Quins

Goodbye Tigers goodbye Sarries, welcome the new Champions, very well done Quins great performance and a thoroughly deserved win!!! Here is to next season, maybe 2 on the trot?

george doors wrote:Goodbye Tigers goodbye Sarries, welcome the new Champions, very well done Quins great performance and a thoroughly deserved win!!! Here is to next season, maybe 2 on the trot?

hehe, well done guys! Hopefully next year we'll be there again and win the damn thing. It's getting a bit annoying going to twickers and losing!

At least you put up a fight when you get there!

Next season is going to be very intriguing and will probably be closer than ever, it will be interesting to see how Quins cope now that they'll be there to be shot down by every side.

Just wait till england get their hands on more of the quins players long enough to ruin them.

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Just wait till england get their hands on more of the quins players long enough to ruin them.

It doesn't seem to have harmed Mike Brown and JTH, and Marler and Robshaw came back better than ever. Lancaster has a background in elite player development, and a similar mindset to Conor. Maybe things will change, but so far there is a nice synergy between the 2012 Quins and the 2012 England.

Tbh now we've won this the next challenge is beating Leinster in the HC final

yappysnap wrote:Tbh now we've won this the next challenge is beating Leinster in the HC final

No. I want them in our group.

I agree with Poorfour. The only way to improve is to play with and against those better than yourself

Not that they are the only team better than us, but they are the best

Beaten Twice by Leinster? Now that's a strange wish to make.

Seriously, Quinns played some intense attacking rugby there, if highlights are to be believed. They play like that or improve on it next year and they'll be a handful for whoever they get in their group.

What has been shown this season I think is that to really challenge for silverware in the long term you have to do it gradually and learn from hard experiences. Leicester pulling their season back together demonstrates years of work. On that basis I'd rather play Leinster and lose and learn how to win the HEC in a few years than get an easy group make a semifinal then bow out to the likes of Biarritz stopping any rugby from being played

Definitely, the same seems to have happened to Saints, getting to the final and then not coming close this season.

I think O'Shea will have it all worked out though and even though we aren't top seeds we should expect to top any group we're in.

Next seasons biggest challenge will be squad management, we really have to sort out who'll cover for Nev and if it is Clegg he has to be given a good run to prove he has the temprement. Other then that it'll be getting a good second choice frontrow working and bringing on an academy lad to take some of the work load off Kohn. Oh and getting the wings to be a bit more clinical and having a plan B to JTH at 12 all season.

Lots to do still, lots to do

Well done Quins yesterday. And thanks again CCC for my free ticket

I went over to the Stoop for post-match drinks, decidedly unwell today

yappysnap wrote:
Next seasons biggest challenge will be squad management, we really have to sort out who'll cover for Nev and if it is Clegg he has to be given a good run to prove he has the temprement. Other then that it'll be getting a good second choice frontrow working and bringing on an academy lad to take some of the work load off Kohn. Oh and getting the wings to be a bit more clinical and having a plan B to JTH at 12 all season.

Lots to do still, lots to do

Hopefully Wallace will get more game time next season. Also I think Quins need an additional line-out option, and maybe Charlie Matthews can supply that otherwise Guest needs to feature more often. Clegg really, really needs game time. At present it's difficult to know how good he is, whilst Burns (who was his rival at age-group) has now progressed to the edge of the senior set-up. An alternative to the JTH approach at 12 is also necessary.

Still, Quins are young and financially stable. They should be able to progress.

Dave M - Cant remember the guys name. But havent Quins just signed a young kiwi that covers 10 and 12? Looks like a good prospect.

Quins

propdavid_london wrote:Dave M - Cant remember the guys name. But havent Quins just signed a young kiwi that covers 10 and 12? Looks like a good prospect.

Its Frano Botica's son and if he has the talent of his old man he really will be a prospect!

Congrats on the win Quins.

Hongkongcherry I agree with that.

Going to be very interesting next season.

Cheers Beshocked

I imagine next season for a lot of the Prem we'll see Clegg at 10 with Botica at 12 to take kicking off his hands and help with some of the management of the backline.

That could work really well especially with Hopper and Chisholm in and around the team as well to add some creativity.

Not sure where that leaves Casson though, it would be unfair for him to be left in the wild after the little game time he has been given.

Yappysnap no worries.

Why would you drop Evans?

who is Botica?

You could give Casson back to us perhaps?

Why would you drop Evans?

Because he's not shown much of his best form since Christmas. The guy plays to much and needs rest in my opinion. I don't think he was fit for the last couple of months of the season.

Winning one title is good but it's winning two that sets a team apart. Sarries couldn't manage it this season when the picked up a couple of injuries and had to split their remaining resources between HEC and AP. There's been some good recruitment this off season by several teams so next year should be very interesting.

Sam I wouldn't say it was just a couple of injuries but if it makes you feel better than by all means. We just don't fanfare our injuries and missing players as much as other clubs.

Sam I wouldn't say it was just a couple of injuries but if it makes you feel better than by all means. We just don't fanfare our injuries and missing players as much as other clubs

Was just making the point winning the second is tougher than winning the first. Yes, it is more than a couple I know the Sarries backrow was decimated by injury. You'll be back next season with more experienced back up flankers challenging your first teamers though. Not sure why it would make me feel better? My team made a mess of their own final, Sarries had nothing to do with it.

Sam exactly injuries and call ups can be a blessing in disguise. It tests your squad depth.

For example Flood's injury gave Ford vital experience in an AP semi and final.

It will be interesting to see how Quins react next season to their strength in depth being tested.

It will also be fascinating to see how the English sides do in the HC.

Ford has really stepped up in the second half of the season and is looking a very tidy young player. Now if we could have only sorted the backs outside him on Saturday...

I think the English teams should do alright in the HEC. The wage cap increase plus the lack of the RWC should see the teams be able to build up some steam and with a decent draw maybe get a couple of teams into the quarters and perhaps a semi final spot. The Ospreys showed Leinster are human after all and that Ospreys team is certainly beatable. As long as luck is good with injuries it should be ok.

I heard the other day that Sarries are planning a Wembley hom,e game for the third round of the AP, provisionally against Leicester. That should be fun.

Yes should be fun but I think the current situation at Saracens in regards to where they'll be playing next season is a bit chaotic.

I worry that the Saracens management don't do enough for the fans.

I worry for our strength in depth- it's pretty good in the back row, back 3 and arguably centres and SH but really lacking in the other positions. Our academy has stepped up before and hopefully can again.

Everyone has their squad weaknesses and you at times just have to trust the younger guys to do a job. It's worked for Quins this season, Sarries did alright out of their young backrowers and Tigers have advanced a very good young set of half backs (jokes will have to be endured mind) of Harrison and Ford.

Quins could certainly do with bringing in some front row cover, then again Sarries wouldn't mind another tighthead and Tigers are looking a tad fragile at hooker. Hopefully all the rubbish about the AP not being good enough will be put to bed after that epic final and we can concentrate on another great season next year (with Tigers winning).

formerly known as Sam wrote: Tigers have advanced a very good young set of half backs (jokes will have to be endured mind) of Harrison and Ford.

Not Young and Youngs then?

Given that both Ford and Flood are likely to spend most of next season having their form and confidence ruined by various England squads what cover do Tigers have at 10? I remeber various rumours of signings (including Gopperth) but my ailing memory fails me, do they have someone coming in?
The depth at 9 is great, Hooker (seriously how much more Chuter?) as you say more of an issue as it has been since the french chap left.

Sam I still ruing the players we let get away IMO - Tongauiha (should have made sure that bloody contract was watertight!), Cole (heard we were looking at him), Gray (how the hell did Sale get him).


I don't know why Quins didn't snap up Ashton, I think he would really suit them. I still feel they need a high profile winger to replace Strettle.

Think Tigers have made very smart signings as usual.

Given that both Ford and Flood are likely to spend most of next season having their form and confidence ruined by various England squads what cover do Tigers have at 10? I remeber various rumours of signings (including Gopperth) but my ailing memory fails me, do they have someone coming in?

Dan Bowden will be filling the role of 10/12 cover held this season by Billy.

The depth at 9 is great, Hooker (seriously how much more Chuter?) as you say more of an issue as it has been since the french chap left.

Ah, Ben Kayser. We took him as an average hooker with prospects and turned him into a very good all rounder. He got some international caps and was told he needed to move back to France to fullfill those international ambitions. What a waste the two years at Stade, 1 year at Castres have been. No more caps and only now when at Clermont is he back in the running. I bet the wages were pretty sensational though. Step up Tom Youngs otherwise we be in deep trouble next season.

Sam I still ruing the players we let get away IMO - Tongauiha (should have made sure that bloody contract was watertight!), Cole (heard we were looking at him), Gray (how the hell did Sale get him).

Gray to Sale blindsided everyone. I can't believe neither Sarries nor Bath made a big money move for him, he'd have been a beast in both packs. Cole was always going to be a tough signing as he is a proper Leicester Tigers boy (born across the road from the ground and lives close to the training ground). Tongahuia would have been a great Sarries signing but I think a tighthead is a more pressing issue with Nieto not getting any younger.

nathan wrote:

george doors wrote:Goodbye Tigers goodbye Sarries, welcome the new Champions, very well done Quins great performance and a thoroughly deserved win!!! Here is to next season, maybe 2 on the trot?

hehe, well done guys! Hopefully next year we'll be there again and win the damn thing. It's getting a bit annoying going to twickers and losing!

It's worse when you actually finish top.

Evans just needs to be rested more often, he's not getting any younger and gets targetted a heck of a lot. Clegg is seriously hit and miss and needs a good run of games to actually try and get some sort of form together.

I want us to be more like the Irish and just save some big name players for key matches then use the academy for simpler games.

I'm already excited about next seasons matches, especially how all the Eng clubs go in Europe. With a bit of luck we should be able to get at least three teams in to the knock outs.

Oh and do we think Saracens will give in and play a running game more often next season now that they're safety first approach failed?

Depends on how Sarries signings go Yappy. If they still lack a natural 13 next season and Farrell plays there then they'll probably limit their free flowing stuff to the counter attacks by Goode and Ashton. If Tomkins comes in and does good things then the midfield and the back three might well start to gell nicely. Whether they go Hodgson or Farrell for the big games will be interesting with both inter-changing for the regular games.

Yappysnap to be honest I don't know but I hope a more expansive style is explored.

Sam I like to think the Saracens management aren't foolish enough to continue to persist with the likes of Farrell and Wyles at 13.

Tomkins is a good mate of Ashton's allegedly so I can see both of them linking up in attack.

Sam Stanley is probably like to be tried out too.

There's also still Powell and Ratuvou who could have a say.

The good thing for these guys is that they'll be involved in pre season.

Might take a little while for the combinations to gel as the likes of Strettle,Ashton,Farrell,Hodgson,Barritt etc are on the South African tour.

Not sure what happened to Powell he seems to have fallen fully out of favour with Sarries, bit suprised that he's staying to be honest as Sarries must be up to the cap and they could get rid of him to fund a signing elsewhere. Powell can't be happy with his role in the team reduced from first team regular to squad backup. Ratavou could be a good option but he hasn't been seen much this season, was he injured?

Surely Tomkins is the big one, an expensive acquisition from RL where he has a decent reputation. He should have the skillset once he finishes adapting. Then again the same was said of Lee Smith the Leeds Rhinos full back when he went to Wasps.

Hats off to C O Sea.

I'd like to see Tomkins given a chance. For me he has the most potential and if he isn't doing well then Powell should come back in to the fold. (Didn't he fall out with the coaches though?)

As to the rest of the backline, Farrel has to be at 10, if there is an injury to Barritt then maybe play him at 12 but you have to keep forcing him to pass a bit more so he gets his confidence levels up.

Hodgson can do a job off the bench but Farrel is the future and needs to be invested in.

beshocked wrote:Yappysnap to be honest I don't know but I hope a more expansive style is explored.

Sam I like to think the Saracens management aren't foolish enough to continue to persist with the likes of Farrell and Wyles at 13.

Tomkins is a good mate of Ashton's allegedly so I can see both of them linking up in attack.

Sam Stanley is probably like to be tried out too.

Might take a little while for the combinations to gel as the likes of Strettle,Ashton,Farrell,Hodgson,Barritt etc are on the South African tour.

I thought Stanley looked sensational before his really nasty injury.

I really do think Sarries should consider moving Goode up the pitch. He's playing brilliantly at FB, but he can pass, step, run and kick and frankly Sarries need some of that in midfield. I've thought for a while he could do a job at 12, but perhaps 13, with the added space could work too.

I've thought for a while he could do a job at 12, but perhaps 13, with the added space could work too.

I did wonder why they didn't do that in the play off semi. They needed some spark in the midfield when they were chasing the game and they could have shifted Farrell to 15 where his boot and defence would have given them good security at the back. I think Goode is a bit like Geordan Murphy in that he is just a very talented all round footballer and it's tough to know where to put him to get the best out of him. Murphy ended up going to full back because there is next to nothing on him but Goode has a bit more bulk to him so there is more options for him.

Could Goode be trialled at 10 again? Maybe as the long term alternative to Farrell? He would bring a different style to the team and could replace Hodgson

I think he is wasted at 10 Yappy. He works better when attacking gaps and utilising space, reminds me of JOC in that he is brilliantly creative but slightly stifled when forced to play that close to the breakdown.

May be true there Sam, it was good to see him stretch his legs on Sun though.

I just think he isn't best at fb

I think he could be an outstanding full back if used differently by Sarries. In the first half of the AP semi final Sarries looked very threatening with Goode coming into the line as an additional play maker and he set up two promising attacks, including Strettle's near miss. If he is utilised in that more Geordan Murphy style role (ironic as Tigers tried to sign him a few years ago as an understudy to Murphy) with Goode offering a play making option on the blindside or outwide to link play to the backthree and stretch the opposition defence then a lot of damage could be done.

At the minute he is just to confined to counter attack plays from wayward kicks which has been Sarries best method of attack for the last two seasons. If they get him involved more he'll get a lot of England caps and Sarries will look more potent in attack.

Just noticed Leicester have re-signed Matt Cornwell from Italy too as Fly half and back three cover.

looks like he'll be fourth choice for you guys so maybe on the bench during internationals.

Have we signed another tight forward yet?

Just noticed Leicester have re-signed Matt Cornwell from Italy too as Fly half and back three cover.

looks like he'll be fourth choice for you guys so maybe on the bench during internationals.

Good to see him back at the club, a proper Leicester boy (born and raised) who has done an awful lot for the Matt Hampson foundation. England under 20s captain and IC has become a 10 in Italy and was nominated for the player of the year award. Will cover 10,12,13,15 next year as a squad player, he's a good footballer but was never powerful or fast enough for the top level.

Have we signed another tight forward yet?

I'm sure O'Shea is scouring the land.