Welsh rugby: best future outcome

First topic message reminder :

Hi everyone. I'd like to hear people's idea on how pro rugby in Wales could best go forward from where it is now. Solutions only please. There's a fine thread on what's going on in Wales in the present and why it is in a crisis, this one is for your vision for how to really make pro rugby a great success there and what this would look like.

Perhaps I'm overly optimistic but in my opinion, in a country where rugby is popular and has so many talented players there must be a way for this pro aspect of the game to thrive. I'd like to hear your ideas on how this can be accomplished.

Surely the best outcome is we all kiss and make up. All four regions fill the pro12 spots, the new champions cup starts with an all welsh final, as does the challenge cup. Oh and Wales win all their autumn games, then a grandslam, playing wonderful rugby.

Yes it exceptionally unlikely, but technically possible, so its got to be the best possible out come

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Surely the best outcome is we all kiss and make up.  All four regions fill the pro12 spots, the new champions cup starts with an all welsh final, as does the challenge cup.  Oh and Wales win all their autumn games, then a grandslam, playing wonderful rugby.

Yes it exceptionally unlikely, but technically possible, so its got to be the best possible out come

Aint never goin to happen and we knew this for definite last year in April when RRW held that press conference at CAP.

Irish Londoner wrote:TBS - apologies for the mispelling - and it wasn't meant as a dig it was meant as an indication of how far you'll have to trawl to find a person who might possibly be in a position to bang heads together and who all three sides might would think acceptable.
I know that this is one of the more civilised forums for discussing rugby and would it like to to stay that way   

So d'you think RRW have been "unreasonable" at any time in the last 2 years? Or more even? I haven't ever seen or read any evidence of this and even today Gareth Davies, Drags CEO, said all they want is a fair deal. As a supporter I want a fair deal too ie no 4th AI thank you very much, Gatlands 13 day rule reduced to IRB regs ie 5 days I think it is and a fair and reasonable payment for regional employees. Some flexibility on NWQ players too. That's it I spose.

http://waleseye.com/post/91993578336/the-endgame wrote:The senior regional official added: "This dispute can only end in one of two ways.

"Either the WRU agree to a fair deal or we will go our own way.

"By going our own way, we may survive or we may have to all eventually go under.

"But it will not end the way the union seems to want it to end – with us signing another very bad deal."

So that's the options, a fair deal that will be the same throughout the six years of the contract or sod off.

Who cares at this stage Scarlet - with the proposed foreigner ruling for the regions (only 5 welsh players in a matchday squad) should the regions be getting any money at all if that money is spent on overseas players.

Blues already have a laundry list of New Zealanders on the shortlist ready to replace welsh deadwood. I'm sure the other regions would follow suit. Do you therefore honestly believe welsh rugby should fund teams with an obligation to field just 5 starting welsh players? by that logic 66% of squads in wales could be made up by imports and why should those be paid by the WRU funding?


To be honest if the regions do this it could actually be the end of welsh rugby altogether at any rate regardless of the amount of money the WRU pay them because without a successful wales we wont be getting anywhere near what the WRU currently generate in income. That in turn hurts everyone because if the WRU make less they will be able to distribute less money. This is a crazy foreign policy in my opinion.

Mushroom, realistically the limit has been 8 (6+2) until lsat season, or the season before. And how often have we seen the regions run out with that number of NWQs.

Also the talk of the 31 game limit for internationals (13 internationals, 18 regional games) it is realistically the only way they can remain competitive through out the season.

CLass NWQ players are a good thing the likes of Rush, King, Collins, Bowe etc etc are the standard Regions should be after not some fo the deadwood us (Dragons) have had in the past.

That said if it ever came to the point where Regions were only fielding 5 Welsh players that for me would be very bad indeed.

bedfordwelsh wrote:CLass NWQ players are a good thing the likes of Rush, King, Collins, Bowe etc etc are the standard Regions should be after not some fo the deadwood us (Dragons) have had in the past.

That said if it ever came to the point where Regions were only fielding 5 Welsh players that for me would be very bad indeed.

Indeed and on the same note, mediocre and overpaid WQ players are a bad thing.

How much were SNK and Parks paid?

Welshmushroom wrote:Who cares at this stage Scarlet - with the proposed foreigner ruling for the regions (only 5 welsh players in a matchday squad) should the regions be getting any money at all if that money is spent on overseas players.  

Blues already have a laundry list of New Zealanders on the shortlist ready to replace welsh deadwood.  I'm sure the other regions would follow suit.  Do you therefore honestly believe welsh rugby should fund teams with an obligation to field just 5 starting welsh players?  by that logic 66% of squads in wales could be made up by imports and why should those be paid by the WRU funding?


To be honest if the regions do this it could actually be the end of welsh rugby altogether at any rate regardless of the amount of money the WRU pay them because without a successful wales we wont be getting anywhere near what the WRU currently generate in income.  That in turn hurts everyone because if the WRU make less they will be able to distribute less money.  This is a crazy foreign policy in my opinion.

If you're a Drags fan, then i'm a Terk in a dress.
All you seem to do is knock all of "the regions" at every opportunity and you're knocking your own at present. Oh and please feel free to elaborate re "WRU" and "money".

ScarletSpiderman wrote:How much were SNK and Parks paid?

Ooff! I felt that.

Here's a "what if" that hasn't been proposed. I get that the WRU can't afford to buy out four "regions" as they exist and take on their massive debts, but, rather than wait for them to go bust, they could buy out one "region", set it up as an actual region, (eg West Wales) and in time buy out another etc until Wales has an actual regional set up owned by the WRU. I know that this is expensive but it sounds far less acrimonious and potentially damaging than waiting to hoover up bankrupt "regions".

As for this notions that pro rugby can exist without support of benefactors or unions I don't believe it. Sure there are a few clubs in England and France that manage this, but they are the exception, and they still get some support from their unions. Whatever new model happens it's going to involve support from more than the Welsh public.

Intotouch wrote:Here's a "what if" that hasn't been proposed. I get that the WRU can't afford to buy out four "regions" as they exist and take on their massive debts, but, rather than wait for them to go bust, they could buy out one "region", set it up as an actual region, (eg West Wales) and in time buy out another etc until Wales has an actual regional set up owned by the WRU. I know that this is expensive but it sounds far less acrimonious and potentially damaging than waiting to hoover up bankrupt "regions".

As for this notions that pro rugby can exist without support of benefactors or unions I don't belieeeeeeeve it. Sure there are a few clubs in England and France that manage this, but they are the exception, and they still get some support from their unions. Whatever new model happens it's going to involve support from more than the Welsh public.

How very Father Ted.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:How much were SNK and Parks paid?

I'd be interested to know what your take is regarding the move to Cardiff City Stadium and everything that went on before.

Cafdiff Dave, I don't belieeeeeve it because it's not what's happened. If you think I'm being ridiculous then prove it.

Cardiff Dave wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:How much were SNK and Parks paid?

I'd be interested to know what your take is regarding the move to Cardiff City Stadium and everything that went on before.

Dai the move was farcical, but so was the issue with the Warriors offering to take Cardiff Blues as part of the region to save Wales' lowest ranked region from folding due to debt. Wales need a Cardiff base team, but that's always made me a bit miffed (especially as us westerners get all the hate for it)   

Intotouch wrote:Cafdiff Dave, I don't belieeeeeve it because it's not what's happened. If you think I'm being ridiculous then prove it.

Can't prove nowt mate. You better kick me up the arse I reckon.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Cardiff Dave wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:How much were SNK and Parks paid?

I'd be interested to know what your take is regarding the move to Cardiff City Stadium and everything that went on before.

Dai the move was farcical, but so was the issue with the Warriors offering to take Cardiff Blues as part of the region to save Wales' lowest ranked region from folding due to debt.  Wales need a Cardiff base team, but that's always made me a bit miffed (especially as us westerners get all the hate for it)   

You know naff all then in other words. Most don't, but the info is out there and guess what, The Fail (the favourote rag down Llanelli way i've heard) failed on this too.

Enlighten us please Bishop Brennan

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Enlighten us please Bishop Brennan

Can't. I've given up enlightenment for Lent. Anyway all the info is out there along with the credit crunch, the Arms Park memorial garden, Cardiff RFC playing in a new ground down Canton way. Oh and luxury apartments over looking the Taff etc plus the infamous conference centre. And.. I think i've said enough.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Enlighten us please Bishop Brennan

Oh and just saying like, Cardiff City Stadium basic rent was £350,000 pa in 2009. We were still renting CAP at the time too for £98,000.

Oh, I was thinking you were on about the other farcical bit too.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Oh, I was thinking you were on about the other farcical bit too.

Best not mention the pink stuff. Give it time, it'll go away.

Cardiff Dave wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Oh, I was thinking you were on about the other farcical bit too.

Best not mention the pink stuff. Give it time, it'll go away.

  

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Cardiff Dave wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Oh, I was thinking you were on about the other farcical bit too.

Best not mention the pink stuff. Give it time, it'll go away.

  

I see what you mean. No comment.