back row for the lions

First topic message reminder :

Is it just me or does the back row selection for the lions the hardest postions to pick, even with the injured players.

Robshaw
Sean O'Brian
Sam Warburton
Tipric
Tom wood
Steven Ferris
Kelly brown
Jonnie Beattie
toby faletau
Dan lydiate
Jamie heaslip

Any others I have missed and add your opinions for and you they should be picked and shouldn't

welshboii15 wrote:I know Ferris and Dan are injured but if they come back and show some real good form for their clubs I really think they could scrape onto the plane Evan though club level isn't international

I think if this is the case then the same could also be said of Croft as well

If we are able to play a very physical game that has two hampering results on any scavenger:

1) they are on the back foot and slower to the breakdown
2) They get knocked off the ball.


alos no scavenger arrives first at each breakdown to steal the ball. at best they get to about 1 in 2. If you have a team of people who are good at the breakdown then the first man there does their job.


Pocock is not some demigod who has by force of performance carried his teams to glory. He is, rather, an excellent scavenger and a very good player.

[quote="thomh"]LordDowlais

They're both playing well and if Ryan Jones puts in a big performance in a Wales win over England then it will make it an interesting call - but at the moment Robshaw is ahead. Two MOTM performances in a row captaining the form side in the tournament.

Robshaw seems to get MOM just for turning up. Tuilagi was clearly MOM on Saturday. The campaign behind Robshaw continues, the power of the English media to influence is winning the debate in the race to Lions captaincy.

Gatland is a awkward cus, let's hope that he sees through the BS. Robshaw, decent player, pretty ordinary captain.

[quote="dragonbreath"]

thomh wrote:LordDowlais

They're both playing well and if Ryan Jones puts in a big performance in a Wales win over England then it will make it an interesting call - but at the moment Robshaw is ahead. Two MOTM performances in a row captaining the form side in the tournament.

Robshaw seems to get MOM just for turning up. Tuilagi was clearly MOM on Saturday. The campaign behind Robshaw continues, the power of the English media to influence is winning the debate in the race to Lions captaincy.

Gatland is a awkward cus, let's hope that he sees through the BS. Robshaw, decent player, pretty ordinary captain.

Absolute nonsense. I don't normally agree with Jereme Gusset but he hit the nail on the head on Sunday in the BBC rugby forum. Robashw is a grafter, he mops up all the terrible slow ball, makes his tackles, forces penalties and leads by example. He is a player who doesn't have the X-Factor but makes up for it by making very few mistakes. He is also a really likable guy.

I don't get this idea that Robshaw is not a specialist 7 - he's played there most of the time for the last 4 seasons for Quins and all his England career. He's the same height as Warburton and McCaw and about 5kg heavier, so not a huge difference, and he's a real powerhouse at the breakdown (especially recently operating in tandem with Wood).

Oh, and his stats for the France game were 9 tackles made, none missed, and 15 carries for 30m, almost all of which was in the tight where making a metre is really hard work. In a tough game, especially when we were under the cosh in the first half, he was outstanding.

At the moment I like the idea of Robshaw at 7 with SOB at 6 (to offer a big carrying threat and big hitting). 8 is the position that seems really open at the moment.

dragonbreath wrote:

thomh wrote:LordDowlais

They're both playing well and if Ryan Jones puts in a big performance in a Wales win over England then it will make it an interesting call - but at the moment Robshaw is ahead. Two MOTM performances in a row captaining the form side in the tournament.

Robshaw seems to get MOM just for turning up. Tuilagi was clearly MOM on Saturday. The campaign behind Robshaw continues, the power of the English media to influence is winning the debate in the race to Lions captaincy.

Gatland is a awkward cus, let's hope that he sees through the BS. Robshaw, decent player, pretty ordinary captain.

I fixed your quote for you. Other than one controversial decision against South Africa do you have anything to back up the "pretty ordinary captain" comment at all?

dummy_half wrote:
At the moment I like the idea of Robshaw at 7 with SOB at 6 (to offer a big carrying threat and big hitting). 8 is the position that seems really open at the moment.

Agree, though am I right in thinking that SOB can also play 8? He's definitely got the carrying game for it. Perhaps if he played there then Wood could come in at 6.

LondonTiger wrote:Why do we get so worked up about what Pocock (or Hooper or ....whoever plays at 7) can do. If we can dictate the play his strengths over the ball at the breakdown can be completely negated.

Rather than moaning we do not have a 7 that can do what Pocock does, glory that we have 7s and back row players who can do things he cannot.

The idea that the breakdown is a one man contest is pretty ridiculous. Pocock can't be at every ruck, and no one Lions player can be there to clear him out of every ruck that he does contest.

thomh wrote:

dummy_half wrote:
At the moment I like the idea of Robshaw at 7 with SOB at 6 (to offer a big carrying threat and big hitting). 8 is the position that seems really open at the moment.

Agree, though am I right in thinking that SOB can also play 8? He's definitely got the carrying game for it. Perhaps if he played there then Wood could come in at 6.

Might work, as we'd clearly want to pick someone who wins lineout ball (both Robshaw and SOB are relative short-harrises for modern forwards). I thought though the consensus from the Irish fans was that 8 was SOBs least effective position.

Robshaw, Wood, SOB, and Brown are in great form at present and are all travelling IMHO.

As for back row to face Aus, right now there are too many options, and too many varied options. Robshaw is standout and right now he has to play, I'd rather not have him as 7, and think he's a better 6, but we have no standout 7's right now.

Similar to 8, Falatau and Heaslip are going ok, but not really standout, and SOB goes quiet in an 8 shirt for some reason!

I think Toby faletau is a fir sure at number 8 he never has a bad game, never takes a back step, turns ball over puts his hits in. I think with him and robshaw you can have SOB at 6 but I think with someone like lydiate at 6 so he cam chop everyone down so robshaw can take take pockock out of the game and fatetau to carry or wood at 6 to steal the ball SOB at 7 to carry and Toby at 8

welshboii15 wrote:I think Toby faletau is a fir sure at number 8 he never has a bad game, never takes a back step, turns ball over puts his hits in. I think with him and robshaw you can have SOB at 6 but I think with someone like lydiate at 6 so he cam chop everyone down so robshaw can take take pockock out of the game and fatetau to carry or wood at 6 to steal the ball SOB at 7 to carry and Toby at 8

Lydiate is not even in the equation. I really wish people would stop talking about him. If by some Miracle he is back in time for some 6N rugby he has to displace Ryan Jones who is playing really well.

If he Can't he will have to rely on his games for the Dragons to stake his claim.

Gatland has already said the 6N is the tournament to put your hand up for selection.

Time to face facts.... Lydiate ain't going! Especially when Brown, Wood, Jones, POM are all playing well.

POM? Really???

thebluesmancometh wrote:POM? Really???

He is certainly playing better than Lydiate at the moment.

Dan lydiate as long as he's fit is simply better that all of them simple that's why as long as hes fit gatland will take him. There's no one in the six nations that can compete with him as a tackling machine, plus hes back in training with the welsh squard so enough said

dragonbreath wrote:Robshaw seems to get MOM just for turning up. Tuilagi was clearly MOM on Saturday.

No, Louis Picamoles was clearly MOM on Saturday.

LordDowlais wrote:Also, I think Sam Lewis of the Dragons could be the uncapped bolter who tours with the Lions, Gatland knows him and he is a very good player and he should be in the Wales team now if you ask me.

Do you mean Lewis Evans?

If we're taking 7 I'd take Wood, Robshaw, Jones, O'Brien, Faletau, Warburton and Beattie. You can pick purely on form and drop Warburton but if he gets some game time then without the captaincy to take the pressure off I think he will improve... and at his best he's the best openside we have.

I like the look of Wood, Robshaw and Beattie as a combo. O'Brien would be an excellent guy to come off the bench... he would have solid impact and can play 6 or 7.

Against the Aussies direct style around the loose, you are going to need an openside flanker who not only has clearly overcome the "Pocock Effect" in the past but can provide a link between his fellow forwards and the backs.

A fit Ross Rennie achieved that, and I see Tuperic very much in that mould as well, in my mind Warburton didnt quite do that for Wales against Oz.

If match fit and well, I would select

6 Ryan Jones or Dan Lydiate
7 Ross Rennie
8 Ben Morgan

welshboii15 wrote:Dan lydiate as long as he's fit is simply better that all of them simple that's why as long as hes fit gatland will take him. There's no one in the six nations that can compete with him as a tackling machine, plus hes back in training with the welsh squard so enough said

Kelly Brown has made 45 tackles and missed 2....

If Lydiate starts against Scotland ahead of Jones I'll be happy. He is not match fit and will be coming up against a very potent Scottish pack.

Lydiate touring at this stage would be a mistake and I'm certain Gatland will not have the mindset of "if he's fit, he tours." Especially with the depth of talent available to him in the backrow that has been playing intense test match rugby.

Lydiate was good last season, no doubt. But he hasn't played rugby since October is it? His inclusion and mention by fans smacks of desperation to me.

We won't out do Pocock whoever he choose... do so and we lose.

However if you get a team filled with breakdown Monsters like AW Jones, Cole, Healy, Best etc then you don't need out and out opensides.

Guys like Wood and Robshaw have proved how effective they are in the tight, for me they have to be the fav. 6 & 7 to tour. Put Beattie in there for front foot ball and then I think we have a very decent balance.

SOB is only playing 7 because Ferris is 10 of the player he is

Its not Rugger, Gats has form for this with Gethin RWC 2011...he knows how crucial chopper is to slowing quick ball and i maintian that if fit he will tour...i expect him to come off the bench v Scots if game is won

Lydiate will tour no doubt about that

[quote="RuggerRadge2611"]

dragonbreath wrote:

thomh wrote:LordDowlais

They're both playing well and if Ryan Jones puts in a big performance in a Wales win over England then it will make it an interesting call - but at the moment Robshaw is ahead. Two MOTM performances in a row captaining the form side in the tournament.

Robshaw seems to get MOM just for turning up. Tuilagi was clearly MOM on Saturday. The campaign behind Robshaw continues, the power of the English media to influence is winning the debate in the race to Lions captaincy.

Gatland is a awkward cus, let's hope that he sees through the BS. Robshaw, decent player, pretty ordinary captain.

Absolute nonsense. I don't normally agree with Jereme Gusset but he hit the nail on the head on Sunday in the BBC rugby forum. Robashw is a grafter, he mops up all the terrible slow ball, makes his tackles, forces penalties and leads by example. He is a player who doesn't have the X-Factor but makes up for it by making very few mistakes. He is also a really likable guy.

You know what you are right, your, representation on Robshaws behalf has inspired me. What a player what a captain, what a nice guy. I just don't know how I didn't recognise how obvious and realise how easy Gatlands decision is. Thanks

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Also, I think Sam Lewis of the Dragons could be the uncapped bolter who tours with the Lions, Gatland knows him and he is a very good player and he should be in the Wales team now if you ask me.

Do you mean Lewis Evans?

Sorry, yes I did. The Dragons no. 6. He is a very good player and another good back rower to come from the Gwent region.

I'm not sure that I have the energy to get back into this, but a few things are worth mentioning:

1. Some very strange comments about Pocock being unplayable. This is not conjecture - it is a simple fact that both Rennie and Barclay have each played Pocock in two consecutive years and each has kept him in a box very, very effectively. The number of people who cannot make the correlation between this and Scotland winning two on the bounce against the Wallabies is staggering. What do you think happened? Pocock just fell over every time he touched the ball?

2. Robshaw has taken plenty of stick for not having a classic openside physique and positioning but the fact remains that in the autumn internationals, he was responsible for more turnover ball than any other NH forward. It has to mean something.

3. I hope that Gatland can cut through the spam of actual form v reputation better than some of the posters on these boards. Otherwise, we're doomed.

4. The best loosies so far in the 6N have been Robshaw, Faleau, Wood, Morgan and Brown. Beattie, O'Brien and Tipuric get pass marks. And yes, I have watched all of the games.

Lewis Evans has been awful lately

fa0019 wrote:We won't out do Pocock whoever he choose... do so and we lose.

However if you get a team filled with breakdown Monsters like AW Jones, Cole, Healy, Best etc then you don't need out and out opensides.

Guys like Wood and Robshaw have proved how effective they are in the tight, for me they have to be the fav. 6 & 7 to tour. Put Beattie in there for front foot ball and then I think we have a very decent balance.

Its already been done! can you not remember Rennie outperforming Pocock, and Barclay the year after.

Secondly if you fill the breakdown with lumbering monsters 1-5, the Aussie 6-8 will recycle and distribute, you'll see after 30 mins the likes of AWJ absolutely knackered on the ground sticking his left peg out and becoming a penalty machine. Quick recycling from the breakdown will be key on the Aussie pitches

flyhalffactory wrote:

fa0019 wrote:We won't out do Pocock whoever he choose... do so and we lose.

However if you get a team filled with breakdown Monsters like AW Jones, Cole, Healy, Best etc then you don't need out and out opensides.

Guys like Wood and Robshaw have proved how effective they are in the tight, for me they have to be the fav. 6 & 7 to tour. Put Beattie in there for front foot ball and then I think we have a very decent balance.

Its already been done! can you not remember Rennie outperforming Pocock

Secondly if you fill the breakdown with lumbering monsters 1-5, the Aussie 6-8 will recycle and distribute, you'll see after 30 mins the likes of AWJ absolutely knackered on the ground sticking his left peg out and becoming a penalty machine. Quick recycling from the breakdown will be key on the Aussie pitches

Scottish players don't exist! We only exist on Lions tours as Doctors or tour managers! Despite the fact both of our specialist opensides hae done a number on Pocock! Even when our playerslike Hogg, Laidlaw and Grant do play well they get pidgeon holed as Scottish and ergo must be substandard to every othe player in the Uk & ireland.

It's such a shame Rennie and Barclay have not played a part in the 6nations due to injury. Barclay may get a crack against Wales on in 2 weeks, howver I feel Rennie can't travel since he has been injured and his fitness is questionable (ala Lydiate). Although a lot of Welsh posters are still insistant that he should travel.

I think a front five of Healy, Best, Cole, Launchbery and Jones would be very dynamic at the breakdown and would still have the muscle to hold AUS in both the Lineouts and scrums. Add guys like Beattie and Wood for the lineout and we would have a serious team.

I agree quick recycling is key to AUS so for me Wood and Robshaw should play.

I don't get to see enough of Scotland play anymore I'm afraid but I wonder if the balance is right if we can't retain possession/find it difficult to compete at the moment.
I mentioned it on an earlier thread that I would be concerning going in playing Wales with our current backrow.

100%beefy wrote:Its not Rugger, Gats has form for this with Gethin RWC 2011...he knows how crucial chopper is to slowing quick ball and i maintian that if fit he will tour...i expect him to come off the bench v Scots if game is won

If Gatland treats a Lions tour like an RWC, then it will be an unsuccessful tour. At the RWC you have a squad of players who know each other and will have trained together extensively, and 4-6 weeks for a player coming back from injury to play themselves in. A coach only has one country's pool of internationals to choose from, so it's quite possibly a better bet to take a strong player who's not fully fit and hope they can be ready in time, than to rely on an unproven backup.

On a Lions tour you have 4 times the pool of players, close to zero familiarity in the squad and very little time for them to come together as an effective unit. You also need the squad to gel and everyone to feel they have a chance to play in the test side. To go with an unfit or out-of-form player is a) taking a big risk that that player can not only find form but slot into the side instantly and b) sending a big message to the other candidates for that position that they are so poor that a crock is preferred to them. In a hotly contested area like the back row, you just don't need that.

It's possible that a seasoned international player like Croft or Lydiate could play enough of a stormer in the end of the club season to warrant inclusion. But I think it would be a big mistake to pick one of them if they are anything less than fully fit and on fire. Unfortunate for the individuals in question, but the right decision for the Lions.

And by the way, wasn't it widely predicted that England wouldn't be able to counter Richie McCaw without a "proper" openside? Funny how that turned out. I think they have been showing since December that fast line speed and high intensity in support can counter the effectiveness of a good poacher. Not necessarily eliminate it, but reduce it enough that it's not the decisive factor.

George Carlin wrote:I'm not sure that I have the energy to get back into this, but a few things are worth mentioning:

1. Some very strange comments about Pocock being unplayable. This is not conjecture - it is a simple fact that both Rennie and Barclay have each played Pocock in two consecutive years and each has kept him in a box very, very effectively. The number of people who cannot make the correlation between this and Scotland winning two on the bounce against the Wallabies is staggering. What do you think happened? Pocock just fell over every time he touched the ball?

2. Robshaw has taken plenty of stick for not having a classic openside physique and positioning but the fact remains that in the autumn internationals, he was responsible for more turnover ball than any other NH forward. It has to mean something.

3. I hope that Gatland can cut through the spam of actual form v reputation better than some of the posters on these boards. Otherwise, we're doomed.

4. The best loosies so far in the 6N have been Robshaw, Faleau, Wood, Morgan and Brown. Beattie, O'Brien and Tipuric get pass marks. And yes, I have watched all of the games.

There is form and class and we all know which is permanent. Yes players such as Kearney and Warbs are not firing and shoo ins such as Heaslip and Roberts will be lucky to tour if Gats just goes on form but there is so much more to it than that. Gatland will wnat a balance of experience, form and new talent. For me the bolter could be Hogg.
Traditionally the Lions is fairly conservative in selection and sometimes blatantly stupid (SCW) While I think Welsh players will have to do more to get on the plane after Graham Henry I think Gats will knwo he has to go back to Wales and leaving out players who were injured but are are fit at the time of selection will be hard - I am mainly thinking of Lydiate here.
Right now I expect lots of English, a decent contingent of Scots this time, a few Taffs and a very few Irish.
For me Robshaw is the stand out Lions Capt if Eng Slam. If not, I still think he is the best option apart from BOD but his last two appearances have been poor, one of his own doing and the last just a bad day at the office for the team
How can you omit Ryan Jones from that loosies list?

Right now, I'd go with one of the following:

6. Robshaw
7. Tipuric
8. Beattie

6. Wood
7. Robshaw
8. Faletau

Bench spots between: R Jones/SOB/Brown

thats just because it fits the sort of balance I'd like in my backrow and to me those players are all fit and in form.

I really like Wood Robshaw Faletau. All carriers, hard workers and choppers

From what we've seen in the 6 Nations I think it'll look something like this:

Wood, Robshaw, SOB, Tipuric, Jones and Falateu.

Based on the 6 Nations so far I think that's pretty fair.

FES - I think Beattie can basically pack his bags aswell

George Carlin wrote:I'm not sure that I have the energy to get back into this, but a few things are worth mentioning:

1. Some very strange comments about Pocock being unplayable. This is not conjecture - it is a simple fact that both Rennie and Barclay have each played Pocock in two consecutive years and each has kept him in a box very, very effectively. The number of people who cannot make the correlation between this and Scotland winning two on the bounce against the Wallabies is staggering. What do you think happened? Pocock just fell over every time he touched the ball?

2. Robshaw has taken plenty of stick for not having a classic openside physique and positioning but the fact remains that in the autumn internationals, he was responsible for more turnover ball than any other NH forward. It has to mean something.

3. I hope that Gatland can cut through the spam of actual form v reputation better than some of the posters on these boards. Otherwise, we're doomed.

4. The best loosies so far in the 6N have been Robshaw, Faleau, Wood, Morgan and Brown. Beattie, O'Brien and Tipuric get pass marks. And yes, I have watched all of the games.

Nice to see some analysis based largely on match statistics rather than patriotic nonsense.

I'll admit that my knowledge of rugby is not that great, but am I the only person who thinks Lydiate is being very overrated? Just kind of seems that his absence coinciding with a period of poor Welsh performances has people making him out to be far better than he actually is?

I can't see why so many are so adamant that he should be on the plane even if barely match fit, what does he bring that Wood, Ryan Jones, Ferris (if fit) or Brown don't?

LordDowlais wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Also, I think Sam Lewis of the Dragons could be the uncapped bolter who tours with the Lions, Gatland knows him and he is a very good player and he should be in the Wales team now if you ask me.

Do you mean Lewis Evans?

Sorry, yes I did. The Dragons no. 6. He is a very good player and another good back rower to come from the Gwent region.

I thought you meant Sam Lewis of the Ospreys for a second! Very premature!

BamBam wrote:I'll admit that my knowledge of rugby is not that great, but am I the only person who thinks Lydiate is being very overrated? Just kind of seems that his absence coinciding with a period of poor Welsh performances has people making him out to be far better than he actually is?

I can't see why so many are so adamant that he should be on the plane even if barely match fit, what does he bring that Wood, Ryan Jones, Ferris (if fit) or Brown don't?

I think his absence has highlighted his importance to Wales, although that does not necessarily transfer to meaning the same thing for the Lions.

We have Ferris/SOB/Brown/Ryan Jones/Robshaw/Wood/Lydiate who could all perform very, very well as part of a backrow for the lions. It will all just be down to how Gatland wants to balance the pack, not just the backrow.

Personally, I wouldn't have him going as hes yet to play this season and other 6's have performed to a high standard. He could struggle to get back in the team ahead of R Jones at 6. I would personally leave him out of the 6nations even if he is fit for the next 2 games.

100%beefy wrote:For me the bolter could be Hogg.

He's got as many caps as Robshaw, Barritt etc - not really a bolter in the usual sense.

On Lydiate, what you're missing is that the Lions have so much depth in the back row, particularly at blindside, that it wouldn't make sense to take someone who'd barely played any rugby for a year, whatever his form was like back then. The Jenkins analogy isn't a good one because the drop off in quality if he wasn't there would be a real problem, and because he was an established leader in the Wales squad. Wales at RWC2011 would have lost far more with Jenkins missing than the Lions will if Lydiate is.

The thing about bolters is that they should only be considered if the coach thinks their national coach has been unfair in not picking him... i.e. Will Greenwood in 97.

Test rugby is a massive step up from club rugby. Having the potential in the Aviva, Rabo etc is a big step away from showing form in tests.

Without knowing the European game too well.... is anyone banging the door down for selection without success?

Potential bolters to tour:

Rhys Patchell - uncapped. Very handy flyhalf at the blues
Ian Henderson - 3 caps. lock or back row. Plenty of muscle.
Freddy Burns - 100% record v NZ. 1 cap.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

dragonbreath wrote:Robshaw seems to get MOM just for turning up. Tuilagi was clearly MOM on Saturday.

No, Louis Picamoles was clearly MOM on Saturday.

Can't we find him an Irish grandparent or something - would certainly be first choice 8 for the Lions based on his performance on Saturday

The guy is immense, and even managed to enhance his reputation while all around was falling apart in the 2nd half.

Note to PSA - first names on your teamsheet - 8: Picamoles, 9: Parra, 10: Trindh-Duc, 12: Fofana. Build the rest of your team round that spine and you'll win a lot of matches.

You could nearly give Fofana MOTM for the try alone. Best try of the six nations so far. Thing of beauty.

...Ashtons matador attempt at a tackle added to the entertainment value too.

George Carlin wrote:I'm not sure that I have the energy to get back into this, but a few things are worth mentioning:

1. Some very strange comments about Pocock being unplayable. This is not conjecture - it is a simple fact that both Rennie and Barclay have each played Pocock in two consecutive years and each has kept him in a box very, very effectively. The number of people who cannot make the correlation between this and Scotland winning two on the bounce against the Wallabies is staggering. What do you think happened? Pocock just fell over every time he touched the ball?

2. Robshaw has taken plenty of stick for not having a classic openside physique and positioning but the fact remains that in the autumn internationals, he was responsible for more turnover ball than any other NH forward. It has to mean something.

3. I hope that Gatland can cut through the spam of actual form v reputation better than some of the posters on these boards. Otherwise, we're doomed.

4. The best loosies so far in the 6N have been Robshaw, Faleau, Wood, Morgan and Brown. Beattie, O'Brien and Tipuric get pass marks. And yes, I have watched all of the games.

1 - One of Scotland's biggest issues this season has been the absence of both Rennie and Barclay. Brown is a fantastic player, but is clearly a blindside being asked to play openside because of the lack of any better options. I'd love Rennie to be fit for the Lions, as he is the classiest 'fetcher' type 7 we have available.

2 - As I put up earlier, Robshaw isn't that much bigger than McCaw or Warburton (same height, about 5kg heavier). He's been playing very well at 7 this season for England and for about 3 or 4 years there for Quins. Maybe a step slower than the absolute best 7s, but more powerful.

3 - Good point

4 - Only one I'd really question is Morgan, simply because he's only played about 50 minutes of the 6Ns. All us England fans are hoping he'll be back for the Italy game as his powerful carrying is a good balance to the work our flankers do (and we can put Wood back to his better position of 6).

People saying about Rennie doing pocock im not being funny have you ever watched a game of rugby. Barkly and rennie came up against more or less came up against second string teams Australia new Zealand and south Africa take the pee out of Scotland by playing their second string side and when they play their best teams Scotland end up being hammered and pocock would make rennie Beattie Barkley robshaw wood Warburton look like silly people chasing shadows different class

welshboii15 wrote:People saying about Rennie doing pocock im not being funny have you ever watched a game of rugby. Barkly and rennie came up against more or less came up against second string teams Australia new Zealand and south Africa take the pee out of Scotland by playing their second string side and when they play their best teams Scotland end up being hammered and pocock would make rennie Beattie Barkley robshaw wood Warburton look like silly people chasing shadows different class

bitter... very bitter.

I'm guessing King Warbs didn't do too well against the Ozzies in the summer eh?

How many times have Wales played Australia in the last ffew years? 6,7 or 8 times? All I know is Wales were beaten every single time.

Scotland have played Australia twice, and won! TWICE

All built around a strong and mobile pack who contested the breakdown effectively and took their chances.

Backrow aside, perhaps Wales should try playing a Scrumhalf instead of a lumbering numpty like Phillips and they might cause Australia problems.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

welshboii15 wrote:People saying about Rennie doing pocock im not being funny have you ever watched a game of rugby. Barkly and rennie came up against more or less came up against second string teams Australia new Zealand and south Africa take the pee out of Scotland by playing their second string side and when they play their best teams Scotland end up being hammered and pocock would make rennie Beattie Barkley robshaw wood Warburton look like silly people chasing shadows different class

bitter... very bitter.

I'm guessing King Warbs didn't do too well against the Ozzies in the summer eh?

How many times have Wales played Australia in the last ffew years? 6,7 or 8 times? All I know is Wales were beaten every single time.

Scotland have played Australia twice, and won! TWICE

All built around a strong and mobile pack who contested the breakdown effectively and took their chances.

Backrow aside, perhaps Wales should try playing a Scrumhalf instead of a lumbering numpty like Phillips and they might cause Australia problems.

This pains me (more than a rash you can't tell your mum about ) to admit it, but i completely agree