Pat Cash - "Nadal is the best volleyer in the game"

I was surprised to hear it from an accomplished serve and volley player like Cash who I would have thought would appreciate the difference between attacking the net and mopping up at the net. This is just my opinion, this is not a dig at Rafa, just something I have thought about for some time and was curious to see if anyone felt the same way?

Nadal in my opinion is the best in the world at sensing when to come to net and finish a point, does that make him the best volleyer in the world? I'm not so sure. His instinct is 2nd to none and his clever drop volleys invariably end in him winning the point.

I understand where people are coming from when they claim this as when he does volley I would say he wins the point 90 percent of the time, he has a great success rate. However, does he hit any great volleys? Volleys that are are special? In my mind no.

Federer misses a lot more volleys than Rafa does, no question. However, he does attempt to come to the net a lot more than Rafa does, he is usually attempting a much more challenging put away and hits some, that are quite frankly ridiculous at times.

Tsonga also I think can hit some absolutely stunning volleys and I have half mind to say he is the best volleyer in the world. Never forget this display https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DW0iKmRkgbA

Andy Murray I think has a great volley as well, he is good at timing his approaches as well like Rafa and am surprised he doesn't utilise this more often. Djokovic comes to the net probably more often than Rafa and Andy put together these days even though I would say has the weakest of the top 4, but it is something he clearly wants to master.

I could not imagine Rafa being capable of serving and volleying 2 points in a game for example, surely that must be something "the best volleyer in the game" must be doing now and again?

My point is, can a guy who seldom comes to the net be regarded at the best volleyer in the world? When he does come to the net of course we have all see him be successful, but have you ever said "wow" more than once in a match after Nadal has hit a volley? I can't say I have.

Yeah, this article is pretty much spot on.

Even as a Nadal fan I chuckled when Pat Cash said that
As you said, when he does come forward he does show some good touch- but frankly he doesn't go into the net often enough (to be called the best volleyer that is).

I'd put Llodra right up there.

Pat Cash, John McEnroe plus others. Addicted to "best ever" & "best in the World" statements.

It's not very grown up and it's certainly not informative.

totally agree red. llodra for me is the best imo.

Think Paes would have something to say about that claim.

LK, I don't really watch that much doubles, it would be unfair for me to comment- I was talking about singles.

I am sure there are some great volleyers in the doubles circuit

I agree that he is one of the best at choosing a good moment to go up to the net and put away a point - when Nadal comes to the net he nearly always wins the point (unless he's forced there by the opponent - even then you've got to get it spot on to catch him out). Having seen him play in person I have also noted that he has very soft hands at close quarters when he needs them - boring though I find him it would be absurd not to acknowledge his tennis skill in that respect (and others).

But he's not the best 'volleyer' in the sense normally understood because he doesn't play serve and volley and he doesn't set himself up to play challenging volleys. When he finishes off a point at the net it's because he's effectively won the point from the back of the court and he's delivering the coup de grace - skilfully, for sure - but only from a position of great strength earned by the real strength in his game, his baseline prowess.

If you put it this way - I doubt that his opponents factor into their game plan the possible need to make a quick decision pass him mid-rally because he might crop up at the net at any time.

barrystar wrote:I agree that he is one of the best at choosing a good moment to go up to the net and put away a point - when Nadal comes to the net he nearly always wins the point (unless he's forced there by the opponent - even then you've got to get it spot on to catch him out). Having seen him play in person I have also noted that he has very soft hands at close quarters when he needs them - boring though I find him it would be absurd not to acknowledge his tennis skill in that respect (and others).

But he's not the best 'volleyer' in the sense normally understood because he doesn't play serve and volley and he doesn't set himself up to play challenging volleys. When he finishes off a point at the net it's because he's effectively won the point from the back of the court and he's delivering the coup de grace - skilfully, for sure - but only from a position of great strength earned by the real strength in his game, his baseline prowess.

If you put it this way - I doubt that his opponents factor into their game plan the possible need to make a quick decision pass him mid-rally because he might crop up at the net at any time.

This is all correct and I'll also add that Nadal very rarely plays any punch volleys or even deep volleys into the corners - that's where the real art of volleying lies, the ability to control a low ball and direct it deep for an outright winner or to set up the final finishing volley. Rafa's volleys are mostly drop volleys or overhead/smashes.

Nadal has very good touch at the net and deceptively soft hands but he is not the best volleyer in the world. He could utilise volleying in his game on hard court more than he does however, and as he looks a step slower on clay than he was and seems to be playing slightly more attacking tennis, I think he should try it for the US Open. At worst he loses a Slam he is not favourite for without drawing out damage to his knees, at best he finally has an area on HC that Djoko won't outstrip him in

ChequeredJersey wrote:Nadal has very good touch at the net and deceptively soft hands but he is not the best volleyer in the world. He could utilise volleying in his game on hard court more than he does however, and as he looks a step slower on clay than he was and seems to be playing slightly more attacking tennis, I think he should try it for the US Open. At worst he loses a Slam he is not favourite for without drawing out damage to his knees, at best he finally has an area on HC that Djoko won't outstrip him in

Dunno about that, racing to the net behind a serve, stopping, split stepping and lunging can be far harder than running left and right.

bogbrush wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:Nadal has very good touch at the net and deceptively soft hands but he is not the best volleyer in the world. He could utilise volleying in his game on hard court more than he does however, and as he looks a step slower on clay than he was and seems to be playing slightly more attacking tennis, I think he should try it for the US Open. At worst he loses a Slam he is not favourite for without drawing out damage to his knees, at best he finally has an area on HC that Djoko won't outstrip him in

Dunno about that, racing to the net behind a serve, stopping, split stepping and lunging can be far harder than running left and right.

Fair enough. But he is going to have to find another way of playing because if he has to drop out of tournaments after RG then the HC season is going to hurt him

Djokovic is the best volleyer in the game. Fact.

It may not be true.

But it's still a fact.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fact

ChequeredJersey wrote:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fact

Stop trying to confuse things with cunning arguments, Jersey!

Here's another fact.

Contrary to popular opinion, Djokovic does not have the best overhead smash ever.

He is only the second best behind Sampras.

Fact.*


*all previous caveats apply.

emancipator wrote:

barrystar wrote:I agree that he is one of the best at choosing a good moment to go up to the net and put away a point - when Nadal comes to the net he nearly always wins the point (unless he's forced there by the opponent - even then you've got to get it spot on to catch him out). Having seen him play in person I have also noted that he has very soft hands at close quarters when he needs them - boring though I find him it would be absurd not to acknowledge his tennis skill in that respect (and others).

But he's not the best 'volleyer' in the sense normally understood because he doesn't play serve and volley and he doesn't set himself up to play challenging volleys. When he finishes off a point at the net it's because he's effectively won the point from the back of the court and he's delivering the coup de grace - skilfully, for sure - but only from a position of great strength earned by the real strength in his game, his baseline prowess.

If you put it this way - I doubt that his opponents factor into their game plan the possible need to make a quick decision pass him mid-rally because he might crop up at the net at any time.

This is all correct and I'll also add that Nadal very rarely plays any punch volleys or even deep volleys into the corners - that's where the real art of volleying lies, the ability to control a low ball and direct it deep for an outright winner or to set up the final finishing volley. Rafa's volleys are mostly drop volleys or overhead/smashes.

I agree. when Nadal volleys he almost already won the point by his baseline play, his net skills are not winning his points on its own, something Pat Cash fails to understand inspite of playing at the highest levels.

LuvSports! wrote:totally agree red. llodra for me is the best imo.

Good shot LS. At least Llodra is one of the last Server/volleyers. Not near Laver, mcenroe and edberg I think though but some nice touch and reflexes.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vm5_iHLTvO0&feature=youtube_gdata_player

Yes WC but remember that they were in more S and V friendly conditions. Whereas today the rackets make it very hard for a S and V player with passing shots galore and so much control at their disposal.

I dont know enough about it back then but thats just my view.

To echo LK's statement, Bryan brothers are pretty good too.

Llodra came from a doubles background, recall Llodra/Clement and Llodra with Benneteau and Mahut playing some great doubles.

I have been impressed with his 'flicks' when he chases down a drop shot, he's very good at finding the slightest gap

He's technically very good, particularly off the backhand side and overhead, good drop volleys too. Not surprising given that he's been playing doubles throughout his career, too. I don't think he's better than Federer; technically they're similar in ability, but if you told Nadal to approach the net as much as Fed and on the same type of shots, you'd see the difference. Other players such as Tsonga are better than both...

The specialist doubles players all romp the singles when it comes to volleying, at any rate! All of the top singles players are at least decent though, even Novak who's improved that area, and Murray who's very dismissive of net play in general. Despite all the discussions on here about surface homogenisation and the modern game, I don't think you can get away with having a dreadful volley when you're at the very top of the sport.

I used to think Tsonga was the best volleyer of the top players. But I really don't think he's volleyed as well since he changed from Wilson to Babolat racquets.