George Groves - will he make it to world class?

I think Groves is a pretty popular British fighter, certainly on these shores.

He has very good pop, decent hand speed and what I think could be a world class jab. But something tells me that against the elite he won't quite make it. I know he is young, and improving all the time, but I have the feeling that once he fights a guy who can a) take a good punch and b) give it back in spades, he is going to come unstuck. I suppose Froch is the name that is being banded about at the moment, and to me that would be a massacre. Froch has a solid chin and when he starts landing his power shots I can't imagine Groves surviving. Time is on his side, yes. And i don't really have anything concrete to explain why I think he will not make it, but there it is.

Whats the boards take on Groves talent?

It's interesting that he wants the winner of Abraham vs Stieglitz because if Abraham wins that Groves could face a real gut check. Abraham is tough and covers up well, but if he lands he hurts you.

I think he could well get one of the belts, him and Degale are both looking at a future with Andre Ward in it and if he stays at SMW then I don't see either of them becoming the main man.

He is world class already. Pity he has Ward in the same division though. He can beat AA if he keeps his defence tight.

i'd say he's about euro level at the moment, and no doubt will become a least a fringe contender.

however i think he can certainly pick up a piece of the title, but he is 2-3 years away from froch or ward

I have just checked his ranking with all the belts he's 5 th on the WBC 2nd on the WBA 7th on IBF and 2nd on the WBO. The only current belt holder he has a chance against is Abraham I think. I don't think he's fought anyone near world level to get him ranked so high. Put him in with Bika or somebody tough and world ranked if he gets through that give him a title shot.

probably the johnson fight won him some ranking points, but he wasn't really putting up much of a fight.

World class as in Alphabet soup...yes...............

World class is a label that doesn't mean anything these days....Sometimes harder to win at domestic level!!

If Ward is world class then he isn't..................

So basically there is only one world class smw according to Truss.

He is not world class yet az.

I think he needs a couple of stern tests first. A decent fighter will tag him plus he just looks the type of British looser who ''tried his best''

Wouldn't seem much different to:

azania wrote:Froch is also the third best fightet at his weight. A world belt holder and also the world's best paper champion. Sad but true. Undeniably a very good fighter but paper champion regardless.

azania wrote:To be fair, Froch is also a paper champ. The best paper champ out there. At this stage Froch will spank Groves, JdG and Clev without much fuss.

He is probably one of the best ten in the world so by definition is world class.

Top. Is anything I wrote incorrect? Froch is world class. Its just that Ward is better.

azania wrote:He is probably one of the best ten in the world so by definition is world class.

Top. Is anything I wrote incorrect? Froch is world class. Its just that Ward is better.

Nothing wrong with that bit, certainly.

I remember a 606 debate sometime back, it went something like "what constitutes world class?". I don't think it was resolved.

If world class means, will he be in a world title fight?... then yes he will.

If it means, will he win a version of the world title?... then yes he will.

If it means, will he be involved in a world wide high profile fight?...then it depends on who he fights.

If it means, will he be rated in the Top 10 in the world by ring magazine?...then yes (he already is)

If it means, will he be Top 10 P4P?... Then no he won't.

Yeah, I would also put him on the maybe list for being world class right now, he has really only beaten guys who are proven Euro Level and nothing more just yet, Johnson was pretty past it so wasn't a true test of world level I don't think, though all the signs are saying that he could make it world class level.

However, I agree with you Sean, there's something that feels slighty... Vulnerable about him, just like there could be a missing piece there.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:World class as in Alphabet soup...yes...............

World class is a label that doesn't mean anything these days....Sometimes harder to win at domestic level!!

If Ward is world class then he isn't..................

I look at it as world class withing your weight category. Is he a world class SM?

Seanusarrilius wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:World class as in Alphabet soup...yes...............

World class is a label that doesn't mean anything these days....Sometimes harder to win at domestic level!!

If Ward is world class then he isn't..................

I look at it as world class withing your weight category. Is he a world class SM?

Yeah I pretty much agree Sean, World Class in comparison to the guys around you in that division.

I get the feeling he can be world class, however only once the current top league move on.

I can't call him world class right now as I'd back Froch, Ward and Kessler over him with great confidence. Not saying anybody who can't beat those three isn't world class, am saying I wouldn't even think twice about it as they are in a totally different class to him right now.

Have to admit Abraham would be a tough one for him in my opinion. Very tough and solid physically, Groves may be used to guys being hurt by his power but he'd be unlikely to really wobble Arthur. Fortunately Arthur's engine doesn't seem great these days. He was huffing and puffing against Stielgitz towards the end. Groves could box safe to a decision, but there would be the possibility for a KO loss around the corner in every round.

He is one of my favourite fighters around right now though so all the best.

I reckon he will totally outclass AA.

Groves is a step ahead of Degale right now, simply put - because he has had less to cope with. I don't like Degale, probably never will but Groves is fringe world at the minute. Far too good for Euro Level which is where Degale will find himself for a few fights to clear his name and build his reputation again (avoiding being labelled a loudmouth who can't back it up as he is now)

I think Groves would get tonked by AA right now. AA is a much much stronger and better boxer than Kenny Anderson, and Groves although pulled it out of the bag to turn around a knockdown - AA hits harder.

That is until in a few fights time, 2 or 3 fights and Groves will have learned and developed that little bit more to take on a world champion. Think Froch right now is too much. Far too much. Think that Ward would pancake him. Kessler would squish his face. So, thats the top 4 out. Not world class yet - however give Froch a year and if he wars with Kessler again, wins and loses to Ward, Froch will probably lose a lot of faith in himself. He'll then know his limit. Groves won't know that until he finds it in Ward.

Have to remember that Groves was all over the place against a guy a few fights back......He sneaked a decision against Degale also...........

Johnson is in his mid 40s and Paul smith is crap...........

So the jury is still out......

Gets a lot of plaudits for the Degale win..but if it had gone the other way no one would have complained.

Can't see why he can't one day be world class, he is 24 atm and has been held back by inactivity which won't be a problem under Hearn

Think that his style is perfect to beat AA, and should he avoid a flush shot in the chin then he should be able to out point AA. AA hasn't looked the same at 168 and his tank and footspeed has looked very poor. Groves hits hard, has a good skill set from his good amateur background and while he's a bit fragile he is always on the move making it hard to land on him solidly

He's improved since Kenny and is looking better than when he eeked out a win over degale

Ward is a couple levels above him (no hame in that), Kessler and Froch are a level or 2 above him and the others are around his level but he has yet to prove it

groves is a long way behind ward, dirrell, kessler and froch. its a great division and i dont think groves will ever be near the top of it. he should be fighting more regularlry, but i get the sense they are not quite sure what to do with him. hes done well to gain such a high profile from the opposition he has beaten, and he owes a lot of thanks to degale and haye for putting him on the map. hes got himself into a position where hes got a lot to lose. sooner or later he will have to take on the divisions best and cant sell himself as a prospect forever

I think provided Groves keeps busy, and keeps getting the rounds under his belt, he will continue to improve. As stated, he is Euro level at present, and should be good for a shot at the WBO bauble in a fight or two.

I like Groves; he's not in Ward's class and right now Froch is likely to have his number, but I don't think Carl would have it all his own way. One to watch - he does the basics well & he entertains. Long may that continue.

Mr Bounce wrote:I think provided Groves keeps busy, and keeps getting the rounds under his belt, he will continue to improve. As stated, he is Euro level at present, and should be good for a shot at the WBO bauble in a fight or two.

I like Groves; he's not in Ward's class and right now Froch is likely to have his number, but I don't think Carl would have it all his own way. One to watch - he does the basics well & he entertains. Long may that continue.

Who is?

Groves

Huh?

Ward is a class apart. No surprise that all other contenders are looking at other belts instead of fighting him.

That's exactly what I said - Groves is not in Ward's class.

Well who is in Ward's class?

I think Degale has more talent....................I think Groves fought the best fight he could have fought last time and still got a contentious decision......

I think Degale was out thought and still had a case for winning....

I believe out of the two Degale is more talented and I believe he'd learn from the first fight and take a decision...........

Yet he's not managed to demonstrate any of that supposed greater talent and ability since, ahead of Groves. Struggled v a Euro patsy and fought nobody since who's better than the (shopworn) Johnson.

Think Groves edged Degale, but i could see him winning more comfortably next time maybe even by stoppage, he looks better every fight and is maturing physically he is now also the one that carries the greater confidence into the ring, Degale has stood still and has quite a few weaknesses in his game. I would love to see Degale work with Rob McCracken for a while and then we could potentially see England with 2 outstanding world class fighters at the top of the division in a couple of years, presuming Ward goes up in weight before long of course.

Some fighters perform better against better opposition........

Starling had terible nights against Bumphus...Blocker...Molinares types.....

On the money against Brown, Honeyghan types though..........

Could be the same with James..

Still think Groves was at his best that night and he still just nicked it.

Yep could be. Though in his one chance to shine so far he failed.

Can't dispute that..