Ulster Rugby 2017-18

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Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pot Hale on Mon Jan 01, 2018 6:25 pm

First topic message reminder :

Jeez - O’Donoghue eeled his way through that maul and caught Herring.


Last edited by Pot Hale on Mon Jan 01, 2018 6:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pot Hale on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:28 pm

Cooney my MOTM.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Artful_Dodger on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:28 pm

Incredible, not sure about the swan dive though.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Artful_Dodger on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:30 pm

Pot Hale wrote:Cooney my MOTM.

Official one as well.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pot Hale on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:31 pm

So pleased for John Cooney. Let’s hope Schmidt was watching.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:33 pm

marty2086 wrote:
eirebilly wrote:Well that is the game to Ulster.

Must say the ref has been absolutely awful, gave everything to Munster in the first half and everything to Ulster in the second.

Like that Cooney try?

Why do you not stop acting the fool, read back what I wrote about the Cooney try. I stated it was a try.

The ref was seriously for Munster in the first half and for Ulster in the second.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:34 pm

Pot Hale wrote:So pleased for John Cooney.   Let’s hope Schmidt was watching.

He has come on in leaps and bounds for Ulster. He must be seriously piling the pressure on Marmion now. Mind you McGrath had another good game for Leinster earlier as well.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:37 pm

Well done to Ulster, does this now mean that you will behind Kiss now or is this just a paper crack covering win?
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:39 pm

eirebilly wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
eirebilly wrote:Well that is the game to Ulster.

Must say the ref has been absolutely awful, gave everything to Munster in the first half and everything to Ulster in the second.

Like that Cooney try?

Why do you not stop acting the fool, read back what I wrote about the Cooney try. I stated it was a try.

The ref was seriously for Munster in the first half and for Ulster in the second.

Maybe you should read what you wrote, you said he gave everything to Ulster in the second half except for a perfectly good try. So he didnt give everything as you yourself have stated, it's one or the other so hardly foolish to point out the contradiction is it?

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Artful_Dodger on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:41 pm

eirebilly wrote:Well done to Ulster, does this now mean that you will behind Kiss now or is this just a paper crack covering win?

That win, and more so the second half performance, probably buys him some time. Some of the players including Piutau talked before the game about putting in a shift for Kiss. That came in the second half. What will be telling is whether or not that second half and the result mean Ulster now push on and play with their tales up heading into the crucial last part of the EC groups. We need at least 5 points from La Rochelle at home and Wasps away to qualify.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pot Hale on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:42 pm

eirebilly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:So pleased for John Cooney.   Let’s hope Schmidt was watching.

He has come on in leaps and bounds for Ulster. He must be seriously piling the pressure on Marmion now. Mind you McGrath had another good game for Leinster earlier as well.

Agreed on Marmion. I thought McGrath was a bit ponderous today at the RDS. Still, having 4 high quality 9’s across the provinces is no bad thing. Given where we seemed to be a couple of years ago. Nucifora has done a good job in overall player development and pathways, as well as steering players around the provinces. Hope we see more of it.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:44 pm

marty2086 wrote:
eirebilly wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
eirebilly wrote:Well that is the game to Ulster.

Must say the ref has been absolutely awful, gave everything to Munster in the first half and everything to Ulster in the second.

Like that Cooney try?

Why do you not stop acting the fool, read back what I wrote about the Cooney try. I stated it was a try.

The ref was seriously for Munster in the first half and for Ulster in the second.

Maybe you should read what you wrote, you said he gave everything to Ulster in the second half except for a perfectly good try. So he didnt give everything as you yourself have stated, it's one or the other so hardly foolish to point out the contradiction is it?

Congratulations, you picked out something that I worded incorrectly. You ARE todays Internet forum champion clap

Might be time to run to the pub and gloat in front of the lads thumbsup
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:45 pm

Pot Hale wrote:
eirebilly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:So pleased for John Cooney.   Let’s hope Schmidt was watching.

He has come on in leaps and bounds for Ulster. He must be seriously piling the pressure on Marmion now. Mind you McGrath had another good game for Leinster earlier as well.

Agreed on Marmion.  I thought McGrath was a bit ponderous today at the RDS. Still, having 4 high quality 9’s across the provinces is no bad thing.   Given where we seemed to be a couple of years ago.  Nucifora has done a good job in overall player development and pathways, as well as steering players around the provinces.  Hope we see more of it.  

Careful there now, are you insinuating that Nucifora did a good job in getting rid of Pienaar to allow Cooney to develop at Ulster? Wink
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by clivemcl on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:45 pm

I want to hear the honest analysis. How much of Ulsters comeback was due to Munsters indiscipline? Would our comeback have even been close if playing against 15.

Let’s get real here. Is that second half really a sign of much at all? Were there any changes to the field on Ulsters side that played much of a factor?


Last edited by clivemcl on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:48 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pot Hale on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:46 pm

eirebilly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:
eirebilly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:So pleased for John Cooney.   Let’s hope Schmidt was watching.

He has come on in leaps and bounds for Ulster. He must be seriously piling the pressure on Marmion now. Mind you McGrath had another good game for Leinster earlier as well.

Agreed on Marmion.  I thought McGrath was a bit ponderous today at the RDS. Still, having 4 high quality 9’s across the provinces is no bad thing.   Given where we seemed to be a couple of years ago.  Nucifora has done a good job in overall player development and pathways, as well as steering players around the provinces.  Hope we see more of it.  

Careful there now, are you insinuating that Nucifora did a good job in getting rid of Pienaar to allow Cooney to develop at Ulster? Wink

Not at all. I’m stating it baldly. Whistle
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:46 pm

eirebilly wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
eirebilly wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
eirebilly wrote:Well that is the game to Ulster.

Must say the ref has been absolutely awful, gave everything to Munster in the first half and everything to Ulster in the second.

Like that Cooney try?

Why do you not stop acting the fool, read back what I wrote about the Cooney try. I stated it was a try.

The ref was seriously for Munster in the first half and for Ulster in the second.

Maybe you should read what you wrote, you said he gave everything to Ulster in the second half except for a perfectly good try. So he didnt give everything as you yourself have stated, it's one or the other so hardly foolish to point out the contradiction is it?

Congratulations, you picked out something that I worded incorrectly. You ARE todays Internet forum champion clap

Might be time to run to the pub and gloat in front of the lads thumbsup

picard


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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:48 pm

Artful_Dodger wrote:
eirebilly wrote:Well done to Ulster, does this now mean that you will behind Kiss now or is this just a paper crack covering win?

That win, and more so the second half performance, probably buys him some time.  Some of the players including Piutau talked before the game about putting in a shift for Kiss.  That came in the second half.  What will be telling is whether or not that second half and the result mean Ulster now push on and play with their tales up heading into the crucial last part of the EC groups.  We need at least 5 points from La Rochelle at home and Wasps away to qualify.

As I have said many times, I do not think that all the issues at Ulster were Kiss' fault. I do not think he is as bad as many point him out to be.

Ulster still are a very solid team and I fully expect them to push La Rochelle in Europe. I do not think La Rochelle are as good as they are made out to be.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:49 pm

Pot Hale wrote:
eirebilly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:
eirebilly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:So pleased for John Cooney.   Let’s hope Schmidt was watching.

He has come on in leaps and bounds for Ulster. He must be seriously piling the pressure on Marmion now. Mind you McGrath had another good game for Leinster earlier as well.

Agreed on Marmion.  I thought McGrath was a bit ponderous today at the RDS. Still, having 4 high quality 9’s across the provinces is no bad thing.   Given where we seemed to be a couple of years ago.  Nucifora has done a good job in overall player development and pathways, as well as steering players around the provinces.  Hope we see more of it.  

Careful there now, are you insinuating that Nucifora did a good job in getting rid of Pienaar to allow Cooney to develop at Ulster? Wink

Not at all.  I’m stating it baldly.  Whistle

Now you know what happens when things get stated badly, there is always one on here to point that out to you Very Happy
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pot Hale on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:49 pm

clivemcl wrote:I want to hear the honest analysis. How much of Ulsters comeback was due to Munsters indiscipline? Would our comeback have even been close if playing against 25.

Let’s get real here. Is that second half really a sign of much at all? We’re there any changes to the field on Ulsters side that played much of a factor?

Bit of chicken n egg. Munster’s indiscipline grew from Ulster’s improved play and urgent pressure from first minute of second half.

Playing against 25 would have been a challenge but I think Cooney would have managed it....
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pot Hale on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:51 pm

eirebilly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:
eirebilly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:
eirebilly wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:So pleased for John Cooney.   Let’s hope Schmidt was watching.

He has come on in leaps and bounds for Ulster. He must be seriously piling the pressure on Marmion now. Mind you McGrath had another good game for Leinster earlier as well.

Agreed on Marmion.  I thought McGrath was a bit ponderous today at the RDS. Still, having 4 high quality 9’s across the provinces is no bad thing.   Given where we seemed to be a couple of years ago.  Nucifora has done a good job in overall player development and pathways, as well as steering players around the provinces.  Hope we see more of it.  

Careful there now, are you insinuating that Nucifora did a good job in getting rid of Pienaar to allow Cooney to develop at Ulster? Wink

Not at all.  I’m stating it baldly.  Whistle

Now you know what happens when things get stated badly, there is always one on here to point that out to you Very Happy

Indeed, which is why I said baldly. laughing
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by clivemcl on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:53 pm

Damn you Pot Hale you quoted before I corrected my typo! Very Happy

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:53 pm

clivemcl wrote:I want to hear the honest analysis. How much of Ulsters comeback was due to Munsters indiscipline? Would our comeback have even been close if playing against 25.

Let’s get real here. Is that second half really a sign of much at all? We’re there any changes to the field on Ulsters side that played much of a factor?

Ulster came out on fire in the second half, they were forcing Munster to make mistakes and then their discipline went to pish. The Ulster win was not down to Munster's indiscipline, it was down to their pressuring of Munster to make errors and infringe.

Proper win.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Artful_Dodger on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:55 pm

A lot of credit should also go to Agent Sammy Arnold, although they might be on to him in Munster now. Wink

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:56 pm

clivemcl wrote:I want to hear the honest analysis. How much of Ulsters comeback was due to Munsters indiscipline? Would our comeback have even been close if playing against 25.

Let’s get real here. Is that second half really a sign of much at all? We’re there any changes to the field on Ulsters side that played much of a factor?

Clive the turnaround in performance led to the infringements from Munster for me, the defence was far better from Ulster and it can't be a coincidence that it wasn't the passive drift defence we've seen so much of recently

There's plenty of room for improvement, Kiss sent the team out in the first half and that performance is on him and the rest of the coaches. The Leinster game will be telling, if they can continue that second half performance and get something in Dublin then we have a platform to build on, if we play like we have been against big teams then he's a goner surely

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pot Hale on Mon Jan 01, 2018 7:57 pm

eirebilly wrote:
clivemcl wrote:I want to hear the honest analysis. How much of Ulsters comeback was due to Munsters indiscipline? Would our comeback have even been close if playing against 25.

Let’s get real here. Is that second half really a sign of much at all? We’re there any changes to the field on Ulsters side that played much of a factor?

Ulster came out on fire in the second half, they were forcing Munster to make mistakes and then their discipline went to pish. The Ulster win was not down to Munster's indiscipline, it was down to their pressuring of Munster to make errors and infringe.

Proper win.


Fully agree, Billy. Well said. Our northern cousins can celebrate with good cause.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by carpet baboon on Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:35 pm

So what happened at half time? What got them fired up? Cave seemed to be an abundance of passion, all the players seemed half a yard quicker in deed and thought, so whatever was said can we bottle it and use it next week.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Standulstermen on Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:01 pm

I’ll eat a bit of humble pie on Cave. I still think he’s nearly done at this level but he used his nous to great effect tonight and I have to say it’s just great to see an Ulsterman show how much the jersey means to him. clap

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by clivemcl on Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:10 pm

But given what we’ve heard I’d say a touch of that passion/aggression after his try was directed towards Kiss. Don’t forget Cave wasn’t meant to have been starting tonight.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Standulstermen on Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:24 pm

Maybe so Clive but he was directing Herring in terms of his speaking to the ref. He also scored one and made another. I don’t think you could criticise any of the backs for the first 40 and while they were far from perfect they got us over the line.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:33 pm

The biggest influence on the game for me was at half time when Ulster replaced their 2 props. Ulster were getting creamed at the scrum and set piece but after the change, got dominance.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by The Great Aukster on Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:44 pm

Standulstermen wrote:I’ll eat a bit of humble pie on Cave. I still think he’s nearly done at this level but he used his nous to great effect tonight and I have to say it’s just great to see an Ulsterman show how much the jersey means to him. clap
Me too SU. Cave was mightily influential tonight, I've never questioned his commitment or his brain - only his ability to compete with faster and more powerful opponents.

Munster had a forwards plan and Ulster's lightweight pack couldn't compete with them in the first half. At 17 - 0 down passion is one thing and then rationality is another. Ulster turning down 12 possible points off the tee was idiotic, and explains why this team will never win anything. Still the comeback scared a relatively rookie Munster into submission that had no logical reason for capitulation. The Munster of old wouldn't have noticed or cared about supposed pressure - they would just have gone on with the business of closing out the game.

Ulster supporters should be glad that the team is so inconsistent as there is no pressure on winning anything!

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:48 pm

We learnt a fair bit today

McCall and Ah You were clearly not match ready after an extended lay offs - terrible selection decisions
Being brave enough to haul them both off at half time was an excellent decision
There was no lack of passion in the first half we just totally carried two forwards and one was poor hardly surprising the others struggled
The backrow improved when Rea replaced Deysel.
Timoney was excellent and that game was the making of Jones - he was magnificence and my MOTM - reminded me a bit of Henderson when he first made the team
Deysel remains a waste of a NIQ contract.
Cave answered his critics today the pick of the threes - also there was one kick through where he showed he is not as slow as many think.
Lyttle is an excellent prospect and should get more game time
Cooney is the best signing we made in 2017

Right for Leinster lets keep changes to a minimum - bring in Henderson, Stockdale and maybe McPhillips (if Christian injured)
Most of all lets go totally left field and pick the same centre parring two games in a row

Saw Jerry Flannery just after the game - boy did he have a face like thunder
The ref was totally out of his depth
On that performance Munster can keep JJ we don't want him - he was terrible

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Standulstermen on Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:57 pm

I thought Jones had a poor first half in truth Geoff. He was very poor at the scrum and his clearouts were muck. Much improved second half and still young though. It was noticeable Herbst actually coached Jones a bit in terms of his bind and body position. I agree on Deysel. Rea was a serious improvement. I don’t know about going down to Leinster with a serious team. Just not sure given La Rochelle is the next week. In truth I’d start McBurney and mccphillips down there as the former deserves a shot and the Lealiafano looked buggered at the end

Aukster
Agreed on Cave. Didn’t question those attributes but like you I worried they wouldn’t compensate for the lack of athleticism. They did tonight mind you.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:14 pm

Agreed not as good in the first half but with 3 passengers hard to look impressive
His 2nd half was outstanding though
Cave played well for one important reason - played where he is at his best 13
Playing players in their best position is really rather a good idea - hope it catches on

We must not put out a poor team, ala Connacht, against Leinster and get stuffed again.
Would negate much of the spirit the team showed in the comeback today
We need to build momentum.
I would be ok with McBurney starting though

Black, McBurney, Herbst, Treadwell/AOC, Henderson, Jones, Rea, Timoney
Cooney, McPhillips, Gilroy, McCloskey, Cave, Stockdale, Piatau
Works for me -
Lyttle on the bench not Trimble




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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:21 am

If the squad can only maintain the glavanising team spirit shown on the second half them we're in with a chance next week. If a 13 can play at (wild guess here) 13 and a centre pairing can play more than 1 game together then we might have a chance. If our strongest pack can start the flipping game and not be the mitigating factor in us falling 17 points behind at half time then, yes we might have a chance.
We'll have to learn to do that against 15 men mind you.
On that point, Arnold had gone high in the tackle a few times and to the letter of the law deserved the red card, that it happened whist Munster were on a yellow is on him and nobody else. Ulster, in previous games wouldn't have taken full advantage. Against the 14 men, I know that Ulster would still have lost that match had it not been for the massive resurgence of team spirit that was shown. Please, please retain that spirit guys.

Cooney has been our player of the season and a capable replacement for Ruan. This in no way vindicates those who chose to remove Pienaar, it's simply fortuitous that he's found his true from at Ulster. He and McGrath will bypass Marmion in Joe's ratings although I'd much prefer to keep Cooney at Ulster during international windows. Billy, I may not need a new Munster top Wink

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by The Great Aukster on Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:25 am

I'm with Geoff on this one. Ulster need to build some consistency with the best players they have, irrespective of whether it's league or cup.
The problem is the short turnaround, and some like Jones had nothing left at the final whistle, so some changes are inevitable.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by clivemcl on Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:57 am

Worth noting we could have signed Clooney anyway and had Pienaar at ten this season rather than Lealifano

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:59 am

The Great Aukster wrote:I'm with Geoff on this one. Ulster need to build some consistency with the best players they have, irrespective of whether it's league or cup.
The problem is the short turnaround, and some like Jones had nothing left at the final whistle, so some changes are inevitable.

We know that doesn't work though, we have done it in the past where we flogged a core group of players and then either someone is unavailable and their replacement comes in cold having not played for an age or come the business end of the season they are out on their feet with nothing left to give.

How many times in the past have we complained about coaches not giving young players a chance, yet here is one giving them a chance in a big game and still we complain

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:38 am

Pete330v2 wrote:

Cooney has been our player of the season and a capable replacement for Ruan. This in no way vindicates those who chose to remove Pienaar, it's simply fortuitous that he's found his true from at Ulster. He and McGrath will bypass Marmion in Joe's ratings although I'd much prefer to keep Cooney at Ulster during international windows. Billy, I may not need a new Munster top Wink

As much as I hate loosing bets, I would be very happy to lose this one. Being very good from the tee certainly puts him higher in the 9 running as he could be a more than capable backup should Sexton be having an off day with the boot. Still not overly convinced with his box kicking but he is not that bad. Keep this form up and I am certain that he should be back up to Murray for the 6N (well if Schmidt does not want McGrath from Leinster in there).
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Pete330v2 on Tue Jan 02, 2018 12:57 pm

eirebilly wrote:
Pete330v2 wrote:

Cooney has been our player of the season and a capable replacement for Ruan. This in no way vindicates those who chose to remove Pienaar, it's simply fortuitous that he's found his true from at Ulster. He and McGrath will bypass Marmion in Joe's ratings although I'd much prefer to keep Cooney at Ulster during international windows. Billy, I may not need a new Munster top Wink

As much as I hate loosing bets, I would be very happy to lose this one. Being very good from the tee certainly puts him higher in the 9 running as he could be a more than capable backup should Sexton be having an off day with the boot. Still not overly convinced with his box kicking but he is not that bad. Keep this form up and I am certain that he should be back up to Murray for the 6N (well if Schmidt does not want McGrath from Leinster in there).

I don't think he'll slip in there so soon despite his form. Joe tends to stick to the tried and tested until either his hand is forced or a player genuinely fits his formulas better. Cooney may be seen as what's missing from his backup formula but I don't see him being in that position this season, perhaps after the summer but hey, Joe has surprised before. I want him to remain at Ulster, we're in dire need right now especially after Christian Leali'ifano heads home at the end of the month leaving us without an outhalf yet again. Imagine if the IRFU had only had the foresight to allow us to sign Pienaar as a 10, he and Cooney running things together Smile

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:04 pm

Even though JJ had a pretty bad game yesterday, I still think he would be well suited to Ulster. He is far better than yesterdays performance and I think he would work well with Cooney. In Keatley, Bleyendaal and Scannell Munster have enough coverage at 10 to miss JJ. JJ just needs a regular run at 10 to get his match fitness, form and confidence back and I think he could do that at Ulster.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:13 pm

eirebilly wrote:Even though JJ had a pretty bad game yesterday, I still think he would be well suited to Ulster. He is far better than yesterdays performance and I think he would work well with Cooney. In Keatley, Bleyendaal and Scannell Munster have enough coverage at 10 to miss JJ. JJ just needs a regular run at 10 to get his match fitness, form and confidence back and I think he could do that at Ulster.

I noticed Bill Johnston came on yesterday, I think at full back, is he back to fitness or still getting there?

He's a player with some real ability and might benefit from a move to get more game time

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:15 pm

Pete330v2 wrote:
eirebilly wrote:
Pete330v2 wrote:

Cooney has been our player of the season and a capable replacement for Ruan. This in no way vindicates those who chose to remove Pienaar, it's simply fortuitous that he's found his true from at Ulster. He and McGrath will bypass Marmion in Joe's ratings although I'd much prefer to keep Cooney at Ulster during international windows. Billy, I may not need a new Munster top Wink

As much as I hate loosing bets, I would be very happy to lose this one. Being very good from the tee certainly puts him higher in the 9 running as he could be a more than capable backup should Sexton be having an off day with the boot. Still not overly convinced with his box kicking but he is not that bad. Keep this form up and I am certain that he should be back up to Murray for the 6N (well if Schmidt does not want McGrath from Leinster in there).

I don't think he'll slip in there so soon despite his form. Joe tends to stick to the tried and tested until either his hand is forced or a player genuinely fits his formulas better. Cooney may be seen as what's missing from his backup formula but I don't see him being in that position this season, perhaps after the summer but hey, Joe has surprised before. I want him to remain at Ulster, we're in dire need right now especially after Christian Leali'ifano heads home at the end of the month leaving us without an outhalf yet again. Imagine if the IRFU had only had the foresight to allow us to sign Pienaar as a 10, he and Cooney running things together Smile

If Joe is forced to go with a backup 10 who isn't the most reliable off the tee, then he might slip onto the bench as someone who can help see out a game and keep the scoreboard ticking over

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Tue Jan 02, 2018 3:16 pm

marty2086 wrote:
The Great Aukster wrote:I'm with Geoff on this one. Ulster need to build some consistency with the best players they have, irrespective of whether it's league or cup.
The problem is the short turnaround, and some like Jones had nothing left at the final whistle, so some changes are inevitable.

We know that doesn't work though, we have done it in the past where we flogged a core group of players and then either someone is unavailable and their replacement comes in cold having not played for an age or come the business end of the season they are out on their feet with nothing left to give.

How many times in the past have we complained about coaches not giving young players a chance, yet here is one giving them a chance in a big game and still we complain

I think you miss understand nobody is talking about flogging the same 15 to 18 players week in week out ala McLoughlin.
What is being proposed is gaining some consistency in playing, roughly, the same team 4 games in a row.
We can rest players against the Kings and we have gaps in the 6N as well.
Playing the same centre combination 2 games in a row would be a novelty.
As for youth look at the team I suggested - positions 4 to 8 would be covered by Henderson, Treadwell, AOC, Jones, Rea and Timoney.
You cant get much more youthful than that !

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Tue Jan 02, 2018 3:18 pm

On current form I can think of no valid argument for McGrath to be above Cooney in the Ireland 9 pecking order

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by eirebilly on Tue Jan 02, 2018 3:49 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:On current form I can think of no valid argument for McGrath to be above Cooney in the Ireland 9 pecking order

McGrath is not playing that badly and he does play for Leinster which is always a plus for Schmidt. He knows Sexton having played inside him for a while now. the 9 selection will also be up to how Schmidt see's the back up 10 to Sexton, if he goes for Keatley then I feel it will be Marmion as back up but if he goes for Byrne or Carbery then I feel it will be McGrath due to familiarity.

Sadly, as well as Cooney has been playing, I cant see Schmidt selecting him ahead of Marmion or McGrath.

Even if it costs me my bet with Pete, I would like to see Cooney rewarded for his good form with a game in the 6N, off the bench.
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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Tue Jan 02, 2018 4:17 pm

McGrath is doing ok but Cooney is doing better than ok.

Also McGrath gets an easier ride behind a dominant pack

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by geoff999rugby on Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:48 am

Two separate points

I see Tommy is doing some of the Getaway holiday programs
Also there will be a documentary on his life on BBC NI
Look like precursors to his new life to me

Also re watched the second half (couldn't bear to watch the first !)
Gibbes didn't look happy.
Turned to Kiss spoke to him then turned away in disgust, holding his head in his hands and shaking it.
Happened twice - hardly conveyed a happy coaching camp

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Redman on Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:27 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:Two separate points

I see Tommy is doing some of the Getaway holiday programs
Also there will be a documentary on his life on BBC NI
Look like precursors to his new life to me

Also re watched the second half (couldn't bear to watch the first !)
Gibbes didn't look happy.
Turned to Kiss spoke to him then turned away in disgust, holding his head in his hands and shaking it.
Happened twice - hardly conveyed a happy coaching camp

I think Tommy has looked pretty good in spells, I think he's probably got 1 more season in him. But he probably doesn't need the money and does he want to ekk out another Pro14 season or retire? Could understand it if he decides to hang up the boots.

The camp is clearly a mess. I said it before, the DoR job for Ulster is way above a normal DoR job in France or England. Because our CEO is MIA in the rugby department being DoR for Ulster should mean he is responsible for all rugby operations in Ulster at all levels under the branch. If for example you're DoR of Leicester, Northampton or wherever the RFU has various support structures which they take care of aspects of the game. In Ulster, Kiss should be at the top with a watching brief for strategy ..... similar or even higher than what Humphreys was. Instead he's coaching the senior team defence week in, week out. There's no point in he himself saying there are serious structural issue within Ulster Rugby, and then ignoring them while defaulting back to his safety blanket of defence coach (and doing a cr*p job of it).

I can imagine Gibbs threw a fit saying something like "I thought we'd agreed never to do that ever again! Why are they still doing that!" While looking at Kiss because he'd have been taking the training sessions the weeks previously when Gibbs was back in New Zealand.

Did anyone see the interview after the game? Strong stuff from the BBC. They basically put it to Kiss that results haven't been good enough, mentioned the Last Kissmas headline and put it to him point blank that people are saying he won't be in a job soon. They won't have done that without themselves being fairly certain that the blazers are indeed thinking about making a change.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by marty2086 on Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:45 pm

I think you are all reading too much into things, Gibbes has been shaking his head most of the season and he had a face like thunder all game. Given it was the unit he is responsible for that was severely malfunctioning and the main reason for the first half scoreline then you can't blame him for being pi$$ed

BBC also said Gibbes absence in Galway may have been a contributing factor to the performance, does that mean he's more hands on than Kiss?

Anyone know why Gibbes was back in NZ?

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

Post by Redman on Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:19 pm

Saw it somewhere that it was to visit family and had been agreed long in advance.

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Re: Ulster Rugby 2017-18

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