Peterson vs Matthysse - May 18th???

First topic message reminder :

Apparantly its going to happen on the Alexander "the cry baby" vs Kell Brook card.

Can Peterson win? commit another robbery (ala Khan)?? Or is the hard hitting Argie Bargie gonna pick up his first strap?

Thoughts??

Peterson doesn't have any outstanding attributes. He’s an all rounder who does most things better than Mathysse. However the problem lies in his speed of reaction (defending). Judah and Alexander have `fast eyes’ allowing them to take the sting out shot's. Peterson doesn't have this luxury and gets caught far too often, and cleanly (even against a far from outstanding fighter like Holt).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ou3k68edpA

If it goes to points (and there aren't too many 10-8 rounds against him) he'll win a fight that he's been made to work every second to win.

azania wrote:I stated that he is one dimensional and continued that the dimension was very good. Is that criticism or a balanced opinion?

I think he would beat JMM but lost to Bradley convincingly. I have watched more boxing than I care to remember. I pay no attention to what others say and go by what I see. Soto was catching Lucas a few times but didn't have the power to do anything. He was cut through like a knife through butter. The weight differential played a part. Soto looked fleshy and out of shape. If you don't believe me then you are deluding yourself.

Now I've heard it all, Lucas loses easily to Peterson, Bradley and Khan yet beats Marquez, the only one of the 3 that has proved himself against aggressive guys with power. Bradley recently struggled with provodnikov (the only come forward fighter on his CV) and has been hurt by Holt and ruslan who is a B level fighter, Khan struggled with petersons and Maidana pressure along with Maidana/Garcia/prescott's power and Peterson struggled with Ortiz's power and pressure. Then you have Maruqez who is at his best when up agaisnt aggressive guys such as Pacquiao, Diaz, Katsidis etc

Btw, I know he isn't a big LWW but can you stop saying Soto wasn't conditioned (in shape) or was fat as that is plain BS

http://www.boxingscene.com/photos-ortiz-lopez-matthysse-soto-massive-gallery--54312

http://www.boxingscene.com/photos-victor-ortiz-josesito-lopez-tense-weigh---54257

88Chris05 wrote:Ah, rats. My apologies, Az - it seems you've stopped calling Olusegun a fat Super-Featherweight and it's now Soto who (more understandably!) gets that title. Sorry again.

Wouldn't mind getting your round by round breakdown of Matthysse-Alexander to see where Devon won all of these rounds, mind you!

I'm going from memory. I just thought Alexander was the busier of the two for most of the fight in the rounds he was upright.

WHU_Champo_League_in_7Yrs wrote:

azania wrote:I stated that he is one dimensional and continued that the dimension was very good. Is that criticism or a balanced opinion?

I think he would beat JMM but lost to Bradley convincingly. I have watched more boxing than I care to remember. I pay no attention to what others say and go by what I see. Soto was catching Lucas a few times but didn't have the power to do anything. He was cut through like a knife through butter. The weight differential played a part. Soto looked fleshy and out of shape. If you don't believe me then you are deluding yourself.

Now I've heard it all, Lucas loses easily to Peterson, Bradley and Khan yet beats Marquez, the only one of the 3 that has proved himself against aggressive guys with power. Bradley recently struggled with provodnikov (the only come forward fighter on his CV) and has been hurt by Holt and ruslan who is a B level fighter, Khan struggled with petersons and Maidana pressure along with Maidana/Garcia/prescott's power and Peterson struggled with Ortiz's power and pressure. Then you have Maruqez who is at his best when up agaisnt aggressive guys such as Pacquiao, Diaz, Katsidis etc

Btw, I know he isn't a big LWW but can you stop saying Soto wasn't conditioned (in shape) or was fat as that is plain BS

http://www.boxingscene.com/photos-ortiz-lopez-matthysse-soto-massive-gallery--54312

http://www.boxingscene.com/photos-victor-ortiz-josesito-lopez-tense-weigh---54257

Where have I mentioned Khan? You're making stuff up again.

Are you serious, see you can't even remember what you write yourself

https://www.606v2.com/t41646-gbp-s-140-tournament-winner-of-tournament-gets-khanwait-what?highlight=Khan

Look at the last comment made by yourself

So the point I made still stands and you failed to respond

On another thread. Fair enough. I'd back Khan to beat him provided he boxes smart. He has the skill set to do a number on him. But if he gets caught.....! Should be box behind the jab and doesn't engage, he should win.

Bradley has been in with the best 140lbs guys and beaten them all. His level of opposition has been better than Lucas. Yes he's been hurt. Take a shower you get wet. The point is, he came back and won. I'd add that I had Pac miles ahead in their fight.

Peterson is a better all round boxer so I pick him. He can vary his game and win a comfortable decision.

JMM is simply too small to make a dent in Lucas hence I'd back Lucas to beat him. But interestingly you criticize Bradley for being bounced a few times, but say nothing about JMM who has done several yo yo acts himself.


Looking at the pictures simply confirms Soto being fleshy. Cheers.

The fact that you needed to look at that thread to remember what you think given you wrote it barely more than a week ago is laughable

Pacquiao is a bigger puncher (and a better boxer) than any of the other guys. He has been in with the best opposition of any of them. I used Provodnikov as an example as provodnikov is the only type of boxer that he has beat who has a style similar to Matthysse (and lets not even talk about the pacquiao win) whereas you can pick alot of strong fighters Marquez have dealt with all of which are levels above Ruslan. Peterson is not a boxer, holt was outboxing him untill he got into a tear up and he was also being outboxed and beaten up by Ortiz before Ortiz started moving backwards and could no longer sustain any attacks and Braldey could do whatever he wanted agaisnt Peterson, hardly a boxer

Marquez is not only the toughest of the lot, but probably hits as hard (none of the other 3 have great stoppage wins) if not harder than all of them and is just all round better

You think that's fleshy? Do you write for boxingnews24 as the garbage you spout is deserving of a job there

azania wrote:

88Chris05 wrote:Ah, rats. My apologies, Az - it seems you've stopped calling Olusegun a fat Super-Featherweight and it's now Soto who (more understandably!) gets that title. Sorry again.

Wouldn't mind getting your round by round breakdown of Matthysse-Alexander to see where Devon won all of these rounds, mind you!

I'm going from memory. I just thought Alexander was the busier of the two for most of the fight in the rounds he was upright.

Now here's the thing with matthysse Alexander Chris. No doubt matthysse was the better man, and that he won his rounds clearly, but you can make a case that he only won the round with the kd until about the 7th. Matthysse can consider himself unlucky but one of those fights where round by round scoring (if you prefer the slicker work of alexander) can make the fight not quite the robbery you and plenty of others think. Minority view perhaps but I had it close.

I've yet to buy my ticket for the matthysse hype train. Suspect Peterson may be too brave for his own good in this one, but I wouldn't write him off. Matthysse tko or Peterson points.

I'm not denying that there's a conceivability that any judge could have it close, Milky. But to me, even if you give Alexander every bit of the benefit of any doubt, it's still basically impossible to have him getting even a draw. I've heard people say that it was a "fight which could have gone either way" but, apart from those two judges, I'm yet to see a single soul who had it in favour of Alexander, or who even had it a draw. To me, that's not a fight which could go either way.

I still think that Matthysse won at least five rounds (the ones stated above) beyond any doubt. I'd say that there were only two rounds of a similar nature in Alexander's favour. Of those three more scrappy rounds, I gave Alexander two of them which I thought was pretty fair.

I have serious misgivings over whether Alexander would have got the nod had that fight not been in his backyard as it was. I said at the time that it wasn't an absolute highway job, but I'd still say it was a stinker of a decision all the same.

i watched this a short while back chris as i missed it at the time and wanted to see what all the fuss was about.

I'm no collector of scorecards, but i recall the only really clear rounds for matthysse being 4,7,8, with 4 being a 10-8.

I'd say 9 was clearly alexander's.

The other's were close, and i preferred alexander's work in most of them.

I see this fight like reid ottke and sturm macklin. One guy wins his rounds big, everyone feels he deserves the nod... but on a round by round basis its not so clear cut.

Genuinely not a robbery in my book. I'd say lucas was unlucky but not jobbed. I recognise this is a minority view, but i'm not completely on my own i can assure you chris!

WHU_Champo_League_in_7Yrs wrote:The fact that you needed to look at that thread to remember what you think given you wrote it barely more than a week ago is laughable

Pacquiao is a bigger puncher (and a better boxer) than any of the other guys. He has been in with the best opposition of any of them. I used Provodnikov as an example as provodnikov is the only type of boxer that he has beat who has a style similar to Matthysse (and lets not even talk about the pacquiao win) whereas you can pick alot of strong fighters Marquez have dealt with all of which are levels above Ruslan. Peterson is not a boxer, holt was outboxing him untill he got into a tear up and he was also being outboxed and beaten up by Ortiz before Ortiz started moving backwards and could no longer sustain any attacks and Braldey could do whatever he wanted agaisnt Peterson, hardly a boxer

Marquez is not only the toughest of the lot, but probably hits as hard (none of the other 3 have great stoppage wins) if not harder than all of them and is just all round better

You think that's fleshy? Do you write for boxingnews24 as the garbage you spout is deserving of a job there

And look how well Bradley performed against Pac. He lost imo but still performed well. If you're suggesting that Lucas is nearly as good as Pac, then I will have to disagree.

If you come rushing in against JMM with little to no defence, then hell pick you apart. I see you criticize Tim's opponents, yet ignore the fact that Diaz, Kats are both very limited fighters. I don't see JMM as a hard puncher. The punch that flattened Pac was perfectly placed and thrown. I doubt he'll ever score a KO like that again or has scored one like that in the past.

Look at how well JMM did against Pacquiao, he showed that he is a level above Bradley and after last week it seems even moreso

I didn't say that Lucas is as good as pacquiao, as I said I think as does most people do that JMM and Tim (less so after last week) would beat him, but style wise Diaz and Kat are similar to Lucas as is Ruslan

JMM may not be a huge puncher in retrospect of welterweights but as I said I'm comparing his power to that of the 3 fighters you think beat Lucas. Peterson, Braldey and Khan don't hit very hard as have never knocked out guys like Pacquiao, Diaz or Katsids who all have great chins.

On the GB tournament thread you said that Garcia beats him too (just in case you forgot). Out of JMM, Bradley, Khan, Peterson and Garcia (you can add Rios to that list as I'm sure that you said that you think Rios beats him) I just can't see how you can pick that JMM that has the worst chance of beating lucas

I tend to agree that Lucas is being a tad over rated.

For me its just another Lara at this point.

When Matthyse wins against Peterson, Garcia etc then I'll take note. But at present he is just another train for folk to jump on, just like Lara and Golovkin.

This year will tell you everything.

He struggled with Judah who is known to hit the ejecter button when hit by a stronger puncher.

He makes a good highlight reel, but there is no way he is the top 140lber

I think hes a little better than Lara and that there is something to get excited about with him. I dunno if I could either be for or against him as much as people on here but I can see a little what the fuss is about. Agreed that wins against those two would get me aboard the hype train but until then i'll err on the side of caution. I really think Golovkin is quite capable and hope to see him tested soon.

I just mean hype wise mate.

He is the flavor of the month, where as Lara was the last "next best thing", Golovkin as good as he seems hasnt really been in with top opposition. His last he didn't look all that special tbh.

I could and probably will be wrong. But seems some people are getting excited a little too early.

Where is Lara these days anyway?? Yea thats right, who cares

Judah was Lucas' first fight outside Argentina and the first real name he faced. You'd have to be blind not to see he's improved since then.

Nobody's actually saying he's an unbeatable monster. People keep saying people aare saying he's an unbeatable monster, but nobody actually has.

For such a none controversial boxer he certainly stirs debate. Moreso than PED, owned by bradley, lucky against Ortiz, down a few times Peterson.

John Bloody Wayne wrote:Judah was Lucas' first fight outside Argentina and the first real name he faced. You'd have to be blind not to see he's improved since then.

Nobody's actually saying he's an unbeatable monster. People keep saying people aare saying he's an unbeatable monster, but nobody actually has.

For such a none controversial boxer he certainly stirs debate. Moreso than PED, owned by bradley, lucky against Ortiz, down a few times Peterson.

This is a thread about Lucas and Bradley. I will repeat for the stubbornly ignorant, I want Lucas to win because Peterson is a cheat. I want Peterson to lose and disappear from boxing. But unfortunately, just as Lucas has improved, so has Peterson. I have my opinion why Peterson has improved physically and appears stronger than before but that's another story. The fact is that he has improved. At thi stage I will pick him over Lucas relatively easily. No slouch on Lucas who is a damn fine fighter. But Peterson is better.

People now want us to discount the Judah loss but want to drag the Ortiz draw and hold it against Peterson. Bradley may put most fans to sleep unless he is in the ring with a wild swinging boxer, but he is a very good technician and probably the best at 140.

WHU_Champo_League_in_7Yrs wrote:Look at how well JMM did against Pacquiao, he showed that he is a level above Bradley and after last week it seems even moreso

I didn't say that Lucas is as good as pacquiao, as I said I think as does most people do that JMM and Tim (less so after last week) would beat him, but style wise Diaz and Kat are similar to Lucas as is Ruslan

JMM may not be a huge puncher in retrospect of welterweights but as I said I'm comparing his power to that of the 3 fighters you think beat Lucas. Peterson, Braldey and Khan don't hit very hard as have never knocked out guys like Pacquiao, Diaz or Katsids who all have great chins.

On the GB tournament thread you said that Garcia beats him too (just in case you forgot). Out of JMM, Bradley, Khan, Peterson and Garcia (you can add Rios to that list as I'm sure that you said that you think Rios beats him) I just can't see how you can pick that JMM that has the worst chance of beating lucas

Look at how well JMM has always done against Pac. For me he's 4-0 up. He has his number. Look at how well Norton did against Ali. Does it mean Norton should beat Foreman? It means nothing.

If they were all FW or SFW, or even LWs I would pick JMM. But these are huge LWW who come in at LMW. I doubt JMM has sufficient power to go with his skills to keep them off him. Look at the issues a limited Katsidis gave him. These guys would beat and probably KO JMM. He may be highly ranked in the p4p stakes, but which LWW has he beaten? I discount Pac because he beat him at all the weights they have fought.

Not a chance, Pacquiao is harder hitting than anyone at 140lbs and had a chin far more proven than anyone at that weight, you also can't discount his wins over Pacquiao at the higher weights because he was proven at the higher weights.

The only chance Matthyse, Rios or the like have of beating Marquez is that he gets old over night.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Not a chance, Pacquiao is harder hitting than anyone at 140lbs and had a chin far more proven than anyone at that weight, you also can't discount his wins over Pacquiao at the higher weights because he was proven at the higher weights.

The only chance Matthyse, Rios or the like have of beating Marquez is that he gets old over night.

He's beaten him at every weight they fought. If they both put on another stone JMM would still beat him. If they both went down to Fly, the result will still be the same. JMM has his number plain and simple.

The more pertinent point is that Marquez can take Pacquiao's punch pretty damn well and totalled him in return, nobody at 140lbs hits as hard he does yet you back far inferior boxers to knock him out, another crazy theory of yours.

Let JMM in with someone notable at LWW or WW and see what happens. I'm not talking an easy to hit Kats type of fighter either. This is a FW who bulked up to chase Pac because he could beat Pac. Against someone else the weight difference will be telling.

marquez has always been beatable. hes one of my favourite boxers, but he often leaves you on the edge of your seat. he started very poorly against an average at best katsidis and if he had started that slowly against rios or matthysse he could well have been stopped.

when did he struggle with Katsidas btw??? Apart from the knockdown in the 3rd round it was one of the worst beatings iv seen a fighter take in years

A fighter of the calibre of JMM should not be getting knocked over by katz.

getting knocked down is a bit of a struggle though isnt it. it was no flash knockdown either, i think he hurt him and shook him up a bit. i dont rate rios, but marquez couldnt afford to get slack with him like him did with kats.

Some people are talking about Marquez, but don't have the first clue about him.

Marquez is a counter puncher and figures you out in the early rounds (just like Floyd Mayweather does). Any puncher will have a slight chance in the early rounds to knock them out before they crack your code. Once that happens you are finished.

1. Diaz started well and got blasted out
2. Katsidis started well and got dominated

Marquez got dropped heavily by Katsidis, yet at the end of the round he was battering him around the ring.

Marquez always starts slow, counter punchers always start slow.

Are people seriously suggesting that Khan can beat Marquez, but the stronger fast Pacquiao could not?

Marquez is even more dangerous when he is hurt... so the guys like Rios, Matthysse and Peterson? would have a punchers chance early, but if they can't get it him out of there, they are in for a serious beating.

Exactly, Marquez atm is levels above the three other mentioned fighters and while he may have one or two things to pick against him he has fought at the best opposition and done it the most convincingly. Kat dropped him heavily, and that was probably the only round he won, the others were dominated by JMM as he cut through Katsidis' defence and his face with so much ease as he is at his best when the action heats up

He has the best chin, the best technique, the best experiance, the best ring IQ and is on the best form

On a side note I think that this a great bumper night of boxing with it being an undercard fight on the brook bill and with more shows like this and the recent addition of mayweather showtime will make waves this year and could match HBO by 2014

I can't wait for this, should be a great card!