Australia v India, 2nd Test, Brisbane

First topic message reminder :

After the first test witnessed India staying alive in the game and taking the fight to Australia before undoing it all in the final session, the 2nd test is getting underway at the Gabba tomorrow. Both sides will see a change in leadership. Australia's regular skipper Michael Clarke is injured and isout of the series and Steven Smith takes over, while Mahendra Singh Dhoni, the regular skipper returns and takes over from Virat Kohli. How would Smith the captain look like? Will Dhoni stick to his pragmatic guns or take a more aggressive approach with his weak bowling attack?
Besides Clarke, Ryon Harris, the best Australian seamer in the first test, is also out injured, while the struggling Peter Siddle is dropped. Shaun Marsh comes in for Clarke, and Mitchell Starc and Josh Hazlewood come into the bowling unit. For India, Ravichandran Ashwin is likely to come back in place of the unimpressive Karn Sharma.
The preview from cricinfo indicates that the track is expected to be rather different from one on which the first test was played. If spin had lots going for it on that track, this one is expected to be quicker and livelier for the seam bowlers.

msp wrote:Ashwin in his first 11 overs, maintained excellent control. He looked dangerous in that spell. He really earned Watson's wicket. He did go for a few in the final hour, but as I wrote above, that was mostly down to a calculated attack from Smith rather than Ashwin bowling poorly.

Ashwin could do nothing on the super-helpful pitches in India vs. Eng and we lost the series....this finished his credibility as a spinner...and it was duly repeated when he had D5 pitch in SA and also got 2 tests in Eng.....

England in India Test Series, 2012/13
4 8 236.5 48 737 14 3/80 5/214 52.64 3.11 101.5

Was there not an undue bias in giving CSK players + some of Dhoni's favourites a very very long run....then the home series vs. Eng should have been the last nail in his coffin.
the like of Rasool, Kuldip Yadav, Gopal waiting in the wings can do not worse......and one of them might , just might turn out to be as good as Lyon or Stuart Mcgill as a strike bowler.

But we can unearth a new talent only when the proven failures are dumped for good

KP_fan wrote:

msp wrote:Ashwin in his first 11 overs, maintained excellent control. He looked dangerous in that spell. He really earned Watson's wicket. He did go for a few in the final hour, but as I wrote above, that was mostly down to a calculated attack from Smith rather than Ashwin bowling poorly.

Ashwin could do nothing on the super-helpful pitches in India vs. Eng and we lost the series....this finished his credibility as a spinner...and it was duly repeated when he had D5 pitch in SA and also got 2 tests in Eng.....

England in India Test Series, 2012/13
4 8 236.5 48 737 14 3/80 5/214 52.64 3.11 101.5

Was there not an undue bias in giving CSK players + some of Dhoni's favourites a very very long run....then the home series vs. Eng should have been the last nail in his coffin.
the like of Rasool, Kuldip Yadav, Gopal waiting in the wings can do not worse......and one of them might , just might turn out to be as good as Lyon or Stuart Mcgill as a strike bowler.

But we can unearth a new talent only when the proven failures are dumped for good

Can you remind me his figures in the 4-0 whitewash of Australia in 2013?
Lets accept that the days when high quality spinners were unable to make to the national side just because their time coincided with that of a Bedi/Chandra/Kumble. The spinners we haven't aren't of the same class. Amit Mishra got to play a decent number of tests, and Pragyan Ojha hasn't been the same bowler after the changes in his action. Piyush Chawla has been average even at the domestic level. Ashwin and Jadeja are very very good in Indian conditions though I am not forgetting that England series.
Among the bowlers you mentioned, only Rasool has had any sustained level of domestic performance. Even with him, his bowling has come along quite well only in the last 2 seasons. Lets see how he goes about in the Ranji top group.......
Gopal, playing only his 2nd Ranji season, is yet to figure out whether he's a batting all-rounder or a bowling all-rounder. Kuldeep is only playing his first Ranji season.

And in Ashwin's case, he can play as an all-rounder in away conditions. If Rohit Sharma and Suresh Raina can bat 6 for India in test matches, then Ashwin surely can do the same with greater success. A more pragmatic approach would be Dhoni at 6 and Ashwin at 7. The skipper had shown that he has the heart for the fight in that position in England earlier this year. Then they have the flexibility to play even 4 quicks. And when Bhuvi comes back in, there will be additional batting support in the lower to help the combination further.

msp83 wrote:
Can you remind me his figures in the 4-0 whitewash of Australia in 2013?

Everyone spinner picks wkts on Indian pitches maninder, siva, raju, chauhan....etc etc......so that's just par......the point here is he failed in 3 consecutive tests "even on Indian pitches"
and he failed "all the time " overseas...even when he had 475 runs to bowl on D5 pitch in SA

Lets accept that the days when high quality spinners were unable to make to the national side just because their time coincided with that of a Bedi/Chandra/Kumble. The spinners we haven't aren't of the same class.

msp...that's an excuse for selectors not having the b.alls to drop Dhoni and Srnivasan backed CSK medicores Jadeja and Ashwin.
If we give 3 tests to each of Rasool, Kuldip, Gopal, Akshar....and they all do just as badly as Jadeja and Ashwin.....then the point is made that we do not have any good spinners.

Amit Mishra got to play a decent number of tests,
and Pragyan Ojha hasn't been the same bowler after the changes in his action. Piyush Chawla has been average even at the domestic level.

How many tests have Mishra, Ojha and Chawla got overseas. ?

msp83 wrote:And in Ashwin's case, he can play as an all-rounder in away conditions.

well that's what I said...bhai talked the talk...." we will contiue to be aggressive"...but faile to walk the walk...
ie having ashwin in place of Rohit...and playing another seamer

Mishra did get to play away from India in England, and he was not at all effective. You said the likes of Raju and Chauhan have picked up wickets on Indian tracks. Mishra has been far too inconsistent on Indian tracks, and Piyush Chawla has been averaging close to 40 for the last few seasons in domestic cricket with the ball.
The experience of Karn Sharma itself suggests that you just can't pick a spinner for the national squad just because he has had 1 good season or a few good matches in Ranji cricket. I don't think even you are serious about the likes of Gopal at this stage of his career. The lad, all of 21, has played only 9 FC games and 3 List A ones....... I doubt whether he's even in the selectorial frame, and I won't blame them for that. Akshar Patel too was on his debut season last year, he did alright, and has done well in ODIs in the limited opportunities he got so far. But then Jadeja has been India's best spinner in ODIs for more than a year now, and he has lots more experience and lot more success in domestic cricket, and he was picked for the test side after playing FC and ODI cricket for more than 5 years.
Akshar or Gopal or even Rasool for that matter, hasn't really set the world alight with their performances, they have done well in few games for or a season or 2 on Indian tracks where 'every spinner takes wickets', lets see how they cope up a bit more.......
The likes of Chawla and Mishra have been proven international failures on Indian tracks too, Ashwin and Jadeja have been, overall, quite good at least on Indian tracks.......
Remember seamers like Deepak Chahar and Rithuraj Singh had fine debut seasons in Ranji, both have been struggling since.

They won't drop Rohit no matter what!. They are waiting for that one decent innings that would extend to next 10 tests of total mediocrity.......

msp83 wrote:They won't drop Rohit no matter what!. They are waiting for that one decent innings that would extend to next 10 tests of total mediocrity.......

yes Rohit is symptomatic of the malaise in the our cricketing system

Hopefully the joker gets a few when it means something sooner rather than later.......

--look MSP
Ashwin and Jadeja are fine for home tests.
But are proven "useless" on overseas tracks...and just like a tiger cannot change it's stripes......ashwin and jadeja will average 45 runs / wicket 1.5 to 2 wkts / test...can't do any better.,


--when you play only 4 bowlers and the other 3 are also averaging 35+ type seamers....then you cannot accept your 4th bowler and main spinner to be as useless.

so we need to look beyond Jadeja and ashwin

--and look beyond means try the ones who "appear" to have X-factor or ones doing well in Ranji

Like Karn sharma was bamboozling everyone with his BIG legbreaks in IPL.

So it's a bit of a gamble....but he couldn't have done worse than ashwin and jadeja

--if he doesn't work out and one game is not enough......but after 2 to 3 chances then they need to look at the next ones in queue such as Kuldip yadav ( x factor chinaman bowler and U-19 world cup sucess)
OR Rasool ( Ranji success) or Ojha ( Ranji , home tests and County sucess has not played a single overseas test); or akshar patel ( Ranji and ODI succes), Jalaj Saxena ( Ind-A and Ranji sucess)


--of these especially Ojha....proven in tests, Ranji and county does not get a single overseas game ????
and akshar patel..great Ranji season,. great IPL and good account of himself in ODis....why not him ??

and Rasool...season after season leading bowler in ranji and a handy batsman too

why not give him a chance.....he can't do worse than proven failures

--because there is resistance from Srnivsans and CSK lobby to look beyond Ashwin and Jadeja
the same malaise in the system....drop Rohit to bring Raina and drop raina to bring Rohit using their Patta pitch ODI or T20 performances.

--Insanity is defined as.....doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

lets hope we get a diffrent result in this test

look at these names top spinners in last Ranji season.....and more important you would have heard these names season after season....
They should be given a break in Ind-A and ODI games  and if successful in test matches at home or away
actually Darekar, Jalaj ; Ojha and akshar have all given a good account of themselves in A games / ODIs and domestic tests

It's just a CSK/ Dhoni propaganda machine that tells us " there is no spin potential in India"

dhabolkar 39 wickets @26avg
Darekar 33 wkts @28 avg
S gopal 22 wkts@18 avg
Jakati 30wkts @avg

Rasool 29 wkts at 30 avg
akshar patel 29 wkts at 23
Jalaj Saxen 35wkst at 19avg
sharath 32wkts at 19

add to these a few X-factor wrist/ mystery spinners like Karn, Kuldip, Harmeet and the potential is Huge

Ojha is struggling with his modified action since the Australia series. But I agree he should have had his chances in away tests. I see Akshar as a future test prospect, not ready yet, and rushing him might end up damaging his career. Rasool has come along in the last 2 seasons, yet his bowling average in domestic cricket is close to 34 we need to remember....... Kuldeep is nowhere near ready for the longer format. Just because he bowls chinaman, he shouldn't be picked. A certain potential, but that again has to be in the future.
We have seen that some flashy performances in IPL won't become automatic success in test cricket. Otherwise Suresh Raina by now should have nailed down that number 6 position for himself.......

Whilst I totally agree with msp and kpf on Rohit and think he should be nowhere near the Test side, I don't understand why the same criticism isn't extended to Dhawan. He has had more chances in overseas tests than even Rohit for equally poor results. Both should be consigned to the dustbin as soon as possible. And in Dhawan's case, we at least have a decent backup on tour unlike for Rohit, who'll have to be replaced by Raina.

I hope Rohit plays a big game changing innings to change my views on him or fail miserably enough to force the selectors and the team management to do the needful. A 50 that just about helps him retain his place in the side would be the worst thing possible to this Indian side.

msp83 wrote:Ojha is struggling with his modified action since the Australia series. But I agree he should have had his chances in away tests. I see Akshar as a future test prospect, not ready yet, and rushing him might end up damaging his career. Rasool has come along in the last 2 seasons, yet his bowling average in domestic cricket is close to 34 we need to remember....... Kuldeep is nowhere near ready for the longer format. Just because he bowls chinaman, he shouldn't be picked. A certain potential, but that again has to be in the future.
We have seen that some flashy performances in IPL won't become automatic success in test cricket. Otherwise Suresh Raina by now should have nailed down that number 6 position for himself.......

" He is not ready"...another statement from the propaganda machine of Srni/ CSK/ Dhoni Bhai
"he is not ready" will be proven if he is given a chance t play and doesn't deliver

mystery and wrist spinners is a punt...the talent based spontaneous selection that the likes of Ganguly / Imran / Rantaunga have done in plenty and with a good success rate.

and if the "punt" doesn't work out......then they still can't be worse than the averaging 45 and 1.5 to 2 wkts per test Ashwin / Jadeja...
what have you gotta lose ???

ShankyCricket wrote:Whilst I totally agree with msp and kpf on Rohit and think he should be nowhere near the Test side, I don't understand why the same criticism isn't extended to Dhawan. He has had more chances in overseas tests than even Rohit for equally poor results. Both should be consigned to the dustbin as soon as possible. And in Dhawan's case, we at least have a decent backup on tour unlike for Rohit, who'll have to be replaced by Raina.

I hope Rohit plays a big game changing innings to change my views on him or fail miserably enough to force the selectors and the team management to do the needful. A 50 that just about helps him retain his place in the side would be the worst thing possible to this Indian side.

Dhawan is getting a long rope based on a relatively better show overseas than Rohit.......but he does not scare us
for if he doesn't deliver he will be dumped......and will not be brought back on "excuses" like rohit and Raina

Sharath is a seamer isn't he? Dabholkar has had one good season, and the little I've watched him, didn't come across as someone with that something extra. Darekar too, hasn't been not much more than the usual run of the mill domestic spinner.
Gopal and Akshar are future potentials who haven't had the necessary experience or in Gopal's case in particular, consistency for test cricket at this stage. Rasool is a solid all-round potential but I doubt he's the led spinner stuff in away conditions. I wouldn't rush him to test cricket as yet, though I believe he'd be much more worth than Rohit Sharma even at this point of time.
And one spinner you forgot to include in the list is Jharkhand's Shahbaz Nadeem.

I have to say I'm firmly with KPF on the Ashwin situation. Certainly, I would be quite loathe to rate a spinner based on performances against third grade players of spin such as Australia on raging dustbowls in the subcontinent or WI anywhere. Ashwin failed miserably against the only half decent side he has faced even at home so far and the less said about his overseas numbers, the better.

I think Shikhar is one innings away from being dropped unless he delivers. Or at least that's what they should do...... And unlike in England, they do have a replacement who is there because of performance rather than past reputation.
As for Rohit, he might even score a big hundred somewhere in this series, but you can be rest assured he'll be total crap for the next 10 tests.......

KP_fan wrote:

msp83 wrote:Ojha is struggling with his modified action since the Australia series. But I agree he should have had his chances in away tests. I see Akshar as a future test prospect, not ready yet, and rushing him might end up damaging his career. Rasool has come along in the last 2 seasons, yet his bowling average in domestic cricket is close to 34 we need to remember....... Kuldeep is nowhere near ready for the longer format. Just because he bowls chinaman, he shouldn't be picked. A certain potential, but that again has to be in the future.
We have seen that some flashy performances in IPL won't become automatic success in test cricket. Otherwise Suresh Raina by now should have nailed down that number 6 position for himself.......

" He is not ready"...another statement from the propaganda machine of Srni/ CSK/ Dhoni Bhai
"he is not ready" will be proven if he is given a chance t play and doesn't deliver

mystery and wrist spinners is a punt...the talent based spontaneous selection that the likes of Ganguly / Imran / Rantaunga have done in plenty and with a good success rate.

and if the "punt" doesn't work out......then they still can't be worse than the averaging 45 and 1.5 to 2 wkts per test Ashwin / Jadeja...
what have you gotta lose ???

Who got selected to the test side under Ganguly having played 2 or 5 or even 10 FC games? Can't remember anyone, and if anyone got selected, then I can't remember they being successful at all.
When Harbhajan was brought back in 2001, it was after he gained 3 years of FC experience after a couple of early tests that weren't successful. Virender Sehwag had lots of domestic experience and considerable ODI success before playing his first test. Think Irfan Pathan is the only player who had some success at the test level having come into the side without much FC experience.

These last 2 tests (at The Oval and this ongoing Test) is the first instance in which Ashwin has managed to string together 2 tests in a row in which he has taken at least a single wicket .
Before these 2 tests, his overseas wickets distribution was as follows :

4, 0, 5, 0, 0. Thats a staggering 3 wicketless tests out of the first 5. How many Indian spinners have managed to go wicketless in 3 out of their first 5 overseas tests and yet managed to play more? His economy rate isn't the greatest for an offspinner either.

Parthiv Patel now is one of the better wicketkeeper batsmen in domestic cricket. When he was picked to play for the national side aged 17 and then failed despite a number of chances, I think it ended up doing more damage to his international prospects than much good. He's a more rounded batsman now, but impressions are already created and its hard to move on from those. And when a rare 2nd chance presented itself, he didn't take it, and didn't have a decent run to show things had changed.
Like in the spin department today, we had serious problems in the wicketkeeping department in the late 1990s and the first half of 2000s. Mongia, Saba Karim, MSK Prasad, Vijay Dhaiya, Samir Dighe, Parthiv, Ajay Ratra, Dinesh Karthik....... And the one who eventually succeeded was Mahendra Singh Dhoni, who not only had that something extra, but also decent experience in domestic cricket.......

Ashwin was pretty poor in his first overseas assignment in Australia, and he was a letdown in South Africa. However, for all the criticism he's been getting, don't think he bowled badly at all on day 2 of this game. In fact this was one of his better days in away tests though he took only one wicket.......

msp wrote:Who got selected to the test side under Ganguly having played 2 or 5 or even 10 FC games

?

Yuv, Kaif, Parthiv, Munaf, Zaheer, Tinu Yohanan, Harbahajn, Zaheer, and a few others that I cannot remember got in in their first season....
none of this ..." not ready" B.S was served at us then

I quite like Ravi Ashwin. Hope he does well. The world needs more spinners in short sleeves.

South Africa has basically stopped picking kids in Test squads, but that's because we have a very settled team, with maybe one bowling spot, and two batting slots available. When a team has a few spots up for grabs, can't see what's wrong with picking a kid. At worst he realises how far off he is from making the grade and goes back to the domestic scene and worms harder and sures up his technique.

The question is, what did Dhawan do to even be picked for these 2 tests after being dropped in England? Based on ODI performances at home against SL? A team against whom even a grade 3 slogger like Rohit scored a 264? Even in the ODI series against SL, he was getting squared up with the new ball and looked all at sea early on, just that he managed to survive those first 3-5 overs, which is about as long as the white ball swings and unlike in Test cricket, he can easily target the 4th and 5th bowlers in ODIs. Certainly, I haven't seen a single attribute of a Test batsman in his batting. He is no different to Raina or Rohit, an ODI slogger who is still in the Test side based on home ODI performances whereas Rahul, the 3rd highest run getter in Ranji last season and a twin centurion in this year's Duleep Trophy on.a tricky Kotla pitch warms the benches and Uthappa (another guy who had a brilliant Duleep Trophy including a 100 on a green top at Lahli,where he scored in 1 innings about 30% of the total runs scored by both the teams in the entire match) doesn't even make the squad.

Yes, Dhawan scored a hundred on debut (so did Raina) and had 2 decent inns in NZ (Raina had 2 decent inns on tough pitches in WI in 2011 and a 80 at Lords in the first test in Eng.in the same year). So how are they any different? They have similarly mediocre FC/Ranji records too. So how is Dhawan ok but Raina not? Both are awful.

msp wrote:In fact this was one of his better days in away tests though he took only one wicket.......

yeah maan...I told ya..if you set the bar of expectation so low...even Sehwag batting at no. 7 ( ahead of Dhoni) will sneak in with his off.spinning skills in the spin bowler slot

ShankyCricket wrote:The question is, what did Dhawan do to even be picked for these 2 tests after being dropped in England? Based on ODI performances at home against SL? A team against whom even a grade 3 slogger like Rohit scored a 264? Even in the ODI series against SL, he was getting squared up with the new ball and looked all at sea early on, just that he managed to survive those first 3-5 overs, which is about as long as the white ball swings and unlike in Test cricket, he can easily target the 4th and 5th bowlers in ODIs. Certainly, I haven't seen a single attribute of a Test batsman in his batting. He is no different to Raina or Rohit, an ODI slogger who is still in the Test side based on home ODI performances whereas Rahul, the 3rd highest run getter in Ranji last season and a twin centurion in this year's Duleep Trophy on.a tricky Kotla pitch warms the benches and Uthappa (another guy who had a brilliant Duleep Trophy including a 100 on a green top at Lahli,where he scored in 1 innings about 30% of the total runs scored by both the teams in the entire match) doesn't even make the squad.

Yes, Dhawan scored a hundred on debut (so did Raina) and had 2 decent inns in NZ (Raina had 2 decent inns on tough pitches in WI in 2011 and a 80 at Lords in the first test in Eng.in the same year). So how are they any different? They have similarly mediocre FC/Ranji records too. So how is Dhawan ok but Raina not? Both are awful.

dhawan has 3 credits which has afforded him a run.....
1) Champions trophy in Eng..I know pitches were flat...but these were not the subcontinental Pattas and in a couple of games the pitch was quite juicy
2) test in NZ where he scored a 95ihs
3) test in NZ where he scored a hundred

Ashwin wasn't just a "letdown" in South Africa. Sending down 34 wicketless overs on a Day 4/5 pitch taking variable bounce with a cushiom of 457 runs on the board is one of the worst displays of spin bowling I've seen from any spinner from any country in test history.

I go to sleep now....with that that eerie, creepy feeling when I wake up tomm......Aus already are or looking like getting 150 runs ahead......with James Anderson ( equivalent) nearing a 100 and Rohit / Vijay bowling at him, Dhoni waiting for a declaration.....
and then India will fold for 200 runs.....taking the 4 inning "bowling on the wearing pitch out of the equation"

I won't be surprised at my sense of dejavu
Good night

Indians are up for this. Been chirpy, umpire has gotten involved. I'd hate for one of their players to get banned for a game.




That's normally the point where BCCI decide to boycott the tour

Bad move from Rohit to sledge MJ.

Johnson has smashed the Indian bowlers all round the park this morning. 67 off 53 deliveries.

130/2 in the first session. Only 57 behind with 4 wickets in hand.

Jeez I've sat through both sessions... Just short of remarkable. India really are toothless, with 23, Lyon is the tailender who missed out

They are falling to pieces here. From a possible winning position to 100 (so far) behind. Should have kept Kohli as captain.

So a 97 run lead. All out 505.

Looking forward to this last session today.

As Shastri said during the tea break "We are in for a scrap." Well, they sure got one.
The Indian bowling was totally dismantled. Our bowlers should enjoy the challenge now.

KP_fan wrote:I go to sleep now....with that that eerie, creepy feeling when I wake up tomm......Aus already are or looking like getting 150 runs ahead......with James Anderson ( equivalent) nearing a 100 and Rohit / Vijay bowling at him, Dhoni waiting for a declaration.....
and then India will fold for 200 runs.....taking the 4 inning "bowling on the wearing pitch out of the equation"

I won't be surprised at my sense of dejavu
Good night

well I woke up to predicted horrors.
Dhoni doesn't surprise. He returns and Aus path to 4-0 is looking unhindered

if this was FB, i would have liked my post

Well, I'm off. Gonna take a two hour power nap, then go watch the cricket.

KP Fan spot on with his prediction of some James Anderson type lower order runs

Did you see Mitchell Johnson's innings, VTR?
James Anderson could never match that! He doesn't have the power nor variety of strokeplay.

Not really surprised with Starc's effort... but even Lyon was finding the ropes.
In fact, all 11 Australian batsmen scored boundaries.

No I was soundly asleep, but I do recognise that Mitch is a hundred times the batsman Anderson will ever be!

I think his point was about doing all the hard work then letting the tail undo it, that does appear to have happened - 300-6 wasn't it?

250-6 actually. I'd be furious with that as a supporter

since we have 9 wickets in hand and deficit is minimal...if we bat all of tomm...then Aus has all of last day to win/ lose or draw the game
so it really comes down to batting all day tomm, with a normal 3.3+ RPO to be in with a CHANCE on final day

VTR wrote:250-6 actually. I'd be furious with that as a supporter

I was thrilled with that as a supporter.

They seem to do it with ease... grab the match by the scruff of the neck and blast the bowling away. Totally demoralising stuff.
The rate at which they score is also something to behold. I never see any other team do that on a regular basis.

2/128 at an economy rate of 4.00. Nice to see Ashwin justifying his selection overseas yet again.

The Loaded Dog wrote:

VTR wrote:250-6 actually. I'd be furious with that as a supporter

I was thrilled with that as a supporter.

They seem to do it with ease... grab the match by the scruff of the neck and blast the bowling away. Totally demoralising stuff.
The rate at which they score is also something to behold. I never see any other team do that on a regular basis.

True! I loved the Jimmy/Root partnership in the summer - comedy gold. Also Bresnan nearly made a hundred against India once. But if I was an India fan I would be putting my foot through the TV every time!

KP_fan wrote:since we have 9 wickets in hand and deficit is minimal...if we bat all of tomm...then Aus has all of last day to win/ lose or draw the game
so it really comes down to batting all day tomm, with a normal 3.3+ RPO to be in with a CHANCE on final day

Didn't see any of the third day but India have transformed a position of decent strength to one of worrying weakness. Shades of the last Ashes series with the Australian final four wickets outscoring the first six, although this time without Haddin coming to the party. From the reports, India made a total botch of how they greeted Johnson the batsman, both with the ball and verbally. Still great credit to him though and, of course, Smith with a ton in his first match as captain.

I don't know what the pitch is like and how much it's expected to deteriorate by the final day but I would still expect an Australian win from this position. One of the difficulties for India is that so many of the Australian batsmen are capable of scoring so quickly. Even if India bat into the final morning, I would still fancy Australia to get, say, 300 off 75 overs. In a strange sort of way, a full day of 90 overs to get, say, 260 might present more challenges with an unsure mindset as to which gear to bat in. That all said, India need to bat well into the final session of day 4 as a minimum.

guildfordbat wrote:

KP_fan wrote:since we have 9 wickets in hand and deficit is minimal...if we bat all of tomm...then Aus has all of last day to win/ lose or draw the game
so it really comes down to batting all day tomm, with a normal 3.3+ RPO to be in with a CHANCE on final day

Didn't see any of the third day but India have transformed a position of decent strength to one of worrying weakness. Shades of the last Ashes series with the Australian final four wickets outscoring the first six, although this time without Haddin coming to the party. From the reports, India made a total botch of how they greeted Johnson the batsman, both with the ball and verbally. Still great credit to him though and, of course, Smith with a ton in his first match as captain.

I don't know what the pitch is like and how much it's expected to deteriorate by the final day but I would still predict an Australian win from this position. One of the difficulties for India is that so many of the Australian batsmen are capable of scoring so quickly. Even if India bat into the final morning, I would still fancy Australia to get, say, 300 off 75 overs. In a strange sort of way, a full day of 90 overs to get, say, 260 might present more challenges with an unsure mindset as to which gear to bat in. That all said, India need to bat well into the final session of day 4 as a minimum.

Excellent summation considering you slept soundly through it all, Guildford.

It was indeed a shade of the last Ashes... but with yet another surprising dimension. It sort of exploded out of nowhere after the loss of Marsh and Haddin. It took me a little by surprise I must admit. They just clicked all of a sudden and piled on the runs.

I had to duck out for a short while (only 10-15 mins) and couldn't believe how quickly Johnson had got going when I got back. Then Starc and to a lesser extent, Hazelwood and Lyon got in on the act as well. There was such a buzz at the ground. Henry Blowfeld sounded quite excited too on the local radio! (I struggle listening to the TV commentators)

Seen very little . Too much work...

But a heck of a comeback from the Australian tail ! Much credit to Smith of course (more impressive by the day)but Johnson really seems to have changed the game. I get the impression he had a bit of cooperation from the Indian bowlers ...far too much short stuff , no ? I mean , Johnson is a handy , aggressive , sometimes spectacular tail end bat ; but not quite an all rounder in the strictest sense as he has too many low scores for mine (won't revisit the "what constitutes an allrounder" thread ! Opinions differ but that is mine) ... But my point is that a "normal" approach to Johnson when he comes out to bat ; ie off stump channel , as per any competent batsman , while it may well see a few boundaries , will generally get him before he does too much damage...they seem to have fallen into the trap of trying to bounce him out ; and been heavily punished for it . That said , Mitch does seem to like the Gabba. Wonder if this knock will fire up his bowling , which has been a bit off so far I gather?
India aren't dead yet ; only twenty odd behind now with nine in hand ...a couple of good sessions and they might be able to present Australia with some problems batting last. But , although they didn't implode with the bat after that demoralizing experience in the field , I still have a feeling they can fade away pretty quickly when a couple of things go wrong for them.
And I just don't think they have the bowling to dismiss Australia twice.

Hope it is set up for a good finish Sunday as I might actually be able to sit and watch it all.

Mitch gets Kohli. Gone for 1.

Dhawan has been injured in the nets... so has been retired hurt... but they will be assessing him to see if he can return to the crease at a later stage.

Oh dear. The rout continues.

Rahane, R Sarma and Dhoni all fall in quick sucession. Johnson on fire this morning.
India 87/5... still trailing by 10 runs.

Johnson on fire and 3 wickets already this morning. Think it was Raf who said he often bowls well after scoring runs. Anyway, Kohli, Rahane and Sharma all falling to his pace. Absolute brute of a throat ball (shades of Andy Roberts for older posters) to account for Rahane, lobbing up a simple catch for Lyon at gulley.

India in freefall as Dhoni walks across a straight one from Hazlewood and is plumb lbw.

Now 89/5 with Dhawan reportedly in hospital being checked out.  Almost impossible to see India coming back from here ....