Italian GP Thread - Contains Spoilers of Race/Qualifying & Practice - Sponsored by Dolmio - When'sa your Dolmio Day?

[Fernando]

First topic message reminder :

This weekend is the final European race of the 2013 Formula One season and the home race for both Ferrari and tire supplier Pirelli. We are, of course, talking about the Italian Grand Prix at the legendary Autodromo di Monza, located on the outskirts of Milan. The track was built in 1922 and has hosted the Italian GP every year since 1950, with the sole exception of 1980, when the race was held at nearby Imola.

It’s the fastest track on the calendar with an average speed in excess of 150 mph. Additionally, cars exceed 200 mph at four different points on the lap, so the combination of straight-line speed and braking stability is the key for race engineers and drivers.

A single lap measures 3.6 miles, and with drivers covering some 53 laps during the race, the total distance of the race is about 190 miles. As always it is a compromise in terms of setup, though lower drag than normal is favored due to the long straights and high track efficiency; Monza, alongside Monaco, is one of the two races where teams will often use track-specific aerodynamic components.

Looking at the weather forecast for the weekend, temperatures will be hot and there is a chance of a storm on both days. Pirelli is bringing its P Zero Orange hard tires and P Zero White medium tires: the same used for the previous Belgian Grand Prix.

Going into the weekend, Red Bull Racing’s Sebastian Vettel leads the Drivers’ Championship with 197 points. Ferrari’s Fernando Alonso is in second with 151 points while Lewis Hamilton of Mercedes AMG is in third with 139 points. In the Constructors’ Championship, Red Bull Racing commands 312 points versus the 235 points of Mercedes AMG and the 218 points of Ferrari.

Weather Forecast:http://www.weather-forecast.com/locations/Monza/forecasts/latest

Source:MotorAuthority.com

[CaledonianCraig]

Don't be ashamed just go on any forums and say your favourite player is the absolute best at their field so you can feel ten feet tall and take the moral high ground in any debates. That is the art of glory hunting.

[bogbrush]

Wow, what a clown you are. With emotion like this to tap into, who could resist enjoying watching Seb roll them over?

Fun to observe you just described Vettel as being in a group being "the absolute best in their field". You really don't think before you type, do you?

[CaledonianCraig]

It is odd that we never heard you blowing your trumpet about Vettel here until he was a dual World Champion. Also am curious as to why you have yet to throw your weight behind another tennis player. I know you spoke of admiration for Dimitrov but I suppose as he is not a champion yet he doesn't get your backing? The clues are there and I'd bet a million bucks you weren't a Federer fan in 2000 either.

[Guest]

Agree, those McLaren hats were embarrassing, Button looked so uncomfortable wearing it. Anyone else also see Rowan Atkinson in the Mercedes garage & not the McLaren one. Clearly, still a huge F1 & Hamilton fan.

Title is over, even for Alonso in my opinion. As I said, Ferrari will be struggling on high down force in Singapore, therefore Vettel`s main threat losing more ground. Load of rumours suggesting Kimi has had enough of Lotus & wants the Ferrari drive, regardless of teaming up with Alonso. Lotus, who have talked to Hulkenberg will line him up as his replacement.

Vettel/Ricciardo
Hamilton/Rosberg
Alonso/Raikkonen
Grosjean/Hulkenberg
Button/Perez

[bogbrush]

It is odd that we never heard you blowing your trumpet about Vettel here until he was a dual World Champion. Also am curious as to why you have yet to throw your weight behind another tennis player. I know you spoke of admiration for Dimitrov but I suppose as he is not a champion yet he doesn't get your backing? The clues are there and I'd bet a million bucks you weren't a Federer fan in 2000 either.

Hmm, so I express admiration for a players style but you then contradict that and use it as proof of something? One of these days you'll make a point without jamming it into the side of your head, but I'm not holding my breath. You just don't read properly before reacting.

I don't really care about these drivers, but who could resist the blather trying to run down the lad?

As it happens, Seb provides aggressive and competitive driving, like Hamilton. Plus he's a nice lad with a good sense of humour. Anything over that dick in the Ferrari too.

[GSC]

Guys beginning to say its Kimi or Alonso. Towns not big enough for both

And Alonso might need to be humble in the upcoming weeks

[bogbrush]

Agree, those McLaren hats were embarrassing, Button looked so uncomfortable wearing it. Anyone else also see Rowan Atkinson in the Mercedes garage & not the McLaren one. Clearly, still a huge F1 & Hamilton fan.

Title is over, even for Alonso in my opinion. As I said, Ferrari will be struggling on high down force in Singapore, therefore Vettel`s main threat losing more ground. Load of rumours suggesting Kimi has had enough of Lotus & wants the Ferrari drive, regardless of teaming up with Alonso. Lotus, who have talked to Hulkenberg will line him up as his replacement.

Vettel/Ricciardo
Hamilton/Rosberg
Alonso/Raikkonen
Grosjean/Hulkenberg
Button/Perez

If Ferrari take Kimi on they have chances next year. The team will unite around a cohesive figure and in the end a united Ferrari will always have good chances.

[GSC]

Put it this way. Kimi ain't giving Alonso a tow around Monza.

Kimi/Alonso and Hulk/Bianchi/DiResta for Ferrari I think

[bogbrush]

Guys beginning to say its Kimi or Alonso. Towns not big enough for both

And Alonso might need to be humble in the upcoming weeks

Oh he's burned his bridges. One big mouthed rant too many.

De Montezemolo is too rich, too proud, and too intelligent to let his employees embarrass him for fun.

[GSC]

No ones bigger than Ferrari. And Kimi gives them a plausible plan B.

I sense there is a backlash for Alonso throwing the team under the bus the last 2 seasons coming

[Bull]

Kimi joins Ferrari according to the bulling news.

SSN to report this in the next few days.

[GSC]

Heard that on the weekly dogging sesh bull?

[beninho]

Kimi to Ferrari I like. They won't drop Alonso though. He has 3 years on a contract? They won't pay that all up like they did with Kimi before. And did restaurant to Ferrari?? No way. Not good enough and loves blaming other people.

[JubbaIsle]

Has anyone noticed the glaring hypocrisy amidst the FIA's penalty administration ?

Rewind a few weeks, Mercedes tyre de-laminates, one of many cars' rear left blowouts, they succumb to a damaged gearbox, get demoted ten places for changing it.

Fast forward, Red bull claim gearbox damage, prove it and are allowed to realistically change the whole shebang, and guess what, no penalty.

Now where is the difference people ? One is self inflicted, the other is manufacturer inflicted.

[Fernando]

I didn't think it would long til i saw this so i came pre-prepared for this.

"Gear ratios and dog rings (excluding final drives or reduction gears) may also be changed under supervision for others of identical specification at any time during an Event provided the FIA technical delegate is satisfied there is evident physical damage to the parts in question and that such changes are not being carried out on a systematic basis."

[Guest]

Under the new rules next year, failure of KERS during a race, would mean an instant DNF, due to it being inherently built into the car next year. I guess, if there's any slither of hope for other teams against Red Bull, this could be it. I wonder how many races or qualifying sessions Webber would have failed this season, if those rules were in place this season?

Kimi & Alonso is just the partnership needed for Ferrari. If, it fails, then having a backup option of Hulkenberg is hardly a bad one.

[liverbnz]

Under the new rules next year, failure of KERS during a race, would mean an instant DNF, due to it being inherently built into the car next year. I guess, if there's any slither of hope for other teams against Red Bull, this could be it. I wonder how many races or qualifying sessions Webber would have failed this season, if those rules were in place this season?

Kimi & Alonso is just the partnership needed for Ferrari. If, it fails, then having a backup option of Hulkenberg is hardly a bad one.

Probably none. BUt then KERS failure would have been gearbox, clutch, DRS, etc.

[CaledonianCraig]

If Kimi does sign for Ferrari I will be surprised for a few reasons.

1. How well will this go down with Fernando Alonso - for so long the top dog at Ferrari - not very well I'd think.

2. How will Kimi feel going there - will he be willing to move over to allow Alonso through?

3. It would seem to be Ferrari abandoning a long held philosophy. Have a recognised No.1 driver in position with a competent driver as rear gunner. With this pairing it rather goes out the window and becomes the first time they have had two top drivers in the team at the same time since it is so long I can't remember. I'd say it is a sign that Ferrari may be covering themselves and feel Alonso may be fishing for a move and also a sign that they realise how far behind Red Bull they are in car development that having two top drivers in their team may help to close the gap in the constructors championship.

[GSC]

I think Kimi is firmly in play as leverage over Alonso.

[CaledonianCraig]

I think Kimi is firmly in play as leverage over Alonso.

I am confident if that moves come off Alonso will not be at Ferrari long - a season at the maximum.

[Guest]

Haha probably none. Crack up.

1. I'm pretty sure Alonso doesn't care at all. Allison is on board and will want to create a car to challenge for a title. Alonso will want that and if they do create a competitive car, alonso is not scared of taking on Kimi n vice versa, they both have the undoubted ability.

2. Kimi will love going back there, happy memories n he's getting paid. He is ruthless, doesn't give a **** about it being alonso`s team. All kimi wants is to win another championship and then get out. Lotus or Ferrari? No brainer.

3. Luca has had enough. He's miserable and now wants to buy success n end this barren run with no titles. Kimi n Alonso, without doubt the best line up n behind the scenes has seen a reshuffle n Allison being appointed. What they've done recently has not worked, therefore time to change. Yeah, risky having two big shots in the team but in ferrari`s situation enough is enough.

[CaledonianCraig]

Sorry but in my opinion, as things stand, bringing in Kimi is not going to close the gap by any great stretch on Red Bull. On the other hand coax Adrian Newey from Red Bull and they are in business big time. In short Alonso and if it is to be him then Kimi can only work with the car they are given and at present it is not in the same league as the Red Bull.

[CaledonianCraig]

Of course with the massive changes coming for next season who knows how competitive Renault's engine is going to be compared to Ferrari - that is something for the Tifosi to cling to.

[bogbrush]

The funny bit will be if Kimi starts outperforming Alonso. The moaning of the last two years will be as nothing.

[Guest]

Bringing in kimi is no guarantee of success, the major moves behind the scenes, new regulations n the competiveness of the Ferrari engine are the key factors. No guarantee either RB are the dominant force in 2014, who knows how effective the Renault engine is or how reliable there KERS technology will be, therefore decisions need to be made by all parties, leading into a new era of f1 uncertainty. Its an unknown, that's the exciting part.

Kimi could well beat Alonso & vice versa. If Alonso is beaten, I think his passion n desire to continue will be questioned. In my opinion, he's the best driver on the grid and I think the Vettel domination is beginning to effect him n for the first time and he looks rattled n dissulioned with F1 life.

[bogbrush]

It certainly isn't, but I keep saying that a united team is a pre-requisite. I just can't believe that the team view Alonso as one of them, surely the radio message over the weekend just confirmed what he thinks of them.

You think about how important the relationship between driver and team has always been. When can anyone recall a driver being this dismissive of his team?

I see Raikonnen coming in and Alonso being told if he wants to stay he falls in line, and if he doesn't then to shut the door on the way out.

[Trebs]

I think the team would sooner have two drivers who will fight for them no matter how talented they are. It's the same in football or other sports. Having said that, Alonso has a contract which he has to fulfill. I hope Massa stays at Ferrari as I'm a fan of his, even if he's with Hulkenberg but both will be loyal that would be better than a half arsed Alonso effort.

As for Vettel and his support, the only problem I have is when people constantly change who they support depending on who is winning. People shouldn't have to support their own drivers, I don't really like Hamilton or Vettel I'm a Ferrari fan through and through, but I have a couple of other drivers i like. As long as I'm not supportingVettel at the moment but changing to Alonso if he is winning next year etc it's fine. People can support who they like.

[GSC]

Alonso and Kimi would be a mistake. Alonso ultimately drives for Alonso, and thats why his McLaren spell was short lived. Kimi won't be planning on towing Alonso around Monza

[GSC]

I agree with BB tbh. Alonsos been throwing the car under the bus for the best part of 2 years now. Kimi is a contender calibre driver available which gives them an alternative to Alonso, can't really line up Hulkenburg-Massa. I can't see both of them at Ferrari, I think Alonso steps in line or hes gone.

[Fernando]

In a Q&A with fans on his Twitter account
on Monday, Alonso said: "I said yesterday to the media it's not possible for me to talk of any name for next year because I have a lot of respect for Felipe.

"We've been working very hard and close for four years to give Ferrari the maximum.

"Whatever decision the team will take will be good for me and we will keep working to give Ferrari the best results possible."

[SteveG]

Will be surprised if Ferrari bring in Kimi alongside Alonso as they're not exactly known for operating driver parity. Hulkenberg alongside Kimi or Alonso - a good oldin' and a good youngin' would seem more logical. Also they still seem very fond of Massa who is tuned in to their philosophy of Ferrari always comes first. Unlike Red Bull this is a tough one to call and there may just be a twist.

[beninho]

Kimi in seems a done deal. Ferrari need to do something, Massa is not backing up Fernando with points on a regular basis. If they cannot win the WDC, then they need to mop up the points to challenge for the WCC.

[Guest]

Kimi to be confirmed today. Think its a great move for F1 & seeing how they compete against each other. With an improved car, possibly, we could finally see two Ferrari`s instead of one competing regularly. I don't see why there should be negativity about this move, its not your problem, its the teams. Luca has become frustrated with Alonso`s actions, dominance in the team & the lack of titles. Bringing in Kimi, a proven winner, will will give everyone a kick up the a** & give fresh impetus to the team moving forward. Decisions like this have to be made, in an attempt to end this Vettel streak. I'm delighted.

[SteveG]

There is still the question of is he replacing or partnering Alonso? If partnering then this must be designed to rattle him into action rather than gather more constructors points as Ferrari have always been more concerned about the WDC.

[beninho]

Alonso will stay at Ferrari. No reason for them to get rid or for him to move. The option to sign Kimi is a no brainer though, i suppose its just all fallen in to place at the time they want to get rid of Massa. I am not sure what else Alonso could have done, he is up against a perfect car during the race, and in qualifying up against the fast Merc. The Ferrari isnt as fast as the merc over one lap or as good as the RB over race pace and distance.

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