England ODI side in India?

After Englands impressive one-day series against India their next challenge is against India in India. A lot of their bid dogs will be back so this will prove to be a tough series for them. What I ask is what would you be your one-day side against India? Here's mine-

1) Alistair Cook (C)
2) Craig Kieswetter (W-K)
3) Kevin Pietersen
4) Jonathan Trott
5) Ravi Bopara
6) Ben Stokes
7) Jonny Bairstow
8) Tim Bresnan
9) Graeme Swann
10) Steve Finn
11) James Anderson

Anderson- 10 overs
Bresnan- 10 overs
Finn- 10 overs
Swann- 10 overs
Stokes- 6 overs
KP- 2 overs
Bopara- 2 overs

Cook
Kies
KP
Trott
Ravi
Bairstow
Bresnan
Swann
Briggs
Finny
Jimmy

Back Ups

Stokes
Buttler
Borthwick
Woakes

Have you forgotten how Jimmy A went round the park during the World Cup.

Plus Stuart Broad is not ruled out of the India series (yet) just the matches v WI.

Stokes unlikely to be able to bowl by then either.

I expect the lineup to look like:

Cook
Kieswetter
Trott
Pietersen
Bell
Bopara
Patel
Bresnan
Broad
Swan
Dernbach

Backup:
Taylor
Bairstow
Briggs/Borthwick
Anderson
Finn

LondonTiger, Broad's predicted to miss the first couple one-dayers.

Did you see Dernbach last night?

Finn has to get in ahead of him.

Liam_Main wrote:LondonTiger, Broad's predicted to miss the first couple one-dayers.

He is out for the whole series.

Source? I've only heard he's out of the first few.

If Dernbach gets picked ahead of Finn then I will stop watching ODI cricket.
It would be an UTTER DISGRACE to pick Dernbach.The bloke is CRAP.

http://www.espncricinfo.com/england-v-india-2011/content/story/532089.html

Dernbach's jobs to bowl well at the death which he's done terribly.

Cook
Kieswetter
Trott
KP (I'd like to see KP come in earlier if a wicket falls in the Powerplay)
Bopara
Bairstow
Buttler
Patel/Borthwick/Rashid - Basically a second spinner, which we will need in India.
Bresnan
Swann
Finn - At least to give him a go. he has been bowling quick in the ODI's.


Bowlers - Finn, Swann, Bresnan (10 each)
Part time options - Patel*, Bopara, KP, Trott

To be honest, I might be a bowler light but I really wanted Buttler in as another hitter on the flat Indian pitches. Don't think it matters who bowls anyway, they will get carted. If MS, and Suresh can get going in England then they will destroy us in India.

Shanky, your tail looks a bit long with Briggs at 9. His batting isn't the best.

Liam, will Stokes be able to bowl by the tour? I haven't heard if his injury will have fully healed.

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:http://www.espncricinfo.com/england-v-india-2011/content/story/532089.html

At the moment the official word from ECB was that he is only out for a couple of weeks. We shall see I guess.

As to Dernbach he has bowled really well at the death in both T20 Internationals he has played, 3 ODIs v Sri Lanka, the ODI v Ireland. Yes he has taken stome stick against India and his yorker was badly targetted - but all the bowlers have taken stick at the end of the innings.

Finn will go, but in subcintinetal conditions I really doubt he would be first choice.

If Broad isn't fit I'd go with Patel, so:

Cook(c)
Kieswetter
Trott
KP/Bell
Bopara
Stokes/Bairstow
Patel
Bresnan
Swann
2 from Anderson/Finn/Dernbach

Is Stokes really a front line spinner? Has he done anything to justify beng picked?
The second spinner remains a problem position for England.

Cook, Keiswetter, Trott, KP is a given
as are Bresnan, Swan and Broad (if fit) and Anderson if not.

That leaves 4 from
Dernbach, woakes, finn, Patel, Bell, Bopara, Stokes, Bairstow with the likes of Buttler Taylor Briggs and Borthwick as replacements.

I dont think Englands support bowlers ( Stokes, KP, Bopara, Trott) are good enough to allow thenm a 4 bowler attack, and you need at least 20 overs of spin in the side so Patel will probably get in the side by default..if they were seriously considering Borthwick in the short term I think he wouldve got a game by now.
Bopara is in a straight fight with Bell for the number 5 slot whilst Morgan is out.
Dernbach has a speacilist bowling role within the unit and offers vairation the other seamers dont, so i think he'll stay.


Keiswetter
Cook
Trott
KP
Bopara
Bairstow
Patel
Bresnan
Swann
2 from broad anderson dernbach depending on fitness

Hoggy I am surprised that you are even considering Dernbach.The guy is a club bowler at best.

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:Hoggy I am surprised that you are even considering Dernbach.The guy is a club bowler at best.

Reckon he's shown enough to remain in the squad for a while at least.
Yes, he got some tap in this series, but he was bowling at the death against some of the best ODI batsmen going.

Hoggy_Bear wrote:

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:Hoggy I am surprised that you are even considering Dernbach.The guy is a club bowler at best.

Reckon he's shown enough to remain in the squad for a while at least. Yes, he got some tap in this series, but he was bowling at the death against some of the best ODI batsmen going.

He has played 78 List A matches and has an economy rate of 6.2.Says it all really.Its hardly a surprise that he has looked so terribly out of depth at this level.

Cook
Kieswetter
Trott(Don't think he can bat anywhere other than at 3)
Pietersen
Bell
Bopara
Patel(Think England would need a 2nd spinner in the sub-continent, and since they don't seem to trust Rashid much, and Briggs is on the lighter side with the bat, Samit Patel will get some more games)
Bresnan
Swann
Anderson
Finn.

If England go the braver route, Bairstow, who really does seem like a superb tallent with particularly good ODI abilities should make it in place of Ian Bell, thereby pushing Bopara up to 5. Or else, they should take the risk of finding at least 10 overs from among Bopara, Pietersen, Trott and Bell? and play Bairstow in place of Samit Patel.
Dernbach may make it to the squad, but as of now, I don't think he's good enough to be a consistent member of the playing XI.
England will certainly miss Eoin Morgan and Stuart Broad.

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:If Dernbach gets picked ahead of Finn then I will stop watching ODI cricket.
It would be an UTTER DISGRACE to pick Dernbach.The bloke is CRAP.

Oh dear what a numpty you are

jimbobgooner wrote:

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:If Dernbach gets picked ahead of Finn then I will stop watching ODI cricket.
It would be an UTTER DISGRACE to pick Dernbach.The bloke is CRAP.

Oh dear what a numpty you are

Look at his career List A record

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Is Stokes really a front line spinner? Has he done anything to justify beng picked?
The second spinner remains a problem position for England.

Cook, Keiswetter, Trott, KP is a given
as are Bresnan, Swan and Broad (if fit) and Anderson if not.

That leaves 4 from
Dernbach, woakes, finn, Patel, Bell, Bopara, Stokes, Bairstow with the likes of Buttler Taylor Briggs and Borthwick as replacements.

I dont think Englands support bowlers ( Stokes, KP, Bopara, Trott) are good enough to allow thenm a 4 bowler attack, and you need at least 20 overs of spin in the side so Patel will probably get in the side by default..if they were seriously considering Borthwick in the short term I think he wouldve got a game by now.
Bopara is in a straight fight with Bell for the number 5 slot whilst Morgan is out.
Dernbach has a speacilist bowling role within the unit and offers vairation the other seamers dont, so i think he'll stay.


Keiswetter
Cook
Trott
KP
Bopara
Bairstow
Patel
Bresnan
Swann
2 from broad anderson dernbach depending on fitness

Stokes isn't a spinner, he bowls medium-pace.

1)Cook
2)Kieswetter
3)Trott
4)KP
5)Ravi Bopara
6)Jonny Bairstow
7)Jos Buttler
8)Graeme Swann
9)Tim Bresan
10)Briggs/Borthwick
11)Anderson/Dernbach

cricketfan90 wrote:1)Cook
2)Kieswetter
3)Trott
4)KP
5)Ravi Bopara
6)Jonny Bairstow
7)Jos Buttler
8)Graeme Swann
9)Tim Bresan
10)Briggs/Borthwick
11)Anderson/Dernbach

Are you expecting Bopara to bowl 10 overs?

no bopara, trott and kp can all chip in

Hoggy_Bear wrote:

cricketfan90 wrote:1)Cook
2)Kieswetter
3)Trott
4)KP
5)Ravi Bopara
6)Jonny Bairstow
7)Jos Buttler
8)Graeme Swann
9)Tim Bresan
10)Briggs/Borthwick
11)Anderson/Dernbach

Are you expecting Bopara to bowl 10 overs?

That's why I have Stokes in my side. Is a far better bowler than Ravi.

That's when he's fit of course.

cricketfan90 wrote:no bopara, trott and kp can all chip in

Very risky IMO.
Bopara is a decent part-timer, but 10 overs from him Trott and KP could be a serious weakness for England.

Briggs has to be given a chance!

Hoggy_Bear wrote:

cricketfan90 wrote:no bopara, trott and kp can all chip in

Very risky IMO.
Bopara is a decent part-timer, but 10 overs from him Trott and KP could be a serious weakness for England.

Hoggy Bear - indeed. Those with longish memories will recall England's ill fated decision to go into a World Cup final with a fifth bowler comprising the lethal combo of Boycott, Gooch and Wayne Larkins. The Windies took them to the cleaners!

Corporal - remembered and agreed.

You need international bowlers to bowl at international batsmen. That's partly why Wayne Larkins doesn't have a World Cup winners medal and has never been heard of by the majority of posters on this site.

Well and good if those bowlers can bat a bit but they have to be bowlers first and foremost.

Cook(c)
Pietersen
Trott
Bell
Bopara
Bairstow(wk)
Patel
Bresnan
Swann
Anderson
Finn

I think its very harsh to drop Kieswetter, but he hasn't scored enough runs to guarantee his place in the team, and I liked what (little) I saw of KP opening in the World Cup. I'm also a huge fan of Bell, and I think if he's given more time he'll crack ODIs like he's cracked tests.

Bell's had enough chances in one-day Cricket. Kieswetter did well against India.

Trott is good enough to bowl at least 5-6 overs in an odi with the keeper standing up, kp can turn the ball a lot, which helps playing in sub contient, and ravi's cutters would be more useful in india.

cricketfan90 wrote:Trott is good enough to bowl at least 5-6 overs in an odi with the keeper standing up, kp can turn the ball a lot, which helps playing in sub contient, and ravi's cutters would be more useful in india.

What makes you feel that mate?

So all those calling for Stokes in ODis are now turning their backs on him after a few matches?

liverbnz wrote:So all those calling for Stokes in ODis are now turning their backs on him after a few matches?

Exactly.Too harsh to drop him after 2 innings although he shouldnt be in the starting XI,he should be in the squad.

liverbnz wrote:So all those calling for Stokes in ODis are now turning their backs on him after a few matches?

Welcome to 606. Bairstow will be hyped to holy hell and back until he next plays now. While Bopara playing several match saving innings is swept under the rug. The new players are always the most popular until they fail.

liverbnz wrote:So all those calling for Stokes in ODis are now turning their backs on him after a few matches?

Exactly, I have in my line-up but no one else seems to, very strange. Especially after only a couple of innings.

cricketfan90 wrote:Trott is good enough to bowl at least 5-6 overs in an odi with the keeper standing up, kp can turn the ball a lot, which helps playing in sub contient, and ravi's cutters would be more useful in india.

I wouldn't bowl all 3 of Trott, Ravi and KP dampens the bowling.

would just like to say, the reason why stokes isnt in my side is because i didnt think he should have been in the side purely as a batsman, pick him when he is fit to bowl as an allrounder. i wanted buttler to play this summer.

A lot of people seem to be ignoring the fact that we will need a second specialist spinner to go with Swann to India, there will be no point in playing 4 seamers and a spinner in India. I'd go as far to say you have 2 seamers (Anderson/Bresnan) with 2 spinners (Swann/Rashid?) and then Bopara and Patel as the 5th bowler. Maybe.

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:

jimbobgooner wrote:

shankythebiggestengfan wrote:If Dernbach gets picked ahead of Finn then I will stop watching ODI cricket.
It would be an UTTER DISGRACE to pick Dernbach.The bloke is CRAP.

Oh dear what a numpty you are

Look at his career List A record

just good to see england no1 in test cricket

Carrotdude wrote:A lot of people seem to be ignoring the fact that we will need a second specialist spinner to go with Swann to India, there will be no point in playing 4 seamers and a spinner in India. I'd go as far to say you have 2 seamers (Anderson/Bresnan) with 2 spinners (Swann/Rashid?) and then Bopara and Patel as the 5th bowler. Maybe.

Rashid is nowhere near the side anymore. Patel is the nearest thing to a speacilist sipinner they have, Borthwick appears to be the other batter spinner whos being groomed. If theres 2 proper spinners in the side i dont see PAtel getting a look in, hes not good enough to pick purely on his batting and if they really need a 3rd spinner Pietersen is an emergency option and there will always be two medium pace options from the batsmen.

i would have trotty 3, on the scorecard, but would be flexible, i would have kp 4, and if kieswetter fell early then i would bring kp up the order to number 3, but if cooky fell i would bring trott in, i hate it when in odi's we have cook and trott together at the crease, cos the scoring rate is so slow.

I think Cook's SR in ODis since early 2010 is over 100 which is kinda remarkable when you consider the doubts people (myself included) had over him becoming ODi captain. Cook and Trott at the crease isn't the worry it was a few months ago. It will be tested more in India where pitches are slower and the outfields much smaller meaning less gaps to find. Something that Trott and to a certain extent, Bell, struggled with this summer.

I think it's also very difficult to be flexible with Trott in the team. He either bats at 3 or doesn't bat at all to my mind.

So many things can happen in a game, sometimes yuou need a guy who can just get runs on the aboard to give you a fighting chance with amodest rather than hopeless total.
Egland are rarely felxible with their order anyway , without the openers batting 30+ overs ( and with Keiswetter thats hugley unlikley) tehre will aleways be a role for Trott to come in. He too has made big scores with and SR over 100 recently, its only the real blasting in the last 10 overs he can never manage.
Cook has defiantly proved the doubters wrong, he can play in different ways according to the situation and whats on. The side has to start with proper batsmen like these otherwise the blasters wont get a chance to dfdo their thing.

its always good in odi's to open with a hitter and someone who can anchor the innings..

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:

Carrotdude wrote:A lot of people seem to be ignoring the fact that we will need a second specialist spinner to go with Swann to India, there will be no point in playing 4 seamers and a spinner in India. I'd go as far to say you have 2 seamers (Anderson/Bresnan) with 2 spinners (Swann/Rashid?) and then Bopara and Patel as the 5th bowler. Maybe.

Rashid is nowhere near the side anymore. Patel is the nearest thing to a speacilist sipinner they have, Borthwick appears to be the other batter spinner whos being groomed. If theres 2 proper spinners in the side i dont see PAtel getting a look in, hes not good enough to pick purely on his batting and if they really need a 3rd spinner Pietersen is an emergency option and there will always be two medium pace options from the batsmen.

I disagree about Patel, I think he could play at 7 as a 3rd spinner and we'll only play 2 seamers as there will be nothing on offer for them so what's the point in playing them just to get tonked? At least the spinners may get some turn and be able to slow the scoring rate. This obviously depends on the pitches but I'm just going by what they are usually like. Maybe this isn't what will happen but it's what I would do although I really don't rate any aspect of Patel's game but he's the best allrounder spinner we currently have available.

Carrotdude wrote:

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:

Carrotdude wrote:A lot of people seem to be ignoring the fact that we will need a second specialist spinner to go with Swann to India, there will be no point in playing 4 seamers and a spinner in India. I'd go as far to say you have 2 seamers (Anderson/Bresnan) with 2 spinners (Swann/Rashid?) and then Bopara and Patel as the 5th bowler. Maybe.

Rashid is nowhere near the side anymore. Patel is the nearest thing to a speacilist sipinner they have, Borthwick appears to be the other batter spinner whos being groomed. If theres 2 proper spinners in the side i dont see PAtel getting a look in, hes not good enough to pick purely on his batting and if they really need a 3rd spinner Pietersen is an emergency option and there will always be two medium pace options from the batsmen.

I disagree about Patel, I think he could play at 7 as a 3rd spinner and we'll only play 2 seamers as there will be nothing on offer for them so what's the point in playing them just to get tonked? At least the spinners may get some turn and be able to slow the scoring rate. This obviously depends on the pitches but I'm just going by what they are usually like. Maybe this isn't what will happen but it's what I would do although I really don't rate any aspect of Patel's game but he's the best allrounder spinner we currently have available.

Danny Briggs?

We need two genuine spinners and if a bowling all-rounder (Borthwick) or batting all-rounder (Patel) isn't needed then Briggs is the perfect option. Left-arm variation is better than Patel's and can spin the bowl more than Patel. Patel isn't needed in England team, Bresnan can easily bat 7 and part timers won't be needed.