Wales International Rugby Summer 23 onwards.

First topic message reminder :

As the pages were going over 20 shortly, I’ve had to start a new thread. This is still the place to discuss the U20s, the women and everything else internationally. Updated RWC 23 squad below.

Forwards (25)

Corey Domachowski (Cardiff Rugby / Caerdydd– uncapped)
Kemsley Mathias (Scarlets – uncapped)
Nicky Smith (Ospreys / Gweilch– 42 caps)
Gareth Thomas (Ospreys /Gweilch – 21 caps)
Elliot Dee (Dragons / Dregiau– 41 caps)
Ryan Elias (Scarlets – 33 caps)
Dewi Lake (Ospreys / Gweilch – 8 caps)
Sam Parry (Ospreys / Gweilch – 5 caps)
Keiron Assiratti (Cardiff Rugby / Caerdydd– uncapped)
Tomas Francis (Ospreys / Gweilch – 71 caps)
Dillon Lewis (Harlequins – 50 caps)
Henry Thomas (Montpellier – uncapped)
Adam Beard (Ospreys / Gweilch– 46 caps)
Ben Carter (Dragons / Dregiau– 9 caps)
Rhys Davies (Ospreys / Gweilch – 2 caps)
Dafydd Jenkins (Exeter Chiefs / Caerwysg – 6 caps)
Will Rowlands (Dragons / Dregiau – 23 caps)
Christ Tshiunza (Exeter Chiefs / Caerwysg – 5 caps)
Teddy Williams (Cardiff Rugby / Caerdydd– uncapped)
Taine Basham (Dragons / Dregiau – 11 caps)
Taulupe Faletau (Cardiff Rugby / Caerdydd – 100 caps)
Dan Lydiate (Dragons / Dregiau – 68 caps)
Jac Morgan (Ospreys / Gweilch – 9 caps)
Tommy Reffell (Leicester Tigers / Caerlŷr– 9 caps)
Aaron Wainwright (Dragons / Dregiau – 37 caps)

Backs (22)

Gareth Davies (Scarlets – 67 caps)
Kieran Hardy (Scarlets – 17 caps)
Tomos Williams (Cardiff Rugby / Caerdydd – 45 caps)
Gareth Anscombe (unattached – 35 caps)
Dan Biggar (Toulon – 107 caps)
Sam Costelow (Scarlets – 2 caps)
Owen Williams (Ospreys / Gweilch – 7 caps)
Mason Grady (Cardiff Rugby / Caerdydd – 2 caps)
Max Llewellyn (Gloucester Rugby / Caerloyw – uncapped)
George North (Ospreys / Gweilch – 113 caps)
Joe Roberts (Scarlets – uncapped)
Nick Tompkins (Saracens – 27 caps)
Johnny Williams (Scarlets – 5 caps)
Keiran Williams (Ospreys / Gweilch – uncapped)
Josh Adams (Cardiff Rugby / Caerdydd – 49 caps)
Alex Cuthbert (Ospreys / Gweilch – 57 caps)
Rio Dyer (Dragons / Dregiau – 7 caps)
Cai Evans (Ospreys/ Gweilch – uncapped)
Leigh Halfpenny (unattached – 99 caps)
Louis Rees-Zammit (Gloucester Rugby / Caerloyw– 25 caps)
Tom Rogers (Scarlets – 2 caps)
Liam Williams (Cardiff Rugby/ Caerdydd – 84 caps)

mikey_dragon wrote:

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:Dropped Rowlands to the bench? Thought he was decent v France. One of the top tacklers with Jenkins I thought?

I would have dropped Adams for Grady.

Glad to see Tomkins and North back. I like that combo and despite his critics North does have a knack for scoring tries.

Those are all bad calls, but I think the worst call is the replacement front-row. The props have been dominated by weakened teams in the URC, whilst Lloyd has 2 minutes of pro rugby experience. Is Gatland trying to get himself sacked? Seems to be a thing where big wigs in the WRU get sacked and then receive a hefty 6 figure payout.

At this point, I'm also wondering if North was pushed into his decision to call it a day? A shame to go out like this, but he's been a fantastic player and ambassador for Wales.

To be honest, he probably knows Wales are on a hiding in the Summer Tour & AI's this season so probably fancies a nice time in France.

A fit and firing George North was a wonderful sight on the pitch.

Come on, it's the WRU we are talking about. They don't engage their brains, and I've seen nothing to convince me they've turned a corner. Another overall review is incoming, the results I'm sure the WRU will sweep under the rug.

Oakdene wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:Dropped Rowlands to the bench? Thought he was decent v France. One of the top tacklers with Jenkins I thought?

I would have dropped Adams for Grady.

Glad to see Tomkins and North back. I like that combo and despite his critics North does have a knack for scoring tries.

Those are all bad calls, but I think the worst call is the replacement front-row. The props have been dominated by weakened teams in the URC, whilst Lloyd has 2 minutes of pro rugby experience. Is Gatland trying to get himself sacked? Seems to be a thing where big wigs in the WRU get sacked and then receive a hefty 6 figure payout.

At this point, I'm also wondering if North was pushed into his decision to call it a day? A shame to go out like this, but he's been a fantastic player and ambassador for Wales.

To be honest, he probably knows Wales are on a hiding in the Summer Tour & AI's this season so probably fancies a nice time in France.

And not the first high profile 'retirement' since Gatland came back either.

mikey_dragon wrote:

Oakdene wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:Dropped Rowlands to the bench? Thought he was decent v France. One of the top tacklers with Jenkins I thought?

I would have dropped Adams for Grady.

Glad to see Tomkins and North back. I like that combo and despite his critics North does have a knack for scoring tries.

Those are all bad calls, but I think the worst call is the replacement front-row. The props have been dominated by weakened teams in the URC, whilst Lloyd has 2 minutes of pro rugby experience. Is Gatland trying to get himself sacked? Seems to be a thing where big wigs in the WRU get sacked and then receive a hefty 6 figure payout.

At this point, I'm also wondering if North was pushed into his decision to call it a day? A shame to go out like this, but he's been a fantastic player and ambassador for Wales.

To be honest, he probably knows Wales are on a hiding in the Summer Tour & AI's this season so probably fancies a nice time in France.

And not the first high profile 'retirement' since Gatland came back either.

Very true.

To be honest, when Gatland was head coach first time around, we beat teams by being fitter & more disciplined but this just doesn't win matches anymore.

Rugby Fan wrote:A fit and firing George North was a wonderful sight on the pitch.

It's a shame to see him retire, but clearly he knows when it's time to go and the frequency with which he picked up head injuries was alarming. I met him at a charity lunch only a year or so into his Wales career. Nice guy - but he was clear even then that he needed to build the skills to have a second career after rugby, probably in speaking or media.

I wish him well (and a decent payday) for his time in France, and a healthy and happy career when he retires in full from playing.

Good result for the U20s, a few hours ago. I was only able to follow it online, but was surprised by the second half turnaround. Good for them to get the BP too.

Not looking forward to getting up off nights and having to endure tomorrow really. I certainly don't see us doing enough to not finish last, but I also feel that Italy probably deserve the win more, after our respective tournaments too.

Just read on the BBC, that Josh Adams was having to get his knees drained before the Six Nations. I guess that goes some way to explaining why he hasn't looked fully fit during the tournament. He must be dreading going back to play on the Arms Park pitch, if he was having that issue.

If that’s the case, I think it’s another reason he perhaps should not have been picked. Hasn’t looked himself all tournament. No tries. No breaks (from memory). Could have started Mason Grady in a few games instead.

U20s were good to watch 2nd half. Realised they had an attacking weapon with their lineout maul and used it to good effect when they had penalties.

This team looks dead, like they’ve given up. Not surprising tbh, that Gatland can do no wrong though.

Meant to ask this last week, but there wasn't really an active topic: how long has Johnathan Davies been insufferable on commentary for? I don't remember him being this bad before. Would like to see Nigel Owens given a chance to see if he can do more than be the 'ref consultant' personally.

This is almost laughable, if I wasn’t Welsh! Never seen such poor play from an international team. Gatland can blame the clubs for ‘not preparing them appropriately’ but he needs to take ownership for the way he play under him. Shocking. He’s had them for 8 weeks or so now. And this is all he can manage?

Lowlandbrit wrote:Meant to ask this last week, but there wasn't really an active topic: how long has Johnathan Davies been insufferable on commentary for? I don't remember him being this bad before. Would like to see Nigel Owens given a chance to see if he can do more than be the 'ref consultant' personally.

To each his own. I like him. I don’t like some others. C’est La vie!

Gatland was clearly past it at Chiefs. WRU were dumb enough to bring him back and make him untouchable, just look at how Walker was fawning over him. Wales have just one win in the last two 6N, that win was against Italy, who we look set to lose to today.

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:

Lowlandbrit wrote:Meant to ask this last week, but there wasn't really an active topic: how long has Johnathan Davies been insufferable on commentary for? I don't remember him being this bad before.

To each his own. I like him. I don’t like some others. C’est La vie!

I think the thing that's doing it is how miserable he sounds this year. Which probably is a fair reaction to how Wales have played really.

Italy will probably be disappointed not to have a bigger lead but a shocking conversion attempt by Garbisi and kicking the ball away when in good attacking positions has likely cost them points.

Having said that Wales looked like they were starting to wake up a bit towards the end of the half so they can still take this as Italy looked like they were trying to be a bit too clever at times and may slip up.

Great first half from Italy. They’re controlling the game magnificently but Wales are struggling to bring anything that looks remotely threatening. Where they may have some luck are the chips over the top. That seems to have worked well but not brought any points. I feel for Welsh fans, this must be tough to watch given where they were as a team a decade ago.

bsando wrote:Great first half from Italy. They’re controlling the game magnificently but Wales are struggling to bring anything that looks remotely threatening. Where they may have some luck are the chips over the top. That seems to have worked well but not brought any points. I feel for Welsh fans, this must be tough to watch given where they were as a team a decade ago.

Not even a decade, Bsando. We’ve won this tournament twice in the last 5 years, believe it or not!

Great try Italy

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:Great try Italy

And another young Italian fullback with real gas. A lot of their back line look like they could still be playing U16s.

Italy haven’t been pushovers for a while. Their U20s continue to improve. Wales is struggling at every level, the future seems bleak.

mikey_dragon wrote:Italy haven’t been pushovers for a while. Their U20s continue to improve. Wales is struggling at every level, the future seems bleak.

Difference could also be the level of coaching. Italy recruited wisely with a coach who'd learned his trade with club sides in multiple countries. Wales panicked and went for a name who's been far from good for several years.

Well, I can’t see any way out of this. 18 points down with 20 mins to go. No way will we score 3 times now.

formerly known as Sam wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:Italy haven’t been pushovers for a while. Their U20s continue to improve. Wales is struggling at every level, the future seems bleak.

Difference could also be the level of coaching. Italy recruited wisely with a coach who'd learned his trade with club sides in multiple countries. Wales panicked and went for a name who's been far from good for several years.

Yeah there’s that. The Italians were also smart enough to realise it all starts with junior rugby - didn’t they bring in Conor O’Shea?

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:Well, I can’t see any way out of this. 18 points down with 20 mins to go. No way will we score 3 times now.

and if we did, wouldn’t we still get the spoon? The whitewash looks on though. Gatland still getting a fat pay cheque.

Sorry but Nigel Owens waste of time. The clash then and he refuses to give opinion and says Jiffy should!

How the hell are the pair of them not going for HIAs?

As harsh as it sounds, the Italian player should have got a yellow there for me.

mountain man wrote:Sorry but Nigel Owens waste of time. The clash then and he refuses to give opinion and says Jiffy should!

I think he was trying to listen to what the officials were saying and trying to get Jiffy shut up jibbering.

He's also pretty one eyed. I know it's heresy to criticise him but he is too biased.

mikey_dragon wrote:

TAFKA The Oracle wrote:Well, I can’t see any way out of this. 18 points down with 20 mins to go. No way will we score 3 times now.

and if we did, wouldn’t we still get the spoon? The whitewash looks on though. Gatland still getting a fat pay cheque.

If we got 4 tires and beat Italy by more than 7 then we’d finish above them. Not going to happen though.

mountain man wrote:He's also pretty one eyed. I know it's heresy to criticise him but he is too biased.

Davies is. I think that Owens is normally pretty good.

He's dropped that.

I don't quite get that call - if the tackle is complete and Italy dragged him over the line doesn't that mean he was holding on? Still it's woken up Wales though.

formerly known as Sam wrote:He's dropped that.

I think he was trying to lay it back as he lunged forward, and the TMO decided he ended up putting on the line, so awarded the try.

Garbisi will be sweating that missed conversion now ...

Oh that's a daft pen to give away

Well Wales used to be the come-back kings but surely that's it now ...

Probably the best performance from Italy in the pro era today. They’ve controlled this game so well.

Italy deserve the win they have been excellent.
Wales I'm afraid bloody awful.

mikey_dragon wrote:Italy haven’t been pushovers for a while. Their U20s continue to improve. Wales is struggling at every level, the future seems bleak.

While Italy will get confidence from this tournament, I think they're getting a lot of credit for being competitive in a very weak year (understandable, post WC). It's good for them to get some wins, but I'm not sure there's that many in this squad that aren't under threat from the next generation. The u20 performances are the real good news for them this year.

bsando wrote:Probably the best performance from Italy in the pro era today. They’ve controlled this game so well.

With respect, I think you have to consider Italy’s performance in the context of Wales’ performance. Wales have been beyond awful. It’s not been difficult for Italy at all. We can’t even catch the ball! So i’m not sure if it’s been their best performance in the pro era. They’ve played much better IMO e.g. against France the other week.

bsando wrote:Probably the best performance from Italy in the pro era today. They’ve controlled this game so well.

I dunno they've good for a while now. Bar Ireland where they were overwhelmed they been right up there with England, Scotland and France. England managed a win, France scrapped a draw but Italy winning any of those three wouldn't have been undeserved.

Wales have been abject. They've got some exciting players but the tactics and execution are awful.

If that's not double movement it's a very good finish from Rowlands.

One of the worst Wales performances I've seen, but those late tries give an illusion of closeness.

formerly known as Sam wrote:If that's not double movement it's a very good finish from Rowlands.

I was a bit sus about that but I think they couldn't be bothered to check as it wasn't going to matter anyway

Another 5 mins and we might have won that!

WTF was the commentator on about when he said Wales could avoid the spoon with a LBP - how could they start behind Italy and end up above them by losing?

Heaf wrote:Well Wales used to be the come-back kings but surely that's it now ...

Almost ...