco.


p.s isn't it marvellous to see his poor form continue in Turkey?

Can't imagine why Woods would apologise to team members for his poor form. His Captain perhaps, but the fact that he's proven to be incompatible in any long-term relationship (Furyk, Elin, Stricker, IMG) must be evidence that he's useless in a team environment.

Until Team USA can figure out why their Sunday lead was likely to be vulnerable, Europe will always have an edge. Regardless of skipperdom.

If he is useless in a team environment how come he has a good Presidents Cup record ? Or are we meant to just ignore that fact because it doesnt suit the argument ?

Well make him Presidents Cup captain then. No problem with that, it's a mere sideshow/exhibition anyway which Kwini has confirmed isn't really a big deal, but he clearly has a problem in Ryder Cup doesn't he?, otherwise his record wouldn't be so laughably dismal.

kwinigolfer wrote:... must be evidence that he's useless in a team environment.

In a playing capacity yes, but who knows how he would do as Captain. My guess is if he genuinely wants is that he would be very good.

Diggers wrote:If he is useless in a team environment how come he has a good Presidents Cup record ? Or are we meant to just ignore that fact because it doesnt suit the argument ?

The RotW aren't as good as Europe?

Digs,
There's no pressure in a Presidents Cup environment, not to the Americans anyway - even then, in Melbourne, he didn't start to play decent golf until the result was no longer in question.

And, for obvious reasons, the RotW are also hopeless as a Team - a couple of players only just turned up in time last year, they couldn't really care less.

I really believe the Ryder Cup has team pressure these guys don't experience in any other environment.

kwinigolfer wrote:Digs,
There's no pressure in a Presidents Cup environment, not to the Americans anyway - even then, in Melbourne, he didn't start to play decent golf until the result was no longer in question.

And, for obvious reasons, the RotW are also hopeless as a Team - a couple of players only just turned up in time last year, they couldn't really care less.

I really believe the Ryder Cup has team pressure these guys don't experience in any other environment.

How was the result received in America Kwini? Brushed under the carpet as if it never happened North Korea style?

I dont really see what pressure has to do with it. The question is can he play in a team, does he enjoy being in a team, do the team enjoy him being part of the team.
Quite clearly from the Presidents Cup the answers would be yes. So its not that he cant be part of a team or play well in a team its just that it hasnt worked out that way in RC matches all the time.
So I really dont see how you can just dismiss him as being useless in a team environment, becausethere is eveidence to suggest that isn't the case at all times.

Diggers, I think the point is that he can make a result when he is playing against a disorganised opposition who couldn't care less, but really struggles against a passionate team who'll do anything to win when there is real pressure and when team unity/tactics/passion really come into play.

The Presidents Cup doesn't really have any of those elements just like the Seve Trophy.

Seems like the implication is he just cant get on with team mates in any shape or form and thats being taken from his RC record...because it suits. Its also clearly wrong becasue there is evidence to suggest that he can be part of a team, I dont really see how that can be ignored just because people feel it suits their argument.
You cant dismiss facts.

s_r:
The Ryder Cup?

The Pros, guys like Miller, Azinger were just "stunned", their word, not mine. The golfing media have been all over the place, Davis Love's fault for picking Furyk and Stricker, not sending Bradley and Phil out for Saturday fourballs, having Bubba opening the singles batting and Woods relegated to 12th man. You name it, they bellyached about it.

But I think s_r and I were right in our pre-RC debate with Shotrock - the USA are always going to be at a disadvantage in such a "team" environment, the Golf Channel's Brandel Chamblee unwittingly putting his finger on the button by equating Football crowds in Europe with College Football in the USA. Yeah, right Brandel!

I don't think there's any pressure like the Ryder Cup and, for the most part, the US doesn't yet get that.

s_r is spot on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Diggers wrote:Seems like the implication is he just cant get on with team mates in any shape or form and thats being taken from his RC record...because it suits. Its also clearly wrong becasue there is evidence to suggest that he can be part of a team, I dont really see how that can be ignored just because people feel it suits their argument.
You cant dismiss facts.

I don't think people are saying that at all, except that it could probably be argued that even a dispassionate Woods/ and whoever could win against some of the dross rolled out for the Presidents Cup.

Does that mean he can play in a team, or is the opposition just not very good or interested?

The simple fact is that you dont know the answer to that question, so you just choose to believe he cant be part of a team. Its basically just lazy and doesnt take account of the facts.
Its like saying Woods is rubbish at matchplay when he is actually one of the greatest matchplay golfers in history.

I don't think he is not trying nor do I believe he doesn't care much. It's just one of those quirks, Monty was brilliant playing RC but couldn't close out majors. I know whose professional record I would rather have.

Turning to whether Woods should be a future captain, I tend to agree that he probably shouldn't be. He hasn't shown anything that I personally think would make him a suitable leader at the RC. Either battling and getting points on the board or motivating team mates personally.

That said, does anyone really think he won't get the gig at some point? I think it's a nailed on certainty. (NB not whether he SHOULD get it.)

Diggers, I see what you are saying, but claiming Woods can play in a team environment using a tinpot and worthless event like The Presidents Cup is papering over some very large cracks.

In competition that actually is taken seriously, he falls hysterically short. As for Woods being one of the greatest matchplay players in history. Steady on.

SR, it doesnt paper over anymore cracks than saying the opposite, that he cant play in a team. Therefore I dont believe you can dismiss his RC record in such a simplistic way.
His record in the WGC Matchplay is better than anyones, 3 wins. Or doesnt that count either ?

Why not Diggers, he's got a worse Ryder Cup record than almost anyone, why? He's had many partners (Mickelson, Furyk, Stricker) but time and again fails dismally. (not wholly his fault granted) but rather telling that he can't seem to play with anyone with good results. Highly amusing that his singles record is far better.

Three wins in the WGC Matchplay is very impressive, but it hardly makes him one of the best Matchplay players ever, especially when some of his results in that competition have been pant wettingly funny.

Digs,
Of course his Match Play record has been fantastic, and he does well in RC singles - but he fails dismally as a partner in Ryder Cup.
"Doesn't that count either?".

In the past he was probably one hole up before he'd played his opening tee shot, especially in the WGC MatchPlay. Interesting that most of his losses have been to non-PGA Tour golfers who may not have been as intimidated by him. DC, Nick O'Hern twice before he joined the Tour, Peter O'Malley, Bjorn etc.

Kwini, it does of course count. Ive never said that Woods is a brilliant team player, Ive merely said that here is plenty to suggest he isnt totally useless.
Im not the one ignoring one side of the argument here.

The question is whether or not his team credentials (which are in question) will do him any good in a Ryder Cup captaincy capacity.

You'd have to say that there isn't a great deal which would lead anyone to believe he could be a good Ryder Cup captain, given his results in the event and his dismal personality.

I think you're overlooking some really great things that Woods could bring to the Ryder Cup captaincy. Forgeddabout the ping pong and prayer group stuff.

There would be a brilliant entertainment and relaxation area with lap dancing, buxom waitresses. The boys could have theirs aches and pains cared for with the spa area and finish off with the rub and tug to send them off to bed with a smile on their face.

It would almost be like Carlsberg organising your boys golf trip. You've got your golfing gear handed to you, the cars, playing on a great course, and now the apres golf fun.

Your opinion of his personality is pretty irrelevamnt as you dont actually know the guy. The guys with the more popular personalities like Clarke and McIlroy count Woods a friend, Clarke calls him a very close friend.
Woods gets on with plenty of players as far as I can see.

They are hardly going to publicly say he's an a-hole are they? Bit like when someone comes off the Old Course and they have a microphone stuffed in their face and asked what their favourite course is.

Given his press conferences, which is all we can go on. He doesn't engender the sort of passion or intelligence required to balance a team and instill belief and get a bunch of guys going. Of course he could be Boris Johnston for all I know and have them rolling in the aisles with his eccentricity and turn of phrase, but I doubt it somehow.

I can't see a terrific captain in Team USA's future - Furyk might not be bad and Phil might be OK but none of the other before-Tiger candidates offer much threat, certainly not Toms/Cink/Leonard/Stricker.

Would think that Woods would opt for a USA home game, would be astonished if he fancied playing away. Not golf anyway.

Digs,
To be fair, fellow golfers are unlikely to characterize Tiger as a sh1thead in the same way some have had a go at Phil (for instance). Whatever they really think about him.

kwinigolfer wrote:s_r is spot on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hold the front page!

kwinigolfer wrote:...the Golf Channel's Brandel Chamblee unwittingly putting his finger on the button by equating Football crowds in Europe with College Football in the USA. Yeah, right Brandel!...

Just out of interest, does Chamblee ever say anything worth listening to?