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Is Martinez ripe for the picking?

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John Bloody Wayne
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Is Martinez ripe for the picking? Empty Is Martinez ripe for the picking?

Post by Seanusarrilius Thu 07 Feb 2013, 2:06 pm

Personally, I think he is. 37 years of age and starting to show the natural wear and tear you would expect. Coming off an injury and a fighter that relies heavily on reflexes, he is ripe for the picking. I also feel like he is a small MW, always has been. So, does Murray have the talent to take advantage of it? Probably not, but he should be able to stick around for a respectable UD loss.

On another note, I no longer think Martinez is top at MW. Golovkin KO's him for me. Just can't see how Martinez stays away from him all night.

Who do you see as top of the pile in the MW division and can Martin Murray take advantage of an ageing Sergio and pull off the upset.

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Post by WHU_Champo_League_in_7Yrs Thu 07 Feb 2013, 2:15 pm

Lets wait untill he fights to see if he has aged

His last performance vs Chavez was one of his best and barring an almost catastrophic 12th round he never looked like an old man

The injuries may hurt his body as he had a bad knee injury and it can take it out of you when your at that age but I doubt he will have completely faded from the Chavez fight


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Post by Seanusarrilius Thu 07 Feb 2013, 2:18 pm

He did gas in the Chavez fight tho, and it isn't like Chavez put educated pressure on him. If Murray really really works on his stamina and can up his workrate then he could cause Sergio some issues. I don't think Murray has the talent, sadly.

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Post by JabMachineMK2 Thu 07 Feb 2013, 2:25 pm

I am an absolutely massive fan of Martinez. By some distance my favorite boxer at the moment. Boxing myself, I can't help but be in awe of the man. His ability is fantastic, the hands low, the fact he throws so fast and so hard - for most of the Chavez fight he was bullying a much bigger man around the ring - his jab starts low and sets up for him to throw the straight and land in bunches, this is a man who as you say Sean is 37 years old - but he fights like a man much younger.

He went down in the Chavez fight (who is nothing like his old man by the way) but showed an absolutely incredible fortitude by getting up and finishing the fight. His body punches would have destroyed any other middleweight, just look at Chavez wince when we're in round 9+ the only reason he stood was a higher weight than normal for a middleweight on fight night.

Golovkin is a phenomenal power puncher, but still I feel not good enough to beat Martinez. He's still fast, and still can be elusive (barring sticking his head in the way of Chavez punches towards the end. We only have to look at the Pavlik fight for how good this guy is. I can't see Martinez allowing Golovkin to keep any sort of workrate up. We also have no idea how he'd cope if tagged, he's faced nobody barring Proksa who can really bang. The fact is, Martinez will hit him, hard. And he's a soutpaw - something that mixes it up for Gennadiy.

Martinez is top of the pile at MW and will be for a while until Golovkin proves himself against a known top class opponent. Geale is Martinez' biggest threat right now, and one not likely to go away. He's the most likely to beat him.

I like Murray, I've met him a few times (he's from Sunt 'Elens) and while being talented, he's just not got enough to beat Martinez. Late stoppage or wide UD I think for Martinez.

Martinez is a breath of fresh air for boxing, he'll fight anyone, anywhere and he has that warrior spirit and he's EXCITING.

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Post by John Bloody Wayne Thu 07 Feb 2013, 3:57 pm

I doubt the southpaw factor would trouble GGG. The only times I can recall him facing southpaws was as an amateur, when he pole axed Lucien Bute and outpointed the occasional lefty, Dirrel.

It's very easy to imagine Martinez being particularly vulnerable in the late rounds, more so as time goes on. His stamina won't get better, and it's easier to gas against bigger foes. Martinez is naturally smaller than all the top 160 pounders apart from maybe Golovkin.

With this in mind I think a Chavez jr rematch is likely. They want Jr to be a massive attraction, and that will be easier if he erases the defeat to Sergio. Presuming he can still make 160, a vulnerable performance from Maravilla against Murray would be enough to convince them to throw loads of money at him to face Chavez Jr again. They know he's not got time left to make his fortune and retire on it.

Chavez isn't going to transform into a well rounded boxer by the end of 2013 though, and he took his puncher's chance in round 12 but couldn't finish it. Martinez would have to regress massively to go from winning a 118-109 to losing.

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Post by Seanusarrilius Thu 07 Feb 2013, 4:10 pm

I would be interested to see how much the pasting Martinez put on Junior had diminished him. I mean, Chavez jr trades almost exclusively on his resilience. Another fight where, win or lose, Martinez peppers Chavez jr until the fight ends, might be career shortening.

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Post by JabMachineMK2 Thu 07 Feb 2013, 4:21 pm

Martinez has a penchant for long fights Sean, especially over the last 3/4 years - late KO's and decisions barring Williams, he's just a relentless puncher. He gassed against Chavez, but the man at his age has incredible conditioning. He seems to be getting better with age.

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Post by Adam D Thu 07 Feb 2013, 4:22 pm

Did any of you listen to the Martin Murray interview? Made some interesting points about how he is training for it.

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Post by WHU_Champo_League_in_7Yrs Thu 07 Feb 2013, 5:00 pm

He was getting better with age but he passive showings agaisnt the 2 Brits and the near catastrophic end in the 12th show that he isn't getting better anymore

Golovkin may not be as big as Chavez but I'm sure he is as durable and has as good a chin as well as better conditioning, more power and better boxing skills. He may have only had a short career as a pro but hasn't been dropped or hurt once (Proska hold a a decent dig too), I don't think he has ever been down as an amateur (over 400 fights) and regularly spars light heavies and cruisers and they say he comes out the better despite being an average sized middleweight

Martinez has been in a lot if long fights and generally finishes well but at his age having long fights take longer and longe rot recover from

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Post by eddyfightfan Thu 07 Feb 2013, 5:07 pm

i dont think golovkin is more durable than chavez jr, he doesn't get hit nowhere near as often as he has much better defense, but i dont think many middleweights would take such a one sided beating for 11 rounds like chavez did, and also power wise there isnt much in it, but as golovkin lands much more frequently than chavez, who takes rounds off and waits for his turn. golovkin is better than him in every other respect, but martinez still have the skills to win him.

golovkin vs chavez jr would be a fight i'd like to see if one with martinez (against golovkin) couldnt be made

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Post by AlexHuckerby Thu 07 Feb 2013, 5:31 pm

You know I rewatched the Martinez Chavez fight and it did get me thinking a few points:

Martinez is slick but not particularly great defensively, good head movement etc. but mainly works his defence off of being in and out of range, it did suprise me that given the skill and speed difference that Chavez actually landed 50% of his power punches... His last 3 opponents were able to land an average of 42% power punches before that. We would also guess that Golovkin is a better offensive fighter than his last few opponents and has the power to kill a horse, so although I think Martinez can run around him for a long time outboxing him its a given he will get tagged and I don't think many MW's are up for taking GGG's shots.

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Post by Seanusarrilius Thu 07 Feb 2013, 5:36 pm

AlexHuckerby wrote:You know I rewatched the Martinez Chavez fight and it did get me thinking a few points:

Martinez is slick but not particularly great defensively, good head movement etc. but mainly works his defence off of being in and out of range, it did suprise me that given the skill and speed difference that Chavez actually landed 50% of his power punches... His last 3 opponents were able to land an average of 42% power punches before that. We would also guess that Golovkin is a better offensive fighter than his last few opponents and has the power to kill a horse, so although I think Martinez can run around him for a long time outboxing him its a given he will get tagged and I don't think many MW's are up for taking GGG's shots.

Golovkin would make mince meat of most people he landed 50% of his power punches on. Also, Willaims and Pavlik put Martinez down. I just don't think Martinez would be able to stay away from GGG for 12 rounds.

Golovkin KO 11

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Post by eddyfightfan Thu 07 Feb 2013, 5:40 pm

although he hasnt really shown it recently, martinez is more than capable of putting golovkin to sleep el a paul williams, and golovkin himself lacks head movement, and takes a few digs. a great fight but martinez's experience against top class opposition means he has to go in as favourite for me.

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Post by Seanusarrilius Thu 07 Feb 2013, 5:46 pm

sounds like a fight we should see and find out Smile

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Post by AlexHuckerby Thu 07 Feb 2013, 5:55 pm

The thing is Golovkin has yet to step up and face a genuine world class MW. The thing that you tend to find with these "destroyers" at the weight, there's always a couple of questions that are hanging about, like Golovkins lack of head movement and slightly leaky defense, that are clearly glaring flaws, but because of the fact they blow away pretty average opposition away with consumate ease due to there power they look virtually unbeatable. I think Golovkin has the potential to be great but there's just that defence and no head movement that just makes me think someone will expose such a glaring leak in his arsenal.

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Post by eddyfightfan Thu 07 Feb 2013, 5:56 pm

i think they never meet unfortunately, both at opposite ends of their careers with plenty of other options, but you never know and fingers crossed

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Post by Seanusarrilius Thu 07 Feb 2013, 5:57 pm

Agreed about his lack of head movement, Alex. And he lacks a signature win. But, he does have a hell of an amateur record, so we know he is class. Just want to see someone of note in there with him

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Post by AlexHuckerby Thu 07 Feb 2013, 6:06 pm

eddyfightfan wrote:i think they never meet unfortunately, both at opposite ends of their careers with plenty of other options, but you never know and fingers crossed

I agree, I look at it like Floyd is looking at Martinez, too big a risk with not financial incentive to gain, when Floyd can fight real Welters who can't touch him and make more money doing so and Martinez can end off with a Mexican who he beat up for 11 rounds.

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Post by WHU_Champo_League_in_7Yrs Thu 07 Feb 2013, 9:06 pm

Might not have great head movement but blocks alot of shots on his gloves like he probably learnt to do so in the amateurs

Martinez has clocked over 50 fights, most of them going quite long like his last few so he could age overnight and his style is all about speed, stamina and reflexes so even more likely to age overnight

Murray isn't good enough to beat him but if he has slipped substancially then there may be a couple who beat him

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Post by Imperial Ghosty Thu 07 Feb 2013, 9:13 pm

An amateur record means very very little, he's being hyped to a ridiculous level and people need to calm down when they say he's already the top dog, his best win is a former Kerry Hope victim.

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Post by JabMachineMK2 Thu 07 Feb 2013, 9:32 pm

Why is Geale not being mentioned?

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Post by AlexHuckerby Thu 07 Feb 2013, 9:44 pm

Pirog supposedly wants Gennady, but GGG is fighting Ishida next, so it seems it may take a while before we see him in with someone good.

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Post by AlexHuckerby Fri 08 Feb 2013, 12:16 am

JabMachineMK2 wrote:Why is Geale not being mentioned?

Geale moved heaven and earth not to fight GGG

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