Marquez shows age isn't a number - A warning to Floyd !!

Great to have an American top 3 p4p list....and well done to Tim.....However I was very frustrated watching Bradley-JMM.........I alluded to the fact that Marquez was 40 last night....and picked Bradley to win before it.........

The fight reminded me of what Larry Holmes said after Spinks........"I can see the openings but by the time I could do anything he was gone"..........and that's the problem with age and the reason why it's only in today's current talent drought that Hoppo, Marquez, Manny and to a lesser extent Floyd are getting away with it......

Which brings me to Mayweather........His last few fights have been against guys who weren't speed demons so it's hard to see how his reflexes have declined.........Garcia won't exploit this problem.........But Khan very well might............

Know myself after 20 years plus hard training that it's not easy these days.....Injuries are common, the weights you can lift have declined, motivation is a problem..You take longer between sets to recover........and you just aren't as quick.

JMM is a big warning to Floyd and all his fans like myself that the well does run dry and very quickly at the SMALLER WEIGHTS!!!.....

Not a given by any stretch Mayweather is around to complete his deal............Forget Manny, Garcia types..............It's the Bradley and Broner and Khan's that pose the problem........

Marquez shows age isn't just a number................A timely reminder that Boxing waits for no Man........

Perhaps but I think Marquez has shipped far more leather than Mayweather who hasnt lost any of his speed or reflexes - or if he has, his brain and experience compensates for them. I think Mayweather may still be going strong at 40.

Fair enough shah.......Leather is one thing but speed and reflexes at the lower weights is another.......

JMM certainly looked old last night.......whatever the cause.

The fact that Bradley is one of the best conditioned boxers around as well as being naturally a lot bigger than Marquez would have played a significant part. Mayweather is still the quickest welterweight out there and taken less punishment than anyone else so he's a young 37 whereas Marquez would have been a standard 40 year old.

Can't argue with that..........But you can't hold back Father-time.

Sooner or later the skills to erode.

A standard 40 year old doesn't fight like JMM.

The skills don't erode but the physical capability to use that skill does, Mayweather and Hopkins use their brain to an extent nobody else does. He may be 37 but he doesn't have many miles on the clock and actually relies more on his brain than his speed.

Hammersmith harrier wrote:The skills don't erode but the physical capability to use that skill does, Mayweather and Hopkins use their brain to an extent nobody else does. He may be 37 but he doesn't have many miles on the clock and actually relies more on his brain than his speed.

Aye - to the extent that he doesnt even bother extending/retracting his jab/cross if he plans to use it again. Minimum use of time and space consumed for maximum results.

You have a point.........For any one to succeed past their sell by date......They have to evolve and reinvent.

Probably why I haven't........

This was also Marquez's first fight against a welterweight. I don't think Marquez is finished. He's just been beaten in a close fight against the best welterweight in the world not named mayweather.
What's next for him though? He built his body around one fighter I. Manny. Not really a rounded approach. Another manny fight will always be available. Maybe 140 would be a better weight class, a fight with Garcia? Plenty options as he's big time.

I didn't see last nights fight so I can't comment on Marquez's performance but I have read that he looked his age. This should be no surprise to anyone really. Footballers, sprinters, basketball players etc all slow down with age, why should boxers be any differerent?

Unless Marquez needs the money, it might be time he retired.

jimdig wrote:This was also Marquez's first fight against a welterweight. I don't think Marquez is finished. He's just been beaten in a close fight against the best welterweight in the world not named mayweather.
What's next for him though? He built his body around one fighter I. Manny. Not really a rounded approach. Another manny fight will always be available. Maybe 140 would be a better weight class, a fight with Garcia? Plenty options as he's big time.

You don't really want to see him fight again do you ??

40 years old..........Have a well earned retirement.

That's three super close wins for Timbo now.

So much for Truss saying he hopes people don't come on here talking about Marquez's age if Bradley wins.

 

kingraf wrote:That's three super close wins for Timbo now.

I'll ignore the wum.........I didn't think it was all that close.......Though he made the mistake of coasting.......and when you have a huge Mexican crowd cheering it's not the brightest thing to do..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

jimdig wrote:This was also Marquez's first fight against a welterweight. I don't think Marquez is finished. He's just been beaten in a close fight against the best welterweight in the world not named mayweather.
What's next for him though? He built his body around one fighter I. Manny. Not really a rounded approach. Another manny fight will always be available. Maybe 140 would be a better weight class, a fight with Garcia? Plenty options as he's big time.

You don't really want to see him fight again do you ??

40 years old..........Have a well earned retirement.

Your right, I don't really care whether he fights again. He walked out of the ring again without doing an interview and straight back to his dressing room. He gave an interview from the changing room disgusted that he has been robbed by the judges for the 6th time in his career. So with that mentality he might hang them up.
If he fights on I'll probably watch, but don't care either way.

WUM?? You constantly said that before the fight. You are a joke fella. Write a silly reply if you may. Thin air might read it. Clown

Only seen highlights of the fight, Truss, so I can't comment on the quality of the cards. But, Bradley's last three wins, one over the second best fighter of this generation, the other an absolute war, and now a victory over an ATG-ish Marquez look ridiculously good. My darkhorse for fighter of the year 2013, though it's very close between him, Stevenson and Mayweather.

I'll try to ignore the wum...but It won't be easy!!!  

kingraf wrote:Only seen highlights of the fight, Truss, so I can't comment on the quality of the cards. But, Bradley's last three wins, one over the second best fighter of this generation, the other an absolute war, and now a victory over an ATG-ish Marquez look ridiculously good. My darkhorse for fighter of the year 2013, though it's very close between him, Stevenson and Mayweather.

I alluded to the fact Marquez was 40 last night.......It is a good win Kingy but Marquez looked old..........I certainly think the three slot is a possibility...

Manny was very contentious........Marquez was a bit past it and he was stupid having a war.......

But he did look classy last night.......But Marquez had seen better days..

Bradley reminds me of Marvin.......Doesn't always look good..But gets the job done.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Bradley isn't a great fighter yet..........

Problem Bradley has tonight is he is fighting a 40 year old.......Apart from the bucks he is a no win situation........

Seanusarrilius wrote:Disagree. I am not hearing many people mention Marquez age. So long as Marquez doesn't just fold, I think Bradley gets credit for a win. Marquez is coming in high off his KO win over Manny.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:No but when/If he looks below par......people will.........

Clown

 

Can you stop writing s**t on my thread.......

I don't want to foe you........But the last few days you've been writing s**t after everything I write.........and It's sad......

Now please stop.

Nothing in them quotes anyway to say contradiction..........  

Why dont you respond to your hypocrisy then? I am not wumming but think its stupid throwing out Marquez's age to discredit Bradley's win, when only a day or two ago you were saying how other people might come out and say this.

Its a valid point, but if you want to start taking a hissy fit then I'/ll take your answer as YOU are in fact the wum.

Another Mayweather bashing thread.

What more can the man do to prove he is a little bit special. You said that he ''bit off a bit more then he could chew with Canelo'' but we all saw Mayweather chew him up and spit him out. Maybe you need to understand boxing before pointing the hopeful finger of failure at Floyd.

Floyd controls pace better then anyone, he presents a target which is in fact a mirage and counters. He is incredibally fit and does not overtrain. You are hoping that Khan will somehow beat him but styles make fights.

Give up this envy, Floyd has more money then all of us not just you.

No hypocrisy...........Just a stalker who is fascinated by my posting........

It's a compliment I guess..  

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:Another Mayweather bashing thread.

What more can the man do to prove he is a little bit special. You said that he ''bit off a bit more then he could chew with Canelo'' but we all saw Mayweather chew him up and spit him out. Maybe you need to understand boxing before pointing the hopeful finger of failure at Floyd.

Floyd controls pace better then anyone, he presents a target which is in fact a mirage and counters. He is incredibally fit and does not overtrain. You are hoping that Khan will somehow beat him but styles make fights.

Give up this envy, Floyd has more money then all of us not just you.

Mayweather bashing thread ??........You are dumb.

Now Truss. What have I told you about being nice to people

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:Another Mayweather bashing thread.

What more can the man do to prove he is a little bit special. You said that he ''bit off a bit more then he could chew with Canelo'' but we all saw Mayweather chew him up and spit him out. Maybe you need to understand boxing before pointing the hopeful finger of failure at Floyd.

Floyd controls pace better then anyone, he presents a target which is in fact a mirage and counters. He is incredibally fit and does not overtrain. You are hoping that Khan will somehow beat him but styles make fights.

Give up this envy, Floyd has more money then all of us not just you.

Mayweather bashing thread ??........You are dumb.

I know an in direct bashing thread when I see one.

You are honestly comparing Marquez to Floyd????
So what if Floyd is getting older?

If you know it when you see it.......elaborate......

Which brings me to Mayweather........His last few fights have been against guys who weren't speed demons so it's hard to see how his reflexes have declined.........Garcia won't exploit this problem.........But Khan very well might............

Where do I start with this.

What is Khan going to do that Canelo, Cotto, and the Ghost could not??? Throw a quick 3 or 4 punch combo on Floyd? Its a 12 round fight is Khan a better pressure fighter then the Ghost or Cotto? No of course not. Watch the Guarreo fight completly different style to that he employed against Cotto and Canelo. Floyd crouched down, arms low head high giving Garreo just 1 small target, his head which he missed time and time again whilst getting countered with the quick right. What do you think he will do against speed merchant Khan? stand in front of him no of course not.

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:Which brings me to Mayweather........His last few fights have been against guys who weren't speed demons so it's hard to see how his reflexes have declined.........Garcia won't exploit this problem.........But Khan very well might............

Where do I start with this.

What is Khan going to do that Canelo, Cotto, and the Ghost could not??? Throw a quick 3 or 4 punch combo on Floyd? Its a 12 round fight is Khan a better pressure fighter then the Ghost or Cotto? No of course not. Watch the Guarreo fight completly different style to that he employed against Cotto and Canelo. Floyd crouched down, arms low head high giving Garreo just 1 small target, his head which he missed time and time again whilst getting countered with the quick right. What do you think he will do against speed merchant Khan? stand in front of him no of course not.

So I've not said anything that isn't true......but It's a Mayweather bashing thread from one of his biggest fans.......

okay........

Thing is, I don't think Marquez aged overnight. It's been happening. I still maintain that he fairly lost the third fight vs MP, there was an excellent article on Bleacher Report which showed how a lot of the punches which Marquez looked to have muffled off actually caught real estate. Then he got concussed in six rounds vs MP in the fourth fight, before landing a Hail Mary. Personally Don't think it's as sudden as is thought.

Know myself after 20 years plus hard training that it's not easy these days.....Injuries are common, the weights you can lift have declined, motivation is a problem..You take longer between sets to recover........and you just aren't as quick

So you're the p4p greatest weightlifter on the planet???

Floyd is the exception to the rule. No point bringing up Holmes either Floyd has never had a Holmes v Nortan or Shavers type fight in his whole career. Wars take the most out of you as a fighter, how many wars has Hopkins been involved in??? zero is he still fighting today at nearly 50? yes.

Floyd WILL honor his contract and see it through. The best he could have fought he has faced and beaten its easy bread from now till the end of the road mate.

I do find it cool that we all keep pretending Popkins is still fighting without some "help"

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:Know myself after 20 years plus hard training that it's not easy these days.....Injuries are common, the weights you can lift have declined, motivation is a problem..You take longer between sets to recover........and you just aren't as quick

So you're the p4p greatest weightlifter on the planet???

Floyd is the exception to the rule. No point bringing up Holmes either Floyd has never had a Holmes v Nortan or Shavers type fight in his whole career. Wars take the most out of you as a fighter, how many wars has Hopkins been involved in??? zero is he still fighting today at nearly 50? yes.

Floyd WILL honor his contract and see it through. The best he could have fought he has faced and beaten its easy bread from now till the end of the road mate.

I think you've lost the plot ONETWO.......Kingy you don't know Hoppo is on anything.......He only fights 30 seconds a round.

kingraf wrote:I do find it cool that we all keep pretending Popkins is still fighting without some "help"

Prove it or keep quite.

I did say we can keep pretending he keeps going without "help". No problem with me.

kingraf wrote:I did say we can keep pretending he keeps going without "help". No problem with me.

Just kidding mate.

Don't you think at his age the powers that be will be looking at his methods a little more then anyone else?

Its buffulo meat mate thats the secret

He is the guy OdLH uses as his "muscle" during weigh-ins and such, ONETWO. I can't see Oscar trying to witch hunt his buddy boy.

I'm not having it, I thought Bradley won because he was better, not because Marquez got old overnight. Marquez can still have some great fights, although for me I want him to retire with one last swansong fight in Mexico. Marquez should arguably be a 5 weight world champ anyway, because Pacquiao should have still been champion when he won.

I was worried that Bradley's speed would be too much for Marquez, his foot speed last night was excellent, Bradley made that fight closer than it should have been. Would like to see Bradley against Mayweather now, although that will be a one sided beat down as well, shows how good Mayweather really is. Floyd might even stop him.

kingraf wrote:Thing is, I don't think Marquez aged overnight. It's been happening. I still maintain that he fairly lost the third fight vs MP, there was an excellent article on Bleacher Report which showed how a lot of the punches which Marquez looked to have muffled off actually caught real estate. Then he got concussed in six rounds vs MP in the fourth fight, before landing a Hail Mary. Personally Don't think it's as sudden as is thought.

You are probably one of the only people I know who thought Marquez lost the third fight, I had it wide for Marquez as did many others.

BoxingFan88 wrote:I'm not having it, I thought Bradley won because he was better, not because Marquez got old overnight. Marquez can still have some great fights, although for me I want him to retire with one last swansong fight in Mexico. Marquez should arguably be a 5 weight world champ anyway, because Pacquiao should have still been champion when he won.

I was worried that Bradley's speed would be too much for Marquez, his foot speed last night was excellent, Bradley made that fight closer than it should have been. Would like to see Bradley against Mayweather now, although that will be a one sided beat down as well, shows how good Mayweather really is. Floyd might even stop him.

Never said Bradley wasn't better...........Marquez was past it though..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

BoxingFan88 wrote:I'm not having it, I thought Bradley won because he was better, not because Marquez got old overnight. Marquez can still have some great fights, although for me I want him to retire with one last swansong fight in Mexico. Marquez should arguably be a 5 weight world champ anyway, because Pacquiao should have still been champion when he won.

I was worried that Bradley's speed would be too much for Marquez, his foot speed last night was excellent, Bradley made that fight closer than it should have been. Would like to see Bradley against Mayweather now, although that will be a one sided beat down as well, shows how good Mayweather really is. Floyd might even stop him.

Never said Bradley wasn't better...........Marquez was past it though..

He wasn't as good as he once was, but that could be due to the weight as well, Pacquiao is a light welter who punches hard enough to be a welter.

This doesn't do any damage to Marquez's legacy, but it certainly enhances Tim's. I would love to see Khan vs Bradley that one would be interesting.

I agree Mate............Marquez has had a wonderful career...and now it's time to call it..

He should retire. If not he should fight Poochio for a 5th time

Hard to say when he was past his best, he was hardly dazzling against Casamayor and Diaz before he closed the show both time while level I believe. Looked ponderous against Diaz in the rematch and Fedchenko but looked good against Pacquiao but he knows him like the back of his hand now.

I think JMM looked old last night, Tim was too quick on his feet for him.

I think Tim clearly won. It was still close on the cards for me (I had it 115-114 to Tim with the 6th even but biased to JMM) but Tim clearly won for me. Similar to Froch vs Kessler 2, it was close on the cards but Froch was the clear winner.

Tim made it a dull fight and wouldn't have done him any favours in popularity. The crowd were very pro JMM and probably made JMM feel he won.

I'd like to see JMM have a fight at 140ibs but feel he'll seek that 147ib title so will stay around for a bit.

Bradley isn't lighting any fires under anyone with a showing like that and he isn't pushing his way to the front of the queue for a crack at Mayweather. After his struggle with Provodnikov you could see there was no way he wanted to engage with Marquez until the last 10 seconds of the round and then threw his hands in the air as if he'd done something incredible.

Vey safety first showing that does little to enhance his legacy. Marquez isn't a come forward fighter and had to be the aggressor in order to ensure any punches were thrown. Won't argue that Bradley was the winner but as stinkers go, he has to have elevated himself to top 5 with that one.

Didn't listen to his post-match interview but if he thinks it elevates him to some kind of p4p greatness then he's deluded

America is producing a lot of very talented boring fighters at the moment.

I was bored after the first 5 rounds of Bradley vs Marquez so I just fast forwarded to the end. Bradley isn't really a likeable character.

Factor in Ward and Floyd and you have 3 good fighters who are not the easiest to watch.