Pro 12 team of the season

First topic message reminder :

This is bound to crop up soon enough so I'm throwing it out there to coincide with the try of the season thread. Should be based on Pro12 and not HEC performances. I haven't decided on a full team yet myself so I'm open to suggestions. My initial picks are (there will of course be an ulster tint to my team)

1. Grant/Court
2. Owens
3. Afoa
4. Pavanello
5.Swinson
6. Strauss
7. Tommy O'Donnell
8. Williams
9. Matawalu
10. Madigan
11. hard to leave out Visser (again)
12.Scott Williams
13.Dunbar
14. Trimble
15. Payne


Also nominate a player of the season.
For me Nick Williams.

Some very good calls. Great to see so many new and young RP12 players get so much recognition.

maestegmafia wrote:Some very good calls. Great to see so many new and young RP12 players get so much recognition.

+1 Nice call, maes

Team is out:

RABODIRECT PRO12 DREAM TEAM 2012 / 13

Full Back Stuart Hogg Glasgow Warriors
Right Wing George North Scarlets
Centre Luke Marshall Ulster Rugby
Centre Jonathan Davies Scarlets
Left Wing Tim Visser Edinburgh Rugby
O/Half Ian Madigan Leinster Rugby
S/Half Nika Watawalu Glasgow Warriors
LH Prop Ryan Grant Glasgow Warriors
Hooker Leonardo Ghiraldini Benetton Treviso
TH Prop Adam Jones Ospreys
Lock Alun Wyn Jones Ospreys
Lock Al Kellock Glasgow Warriors
Flanker Alessandro Zanni Benetton Treviso
Flanker Justin Tipuric Ospreys
No 8 Nick Williams Ulster Rugby

Some very sensible decisions, great team overall.

No complaints about that. Very good team.

VinceWLB wrote:Team is out:

RABODIRECT PRO12 DREAM TEAM 2012 / 13

Full Back Stuart Hogg Glasgow Warriors
Right Wing George North Scarlets
Centre Luke Marshall Ulster Rugby
Centre Jonathan Davies Scarlets
Left Wing Tim Visser Edinburgh Rugby
O/Half Ian Madigan Leinster Rugby
S/Half Nika Watawalu Glasgow Warriors
LH Prop Ryan Grant Glasgow Warriors
Hooker Leonardo Ghiraldini Benetton Treviso
TH Prop Adam Jones Ospreys
Lock Alun Wyn Jones Ospreys
Lock Al Kellock Glasgow Warriors
Flanker Alessandro Zanni Benetton Treviso
Flanker Justin Tipuric Ospreys
No 8 Nick Williams Ulster Rugby

Some very sensible decisions, great team overall.

Yep - difficult to argue with these names.

Being a cycloptic Glasgow fan, I might have given the 8 shirt to Strauss but I can't deny that Williams has been excellent.

If any 9 other than Niko had taken the spot, it would have been a travesty.
A Matawalu/Madigan hinge would be astonishing to watch and a nightmare to play against.

No howlers there. As myself and a few Leinster fans on this thread said, despite the fact that we've done pretty well in the league this year, only one of our players would be in with a shout of making this team, and he did.

Manawalu and Madigan



Explosive!

Matawalu is great - remeber this is an entertainment business. he can be relied upon for moments of brilliance and epic fails in the same game - no one can predict what he will do next even his own teammates! Its an entertainment business and boy does he entertain!

Anybody else wondering why the official Rabo team includes an unknown player called Nika Watawalu??

Or are they talking about Niko Matawalu??

Good work Rabo

And Tim Visser finishes top try scorer for the 4th consecutive season, still playing for a useless team - bravo

Trimble , Van Der Merwe and North could still over take him as they are all in the playoffs

My money would be on DTH van der M

Visser?

Trimble has outscored him and been the best wing in the league all season. His defence has been awesome too.

Except he hasn't, Auk? Visser is top try scorer for regular season again, playing for a fairly hopeless team - seriously impressive

Sorry Asbo: just checked - you're right, Visser has one more.

... I'd still take Trimble over him six days a week and twice on Sunday.

Yep, a more rounded player

Do we have to have this "so and so is a more rounded player", "id take x over him any day" circlejerk everytime someone mentions vissers strike rate, or can we not just appreciate his ridiculous exploits in the first half of the season? He has finished top try scorer for the regular season despite not scoring since 2012, and playing in one of the worst teams in the league.

Imperialbigdave wrote:Do we have to have this "so and so is a more rounded player", "id take x over him any day" circlejerk everytime someone mentions vissers strike rate

Not if Andy Trimble goes on to overtake him and finish as the top try scorer this year, no. Another brace for him at home to Scarlets would put him over the top.

In that instance it would become quite unnecessary!

Imperialbigdave wrote:Do we have to have this "so and so is a more rounded player", "id take x over him any day" circlejerk everytime someone mentions vissers strike rate, or can we not just appreciate his ridiculous exploits in the first half of the season? He has finished top try scorer for the regular season despite not scoring since 2012, and playing in one of the worst teams in the league.

IBD - why hasn't Visser scored in 2013, haven't Edinburgh been playing better in the second half, or are you saying Tim only tries if he thinks his team still has something to play for? It is supposed to be the team of the season rather than just the half season?

The Great Aukster wrote:

Imperialbigdave wrote:Do we have to have this "so and so is a more rounded player", "id take x over him any day" circlejerk everytime someone mentions vissers strike rate, or can we not just appreciate his ridiculous exploits in the first half of the season? He has finished top try scorer for the regular season despite not scoring since 2012, and playing in one of the worst teams in the league.

IBD - why hasn't Visser scored in 2013, haven't Edinburgh been playing better in the second half, or are you saying Tim only tries if he thinks his team still has something to play for? It is supposed to be the team of the season rather than just the half season?

I think his strike rate for the past four years when Edinburgh have had nothing to play for puts that idea to bed.

Hes just been off form. Im not saying that he definitely should be in the team of the season, what im trying to say is that lately its become fashionable on these boards to put him down if anyone so much as mentions him. Everytime anyone says his name, someone will reply with "Ah, but hes a poor all round player, id take any other winger over him in a heartbeat". That may be true, there are plenty of other wingers with a more complete game, but the guy gets no credit anymore despite being top try scorer 4 seasons running now in a poor team.

Im just trying to point out that the whole hes an incomplete player argument has been done to death, and people seem to completely disregard his strengths because he has weaknesses.

Imperialbigdave wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

Imperialbigdave wrote:Do we have to have this "so and so is a more rounded player", "id take x over him any day" circlejerk everytime someone mentions vissers strike rate, or can we not just appreciate his ridiculous exploits in the first half of the season? He has finished top try scorer for the regular season despite not scoring since 2012, and playing in one of the worst teams in the league.

IBD - why hasn't Visser scored in 2013, haven't Edinburgh been playing better in the second half, or are you saying Tim only tries if he thinks his team still has something to play for? It is supposed to be the team of the season rather than just the half season?

I think his strike rate for the past four years when Edinburgh have had nothing to play for puts that idea to bed.

Hes just been off form. Im not saying that he definitely should be in the team of the season, what im trying to say is that lately its become fashionable on these boards to put him down if anyone so much as mentions him. Everytime anyone says his name, someone will reply with "Ah, but hes a poor all round player, id take any other winger over him in a heartbeat". That may be true, there are plenty of other wingers with a more complete game, but the guy gets no credit anymore despite being top try scorer 4 seasons running now in a poor team.

Im just trying to point out that the whole hes an incomplete player argument has been done to death, and people seem to completely disregard his strengths because he has weaknesses.

Not sure who has been putting Visser down, dave, but it is difficult to rate one player against another without it appearing that way perhaps.
Visser is obviously a good player, and the fact that he has been named above is testament to that, yet personally, as with others, I would rate Trimble above Visser. Trimble has been playing consistently well this season for Ulster, and in some games has been outstanding. In fact, at the moment, I would rate Trimble higher than Bowe or Gilroy in terms of playing for club. This against the backdrop of being snubbed by Ireland, and harsh criticism from certain sections of the media, and Ireland supporters. He's responded in the best way possible by upping his game. Hopefully Schmidt rates him higher than Deccie did.

Notch wrote:

Imperialbigdave wrote:Do we have to have this "so and so is a more rounded player", "id take x over him any day" circlejerk everytime someone mentions vissers strike rate

Not if Andy Trimble goes on to overtake him and finish as the top try scorer this year, no. Another brace for him at home to Scarlets would put him over the top.

In that instance it would become quite unnecessary!

"Top try scorer" is only applicable to scoring in the regular season - that's'why they've announced the official 2012 Rabo Dream Team now.

Would be a bit unfair to compare apples to oranges (ie how can you say someone is a better rifleman when they've had the chance to play more games than someone else).

Och, everyone plays a different number of games with internationals and injuries and so on.

Visser has 11 in 15, better strike rate than Trimble and DTHVDM who both have 10 in 17 and North who has 9 in 13.

Those three could yet beat or match Vissers total- fair enough on Trimble and DTH but North can only play the same number of games as the Dutchman...

To be honest, Notch - for balance, I haven't really rated Trimble as being in the same class as Bowe until this season.
I kind of see it now. I didn't before.

Question is whether he can mentally handle the step up to test rugby as easily as Bowe- at Pro12 level, yeah Trimble is his equal for sure. Very much a key player for Ulster. But since being harshly dropped from the side the World Cup he hasn't looked confident in green. I don't know if thats an issue between him and Kidney or just him but I suspect the former. I think he's a confidence player and knowing Mark Anscombe thinks of him as Ulsters best winger of the three Irish internationals we have has really given him a boost. Whereas for Trimble to be the outstanding player of Irelands warm-up games in 2011 only to be jettisoned as soon as Earls was fit again really took the wind out of his sails in a big way.

It will be interesting to see if Trimble can force his way back in to the Ireland squad. Kidney didn't favour him, but if Schmidt can get the best out of him he's a good player. Thing is; Zebo, Earls, Gilroy, Bowe... no wonder Tommy Seymour has had to defect to a foreign cause

Glad TommY Seymour did . Very good back - very fast an powerful and good scorer. Had a few niggly injuries but useful to have to back up DTH and Maitland.

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Glad TommY Seymour did . Very good back - very fast an powerful and good scorer. Had a few niggly injuries but useful to have to back up DTH and Maitland.

+1. Think he's really progressed too

The Great Aukster wrote:

Imperialbigdave wrote:Do we have to have this "so and so is a more rounded player", "id take x over him any day" circlejerk everytime someone mentions vissers strike rate, or can we not just appreciate his ridiculous exploits in the first half of the season? He has finished top try scorer for the regular season despite not scoring since 2012, and playing in one of the worst teams in the league.

IBD - why hasn't Visser scored in 2013, haven't Edinburgh been playing better in the second half, or are you saying Tim only tries if he thinks his team still has something to play for? It is supposed to be the team of the season rather than just the half season?

I hate to have to say this but I think he is missing Nick de Luca inside him (so to speak!) De Luca can somehow put Visser into spaces that no-one else can
Now, after typing that praise for De Luca, I am away to wash my hands. I feel dirty for some reason

I have always found it mystifying how people slate Visser despite his scoring rate for a poor team. He is the king of the try scoring wingers. You do not get to be top scorer what 4 years running without having something especially playing for the MFLs.

InjuredYetAgain wrote:

The Great Aukster wrote:

Imperialbigdave wrote:Do we have to have this "so and so is a more rounded player", "id take x over him any day" circlejerk everytime someone mentions vissers strike rate, or can we not just appreciate his ridiculous exploits in the first half of the season? He has finished top try scorer for the regular season despite not scoring since 2012, and playing in one of the worst teams in the league.

IBD - why hasn't Visser scored in 2013, haven't Edinburgh been playing better in the second half, or are you saying Tim only tries if he thinks his team still has something to play for? It is supposed to be the team of the season rather than just the half season?

I hate to have to say this but I think he is missing Nick de Luca inside him (so to speak!) De Luca can somehow put Visser into spaces that no-one else can
Now, after typing that praise for De Luca, I am away to wash my hands. I feel dirty for some reason

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Glad TommY Seymour did . Very good back - very fast an powerful and good scorer. Had a few niggly injuries but useful to have to back up DTH and Maitland.

+1. Think he's really progressed too

+2. I've always been a big fan of Tommy Seymour and was very, very disappointed to see him leave. Understand though- he is a good player, but we couldn't guarantee him enough rugby with the wingers we have.

Only just noticing the Pro12 team. No real issues with it except the lack of Trimble but the others are top players too. Luke Marshall is fortunate to be in there.

At a quick glance there are 5 in both the team in the OP and the Pro12 team. Treviso got a good representation

15 Liam Williams
14 Eli Walker
13 Jonathan Davies
12 Marshall
11 DTHVDM
10 Weir
9 Pienaar

1 Bevington
2 Hibbard
3 Afoa
4 Ryan
5 Kellock
6 R Jones
8 Williams
7 Tipuric

Player of the season - Pienaar.

George Carlin wrote:To be honest, Notch - for balance, I haven't really rated Trimble as being in the same class as Bowe until this season.
I kind of see it now. I didn't before.

I have yet to see it. Bowe is a top international winger. A real class player who has been Irelands best back behind BOD for years. Despite the hype hes better than Zebo. Trimbles a good player but has never looked comfortable at international level.

I think Trimble should have been on the Pro 12 team of the season though.