England A v Scotland A Sunday 27th June 2021

First topic message reminder :

England A v Scotland A
Sunday 27th June 2021
Welford Rd
Leicester

Kick off 14:00

Live on Channel 4

Well an A team game between the old rivals, where players will get captured, but not capped. Hard to know how this one will go with not much in the way of form and no doubt a lot of players new to the international set up. hard to make any predictions really.

Scotland will be using this as a bit of a trial before cutting down their squad size prior to heading of to eastern Europe for their two proper tests, so expect to see a few of their uncapped players putting in an audition for that role. I would expect to see some of the youngsters starting and maybe a few more experienced players on the bench to steady the ship if they are struggling.

The last A team game between England and Scotland proved a bit of a triumph for the scots and saw the emergence of several players who have gone on to become major stars, Stuart Hogg amongst them. If I was going to pick anyone on that pathway this time around, I would probably be looking at Jamie Dobie, our exciting young SH, who could still be playing U20s this season, he looks very much like one for the future and hopefully there will be some others as well.

ENGLAND:

15. Freddie Steward (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
14. Adam Radwan (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)
13. Ollie Lawrence (Worcester Warriors, 6 caps)
12. Dan Kelly (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
11. Max Malins (Bristol Bears (loan) / Saracens, 7 caps)
10. Jacob Umaga (Wasps, uncapped)
9. Harry Randall (Bristol Bears, uncapped)

1. Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers, 28 caps)
2. Curtis Langdon (Sale Sharks, uncapped)
3. Joe Heyes (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
4. Harry Wells (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
5. Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 21 caps)
6. Lewis Ludlow (C) (Gloucester Rugby, uncapped)
7. Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, uncapped)
8. Callum Chick (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)

16. Jamie Blamire (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)
17. Beno Obano (Bath Rugby, 1 cap)
18. Trevor Davison (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)
19. Ted Hill (Worcester Warriors, 1 cap)
20. Lewis Ludlam (Northampton Saints, 8 caps)
21. Dan Robson (Wasps, 12 caps)
22. George Furbank (Northampton Saints, 3 caps)
23. Joe Cokanasiga (Bath Rugby, 9 caps)

SCOTLAND:

15. Damien Hoyland (Edinburgh Rugby)
14. Rufus McLean (Glasgow Warriors)
13. Matt Scott (Leicester Tigers) CAPTAIN
12. Stafford McDowall (Glasgow Warriors)
11. Blair Kinghorn (Edinburgh Rugby)
10. Ross Thompson (Glasgow Warriors)
9. Charlie Shiel (Edinburgh Rugby)

1. Nick Auterac (Northampton Saints)
2. Ewan Ashman (Sale Sharks)
3. Oli Kebble (Glasgow Warrriors)
4. Cameron Henderson (Leicester Tigers)
5. Kiran McDonald (Glasgow Warriors)
6. Josh Bayliss (Bath Rugby)
7. Rory Darge (Glasgow Warriors)
8. Magnus Bradbury (Edinburgh Rugby)

16. Adam McBurney (Ulster Rugby)
17. Robin Hislop (Doncaster Knights)
18. Javan Sebastian (Scarlets)
19. Jamie Hodgson (Edinburgh Rugby)
20. Callum Hunter-Hill (Saracens)
21. Ben Vellacott (Wasps)
22. Adam Hastings (Glasgow Warriors)
23. George Taylor (Edinburgh Rugby)

And now for something completely different.

Does anyone know from an England or Scotland perspective if the players in either the A match or the USA and Canada tests for England and the Romania and Georgia tests for Scotland get paid the same as for the autumn tests or Six Nations?

doctor_grey wrote:And now for something completely different.

Does anyone know from an England or Scotland perspective if the players in either the A match or the USA and Canada tests for England and the Romania and Georgia tests for Scotland get paid the same as for the autumn tests or Six Nations?  

Unsure on the A game but the other two are test matches so should be get the match fee. Don't know whether the players are splitting the match fee amongst the squad like they did in the 6N though.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Manu may well be one of the best in the world when hes fit....but when is that...and when is he actually available for a prolonged period....?
Relying on Manu is utterly futile these days.

I agree Farrell and Slade dont work for me either...i was merely listing them as options we currently have.

Personally I firmly believe the time is now to develop the kids coming through. Lawrence as you say hasnt looked great...maybe these games will be good for him, especially with Smith pulling the strings at 10.

O'Connor might be the one to come in also.

I agree Manu has to be the cherry on top of the cake he can't be relied upon to be a structural element. If he's fit and in form you pick him though.

We do need to have a look at some options this summer though I can't imagine Eddie will deviate much from the system we currently have. We'll have to seem how Umaga, Smith or Simmonds react and adapt.

15. Freddie Steward (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
14. Adam Radwan (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)
13. Ollie Lawrence (Worcester Warriors, 6 caps)
12. Dan Kelly (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
11. Max Malins (Bristol Bears (loan) / Saracens, 7 caps)
10. Jacob Umaga (Wasps, uncapped)
9. Harry Randall (Bristol Bears, uncapped)

1. Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers, 28 caps)
2. Curtis Langdon (Sale Sharks, uncapped)
3. Joe Heyes (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
4. Harry Wells (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
5. Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 21 caps)
6. Lewis Ludlow (C) (Gloucester Rugby, uncapped)
7. Ben Curry (Sale Sharks, uncapped)
8. Callum Chick (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)

FINISHERS​
16. Jamie Blamire (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)
17. Beno Obano (Bath Rugby, 1 cap)
18. Trevor Davison (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)
19. Ted Hill (Worcester Warriors, 1 cap)
20. Lewis Ludlam (Northampton Saints, 8 caps)
21. Dan Robson (Wasps, 12 caps)
22. George Furbank (Northampton Saints, 3 caps)
23. Joe Cokanasiga (Bath Rugby, 9 caps)

As usual, some surprises - Ludlow as Captain is unexpected. Liking that back row and the entire back line.

Could be a high scoring game as there's a LOT of ball players there!

Wheres George martin?

GeordieFalcon wrote:Wheres George martin?

Still finishing the 7th book?

There's a lot to like about that team, backline looks great.

Questions for me is where is Martin, presumably injured and why bother with Ludlow. I suppose it goes back to its a A game and its about capturing people as much as anything.

Only Underhill and Dingwall were counted out for injury.

Strange to have Davison covering TH, thought he was primarily a LH. At least Rodd is not being captured by England against us.

Good side from England. The backline looks well placed to play a faster, more attacking brand of rugby..

Scotland have had a Covid case in camp with 8 close contacts identified. Game is still going ahead.

Interesting its an uncapped game yet it captures players.

Thoughts on Malins on the wing?

As a result of the 9 players being forced to isolate, the following players have entered camp.

TH: Rae
LK: Hunter-Hill
SH: Vellacott
Centres: G Taylor, McDowall

We only had 2 TH's in the squad before-hand so Berghan or Sebastian is out. We also had 4 SH's and 5 locks in the original squad so not a great sign we had to call up Vellacott and Hunter-Hill.

The A sides are the nominated capture team for both England and Scotland

GeordieFalcon wrote:Thoughts on Malins on the wing?

He's looked good for Bristol there recently and scored 3 tries in the semifinals. That said, he isn't a winger.

He's not a full back really either. Destined to be shunted around by club and country but better at that than Daly.

I wonder if Malins had quickly realised that he wouldn't get anywhere at 10 for Saracens so switched to 15 as he had more chances that way?

Is Furbank or Malins the cover for FH in this squad I wonder?

Malins might actually work well in the hybrid wing/FB extra playmaker role.

Interesting that there is no dedicated FH on the subs bench - so if they want to replace Umaga then either Malins moves across (with Big Joe filling in) or Furbank comes in.

I have more faith with Malins covering FH.

Jones has said Furbank is covering fly half not full bacl.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Wheres George martin?

Presumably misses out because Eddie wanted an experienced leader in the backrow. Ludlow is only 26 but has lots of Prem games under his belt and is Gloucester captain and captains the team on Sunday. Ted Hill named as the reserve lock is interesting and Ludlam on the bench suggests England want their forwards to cover a lot of ground and compete at the breakdown.

I like Malins on the wing, he does play it as a hybrid role but it works very well for Bristol as it gives him a freedom to play second playmaker anywhere required in the backline with no responsibility for covering the backfield. Steward is positionally very good so that should help cover Malins and allow the free role.

Good mix in there for England interested to see how they play. There's plenty of pace but enough technical ability and physicality. Can't get much more attacking than Randall and Umaga at 9 and 10.

How confusing is it going to be replacing Ludlow with Ludlam

Oh my god:

BBC Sport wrote:Scotland have lost nine players for Sunday's A international against England after one member of the squad tested positive for Covid-19.

The other eight were close contacts and have been ruled out of the game at Welford Road Stadium, Leicester, because of the need to self-isolate.

Scottish Rugby, who have not identified the player, say the fixture "is still scheduled to go ahead as planned".

However, the announcement of the team has been delayed until Saturday.

Five players have been added as replacements after travel to Leicester was postponed on Thursday.

Joining the squad are Wasps scrum-half Ben Vellacott, Saracens lock Callum Hunter-Hill and Edinburgh centre George Taylor, plus two from Glasgow Warriors - prop D'Arcy Rae and centre Stafford McDowall.

They're actually very good replacements but that's seriously disruptive.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

GeordieFalcon wrote:Wheres George martin?

Presumably misses out because Eddie wanted an experienced leader in the backrow. Ludlow is only 26 but has lots of Prem games under his belt and is Gloucester captain and captains the team on Sunday. Ted Hill named as the reserve lock is interesting and Ludlam on the bench suggests England want their forwards to cover a lot of ground and compete at the breakdown.

I like Malins on the wing, he does play it as a hybrid role but it works very well for Bristol as it gives him a freedom to play second playmaker anywhere required in the backline with no responsibility for covering the backfield. Steward is positionally very good so that should help cover Malins and allow the free role.

Good mix in there for England interested to see how they play. There's plenty of pace but enough technical ability and physicality. Can't get much more attacking than Randall and Umaga at 9 and 10.

Sam, theres a lot of rumours that they want Ted Hill to move to lock permanently...be interesting to see how he starts next season for Wuss...back row or Lock.

GeordieFalcon wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:

GeordieFalcon wrote:Wheres George martin?

Presumably misses out because Eddie wanted an experienced leader in the backrow. Ludlow is only 26 but has lots of Prem games under his belt and is Gloucester captain and captains the team on Sunday. Ted Hill named as the reserve lock is interesting and Ludlam on the bench suggests England want their forwards to cover a lot of ground and compete at the breakdown.

I like Malins on the wing, he does play it as a hybrid role but it works very well for Bristol as it gives him a freedom to play second playmaker anywhere required in the backline with no responsibility for covering the backfield. Steward is positionally very good so that should help cover Malins and allow the free role.

Good mix in there for England interested to see how they play. There's plenty of pace but enough technical ability and physicality. Can't get much more attacking than Randall and Umaga at 9 and 10.

Sam, theres a lot of rumours that they want Ted Hill to move to lock permanently...be interesting to see how he starts next season for Wuss...back row or Lock.

Those were the rumours. Looks like they could be true. Hill did finish the season at lock for Worcester and seemed to maintain most of his loose game.

A bit surprised that Bevan Rodd isn't involved in this game as he's dual qualified. Heyes, Randall, Umaga and Kelly are all dual qualified players that will be tied to England by the selection.

Scotland will potentially tie in Auterac, Ashman, Hislop, Sebastian, Bayliss, Vellacott and Tuipulotu who are all qualified for multiple nations I believe.

It seemed pretty clear from the start that might be a motivation for the returning A-teams though!

Overall I like the England selection. The backline in particular should be a lot of fun. Steward, Radwan and Malins is a cracking back three.

To be completely honest I've always viewed Ludlow as a very good Premiership player but not an international so somewhat surprised he starts and skippers. Hopefully he proves me wrong.

The lock partnership reads a bit like low calorie vanilla ice cream when craving sticky toffee pudding but with the players unavailable that was always likely to be the case. In the circumstances Ewels and Wells are players that shouldn't let us down.

Yeah I can't see the logic of starting Genge in this game, Obano starting and tying in Rodd would have made more sense to me.

Ted Hill was a lock in the age grades if I remember right, he only switched to back row as he broke into the team at Worcester

There is something slightly perverse about watching Eddie pushing various second-rowers into the back-row now doing the reverse to Ted Hill. I have had high hopes for Hill as destructive blindside in the Stephen Ferris mould. I definitely think we miss ballast back there at times.

Mind you, we've got a cadre of quality young locks coming through (assuming they all settle there): Ted Hill, George Martin and Joel Kpoku to line up with old men Itoje, Hill and Ribbands! I was pretty impressed with Alex Groves for the U20s too.

Groves looks a really impressive young lock. Some find for Bristol there. He's got a huge frame to fill out as well.

lostinwales wrote:How confusing is it going to be replacing Ludlow with Ludlam

Not nearly as confusing as having both on the pitch at the same time

king_carlos wrote:Groves looks a really impressive young lock. Some find for Bristol there. He's got a huge frame to fill out as well.

6'8'' (2.03) 118kg's and 'needs to fill out'

lostinwales wrote:

king_carlos wrote:Groves looks a really impressive young lock. Some find for Bristol there. He's got a huge frame to fill out as well.

6'8'' (2.03) 118kg's and 'needs to fill out'

I didn't say he needs to. Just that he surely will. He's 20-years-old and 1 year into his first pro contract. If he doesn't keep putting on weight naturally with that frame then something will have gone wrong with his diet and conditioning. Lawes packed on about a stone in his late twenties!

BamBam wrote:Yeah I can't see the logic of starting Genge in this game, Obano starting and tying in Rodd would have made more sense to me.

Ted Hill was a lock in the age grades if I remember right, he only switched to back row as he broke into the team at Worcester

Genge is in there to provide some leadership and experience, same as Ewels. As much as I like Rodd and think he'll be a very good player he does tend to go backwards at scrum time, he is only 20 after all. Scotland will probably have the best scrum in the three games we'll play.

king_carlos wrote:

lostinwales wrote:

king_carlos wrote:Groves looks a really impressive young lock. Some find for Bristol there. He's got a huge frame to fill out as well.

6'8'' (2.03) 118kg's and 'needs to fill out'

I didn't say he needs to. Just that he surely will. He's 20-years-old and 1 year into his first pro contract. If he doesn't keep putting on weight naturally with that frame then something will have gone wrong with his diet and conditioning. Lawes packed on about a stone in his late twenties!

I'm out of date with qualification given he's been here a year its another 4 now is it before he can be picked for England?

No 7&1/2 wrote:

king_carlos wrote:

lostinwales wrote:

king_carlos wrote:Groves looks a really impressive young lock. Some find for Bristol there. He's got a huge frame to fill out as well.

6'8'' (2.03) 118kg's and 'needs to fill out'

I didn't say he needs to. Just that he surely will. He's 20-years-old and 1 year into his first pro contract. If he doesn't keep putting on weight naturally with that frame then something will have gone wrong with his diet and conditioning. Lawes packed on about a stone in his late twenties!

I'm out of date with qualification given he's been here a year its another 4 now is it before he can be picked for England?

If he's not got English parents or grandparents (not that I like the grandparent rule to be honest) then it's 5 years residency so another 4 after this, yes. I've no idea if he qualifies through ancestry though.

His dad is English born, so qualified from birth.

king_carlos wrote:

lostinwales wrote:

king_carlos wrote:Groves looks a really impressive young lock. Some find for Bristol there. He's got a huge frame to fill out as well.

6'8'' (2.03) 118kg's and 'needs to fill out'

I didn't say he needs to. Just that he surely will. He's 20-years-old and 1 year into his first pro contract. If he doesn't keep putting on weight naturally with that frame then something will have gone wrong with his diet and conditioning. Lawes packed on about a stone in his late twenties!

Sorry I can see how you think I was picking up on your comment. When I wrote it I was thinking of what the commentators were saying during the game.

The Scotland ‘A’ team to face England ‘A’ at Mattioli Woods Welford Road this Sunday (27 June, kick-off 2pm – live on Channel 4) has today been named.

Interim Head Coach Mike Blair selects 17 uncapped players in the matchday 23 as a new-look Scotland squad begin their 2021 Summer Tour with an ‘A’ international at the home of Leicester Tigers.

With nine players isolating following a positive COVID-19 case earlier this week, the newly selected quartet of Stafford McDowall, Callum Hunter-Hill, Ben Vellacott and George Taylor go straight in to the matchday 23.

Leicester Tigers’ centre Matt Scott captains the side on his return to international rugby and his club ground.

Edinburgh Rugby’s Damien Hoyland starts at fullback with clubmate Blair Kinghorn and Glasgow Warrior Rufus McLean named on the wings.

Outside-centre Scott – the most-capped player in the 23 – is paired with Glasgow Warriors’ inside centre McDowall in midfield.

Ross Thompson is handed the No. 10 jersey after recently being named Glasgow Warriors’ Player of the Season, with Edinburgh Rugby‘s Charlie Shiel selected at scrum-half.


Glasgow Warrior Oli Kebble is named at tighthead prop and packs down alongside uncapped duo Ewan Ashman (hooker) and Nick Auterac (loosehead prop) in the front-row.

Locks Cameron Henderson – who also returns to his home ground – and Glasgow Warriors’ Kiran McDonald combine in the second-row.

Edinburgh Rugby No. 8 Magnus Bradbury anchors a back-row that sees Glasgow Warriors’ Rory Darge and Bath’s Josh Bayliss – named vice-captain for this ‘A’ fixture - selected at openside and blindside flanker respectively.

Glasgow Warriors’ stand-off Adam Hastings is the only capped player named among the replacements, with Adam McBurney, Robin Hislop, Javan Sebastian, Jamie Hodgson, Hunter-Hill, Vellacott and Taylor all vying to make their ‘A’ international debuts.

Interim Head Coach Mike Blair, said: “We’ve clearly had a bit of disruption this week, but the medical team and our playing squad have handled the situation extremely professionally.

“It is unfortunately a reminder of the world we’re currently living in and the players are now isolating as per Scottish Government guidelines.

“Despite this, we’ve still had a really good training week, with this young and talented squad maintaining the high standards and levels of enthusiasm that we expect while in Scotland camp.

“As we’ve said all week, we’re treating this ‘A’ game like a Test match, and so the build-up and processes that we go through on a weekly basis have remained the same. We expect our squad to continue that intensity into game day, as this match gives every player an opportunity to prove themselves on the international stage.

“This is a relatively new group of players – especially with Stafford, Callum, Ben and George only just coming in to the squad - however they’ve already shown in a short space of time that they have the ability and attitude to make a statement with their performances.

“The players have put in the hard work and now we look forward to the challenge of taking on a strong England ‘A’ side this Sunday.”



Scotland ‘A’ team to play England ‘A’ at Mattioli Woods Welford Road, Leicester
Sunday 27 June (kick-off 2pm) – live on Channel 4



15. Damien Hoyland (Edinburgh Rugby)

14. Rufus McLean (Glasgow Warriors)
13. Matt Scott (Leicester Tigers) CAPTAIN
12. Stafford McDowall (Glasgow Warriors)
11. Blair Kinghorn (Edinburgh Rugby)

10. Ross Thompson (Glasgow Warriors)
9. Charlie Shiel (Edinburgh Rugby)

1. Nick Auterac (Northampton Saints)
2. Ewan Ashman (Sale Sharks)
3. Oli Kebble (Glasgow Warrriors)
4. Cameron Henderson (Leicester Tigers)
5. Kiran McDonald (Glasgow Warriors)
6. Josh Bayliss (Bath Rugby)
7. Rory Darge (Glasgow Warriors)
8. Magnus Bradbury (Edinburgh Rugby)

Substitutes:

16. Adam McBurney (Ulster Rugby)
17. Robin Hislop (Doncaster Knights)
18. Javan Sebastian (Scarlets)
19. Jamie Hodgson (Edinburgh Rugby)
20. Callum Hunter-Hill (Saracens)
21. Ben Vellacott (Wasps)
22. Adam Hastings (Glasgow Warriors)
23. George Taylor (Edinburgh Rugby)

An important step in building for the future there with that Scottish selection but it could be a long afternoon for them.

Keeble at TH is the interesting pick for me.

It may have been made out of necessity but it is certainly worth trying in any case due to our precarious position with THs.

BigGee wrote:Keeble at TH is the interesting pick for me.

It may have been made out of necessity but it is certainly worth trying in any case due to our precarious position with THs.

He'll definitely get a good examination against Genge

lostinwales wrote:An important step in building for the future there with that Scottish selection but it could be a long afternoon for them.

Always hard to tell with these games, as it is essentially two scratch sides, who have never played together before or will again. There is no form there and it msy just depend on who csn gel in the day.

On paper, the Scottidh pack looks pretty decent, with Henderson, Darge, Baylis and Ashman amo gst the newcomers who will be pushing pretty hard to be in the full squad sooner rather than later.

The backs look a little more thrown together.

Thompson has great promise but Sheil has often struggled to manage a game as a starter for Edinbugh.

The centres are basically 2 hard runners, both solid players but without the x factor.

Back three, all good going forward, but maybe a little less convincing in defence. McLean, if he gets the in any space is extremely quick!

Scott playing against Kelly the youngster he's helped mentor. Wells up against Henderson the youngster he's helped mentor. The Tigers connections are strong at WR tomorrow.

Eddie Jones has ensured three Welsh-qualified players will be captured by England after naming them in the England A team to play Scotland this weekend.

Gloucester's Lewis Ludlow, Bristol's Harry Randall and Leicester Tigers prop Joe Heyes will all finally be officially out of Wales' grasp if they take the field at Welford Road on Sunday as planned.

Eddie

Don't forget Javan Sebastian

mikey_dragon wrote:Eddie Jones has ensured three Welsh-qualified players will be captured by England after naming them in the England A team to play Scotland this weekend.

Gloucester's Lewis Ludlow, Bristol's Harry Randall and Leicester Tigers prop Joe Heyes will all finally be officially out of Wales' grasp if they take the field at Welford Road on Sunday as planned.

Eddie

Or to phrase things differently. Lewis Ludlow, Harry Randall and Joe Heyes have decided they want to play for England and have been selected on merit of good club performances.

Lewis Ludlow is an odd one though, you look at him and you really struggle to see him breaking into a very competitive English back-row.  I guess he's played well for Gloucester this season as you say KC.  It gives hope to other guys playing well in the Premiership.

The other two have genuine long term prospects with England.

king_carlos wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:Eddie Jones has ensured three Welsh-qualified players will be captured by England after naming them in the England A team to play Scotland this weekend.

Gloucester's Lewis Ludlow, Bristol's Harry Randall and Leicester Tigers prop Joe Heyes will all finally be officially out of Wales' grasp if they take the field at Welford Road on Sunday as planned.

Eddie

Or to phrase things differently. Lewis Ludlow, Harry Randall and Joe Heyes have decided they want to play for England and have been selected on merit of good club performances.

Joe Heyes who is only tenuously linked to Wales and whose father that was born there whilst his grandad was working there opted to represent England when given the choice. Heyes likewise considers himself English, there's been rumoured interest before at contract renewal time. If he wanted to play for Wales he would be in Wales and in the Wales squad already.

Randall politely turned down Wales previously didn't he?

Ludlow, erm I can't see Wales calling him up at any point. He's not big enough to move to lock and there's quality Welsh flankers in the Prem that Wales aren't selecting already so Ludlow was never going to get the call from Wales.

Miles behind the quins game so ignoring a lot of comments and clearly don't know the outcomes but has kenningham got a chance this summer. Being excellent up to 43 mins in the quins game and great since replacing the excellent this year Evans.

Kenningham looks a terrific openside. The battle between him and Evans for the Quins 7 shirt will be great to watch.

There's a lot of talent in the back row to fight past though.