Let's talk about the 6N....

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Post by Rinsure on Tue 17 Sep 2019, 9:15 am

Apparently the CVC deal is back on the table: https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/49722639

With all the implications that selling out a share to private equity brings - the spectre of losing the annual showpiece to paywalled TV being chief among them. Big up front cash boost to the nations, but is the hoped for growth sustainable if there's no rugby on free to air TV?

Look at cricket, post-2005 and the renewed interesting in getting it on free TV this Summer - how many people watched the "Super Over" compared to the, let's say, victorious 2013 Ashes series?

With all the hype about RWC, and it being broadcast on ITV (in England), is it a good time for the 6N to hide a bad news announcement?


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Post by tigertattie on Tue 17 Sep 2019, 9:22 am

Would be a terrible idea to move the 6ns off of free to air.

There were calls for it to be given protected status but nothing came of this.

I'm a beleiver on if it isnt broken, dont fix it. The Six nations is a wonderful tournament and the only time I see mates who dont follow rugby actually watch it on the tele. When Scotland are playing England we can get a whole pub of football fans on thier feet cheering.
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Post by LondonTiger on Tue 17 Sep 2019, 9:36 am

My understanding (as posted in Club section) is an offer of £300m for15% of all future commercial rights to 6Ns and to the AIs played by 6Ns teams. It is a permanent stakeholding and would thus value the 6Ns (and AIs) at £2bn


The 6Ns unions would still hold the decision making, though not sure how the rights are split by country. This could make it easier for a subset to take control. Bringing the AIs into the mix could mean that all countries move to 4 matches maybe, as it is possible that effectively those with an extra game would see monies go to other teams (for commercial rights ie TV etc, not sponsorship). England have a bigger deal with Sky for their AIs than other sides have with their deals, while France and Ireland have had separate deals for 6Ns TV rights. Now everything will be pooled and shared - hence why I wonder if the stakes are equal across the 6 unions.

CVC already have a stake in Premiership Rugby and have almost signed a deal with Pro14. This current deal was always likely to happen once 6Ns vetoed the League of Nations tournament proposed by World Rugby. I have to assume that CVC are looking to eventually have key stakes in all major competitions up to and including RWC.

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Post by LondonTiger on Wed 18 Sep 2019, 7:09 am

Brett Gosper (sp) CEO of World Rugby not happy with this move. He wants CVC and the 6Ns to explain themselves and let him know what they are planning for the future. 

Cynics may say he feels threatened. After all he does seem to be taking a large salary for doing bugger all Smile

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Post by maestegmafia on Wed 18 Sep 2019, 8:44 am

LondonTiger wrote:Brett Gosper (sp) CEO of World Rugby not happy with this move. He wants CVC and the 6Ns to explain themselves and let him know what they are planning for the future. 

Cynics may say he feels threatened. After all he does seem to be taking a large salary for doing bugger all Smile

Reports from when CVC were involved with F1 are not great, they were there to make money and nothing else. Billy Beaumont doesn’t sound overly impressed either as this goes against the elitism he is trying to dispel at World Rugby.

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Post by LondonTiger on Wed 18 Sep 2019, 9:10 am

I am not a huge follower of F1, but friends of mine who are and travel the world to GPs have a reasonably relaxed view on CVC - especially as they were slightly hamstrung by Ecclestone.

When it comes down to it though they are a firm of Venture Capitalists. Their aim is to make money - it is up to the Unions and Leagues to make sure that they take the extra cash and protect the game. That CVC can come in is really a reflection of the mismanagement of the game by the authorities. The RFU stuck it's head in the sand in 1995 to catastrophic effect and is still playing catch up. Other Unions and most certainly World Rugby (and before it IRB) have never grasped the detail in having a professional sport. The attitude generally seems to be "bung a few quid at the players and it will be fine". 

Unsurprisingly every union is out for itself and the governing body has failed to set a lead. We all point the fingers at other countries or unions or indeed club umbrella organisations because it is easier to do that than accept we have issues at home. We see this all over the world in more than just rugby. In fact it could be argued that our game is a microcosm of the populism politics engulfing the globe. RFU and PRL have seriously Frak things up - but no more or less than any other organisation. It is easy to point the finger at others, in fact we see it on the boards daily, and we all get defensive when people criticise "our lot", yet all are to blame.

That 6Ns seemed to have agreed to a deal that serves their best interests should come as no surprise, and it will be interesting to see how this affects the Lions revenues, but considering the proposal from World Rugby was designed to be attractive to just a small section of the game, would have "punished" 6Ns without actually delivering the purported benefits to teh smaller nations.

Ideally all the tier 1 nations would look at playing a Tier 2 side every year. Kudos to Scotland for travelling to Georgia. 6Ns sides should be looing to add fixtures (even if we put out A sides) with European Tier 2 sides. SA should be doing more for African sides, Argentina for South American and NZ & Australia for Oceanic teams. Instead though everyone points the finger and blames someone else for not doing anything.

Rant over.

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Post by Brendan on Wed 18 Sep 2019, 11:19 am

World Rugby have wasted money in the Pacific Island Nations for years with the majority of it not getting to players at any level.

That would have been better spent somewhere else or had better control over the money.

When you compare the number of T1 games Samoa, Fiji and Tonga get from European teams compared to all 4 RC teams.
Add in how many other T2 nations get games against the 6N teams compared to the RC teams.

The 6 Nations are doing loads for T2 teams during the AIs and Summer tours.  It could be argued that there are 6 teams so they need games but they do actually play them.

I think it's time the WR funded either Nambia and Georgia with a team or Georgia and another European Country (that can compete in the Pro 14).  Europe is also opened up its tournaments to T2 sides via the European Shield.

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Post by Brendan on Wed 18 Sep 2019, 11:35 am

My wish list for CVC is as follows.

1. Becomes the 8N with no rest weeks.  In the first 4 weeks the top 4 teams from the previous year play the bottom 4.  It means that there are 2.5 games to rest/rotate players.  Last 3 weeks would replicate the WC and get 3 hard games that matter where anyone can win.  So surely better tournament.
2. The B/u20 sides for the  8N are broken up into Group A and Group B of Division 2 and the remaining 4 B6N teams are added to the groups.  Only group winners play each other. if a B6N team win the Dinvision 2 final they get a playoff v the bottom of the 8N.  Means the U20s would develop better and be more prepared for the Summer tournament.  Georgia u20s are better than Scotland and Italy already.

3. The votes held by European union's in WR are used to fund the 2 teams promoted to the 8N like Argentina have received.

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Post by LordDowlais on Wed 18 Sep 2019, 12:20 pm

Brendan wrote:World Rugby have wasted money in the Pacific Island Nations for years with the majority of it not getting to players at any level.

That would have been better spent somewhere else or had better control over the money.

When you compare the number of T1 games Samoa, Fiji and Tonga get from European teams compared to all 4 RC teams.
Add in how many other T2 nations get games against the 6N teams compared to the RC teams.

The 6 Nations are doing loads for T2 teams during the AIs and Summer tours.  It could be argued that there are 6 teams so they need games but they do actually play them.

I think it's time the WR funded either Nambia and Georgia with a team or Georgia and another European Country (that can compete in the Pro 14).  Europe is also opened up its tournaments to T2 sides via the European Shield.

The Pacific Island nations in rugby really do me head in at times. The corruption, the moaning, the way they are beyond physical but we must except it as it's their way......ect

For my liking, Fiji/Tonga/Samoa get more help than the likes of Georgia, Romania, Namibia and Uruguay. Why ?

They are given thousands of pounds, get regular fixtures with the 6N sides, and what happens, the money goes into corrupt pockets. World rugby would be much better off, actually paying for upgrades in the facilities, paying the players for world cups and the what not. Why they keep handing money over to these corrupt unions is just beggars belief.

I honestly believe that they keep getting help, because of the tradition and heritage rugby has in these nations.

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