Haye Wlad Post Fight Reaction

So that's that. I scored the fight 118-109 to wlad, giving haye only the 3rd and the point deduction. Hayes reflexes looked sharp in terms of his upper body movement, however he was unable to overcome klitschkos size and reach advantages. 

I thought wlad boxed a good fight, he dominated aggressively, worked the jab well enough to keep haye at bay but not effectively enough to break him down with it. Landed some good right hands. Haye was a bit too passive, but I think he was surprised at how quick wlad can move, especially moving back out of range of Hayes attacks. Add this to the size disparity and it led to a lot of missed power shots and off balance moments for haye. David also spent too much time complaining to the ref. 

It was the right decision, the better man won and you have to give wlad his credit - he's very difficult to beat, uses his size cleverly and is a fine athlete and worthy champion. 

Wlad by a country mile. Haye should have worked on working the body because Wlad cannot throw decent punches on the inside. What do you think sweetie? you think Haye's game plan was the right one?

I think Haye really was relying on there being a much much bigger difference between the two in terms of speed of hand and foot. But as it was Wlad moved out of harms way quick enough to not be countered easily and his hands were not slower much than Haye's at all. This made it real hard for Haye to land the one big punch he was looking for while spending the entire fight on the run.

This fight reminded me a bit of Hamed v Barrera.

Haye's trouble is he hasn't got sound boxing fundamentals, he's flexible, sharp, unorthodox and very powerful but that isn't enough against someone like Klitschko. He was amateurish at times. Wlad is just the better fighter, end of story.

I disagee with your scoring or ONETWOFOREVER's version of by a country mile - scored it 117-113 for WK - maybe I'm biased [probably?!?!].

Just disappointed that Haye wasn't more aggressive, if it's true what he said about breaking his toe surely it would have been better going on the offensive from the start?

Just hope he pushes for a rematch or looks to fight Vitali before his much vaunted retirement, otherwise he ends up looking pretty stupid.



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Sorry KC I have to disagree with you, I could not see a round where Haye won outright. Even when Haye landed a meaningful punch Wlad would respond straight away.

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:Sorry KC I have to disagree with you, I could not see a round where Haye won outright. Even when Haye landed a meaningful punch Wlad would respond straight away.

Exactly. Plus, Haye did land his Hayemaker at least once and Klitschko took it.

I can't see how or why he derserves a rematch, he'll have to earn it and join the queue at the back.

It is worrying that it is still the closest fight Wlad has had since Peter 1st time.

I can't see how or why he derserves a rematch, he'll have to earn it and join the queue at the back.

SugarRayBray
Posts: 38
Join date: 2011-05-10
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He deserves a rematch purely for the very fact that there isn't anyone else out there that is even likely to draw let alone beat Wlad, with the possible eception of Adamek who is due to fight Vitali in September. Along with the fact that no other fighter currently brings more MONEY to the table.

Nice summary, Sugar Boy. I scored it 118-110 to Klitschko; one round to Haye and two even (including the round in which Klitschko had his point deducted, as I thought he was the better man in that round regardless of that). The rest, all to the Ukranian, and comfortably, too. Can't see how even the biggest Haye fan can give him more than two rounds, really.

Haye's performance, unfortunately, didn't match his talk. No doubt, the injury played a part, but there's no way on God's green earth that a broken toe alone was responsible for the disparity in performance and class that we saw tonight. We knew what Klitschko would do, but in fairness he did it perfectly. Haye was too one-dimensional and, after six or seven rounds, I believe he was fighting only a minor level above survival mode.

A sad way to go out, but Klitschko is just too effective at what he does.

Would add, too, that he in no way deserves an instant rematch, either. Can't actually believe that's being treated as a possibility.

KC wrote:I can't see how or why he derserves a rematch, he'll have to earn it and join the queue at the back.

SugarRayBray
Posts: 38
Join date: 2011-05-10
_____________________________________________________________

He deserves a rematch purely for the very fact that there isn't anyone else out there that is even likely to draw let alone beat Wlad, with the possible eception of Adamek who is due to fight Vitali in September. Along with the fact that no other fighter currently brings more MONEY to the table.

Unfortunatley, he brings nothing to the table now after that performance - not even a belt. He was beaten comprehensively, who would pay to see that again, I certainly wouldn't.

Isn't Valuev mandatory challenger for the WBA belt anyway?

He wasn't exhasuted at the end so he should have thrown more leather and more at a time. There is no point in a handspeed advantage if you only throw two at a time. None at all. For all his power Haye's actual ability to punch correctly went out the window. He slipped punches well but did not have the confidence or the fundamentals to do anything with it.

awful performance from haye. even holyfield would have put in a better effort even close to 50.

looking at the HW scene... apart from adamek making an attempt, cant see anyone close to taking out these brothers.

I'd like to see Foreman and Lewis getting in for a comeback.

I feel the poor excuse that Haye came up with after the fight is disrespectful to Wlad. I thought Haye would win but it was a very subdued performance but I was impressed by David's ability to Wlad's best punches.

Good foot or not, David did not display the boxing ability to leave Wald in a state of shock bit I did think every time he connected properly that Wlad felt his power more than David felt his.

Bottom line the better man won toniught and poor excuses should not have been dished out tonight by Haye. Take your lumps and move on!!

The size difference between the two fighters was remarkable tbh. Haye's method of wild swings trying to catch Klitch with a big "hayemaker" belied his premonitions of a brutal, calculated KO in the early rounds. He never looked like getting near Wlad to land even a proper shot.

Fair play to Wlad though, he showed a true champs performance.

Just watched the first 4 rounds of the fight with the commentary off so I'm not swayed by it and cos Jim Watts voice does my head in.

I actually score it 38-38 after 4 rounds, will watch the rest of the fight when I get a chance later.

Hi Guys......

1st time post on this site...bear with me....

I just want to give my take on the fight

1st..I will never watch any build up/hype/face offs which have anything to do with the current heavyweight division. Boy did I feel let down
2nd ..I will never pay for any current heavyweight box office fight.
3rd..Regarding Haye's delaying tactics at the begginning of the fight...I don't feeel sorry for Klitschko (he shouldn't have everything his own way)...I feel sorry for Lennox Lewis and George Foreman....You don't treat legends of the sport like that..Lennox looked totally uninformed and very uncomfortable...totally disrespectful.
4th..THE FIGHT...Klitschko fought better than I had expected...or was it that Haye fought terribly abliet a broken toe.
5th..THE REFEREE...terrible terrible terrible.....Haye and Booth had a tactic of stopping Klitschko from putting his weight on Haye by simply falling to his knees....I originally thought this was a good tactic....but in the end it was just embarassing.
6th..The Klitschkos bad for boxing??...NAHHHH...bad for heavyweight boxing??...NAHHHH...heavyweight boxing bad??...HELL YEAHHHHHH
7th..Booth is no master technician..infact I had never heard of this guy before Haye came along...but Manny steward didn't even need to break a sweat...I swear i saw him reading a paper with his feet up during the rounds!!!


Sorry about my rant.......but getting ripped off aint fun!

Cheers

I gave Haye rounds 1 & 3. Maybe 11. Certainly no more than that.

I thought it would be a UD, but I was hoping that it would be a bit closer.

Haye was basically just looking to survive, while occasionally lunging forward with a wild swing, desperately hoping to connect... more often than not, Wlad stepped out of the way and Haye ended up on the floor. It was a poor effort - Wlad was almost as quick as Haye, fitter, stronger, and more skillful.

People criticise the Klitschkos (particularly Wlad) for being boring, but I don't agree. While he isn't an all-action fighter, he is an excellent boxer, with superb defence and impressive ring craft. I really believe he'd be a formidable opponent in any era.

I lost a fair bit of money on the fight but credit to Wlad for controlling Haye. One thing for sure, Wlad is one hell of a boring fighter and whether he'll ever be remembered as a true great will be open to debate.

Captain Lucas wrote:whether he'll ever be remembered as a true great will be open to debate.

We'll never know for sure, as there is nobody out there to test him.

First thing's first I am a Haye fan. However, I was impressed with both fighters' chins last night - they each took big hits and for such allegedly "chinny" fighters did not go down. Wlad's right that he caught Haye with would have knocked a lot of heavies down.

Klitschko was the better man on the night and gave Haye a lesson in ring management and overall boxing. Haye was always looking for the power punch that, let's face it, after 5 rounds was never going to connect.

What I am staggered by is that Haye breaks his toe and still goes into the fight. This shows both a lack of respect for Wlad believing he can fight the best heavyweight in the world at less than 100% and also a stupifying amount of self-belief. Self belief was not enough. He should have rescheduled. and taken the flak. Too much hype for to back down though I guess...

I had it 119-110 To WK.

I had rnd three and rnd twelve a 10/10. I Gave haye a 10-9 when WK had a point deduction... and Gave WK a 10-8 when Haye was supposedly knocked down (which should have just been a point deduction for trying to make it look like WK was pushing him down all the time) .. The Rest were 10-9s to WK..

Every time Haye done well in a round WK would just sneak come back at Haye and pull him self back into it working the jab off again.. and I could not really give the round to Haye.

Haye has always fought the same way though, quick bursts in and out with lots of feints and non action in between. Its been said a hundred times before that his punch output is quite low as he doesn't really box conventionally behind any sort of jab at all.

I'm not sure why people think that the Haye approach was a surprise in terms of how often he threw punches, it wasn't a case of running its just what he always does with someone who fights coming forward.

smashingstormcrow wrote:

Captain Lucas wrote:whether he'll ever be remembered as a true great will be open to debate.

We'll never know for sure, as there is nobody out there to test him.

Well it seems he cant win... This was looked at as the biggest heavyweight fight since Lewis v Tyson... because of how competitive it was and how Dangerous Haye was regarded.. Just because WK Out boxed him and won yet again he is still not tested?

Im not sure WK would have stood up against Lewis and a few others, but I think its fair to say as a Heavy Weight he can hold his own and would have given any of the greats and very hard fight.

I also think he did not fight boring this time, He came forward all fight trying to knock David Haye out and allways looked like he might, and it was Haye who was mostly running and not wanting to engage too much.

i didn't think it was quite the one way traffic some are suggesting. I thought WK won about 7 rounds fairly clearly without really dominating any, and 5 were a bit scratchy where neither landed much. In reality WK was coming forward in those so, in vegas its a shut out, anywhere else it would just have been comprehensive! I thought both looked wary of the other's power and while wlad was more aggressive than usual he was wary of letting the right hand go.

Funnily enough, defensively its as good as i've seen haye look, just like many others before him though, he couldn't get to grips offensively. He fought like he did against valuev, it just didn't work against a significantly better fighter.

All credit to wlad... he did what he had to well. And as for the toe excuse, I'm afraid that's what it was, the boy lacks class.

Would our reactions to Haye have been much more generous if he had conducted himself in a more gentlemanly manner during the build up to the fight? All I mean is that if you focus on the fact that basically he was a cruiser taking on the world heavy weight champion his performance doesn't quite seem so bad. Maybe his pre-fight conduct just resulted in raising our expectations, and seemingly raising Vlad's intensity and determination.

LivinginItaly wrote: All I mean is that if you focus on the fact that basically he was a cruiser taking on the world heavy weight champion his performance doesn't quite seem so bad.

He landed less than five punches a round. That is pisspoor by anybody's standards. and probably the least amount of punches landed by a defending world champion over the distance in history.

Holy showed the world the jump from cruiser to heavy is not so great. Maybe he set the bar too high.

LivinginItaly wrote:Would our reactions to Haye have been much more generous if he had conducted himself in a more gentlemanly manner during the build up to the fight? All I mean is that if you focus on the fact that basically he was a cruiser taking on the world heavy weight champion his performance doesn't quite seem so bad. Maybe his pre-fight conduct just resulted in raising our expectations, and seemingly raising Vlad's intensity and determination.

I don't think so. Most people I know or have encountered on here haven't seemed all that worked up by Haye's pre-fight behaviour, even if they did think that some of it was a little over the top.

Sadly, I think Haye's performance was a big disappointment, and should be viewed as such. He more or less went in to survival mode for the second half of the fight. Even allowing for the toe injury, I don't think anyone can deny that Haye was lacking in ideas and adaptability last night. He can make the excuse that he couldn't throw the big right all he likes, but as far as I'm concerned, if the big right is his only weapon (which based on his lacklustre performance and excuse making afterwards, it is) then it merely indicates that he's not a rounded enough or skillful enough fighter to be sharing a ring with Klitschko anyway.

Don't really buy the 'Cruiserweight' argument either, to be honest. Haye's a solid 210 lb, bested the largest and heaviest belt holder the division has ever seen and came in to the bout as the WBA Heavyweight champion. Can't have it both ways. Klitschko is just too good for Haye, it seems.

Haye was never that good. Old man Ruiz gave him problems at times.

He could talk though. He's a con man really.

Many of us felt, going in, that Haye's ' in and out ' stuff wouldn't work against Klitschko, and that proved to be the case.

A puncher such as Haye would need to plant his feet to let the power punches go, which would involve staying in range and relying on text book skills - blocking, ducking, slipping, etc. - to avoid incoming fire. He didn't do it, and Wlad's reach and jab were, predictably, the principle factors in the playing out of the fight.

I think what became clear last night is that WK is much harder to hit than people realise. His step back, lean back with his hands high defence is obviously very effective. If Haye, the fastest HW, can't get close to his chin more than a couple of times over 12 rounds what chance do the rest have.

WK gets nowhere near the credit he deserves. IMO he should be top 3 P4P.

I think that the pre fight expectations Haye created are working against him now. Sure he lost but it was still the closest fight Klitschko has had for 6 years, it just shows how far ahead he is compared to the rest of the division. I hope Haye doesn't retire as he had planned and sticks around to take some more fights at heavyweight, he's still the best of the rest I think.

Haye has lost face, all his talk of the Klitchkos being boring and him 'breaking down' the machine came to nothing last night, broken toe or not. He said pre fight he wasn't going to leave it to the judges so why didn't he just go all out in the early rounds? If he really did have a broken toe and knowing Wlad had the reach and height advantage I really don't understand why Haye didn't just go for it. A spectacular KO would have been less embarrassing than a mediocre points loss. Haye just wasn't proactive enough - he needed to work the body and needed to be busier. I was screaming at the TV at times just wanting Haye to throw something! I couldn't believe how passive he was considering all the hype. It just makes those T-shirts he wore look so ridiculous now. Pity.

IMO Haye and Booth over egged it with all the plan A,B,C and D nonsence, and with how everyone was going to be shocked at his amazing game plan. Haye should have fought his natural fight. He should have gone out there and thrown everything at Wlad in the first few rounds.

extremely disappointed with haye, we all know what wlad was bringing table, and after all the talk david had done i presumed he had a good gameplan as he was so confident. yet all he did was stay in range of the jab all night and let wlad control the ring. he did no different than all of wlads other oppenents

i gave haye round 3 and two even that was it, wlad wasnt doing much but he was the agressor and landing more shots, which was winning rounds quite easily. topof my head i can onlyrecall two significant shots that haye landed.

whining about his toe and the referee just makes him look worse, he was going down easier than a footballer trying to get as much help of the ref as he could. while the "knockdown" was a farce i can see why the ref had enough of him, wlad only had to touch haye and he was down. i would have deducted a point from him.

The idea that Haye's "natural fight" is to throw everything at his opponent for the first three rounds is a bit of a myth tbh. He plans to retire in October - lets look back at his career:

At HW Haye has fought
(Bonin, 34, a man who's career highlight was a loss to Audley)
Barrett (37)
Valuev (36/7)
Ruiz (38)
Harrison (38)
Wlad (L)

He hasn't fought a man younger than 36 in his proper-HW run. Of those that he has fought - none would be really in a top-10 at-the-weight at-the-time. Of them, only Harrison ended in 3 rounds - and there, nothing was thrown/landed for 2 rounds.

Meanwhile Adamek, also CW champion - has moved up and beaten Golota, Estrada, Arreola, Grant, Maddalone, McBride.

Adamek's record is superior to Haye's.

very poor performance, not only tactics, but with haye going down like a football player and complaing to the ref every 2 mintues. i dont think a champion should be on the floor that easy. haye didnt seem interested in attacking wlad, obviously its an easy job to sit here critizing haye for not getting under wlads jab, but it was apparent that he needed a KO to win, and he seemed more concerned about getting through the fight without taking a punch than he did about trying to land combinations or pressing forwards.

credit to Wlad. he made a very good boxer in haye seem very ordinary.

yes im calling haye a very good boxer, he was and still is but cant mix it with the best.

its hatton all over again, was great but not at the level we all hoped he could be.

Well I think we saw the heavyweight division in cardiac arrest. Haye was a pretender if somewhat interesting one. Klitschko did exactly what he does same time every time. The division has been stale for a decade now but I will give Wlad credit as having a style thats hard to beat and that now people should probably accept as "boring but effective".

To Haye, please retire. You have talked your way to a status that you dont deserve and clearly its been hot air. You sold some fights but saviour of boxing?

I don't think Haye was a pretender I think it's very harsh, perhaps he got his tactics wrong but he gave it a lot of effort, he was waiting for Wlad to make mistakes which rarely came and he couldn't captalise on it, really dissapointed David didn't go for it a little more and come on the inside, but I think Wlad really made him struggle and wouldn't allow him in, full credit to them both, it was a decent fight a little dull at times but ok.

Haye wanted it badly but just didn't quite have it in him, there's no shame in that, he genuinely thought he'd win, what's wrong with the belief?

No not tactics for me, he just never went for it and fell to the floor at every opportunity. It was a mismatch. Haye talked alot and has made his money but if this was to be some kind of boxing renaissance?

AlexHuckerby wrote:I don't think Haye was a pretender I think it's very harsh, perhaps he got his tactics wrong but he gave it a lot of effort, he was waiting for Wlad to make mistakes which rarely came and he couldn't captalise on it, really dissapointed David didn't go for it a little more and come on the inside, but I think Wlad really made him struggle and wouldn't allow him in, full credit to them both, it was a decent fight a little dull at times but ok.

Haye wanted it badly but just didn't quite have it in him, there's no shame in that, he genuinely thought he'd win, what's wrong with the belief?

It was shameful and pathetic. I switched it off as soon as he mentioned the lickle boo boo on his toe-y.

Haye is, for my money, the worst belt holder in the history of the sport. He'd be 50-50 against Seldon and Damiani and I'd certainly expect the likes of Bruno, Rahman and Mercer to beat him.

No he thought he'd win as I said, he genuinely believed he had tthe power to hurt Wlad who he thought had a weaker chin than he imagined. What's he done wrong he tried he got in the ring with him and he gave his best, perhaps the performance was lacking but I think he didn't realise as to what a mammoth task it really was.

fearlessBamber wrote:

AlexHuckerby wrote:I don't think Haye was a pretender I think it's very harsh, perhaps he got his tactics wrong but he gave it a lot of effort, he was waiting for Wlad to make mistakes which rarely came and he couldn't captalise on it, really dissapointed David didn't go for it a little more and come on the inside, but I think Wlad really made him struggle and wouldn't allow him in, full credit to them both, it was a decent fight a little dull at times but ok.

Haye wanted it badly but just didn't quite have it in him, there's no shame in that, he genuinely thought he'd win, what's wrong with the belief?

It was shameful and pathetic. I switched it off as soon as he mentioned the lickle boo boo on his toe-y.

Haye is, for my money, the worst belt holder in the history of the sport. He'd be 50-50 against Seldon and Damiani and I'd certainly expect the likes of Bruno, Rahman and Mercer to beat him.

I'd most certainly have to disagree he beat a genuine World title holder in Valuev and beat a two time HW Champ in Ruiz proving most certainly not the worst, he came across someone who has dominated HW Boxing for years, why is it bad that he fell where everyone else has?

Adamek's CV is more impressive than HAye's but having a good CV doesn't really mean you're better, I think Adamek gets beaten by Haye in honesty...
But no one around right now can beat the K bro's, sad but true...

Thought that Haye was slightly dissapointing but didn't realise until around the 5th round that this was too much of an ask for him. As for the toe injury I think he put it out there and gave the excuse because he was a little embarassed after not being able to live up to the talk.

fearlessBamber wrote:

AlexHuckerby wrote:I don't think Haye was a pretender I think it's very harsh, perhaps he got his tactics wrong but he gave it a lot of effort, he was waiting for Wlad to make mistakes which rarely came and he couldn't captalise on it, really dissapointed David didn't go for it a little more and come on the inside, but I think Wlad really made him struggle and wouldn't allow him in, full credit to them both, it was a decent fight a little dull at times but ok.

Haye wanted it badly but just didn't quite have it in him, there's no shame in that, he genuinely thought he'd win, what's wrong with the belief?

It was shameful and pathetic. I switched it off as soon as he mentioned the lickle boo boo on his toe-y.

Haye is, for my money, the worst belt holder in the history of the sport. He'd be 50-50 against Seldon and Damiani and I'd certainly expect the likes of Bruno, Rahman and Mercer to beat him.

This is why you cannot allow personal feelings to cloud your judgement. You come out with gash like this.

oxring wrote:The idea that Haye's "natural fight" is to throw everything at his opponent for the first three rounds is a bit of a myth tbh. He plans to retire in October - lets look back at his career:

At HW Haye has fought
(Bonin, 34, a man who's career highlight was a loss to Audley)
Barrett (37)
Valuev (36/7)
Ruiz (38)
Harrison (38)
Wlad (L)

He hasn't fought a man younger than 36 in his proper-HW run. Of those that he has fought - none would be really in a top-10 at-the-weight at-the-time. Of them, only Harrison ended in 3 rounds - and there, nothing was thrown/landed for 2 rounds.

Meanwhile Adamek, also CW champion - has moved up and beaten Golota, Estrada, Arreola, Grant, Maddalone, McBride.

Adamek's record is superior to Haye's.

In just about every fight pre WK, bar Valuev, Haye has gone after and hurt his opponent early on.

Also disagree about Adamek's record being superior to Haye's. His meaningful fights so far are; a one sided loss to Dawson at LH; a SD over Cunningham at CW; and a MD win over Arreola. Haye at least unified CW and won and defended a title at HW.

Absolute disaster from David Haye last night. After all the hype and build up he's a laughing stock in England now, you don't give it all the mouth like he did and then go out and fight like that. People are saying he's 'brave', I wouldn't even say that, he simply had a disasterous fight where he was beaten by the better fighter on the night.

Wlad is an effective fighter, simple as that really. He relies on his size, and his reach helps him just control fights with his jab, although I think the jab is faster than people give him credit for, although where was the plan to get inside the jab? Booth is portrayed as some kind of genius by the British media, Sky and Adam Booth are the worst for his, always slipping in little refererences about Booth's 'clever game plans', however last night was his biggest challenge as a trainer and he has come up ridiculously short. Surely the first thing you'd plan for when fighting WK is to get out of the way of the jab? Haye was on the end of that jab all fight long. Don't know about others, but for me, the plan for the fight just seemed to be, 'if we're lucky we'll catch him with one of your big right hands, so swing it and see if we can test his dodgy chin'. Haye was inaccurate all night long with his right hand, swinging it and missing WK by miles regularly throughout the fight. And then of course there was this nonsence about his toe after the fight, I for one am not falling for that.

So, at the moment Haye is a laughing stock, but this can change, it depends on whether Haye wants a legacy in boxing or will stick to his word and retire in boxing. There isn't many challenges left out there for Wlad. He could fight Valuev or another fat overweight American, but what's that going to achieve?! Valuev would be one of the most boring fights ever where Wladimir just jabs him all night long to a UD, so despite the easy win he had last night, I'd still say fighting Haye again would be the best option for WK because the of the state of the heavyweight decision, Haye is still the biggest test to the Klitschko dominance regardless of last night's victory. He still obviously dislikes him, and was still saying how he wants to KO Haye, and beating him again would be a complete embarassement for Haye and COMPLETE personal satisfaction for WK. There would be alot of ££££ in a rematch, and despite the fact Haye probably lost fans last night, the casual 'football boxing' fans as I call them would still probably mean a sell out in a big arena.

However, Haye has to focus on the boxing! All the T-Shirt stuff, the I-Phone app, the tweeting, the TV shows, he has got to block all that out and focus ENTIRELY on training and a plan to beat Klitschko... I still like Haye, and I don't want his legacy to be remembered for this embarassing defeat.