Ospreys v Munster 13th September 2015 14:30 Liberty Stadium

Ospreys have lost their last two Guinness PRO12 matches, in Munster in last season's Play-Offs and at Ulster last Friday, but have not lost three in a row in the tournament since the start of the 2012/13 campaign.

The Welshmen are unbeaten at Liberty Stadium in the PRO12 in their last 14 matches since Munster visited the ground in 2014.

Munster's only loss in their last eight Guinness PRO12 encounters came in last season's final to Glasgow Warriors in Belfast. The Munstermen lost just one of their last eight matches against Welsh regions: 12-26 to Ospreys at Liberty Stadium in March.

The two sides met on three occasions in the PRO12 last season with Ospreys taking both regular season encounters but Munster victorious in the Play-Offs. The Munstermen's overall record at Liberty Stadium in all competitions is three wins and nine defeats.

At Liberty Stadium, 2:30pm.

Referee: Dudley Philips (IRFU, 49th competition game)
Assistant Referees: Wayne Davies, Martyn Lewis (both WRU)
Citing Commissioner: John Charles (WRU)
TMO: Derek Bevan (WRU)

Live on S4C and TG4
Read more at http://www.pro12rugby.com/matchcentre/17801.php#rGDLl19s5uR0ijdV.99

This should be an interesting game. The Ospreys are far better than they shown last weekend out in Northern Ireland, and sure as hell they will be out to prove that was just a poor day at the office. And to be fair even though Munster won last weekend, I think they too will be out to show that the performance last week was far from where they should be.

If the Os can stop Stander, that's going to help them a lot although that's far easier said than done. Munster's record at the Liberty is surprisingly bad - I am going for a home win, if for no other reason than I am tired of constantly seeing Munster being good and playing so well.

I am hoping the Ospreys have gone back to basics in training and spend a heap of time in tackling practice. Neither of the centres, or Kris Phillips (an probably a load more) really let themselves down last week.

If they start with Brendan Leonard, at least their offensive game will be far better than last week.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:I am hoping the Ospreys have gone back to basics in training and spend a heap of time in tackling practice.  Neither of the centres, or Kris Phillips (an probably a load more) really let themselves down last week.

If they start with Brendan Leonard, at least their offensive game will be far better than last week.

SS, I know I picked on Phillips, but I entirely agree with you there were many whose tackling left a lot to be desired, looking at Rees's press conference and yesterdays preview of the game, in a scrum session I could see Smith, Parry, Arhip, Ashley, Thornton, Bearman and Baker, couldn't see the open side, also Dirksen was running round like a blue @rse fly and grinning like hell so hopefully he will be back in, there was also a fleeting glimpse of Leonard with the ball. With Evans, Grabham, John and Sam Davies making up the numbers, don't mind which of the youngsters takes the 7 shirt, be it Evans or Underhill, at least it shouldn't be as bad as last week.

Wayne, to be fair they were all poor last week.

Out of interest would you put Dirkson on the wing or in the centre? Just thinking with Beck crocked, Spratt (?) and John looking a bit iffy last week, and Matavesi on international duty, Hanno could add that bit of aggression and pace into the centre. Also whilst Grabham and Kris are not the best defensive wingers both of them offered more in attack than either of the centres did.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Wayne, to be fair they were all poor last week.

Out of interest would you put Dirkson on the wing or in the centre?  Just thinking with Beck crocked, Spratt (?) and John looking a bit iffy last week, and Matavesi on international duty, Hanno could add that bit of aggression and pace into the centre.  Also whilst Grabham and Kris are not the best defensive wingers both of them offered more in attack than either of the centres did.

SS, when he first came to us he was seen as a centre, we put him with Swansea and he wouldn't or couldn't pass, that's when we started playing him on the wing, we have tried him at centre since but his alignment hasn't been very good in the 13 channel, so I expect him to be on the wing, yet since his knee injury he has lost a fair bit of pace, but I would play him there just for his aggression, Grabham is normally very good there it was so unlike him last week.

Either way I guess he will bring an added edge to the team that was missing.

Munster team - lots of big names to bring the punters in (Saili & Chisholm anyway). Strong team with 3 debutants.

Munster (v Ospreys):

15. Felix Jones (captain)
14. Andrew Conway
13. Francis Saili
12. Rory Scannell
11. Stephen Fitzgerald
10. Tyler Bleyendaal
9. Cathal Sheridan

1. Dave Kilcoyne
2. Mike Sherry
3. Stephen Archer
4. Mark Chisholm
5. Dave Foley
6. Dave O’Callaghan
7. Jack O’Donoghue
8. Robin Copeland

Replacements:

16. Duncan Casey
17. James Cronin
18. BJ Botha
19. Jordan Coghlan
20. CJ Stander
21. Duncan Williams
22. Ian Keatley
23. David Johnston

Ospreys Team
15 Dan Evans
14 Kristian Phillips
13 Jonathan Spratt
12 Owen Watkin
11 Hanno Dirksen
10 Sam Davies
9  Brendon Leonard
1  Nicky Smith
2  Sam Parry
3  Dimitri Arhip
4  Lloyd Ashley
5  Rory Thornton
6  Joe Bearman
7  Sam Underhill
8  Dan Baker
Subs Thomas, Otten, Griffiths, Steenkamp, Cracknell, Habberfield, Jenkins and Fussell
Pleased with forward changes, sorry to see Ben John injured, another tough day at the offices coming, hope our 2 props can stay on  ALL GAME.

Sin é wrote:Munster team - lots of big names to bring the punters in (Saili & Chisholm anyway).  Strong team with 3 debutants.

Munster (v Ospreys):

15. Felix Jones (captain)
14. Andrew Conway
13. Francis Saili
12. Rory Scannell
11. Stephen Fitzgerald
10. Tyler Bleyendaal
9. Cathal Sheridan

1. Dave Kilcoyne
2. Mike Sherry
3. Stephen Archer
4. Mark Chisholm
5. Dave Foley
6. Dave O’Callaghan
7. Jack O’Donoghue
8. Robin Copeland

Replacements:

16. Duncan Casey
17. James Cronin
18. BJ Botha
19. Jordan Coghlan
20. CJ Stander
21. Duncan Williams
22. Ian Keatley
23. David Johnston

Sin e - is JOD's future going to be at 7 rather than at 8? He has huge competition at 8 and he also seems very small (weight wise) according to the Munster website.

An interesting looking Munster side. The Bleyendaal - Scannell - Saili combination looks dangerous.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:
Sin e - is JOD's future going to be at 7 rather than at 8? He has huge competition at 8 and he also seems very small (weight wise) according to the Munster website.

He is a long term 8 I'd say. His main strengths are his ball carrying speed and handling. Also the weights on the Munster site are years out of date.

Great. A strong team. Hope lorddowlais is happy now. Pity about the team last week in Cork..i hope the welsh public enjoy it.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

Sin é wrote:Munster team - lots of big names to bring the punters in (Saili & Chisholm anyway).  Strong team with 3 debutants.

Munster (v Ospreys):

15. Felix Jones (captain)
14. Andrew Conway
13. Francis Saili
12. Rory Scannell
11. Stephen Fitzgerald
10. Tyler Bleyendaal
9. Cathal Sheridan

1. Dave Kilcoyne
2. Mike Sherry
3. Stephen Archer
4. Mark Chisholm
5. Dave Foley
6. Dave O’Callaghan
7. Jack O’Donoghue
8. Robin Copeland

Replacements:

16. Duncan Casey
17. James Cronin
18. BJ Botha
19. Jordan Coghlan
20. CJ Stander
21. Duncan Williams
22. Ian Keatley
23. David Johnston

Sin e - is JOD's future going to be at 7 rather than at 8? He has huge competition at 8 and he also seems very small (weight wise) according to the Munster website.

Don't think so. Jordi Murphy was brought in to play 7. He seems to have always played 8. Big talent. Seemingly Joe Schmidt said at a Q&A in one of the Dublin Clubs that he is the best young forward in the country.

I don't like it that Munster are forced to play on Sunday. Disgusting League.

I hope we have picked our socks up a bit in training this week. None of the squad will have been at all happy with last weeks performance.

I know we have a lot of players missing, including two centres not on international duty but the players need to see this as an opportunity rather than a hindrance.

maestegmafia wrote:I hope we have picked our socks up a bit in training this week. None of the squad will have been at all happy with last weeks performance.

I know we have a lot of players missing, including two centres not on international duty but the players need to see this as an opportunity rather than a hindrance.

Maes, I get all of that, what mystifies me and many on our board, is Tandy's stubborness in fetching back and then selecting certain players, when they have proved over a number of years that they are not good enough at this level, it appears he has learnt the lesson of Martin Roberts, what is it going to take for him to realise that Cai Griffiths who people watch at Premiership level and he can't anchor a scrum there, the other prop Marc Thomas is only about 25 and fair play to him he has improved, but IMO he should not be playing at this level either, the thing with Cai is that we have signed a T/H who has played with Newcastle Falcons in the past few seasons on a short term contract and according to Geordie Falcon he won't let us down in the scrummaging  arts, why isn't he either benching or playing, even if it is for 30 minutes just to give Dimitri a break, why can Tandy be so ruthless with certain players (Delve) and so lenient with others?

Nice to see that there will be a tribute to Jerry Collins before the game begins. What a class player and hard as nails.

ME-109 wrote:Nice to see that there will be a tribute to Jerry Collins before the game begins. What a class player and hard as nails.

Certainly. But is there any significance about tomorrow's date? I'm unaware if so.

I believe its just to do with it being the O's first home game since the tragedy. So first chance to do something.

ME-109 wrote:I believe its just to do with it being the O's first home game since the tragedy. So first chance to do something.

Correct

It is? Good on them - still hard to believe he's gone.

This is starting soon.

I'm looking forward to see the debutants for Munster. I'll be satisfied with some good attack play from Munster.

The scrum (Archer) could be a weak point though.

What do O's fans make of Steenkamp? 8 months out injured at the 1st training and dropped to the bench after the 1st game. Very average signing for the O's which is quite rare for them.

Well, Welsh fans should have no complaints about Deadly Douglas anyway?

profitius wrote:This is starting soon.

I'm looking forward to see the debutants for Munster. I'll be satisfied with some good attack play from Munster.

The scrum (Archer) could be a weak point though.

I'm sorry that you won't be satisfied.

Oh they've livened up a bit Rory. Nothing special yet but promising endeavour enough

And they stole the win.

Irish attacking rugby nowadays:

1) kick ball in the air, pray that fullback catches
2) give ball to biggest player, pray he breaks gain-line
3) if above fails, kick ball away

Of course, there is rarely any half decent support play involved either.

1)
2)
3)
correct.

About five minutes of 'something better than' 1) 2) 3) towards the beginning of that second half but then it was gone again like a breeze.....

Terrible start to the season for the Ospreys and it isn't going to get better as they are away to Edinburgh next!

Terrible start perhaps. But still not terrible play. They can regain composure with a win to settle them.

SecretFly wrote:Terrible start perhaps.  But still not terrible play.

Hmm I dunno, they didn't look remotely close to scoring a try against Ulster and I notice today again all their points came from the boot. No trys in two games has to be a concern.

Daylight robbery if the Ospreys had won that tbh. Breakdown was ok, but again , zero attacking threat. No line breaks or offloads. Munster deserved it and got their reward at the end. We're so lacklustre with the bigguns missing...

Cant say Munster were that good for it to have been daylight robbery if the O's won.

Same old Dudley Phillips. Engineering Munster to avoiding defeat in Wales. Did it last season, and he's pleasing his paymasters again.

Absolutely. Spot on.

Chunky Norwich wrote:Same old Dudley Phillips. Engineering Munster to avoiding defeat in Wales. Did it last season, and he's pleasing his paymasters again.

So, what did he get wrong (apart from penalising Killer for going off his feet)?

Chunky Norwich wrote:Same old Dudley Phillips. Engineering Munster to avoiding defeat in Wales. Did it last season, and he's pleasing his paymasters again.

Ho ho ho. You're so funny chunks..just class..love it. Funniest post so far

Sin é wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:Same old Dudley Phillips. Engineering Munster to avoiding defeat in Wales. Did it last season, and he's pleasing his paymasters again.

So, what did he get wrong (apart from penalising Killer for going off his feet)?

Not giving Kilcoyne a 10 minute rest when we broke through and he deliberately killed a ball about 5 metres from your line, and late in the second half and we destroyed your scrum, the ball was still at Bakers feet and we were marching towards your line which should have been allowed to go forward and would have resulted in a try for us or a Penalty try should have been awarded, that is just off the top of my head after just getting back from the match, I'll no doubt tell you about a few others after I watch the match back tomorrow

As was stated kilcoyne was on his feet when he latched onto the ball. Not sure what scrum you are talking about but the Os lost a good number of them. 11 penalties to 6 indeed show a level of bias in the game

A much better performance than last week especially in the tackling department, there wasn't much of a cutting edge, made a couple of breaks which we couldn't totally exploit, one through a hasty kick and the other a totally cynical breakdown offence, which should have resulted in a yellow card, a number enhanced their reputation, I thought Underhill and Thornton were excellent, Sam Davies made a couple of inexplicable errors but generally controlled the game very well, I thought Leonard showed his class and was a handful for Munster, we should have had more out of this game, but overall reasonably pleased with the players we put out and the experience we had on the park.

ME-109 wrote:As was stated kilcoyne was on his feet when he latched onto the ball. Not sure what scrum you are talking about but the Os lost a good number of them. 11 penalties to 6 indeed show a level of bias in the game

Well obviously I and DD disagree with you, if he thought it was a Penalty and I concur with him it should have been a Yellow card. As for which scrum it was, you obviously didn't watch the whole game, your scrum disintegrated and we were moving forward with the ball at the No 8s feet and DD blew up, why not go and have another look at the match without your RED tinted glasses on.

Unless of course you were looking at the game with heavy sunglasses. Even if kilcoynes indiscretion was a penalty. And Dudley interpreted it as such it was 15 metres out. The scrum I missed but ill take your word for it. But a penalty try is never given off the first scrum penalty. If it was a penalty try it was probably the only possibility of a try for the Os. Was more concerned with Munsters ineptitude to be honest. The penalty count show that Dudley was anything other than a homer but I guess you haven't taken off your sunglasses yet

You gotta win your games.  On your own.  If the ref is 'against you', you gotta beat him too.  As DOD says, penalty count suggests a Home team might have done more with the opportunities afforded by the 'dodgy' ref.
Munster played bad enough for long periods to be beaten, Ospreys played good enough at times to get their win and keep it but.... they couldn't hold out because Munster has the old fox instincts in abundance still and dragged themselves through and applied the pressure just when there is no time left on the clock for a response.  Wily auld coaches operating there as usual.  Risky stuff from them but it's Munster.

ME-109 wrote:Unless of course you were looking at the game with heavy sunglasses. Even if kilcoynes indiscretion was a penalty. And Dudley interpreted it as such it was 15 metres out. The scrum I missed but ill take your word for it. But a penalty try is never given off the first scrum penalty. If it was a penalty try it was probably the only possibility of a try for the Os. Was more concerned with Munsters ineptitude to be honest. The penalty count show that Dudley was anything other than a homer but I guess you haven't taken off your sunglasses yet

It was definitely a penalty and a yellow card, when he had his hand on the ball he was never at any time supporting his own weight, we had made a break and with a deft offload had made about 35 yards and then Kilcoyne blatantly got hold of the ball when not supporting his own weight a more blatant yellow I couldn't imagine, as for the scrum it was at about 69 minutes and we marched you backwards with ALL your front row up in the air, the ball was at Baker's feet and at the least he should have let the scrum carry on.

SecretFly wrote:You gotta win your games.  On your own.  If the ref is 'against you', you gotta beat him too.  As DOD says, penalty count suggests a Home team might have done more with the opportunities afforded by the 'dodgy' ref.
Munster played bad enough for long periods to be beaten, Ospreys played good enough at times to get their win and keep it but.... they couldn't hold out because Munster has the old fox instincts in abundance still and dragged themselves through and applied the pressure just when there is no time left on the clock for a response.  Wily auld coaches operating there as usual.  Risky stuff from them but it's Munster.

Fly, totally agree, we had the opportunities to win this game on our own, and the wily old fox as you put it came away with the spoils, it is  a big learning experience for this young team, hopefully they will learn it quickly, I'm not of the opinion of many on here of biased Irish refs, I think Phillips is basically incompetent like many of the refs in the NH. That first penalty which I've now watched back is very deserving of a yellow card, we made a break gave a nice offload and carried on the move for 35 yards or so and then Kilcoyne did what he had to do to stop IMO a certain try. Phillips rightly gave a Penalty but the extra sanction should have been issued.

I am a little reluctant to post on here after yesterdays game. I know I will get accused of conspiracy theories and the what not, but the ref was totally one sided yesterday, every time Ospreys were in the Munster 22, the Munster players were doing something cynical. Players lying injured but straight away getting up when the play was stopped, slowing the ball down, and the ref was only penalising one team in the scrum. Ospreys had six shots at goal for Munsters foul play, yet they somehow escaped any yellows OR warnings, I was in my seat, and I watched a Munster player pick up the ball behind the ruck, he then jumped NFL style over the ruck with the ball. Is that now allowed ?

I am not saying the ref was biased, but he was rubbish and he favoured Munster. But saying that, he did not cause Ospreys to lose line outs on their own throw. But what he did do, was effect the final outcome of the game, and this is what is making a mockery out of our league. CRAP REFS.

LordDowlais wrote:I am a little reluctant to post on here after yesterdays game. I know I will get accused of conspiracy theories and the what not, but the ref was totally one sided yesterday, every time Ospreys were in the Munster 22, the Munster players were doing something  cynical. Players lying injured but straight away getting up when the play was stopped, slowing the ball down, and the ref was only penalising one team in the scrum. Ospreys had six shots at goal for Munsters foul play, yet they somehow escaped any yellows OR warnings, I was in my seat, and I watched a Munster player pick up the ball behind the ruck, he then jumped NFL style over the ruck with the ball. Is that now allowed ?

I am not saying the ref was biased, but he was rubbish and he favoured Munster. But saying that, he did not cause Ospreys to lose line outs on their own throw. But what he did do, was effect the final outcome of the game, and this is what is making a mockery out of our league. CRAP REFS.

Again LD your commentary is completely at odds with the stats....11-6 penalty count in favour of the O's and did not ref the O's at the breakdown at all. But whatever...your having yourself in terms of conspiracies etc...if it keeps you warm at night then fine.

ME-109 wrote:Again LD your commentary is completely at odds with the stats....11-6 penalty count in favour of the O's and did not ref the O's at the breakdown at all. But whatever...your having yourself in terms of conspiracies etc...if it keeps you warm at night then fine.

Not commenting on this game in particular, but a penalty count in favour or against a team does not show a bias, it is whether or not pens were awarded where they should be or not. For example a if I were a bias ref I would be willing to ping the side I am favouring in the opposition half, however I would turn a blind eye to infringements on their own try line, or and likewise I would possibly allow the odd offside by the opposition side when they are in defence around the halfway line, and then ref them extra harsh in their own 22m.