Aviva Premiership - Round 16

First topic message reminder :

Again the club fixtures slip under the radar, but here goes:

Table

56pts Northampton
47pts Bath
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44pts Saracens, Exeter
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43pts Sale, Leicester, Wasps
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35pts Gloucester
34pts Harlequins
23pts Newcastle, London Irish
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1pt London Welsh



Fixtures

Fri 27th Feb 15

19:45 NORTHAMPTON SAINTS  v   HARLEQUINS Franklin's Gardens BT Sport
Both teams missing important players, but with Lawes and Wood possibly able to feature in some capacity expect quins to be harder hit. After gifting Bath a 10pt lead, Saints controlled the match well to secure an important away win. Meanwhile Quins struggled at home to Exeter, despite the Chiefs seeing 3 yellow cards. Quins do not have the depth of squad capable of coping with the loss of players like Marler, Easter, Robshaw and Brown. Could be an interesting match-up between two scrum halves (Dickson and Care) desperate to catch Lancaster's eye. Will Care try too hard? with Danny Care rules out we get the Dickson boys going head to head.
I struggle to see anything other than a Saints win.


Sat 28th Feb 15

14:30 LONDON WELSH  v   LONDON IRISH Kassam Stadium
Not many teams have failed to get the TBP against LW. London Irish however "only" got 3 tries in a comfortable win at the Madj on Boxing Day. They will want to get all four this time but will need to show much more precision than they have in the last two rounds. Looking at their remaining fixtures this looks like Welsh's best chance to secure a win this season. Confidence is shot to pieces though and the team look like a Pub XV who met in the car park.

15:00 LEICESTER TIGERS  v   SALE SHARKS Welford Road
A repeat of the previous two meetings between these sides will be good for Tiger's Play-Off hopes, but bad for the fans nerves. Twice Leicester have scored a flurry of second half points to overturn large deficits and secure TBP wins. I struggle to see us scoring 4 tries this weekend, so will need to control the game better up front. If Burns is fit, then with Sale posibly missing both half-backs, Leicester should be able to play the game in the right parts of the pitch and grind out a win.


15:00 SARACENS  v   NEWCASTLE FALCONS Allianz Park
At the start of the season you would have marked this down as a guaranteed home win. However Falcons are playing well, while Saracens have major issues at 10 with Farrell and Hodgson both struggling with injuries and Goode with England. Missing Brookes and Furno I do feel that Saracens should be too strong up front, but they have to play better than they have in recent weeks.

15:15 EXETER CHIEFS  v   BATH RUGBY Sandy Park BT Sport
Huge game and and it is possible that a defeat could see Bath drop from 2nd to 6th. Bath struggled to impose themselves against Saints, and with Chiefs close to full strength could well struggle again - especially if Henry Thomas is still with England. Should be a smashing match up between the back rows. Can Bath get Burgess into the game more? I have this feeling that Bath are the only team Exeter have yet to beat in the AP - is this correct? If so this would be a great time to break the duck.


Sun 1st Mar 15

13:00 WASPS  v   GLOUCESTER RUGBY
Wasps will be looking for another big win in Coventry. With Glaws missing Hibbard, Laidlaw and 36 to internationals plus Morgan (and possibly Kvesic) injured it is hard to see them resisting Wasps.

Wasps team to play Gloucester Rugby
15. Rob Miller
14. Christian Wade
13. Elliot Daly
12. James Downey
11. Tom Varndell
10. Andy Goode
9. Joe Simpson
1. Matt Mullan ©
2. Carlo Festuccia
3. Jake Cooper-Woolley
4. James Cannon
5. James Gaskell
6. Ashley Johnson
7. Thomas Young
8. Nathan Hughes

16. Edd Shervington
17. Simon McIntyre
18. Phil Swainston
19. Kearnan Myall
20. Guy Thompson
21. Piri Weepu
22. Alex Lozowski
23. Sailosi Tagicakibau

Unavailable for selection:

Josh Basset - ankle, Chris Bell - shoulder, Charlie Davies - calf, Will Helu - hamstring, Ed Jackson - ill, Ruaridh Jackson - ACL, Ben Jacobs - shoulder, Sam Jones - concussion, Joe Launchbury - neck, Alapati Leiua - knee, Andrea Masi - deep cut to calf, Jack Moates – hamstring.

Lorenzo Cittadini – Italy camp, Bradley Davies – Wales camp, James Haskell – England camp

Gloucester Rugby
15. Charlie Sharples
14. Jonny May
13. Mark Atkinson
12. Bill Meakes
11. Henry Purdy
10. James Hook
9. Dan Robson
1. Dan Murphy
2. Darren Dawidiuk
3. John Afoa
4. Tom Savage (capt)
5. Tom Palmer
6. Ross Moriarty
7. Matt Kvesic
8. Sione Kalamafoni

Replacements:
16. Aleki Lutui
17. Yann Thomas
18. Sila Puafisi
19. James Hudson
20. Jacob Rowan
21. Callum Braley
22. Billy Burns
23. Gareth Evans

After looking at the teams having penalty machine Gill at 1 for Saracens will aid Newcastle. Probably will prevent Saracens gaining ascendancy at scrum time.

We'll see if it's enough for Newcastle.

Londontiger you mention the numerous Wasps absentees but to be honest most of them are squad men missing.

That Wasps backline is pretty much first choice. That pack isn't far off either.

Though Gloucester are missing less players they are missing more important players in my opinion.

I think the missing wasps players are just copied and pasted from their site along with the squad.

I can't imagine LT, a Tigers fan, set out to find them all just fit the one club

yappysnap wrote:I think the missing wasps players are just copied and pasted from their site along with the squad.

I can't imagine LT, a Tigers fan, set out to find them all just fit the one club  

Indeed it was. Good example for other clubs to follow though. I invest a lot of time and money into Leicester Football Club (and a shareholder) and it would be nice to know this stuff for us.

Same goes for Quins too, they're pretty terrible at letting fans know just what us happening with players. It takes all of 5 minutes to add a paragraph like that and would make people a lot happier.

NORTHAMPTON SAINTS  v   HARLEQUINS
How come I never feel really confident about any match?  I know Saints are favoured over Quins, but I simply don't have that great feeling that they should win.  Quins have very good coaching and are very professional.  I know losing Marler, Robshaw, Brown, Care, and Easter creates a huge hole.  I hope the hole is big enough.  And the match starts in a few hours and I have a shoulder to put back together.  Stink.

LONDON WELSH  v   LONDON IRISH
London Irish by 1200 points

LEICESTER TIGERS  v   SALE SHARKS
Tricky, tricky for Leicester.  Has all the hallmarks of a typical Leicester grind-it-out kind of win, by 3 points.

SARACENS  v   NEWCASTLE FALCONS
Likely another grind-it-out kind of match.  Sarries are struggling a bit and Newcastle show promise.  But I think Sarries run 'em out at the end by a dozen.

EXETER CHIEFS  v   BATH RUGBY
I have no idea who will win, but I hope this is televised over here.  I will pick the home team to win by a point, because it helps Saints.  But this could go either way.  

WASPS  v   GLOUCESTER RUGBY
Wasps in thier new home are doing OK, no?  So, let's pick them by 10.

Gutted

Saints were not good, but boy do Quins try their hardest to find ways to shoot themselves in the foot.

Thought that was Yarde's best game for Quins, always looked a threat and did not seem to make the dumb mistakes his team-mates were doing.

How did lawes play?

Our back row is interesting. Speed and breakdown work will be good, but will it be lightweight?

Does that show intentions of throwing it out wide and playing a fast game?

nathan wrote:How did lawes play?

Man of the match, but I didn't think he was outstanding. He said himself he was blowing in e first half but he managed to play the whole game and was still putting it about at the end. Lineout was terrible but Haywood can be iffy and I think Day calls it for Saints. I'd definitely have him playing for Saints next week.

HammerofThunor wrote:

nathan wrote:How did lawes play?

Man of the match, but I didn't think he was outstanding. He said himself he was blowing in e first half but he managed to play the whole game and was still putting it about at the end.  Lineout was terrible but Haywood can be iffy and I think Day calls it for Saints. I'd definitely have him playing for Saints next week.

I felt as though the commentary team were at times giving Lawes credit for something that Manoa had done. However looking at the stats Lawes put in the most tackles with 100% completion and took the most lineouts.

The match stats are interesting:

Quins had 62% possession, ran the ball nigh on 500m, beat 31 defenders but failed to score a try until time was up. Their discipline killed them conceding 17 penalties and 3 free kicks.

LondonTiger wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

nathan wrote:How did lawes play?

Man of the match, but I didn't think he was outstanding. He said himself he was blowing in e first half but he managed to play the whole game and was still putting it about at the end.  Lineout was terrible but Haywood can be iffy and I think Day calls it for Saints. I'd definitely have him playing for Saints next week.

I felt as though the commentary team were at times giving Lawes credit for something that Manoa had done. However looking at the stats Lawes put in the most tackles with 100% completion and took the most lineouts.

The match stats are interesting:

Quins had 62% possession, ran the ball nigh on 500m, beat 31 defenders but failed to score a try until time was up. Their discipline killed them conceding 17 penalties and 3 free kicks.

That's been the story of our season so far, loads of possession but no clue what to do with it.

That's probably the worst factor from this whole season, we've gone from exciting try scorers to just plain rubbish at getting over the line. If there was a star for handling errors that'd explain a lot.

We all know that sometimes the man of the match award is a joke. Barely noticed Lawes till the latter stages of the game.

Also the Saints lineout was disrupted on a few occasions.

Manoa as you mention Londontiger was far more prominent.

Agree with you that Yarde played well. Thought Sloan and Walker did too. Clifford and Robson as well.

Sinkler is an idiot though. Didn't seem at all annoyed at his foolish antics.

To be honest that's a game Quins should have won.

Silly errors just let Quins down at crucial moments plus just not being quite clinical enough.

I thought they offered more than Saints who were well below par - just couldn't land the killer blow.

Good teams know how to win when playing poorly - all Saints needed was their maul

Bad teams know how to lose even when playing well - Quins dominated a lot of the game but never looked like winning

LondonTiger wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

nathan wrote:How did lawes play?

Man of the match, but I didn't think he was outstanding. He said himself he was blowing in e first half but he managed to play the whole game and was still putting it about at the end.  Lineout was terrible but Haywood can be iffy and I think Day calls it for Saints. I'd definitely have him playing for Saints next week.

I felt as though the commentary team were at times giving Lawes credit for something that Manoa had done. However looking at the stats Lawes put in the most tackles with 100% completion and took the most lineouts.

The match stats are interesting:

Quins had 62% possession, ran the ball nigh on 500m, beat 31 defenders but failed to score a try until time was up. Their discipline killed them conceding 17 penalties and 3 free kicks.

I thought Lawes had a fine match, not outstanding, but fine.  He was certainly puffing at the end.  Not ready for England yet from a fitness pov.  Also shows there is no substitute for actual game time. The lineout problems were generally from Mike Haywood at hooker.

Another mediocre match for Saints. Ever since November they have played as if just hanging on. Weird statement for a team at the top of the table, but they certainly don't look like a top of table kind of team. They looked a lot tighter when Woody came on.

Dave Ward did look exceptionally good though, which makes me happy.

London Welsh must be comfortably the worst side I've ever seen in the Premiership. Their defence is simply atrocious (and that might be generous).

Yeh worse than when Rotherham didn't win a game all season ATM.

13-10 to Sarries at the moment.

Leicester Get a Penalty Try!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

2nd try of the game. Pearce got the First Try.

30 mins

20 - 3 Leicester

HT same score.

Well 20-3 at half time, and if anything the scoreline flatters Sale. We have been playing with pace and precision until we get within sniff of the line. Number of linebreaks must be in double figures, Bai playing really well, just a shame his final pass has been iffy on a couple of occasions.

Goneva is looking more confident ball in hand now as well.

TBH at times I am possibly mistaking one for the other - especially when play at clubhouse end.  Hope all the action is at my end now.

Bonus point secured inside 28 minutes and 6 tries in the first half, we've well and truly taken our foot off the accelerator since the break. Currently 45-12 at the Kassam.

I might be forced to eat humble pie - both Hodgson and de Kock injured.

50-12 final score. 8 tries, missed 3 conversions I think.

Tigers update anyone?

23 - 8

Been a bit worse looked more conservative.

Will say Garner has made some very strange calls in Sale's favour this second half esp in the build to there try.

Fair play sarries have dug that one out, but credit to Falcons who gave it a real good lash.

Cheers welly

Bai Try

28 - 8

Burns takes a quick Con DG.

1 min to score a 4th try.

Full time,

Should have gotten the TBP but 4 points keeps us very much in it.

Falcons will be very tough next weekend.

Needed a TBP there really but a win is a win. Bath are desperately seeking a LBP at the minute and Quins lost last night so a couple of results going in our favour that cushion the lack of a badly needed TBP though.

Currently Bath are 4th on 47 Leicester 5th on 47.

Sarries and Exeter ATM 3rd and 4th.

The league is ridiculously tight this year. Great stuff.

Who would have thought that only Saints have won more games than us.

The way we have been playing how are we where we are?

Wasps win will put us 6th, TBP win would put bath 5th.

formerly known as Sam wrote:The league is ridiculously tight this year. Great stuff.

It is, and I reckon it will be even tighter next season.

I hope so Ozzy. The more competitive the league the better the entertainment and the stronger the national team will become as all the teams bar LW have a number of quality English players forced to play at a more intense standard.

Even with Tigers playing dross I have enjoyed the rugby on show this season. Bath vs Chiefs took a while to get going today though.

Also well done to big bad Brad Thorn oldest ever player to have played in the AP

@ 40!!!!!!!!!!!

Sarries win....not the easy one some expected though

Really does amaze me that we're only 1 point from second place and have the joint 2nd most games won.

For the season we've had

Welly wrote: Who would have thought that only Saints have won more games than us.

The way we have been playing how are we where we are?

Wasps win will put us 6th, TBP win would put bath 5th.

If Wasps are level on points we stay ahead as we will have more wins.

nathan wrote:Really does amaze me that we're only 1 point from second place and have the joint 2nd most games won.

For the season we've had

Despite Beshockeds opinion of us i can't believe we're not much higher. A few tweaks and next season we will be much higher.

The trouble is GF everyone is tweaking

Geordiefalcon I guess it depends whether you prefer to win ugly or lose playing well.

Newcastle unfortunately for you have not been notching up the wins for whatever reason. Something needs to change.

The league is incredibly tight this season.

Teams like Tigers, Quins and Sarries who over the last few have run away from everyone are now much closer/lower in the league.

Bath, Saints and Exeter have really built on the last couple of seasons and are now right up there around the top while Wasps and Sale are closing in.

Good times for everyone involved and it's only going to get tighter next season.

beshocked wrote:Geordiefalcon I guess it depends whether you prefer to win ugly or lose playing well.

Newcastle unfortunately for you have not been notching up the wins for whatever reason. Something needs to change.

It is changing. Falcons are lightyears ahead of where they were last season, and indeed the team they were when we faced them at the start of the season. Back in September they had Phil Godawful leading a backline that was incapable of stringing 2 passes, a lineout that did not function, a scrum that at times was an unmitigated disaster and no breakdown ability whatsoever. The scrum is still an issue and his holding them back.

As someone else said though, few of the other teams are standing still either. Sarries, Quins and Tigers have stagnated - but are all looking to change things up.

Next season I really do feel that away wins will be at a premium. Most teams will be expecting to win the bulk of their home matches - no matter the reputation of the visitors.

beshocked wrote:Geordiefalcon I guess it depends whether you prefer to win ugly or lose playing well.

Newcastle unfortunately for you have not been notching up the wins for whatever reason. Something needs to change.

Oh I absolutely prefer wins anyway they come and we could very well have come away with one yesterday. But the improvments we've shown this season is massive and so encouraging.

I'm more than happy with the way things are going.

Yes everyone will be strengthening. Next season will be very interesting.

I dont think the big boys will have it quite as easy as they have against the lower sides....

Chequered, Quins will bounce back. You have an annoying habit of beating us. You should have won vs Saints with no Care, Easter, Robshaw, Brown and Lowe. I think the long preseason will help Quins an awful lot as well. Just need Connor to be a bit less stingy and sign a couple of monstrous forwards.