Italian GP Thread - Contains Spoilers of Race/Qualifying & Practice - Sponsored by Dolmio - When'sa your Dolmio Day?

[Fernando]

This weekend is the final European race of the 2013 Formula One season and the home race for both Ferrari and tire supplier Pirelli. We are, of course, talking about the Italian Grand Prix at the legendary Autodromo di Monza, located on the outskirts of Milan. The track was built in 1922 and has hosted the Italian GP every year since 1950, with the sole exception of 1980, when the race was held at nearby Imola.

It’s the fastest track on the calendar with an average speed in excess of 150 mph. Additionally, cars exceed 200 mph at four different points on the lap, so the combination of straight-line speed and braking stability is the key for race engineers and drivers.

A single lap measures 3.6 miles, and with drivers covering some 53 laps during the race, the total distance of the race is about 190 miles. As always it is a compromise in terms of setup, though lower drag than normal is favored due to the long straights and high track efficiency; Monza, alongside Monaco, is one of the two races where teams will often use track-specific aerodynamic components.

Looking at the weather forecast for the weekend, temperatures will be hot and there is a chance of a storm on both days. Pirelli is bringing its P Zero Orange hard tires and P Zero White medium tires: the same used for the previous Belgian Grand Prix.

Going into the weekend, Red Bull Racing’s Sebastian Vettel leads the Drivers’ Championship with 197 points. Ferrari’s Fernando Alonso is in second with 151 points while Lewis Hamilton of Mercedes AMG is in third with 139 points. In the Constructors’ Championship, Red Bull Racing commands 312 points versus the 235 points of Mercedes AMG and the 218 points of Ferrari.

Weather Forecast:http://www.weather-forecast.com/locations/Monza/forecasts/latest

Source:MotorAuthority.com

[Guest]

Great to be back, judging from two weeks ago & with the low downforce package of Ferrari, I expect a very good result for Alonso. Hamilton needs something special too this weekend. If Vettel wins, wake me up in March 2014.

[bogbrush]

Well this is the one, the race that plays farther away from downforce than anything. If Ferrari don't win here then their hopes are bleak.

[GSC]

RB looked good in a straight line at Spa

[cosicave]

This time I find myself in no-man's land. Here's some of my reasoning:

1/ The way teams have developed this season.
2/ Engine power/torque, balanced against braking efficiency and minimal downforce*.
3/ Tyre wear (yes, I believe it's still a factor).
4/ A chassis' capacity to ride kerbs together with its braking efficiency and a driver's ability to marry the two.
5/ Monza is the simplest of all GP circuits.


For these reasons, before Monza's practice sessions get underway, I find it a bit close to call. Then again, I am not actually expecting the closest of fights because I think whoever strikes the best balance could well stride off into the distance.

Based on the above, it is almost inevitable that three favourites emerge*:
1. Immediately after the summer break, Mercedes looked good but this was at least partially due to Vettel taking a dip behind slower-runners (especially Button). After that, Spa showed us Red Bull probably have the bases covered; besides, who in his right mind would bet against Adrian Newey? Conclusion: Red Bull (Vettel) or Mercedes (Hamilton).
2 & 3. Engine v aero v tyres. On paper it might seem a toss of the coin between Mercedes and Red Bull but we should not forget Ferrari can come up with the best compromise on home tarmac; and Lotus have been easy on their tyres all season.
4. In terms of the most compliant chassis, this circuit probably favours Red Bull but here again there is a dark-horse: Lotus. (Incidentally, it's no coincidence that a compliant chassis goes hand-in-hand with tyre longevity). In terms of outright driving ability, we should consider the last of the late-brakers: Hamilton, as well as Räikkönen and probably the most strategic thinker: Alonso. I would include Button here if he were in a more competitive car but given the current McLaren, I do not see him mounting a realistic challenge for top spot this year. I see Red Bull as the best chassis and surely no-one can still doubt Vettel and his exploitation of track limits after the apex (ahem…); but I also see Hamilton as best able to marry braking with kerbs.
5. This is a team thing. It is far less simple than it appears and may give an advantage to Ferrari if they can get their act together where it matters most: in front of the tifosi. However, ultimately I think the best thinking will come from Red Bull's uncompromising single-mindedness.

*Minimal downforce should not be confused with aerodynamic efficiency.
*In my opinion, Vettel, Hamilton, Alonso.

[Fernando]

Hamilton fastest in P1 0.590 between 1st & 10th could be close. Massa nearly crashed into Alonso at the end of the pitlane.

[Guest]

Vettel looks immense up to this point. I'm hearing 70% chance of rain/thunderstorms on Sunday. I can see teams taking risks with strategy & downforce setups, in preparation for a Vettel pole.

[SteveG]

Have Merc stopped developing their car or what ? - just as in Spa they're a good half second off the pace in dry conditions. Where's all that straight line speed gone? Looks like we need some light rain - but unlike Spa lets hope it actually arrives this time.

[Guest]

Basically, there still working out all the wing setups to maximise performance. I definitely think they've taken some speed out of the car, over one lap, to improve their tyre issues. The Red Bull though is quite clearly the fastest car, coming with a new seven element front wing and a new modified diffuser. This is usually the time where Newey brings the big and 'championship defining' upgrade to the Red Bull. It happened last year and Vettel won four straight races out of nowhere, if I remember correctly.

I still think Hamilton has something in reserve but even a second or third on the grid will still be good enough to challenge Vettel in the wet tomorrow, if it comes.

[GSC]

Hamilton, Raikonnen, Grosjean all fail to make it to Q3.

Can Alonso stop Vettel?

[GSC]

Backed out pretty early on his final lap.

[GSC]

Looks like depressed Lewis is back. 'I drove like an idiot'. Also said Sutil impeded him (he didn't)

[GSC]

Interesting that for all the talk Webber gets about not challenging Vettel, Massa is Alonsos Chauffeur

[SteveG]

Looks like depressed Lewis is back. 'I drove like an idiot'. Also said Sutil impeded him (he didn't)

well if he didnt then give him a pram next time.

[GSC]

Superb pole for Vettel, and RB lock out the front row.

Great 3rd from Hulkenburg, great time to prod Ferrari about that #2 job.

Massa out qualifies Alonso while giving him a tow 

[bogbrush]

Massa out qualifies Alonso while giving him a tow 

What a fiasco that was!

I imagine they're all crapping themselves with the Boss in the garage being humiliated.

[GSC]

Jenson having a moan about strategy.

Must've been an incredibly grumpy garage at McLaren last year

[Guest]

Apparently, it's all kicking off at Ferrari with Alonso. He was heard telling the team, 'your all idiots' and slating them for the strategy. This is not going to go down well with Luca. Even rumours of a 'sabbatical' for Fernando, with no Red Bull seat now available and has become disillusioned with life at Ferrari & Vettel's domination.

Vettel dominating again. Hamilton, openly admitted it was his error, unlike Jenson who always has to blame something else. Excellent drive from Hulkenberg. If it's wets.....and I hope it ******* is, then in changeable conditions, he can be a serious threat.

If it's dry, then Vettel strolls this.

[GSC]

Goodbye Alonso, hello Kimi

[Guest]

dry race - vettel gets away, webber bogs down and hulkenberg goes into second. alonso on full charge will end up taking webber & hulkenberg, but while doing that he's losing time to vettel, who scampers away for the win. vettel 1st, alonso 2nd, webber 3rd

wet race - anything can happen.

what do we want?

wet race.......and badly.

[Fernando]

it won't rain and even if it does it won't be enough to cause any issue to RB.

[Guest]

it won't rain and even if it does it won't be enough to cause any issue to RB.

wake me up in 2014 then

[GSC]

Hopefully Seb gets the job done. Shame he never gets the plaudits he deserves

[Guest]

if it's dry, he will get the job done. no one is catching him in the upgraded RB with modified diffuser, only mechanical failure will stop him. all his rivals seem to just hurt themselves, take points off each other, instead of actually trying to beat him.

Alonso said this and remember this is basically Vettel's nearest rival in the championship, "It is the first time in many, many, many races that I will be able to see the Red Bull rear wings on the grid''......says it all.

[CaledonianCraig]

I'd be very surprised if Vettel doesn't win today. Perhaps only thing to deny him is a technical problem but Red Bulls have been technically largely bullet-proof this year (as many F1 cars are now).

[Guest]

Hearing that the sky is dark n looking likely to be a wet race or rain at some point. We need some excitement, reckon nick hulkenberg will be licking his lips at changeable conditions. If wet, first corner is going to be messy.

[CaledonianCraig]

It would be nice if we had a wet race. Sorry Vettel fans but we want some excitement.

[Guest]

To be fair, even in the wet, Vettel should still win. He was dominant in the wet with Torro Rosso & won't have spray or poor visibility. I still want rain though.

[CaledonianCraig]

Yes you aare probably right John but rain does open the door to other possibilities such as a unique point for say Caterham or Marussia if there are lots of accidents. I'd like to see them get an ounce of reward for their toils over the last few years.

[Fernando]

Rumors suggesting that Ross Brawn has bought out Toto Wolff's shares in Williams F1. That would be majorally interesting.

[GSC]

Vettel won his first race in the wet at Monza. Ricciardo to follow?

I hope Brawn does. Would be great to see Williams challenge

[CaledonianCraig]

Rumors suggesting that Ross Brawn has bought out Toto Wolff's shares in Williams F1. That would be majorally interesting.

Very interesting if true. There is no doubting Brawn's credentials.

[Fernando]

It has started to rain in Italy.

[Fernando]

A lot of mechanics under Button's car. Kers related by sounds of it.

[Fernando]

Turns out it's a fuel line issue, Usually they take along time to change around 30-45 mins to change so JB is screwed

[bogbrush]

Hearing how upset Alonso was at Massa driving properly in qualifying does make me smile. I mean, Mark Webber did all he could to take pole and Massa is supposed to play tow for Alonso, but apparently Vettel has one kind of iron rule over RB.

If the rumours that Kimi is off to Ferrari come true then Alonso is gone. There's no way Raikonnen is lying down like Alonso demands. It would be good for Ferrari, they need a team not one one who blames everyone else when he can't keep up with his personal assistant on track.

[CaledonianCraig]

I do have a suspicion all is not well with Alonso and Ferrari relationship. There are no avenues out for next year though as all the main drives are seemingly sorted. I'd guess if Ferrari aren't more competitive next year Alonso will move on and Kimi will replace him. I'd be gobsmacked if Kimi arrives with Alonso still there. Ferrari don't work like that.

[Fernando]

Jenson has made it out the pitlane so Mclaren have done a hell of a job to get that changed quickly.

[bogbrush]

I do have a suspicion all is not well with Alonso and Ferrari relationship. There are no avenues out for next year though as all the main drives are seemingly sorted. I'd guess if Ferrari aren't more competitive next year Alonso will move on and Kimi will replace him. I'd be gobsmacked if Kimi arrives with Alonso still there. Ferrari don't work like that.

Suspicion? Alonso is humiliating the team on a regular basis. He's been doing this for over a season now. That matters to anyone, but to Italians? To Ferrari??
It's not about Ferrari satisfying Alonso. Alonso is an employee, like all the drivers.

Ferrari simply don't require that. Alonso isn't worth the trouble, there are other drivers who could bring the same to the track and far more off it. Raikonnen seems an obvious choice.

[GSC]

Fantastic win for Seb.

Nail in the coffin for Hamilton an Raikonnen.

[bogbrush]

Yes, only Alonso left now, but if Vettel can win here and at Spa surely he should do well in Asia.

[Guest]

Shocking race. Vettel barely saw another car all day, Alonso not even in the same picture frame. Sick n tired of hearing RB talking about issues they have. Back to back, dominant wins on their supposedly weakest tracks.....please! I'm not blowing Hamilton`s trumpet, but without him in that race, it would of been another dire, borefest. Rosberg was poor, did nothing.

Championship over. The modified & upgraded RB is on another level. Wake me up in 2014!

[GSC]

Might be nigh time Fernando finds out nobody's bigger than Ferrari

[GSC]

Bring back the exploding tyres

Vettels just too good for the opposition.

[Bull]

You can certainly see which one Mark is mates with!

[beninho]

I love f1. But like Spa it was a boring race. The red bull is so good. And vetell is a good driver. But it wasn't a fantastic drive by Seb. It was an easy drive. F1 needs to become interesting again.

[CaledonianCraig]

The Red Bull shows its far superior strengths again. Congratulations to Vettel on a fourth consecutive world title - a great achievement. Driver of the day? For me either Hulkenberg or Hamilton.

[bogbrush]

You can certainly see which one Mark is mates with!

Yes! The other week it was Lewis & Seb chummy with Fernando standing by. Nothing unexpected in any of that.

[Guest]

Horner, `we had issues & problems throughout the race with both drivers`.

 

[SteveG]

Another pi55 easy win for the fingered one (despite red bull doing everything to kid anyone who could be bothered to listen that they had 'serious' issues while their driver pumped in fastest lap after fastest lap lol). Meanwhile no rain but plenty of pain for the perpetually unlucky Lewis who would've been right in the hunt for a podium if not for the puncture. The WDC is over but I'll continue to watch the genius that is Lewis Hamilton. Roll on Singapore.

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