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6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February

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6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February Empty 6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February

Post by George Carlin Sun Feb 08, 2015 7:08 am

6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February Scotla11       6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February Wales_10
SCOTLAND v WALES
Sunday 15 February 2015
KO 15:00 (GMT)
BT Murrayfield, Edinburgh

Live on BBC1

Referee: Glen Jackson (NZR)
AR1: George Clancy (IRFU)
AR2: Dudley Phillips (IRFU)
TMO: Simon McDowell (IRFU)

A. Teams:

1. SCOTLAND
6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February Kareng10
15 Stuart Hogg (Glasgow Warriors);
14 Sean Lamont (Glasgow Warriors);
13 Mark Bennett (Glasgow Warriors);
12 Alex Dunbar (Glasgow Warriors);
11 Tim Visser (Edinburgh Rugby);
10 Finn Russell (Glasgow Warriors);
9 Greig Laidlaw CAPTAIN (Gloucester);

1 Alasdair Dickinson (Edinburgh Rugby);
2 Ross Ford (Edinburgh Rugby);
3 Geoff Cross (London Irish);
4 Richie Gray (Castres);
5 Jonny Gray (Glasgow Warriors);
6 Rob Harley (Glasgow Warriors),
7 Blair Cowan (London Irish);
8 Johnnie Beattie (Castres);

16 Fraser Brown (Glasgow Warriors);
17 Gordon Reid (Glasgow Warriors);
18 Jon Welsh (Glasgow Warriors);
19 Jim Hamilton (Saracens);
20 Alasdair Strokosch (USA Perpignan);
21 Sam Hidalgo-Clyne (Edinburgh Rugby);
22 Greig Tonks (Edinburgh Rugby);
23 Matt Scott (Edinburgh Rugby);

2. WALES
6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February Erinri10
15 Leigh Halfpenny (Toulon)
14 Alex Cuthbert (Cardiff Blues)
13 Jonathan Davies (ASM Clermont Auvergne)
12 Jamie Roberts (Racing Metro)
11 Liam Williams (Scarlets)
10 Dan Biggar (Ospreys)
09 Rhys Webb (Ospreys)

01 Gethin Jenkins (Cardiff Blues)
02 Richard Hibbard (Gloucester)
03 Aaron Jarvis (Ospreys)
04 Jake Ball (Scarlets)
05 Alun Wyn Jones (Ospreys)
06 Dan Lydiate (Ospreys)
07 Sam Warburton (Cardiff Blues, CAPT)
08 Taulupe Faletau (Newport Gwent Dragons)

16 Scott Baldwin (Ospreys)
17 Paul James (Bath Rugby)
18 Scott Andrews (Cardiff Blues)
19 Luke Charteris (Racing Metro)
20 Justin Tipuric (Ospreys)
21 Mike Phillips (Racing Metro)
22 Rhys Priestland (Scarlets)
23 Scott Williams (Scarlets)

B. Form (last 4 games):

1. SCOTLAND

07/02/15 - France 15 - 8 Scotland

22/11/14 - Scotland 37 - 12 Tonga

15/11/14 - Scotland 16 - 24 New Zealand

08/11/14 - Scotland 41 - 31 Argentina

2. WALES

06/02/15 - Wales 16 - 21 England

29/11/14 - Wales 12 - 6 South Africa

22/11/14 - Wales 16 - 34 New Zealand

15/11/14  - Wales 17 - 13 Fiji

C. Head to Head:

120 Played 120

48 Wins 69

69 Losses 48

3 Draws 3

180 Tries 227

80 Conversions 112

130 Penalties 142

30 Drop Goals 25

1,204 Points 1,578


Last edited by George Carlin on Sun Feb 15, 2015 7:16 am; edited 3 times in total
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6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February Empty Re: 6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February

Post by bedfordwelsh Sun Feb 08, 2015 7:56 am

George,

Games on Sunday not Saturday Wink

As for the game well I said all along that I wasn't looking forward to this game and after the games over Friday and Saturday I am far more uncomfortable about our trip up there.

The areas where we struggled on Friday namely the scrum, lineout and breakdown is where you guys seemed very good in yesterday against France.

Gatland HAS to make changes he simply can't say same again and expect it to work, I would make 5 possibly 6 changes but the problem being is those players I would change have been stalwarts for Gatland so I don't know if he has the minerals to drop them all.

For me I would pick the following:

James (poss Evans)
Hibbard (poss Owens if fit)
Lee
AWJ
Ball
Warburton
Faletau
Tipuric (think his style will suit this game)

Webb
Biggar

Halfpenny
Doc
Sc Williams
Amos

Li Williams
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6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February Empty Re: 6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February

Post by majesticimperialman Sun Feb 08, 2015 8:01 am

After watching the France v Scotland game yesterday, i would say that you have to fancy Scotland to win.

Wales just seemed to me that they could not be bothered on Friday. In the first half they played some good rugby, in the second half they had simply switched off.


Last edited by majesticimperialman on Sun Feb 08, 2015 8:05 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by bedfordwelsh Sun Feb 08, 2015 8:03 am

maj,

Agreed and like mentioned I didn't fancy the trip before the first round of games.
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Post by RDW Sun Feb 08, 2015 8:25 am

Scotland will have to face a backlash from Wales because if they lose this their championship will be over.

Let's not forget that 2 years ago Wales were badly beaten by Ireland in their first game then went on to win the championship.

Best not to write Wales off yet...

As far Scotland - heroic performance but we still lost. We've also lost the last 8 games against Wales.

It doesn't get any easier.

I think our chances rest on injuries - Dunbar looked in a bad way, so unless Matt Scott is fit again we're going to have to play Horne or Lamont at 12, which is absolutely terrifying. Shocked

Denton isn't going to be fit yet so we're stuck with Beattie.

I'd definitely not say we're favourites!

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Post by George Carlin Sun Feb 08, 2015 8:34 am

Thanks Bedford - OP updated.

Predictably, who will win will come down to (a) injuries and (b) whether the coaches are strong enough to replace underperforming players.

As far as we are concerned:

(a) Injuries

We have to be worried about (i) Tommy Seymour, who left the game quite early after taking a blow to his hip, (ii) Blair Cowan, who was subbed with what seemed to be a wrist problem and (iii) Alex Dunbar, who seemed to take a hit to the sternum. We cannot afford to lose any of those guys because their replacements are either untested or aren't close to being the same quality. The usual problem if you're a Scotland fan. We also lose Euan Murray because it's a Sunday.

(b) Crapness

Most Scotland fans would agree that Johnny Beattie was disappointing - he tried to force too much, basic skills let him down and he received a yellow card. The problem is that we don't really have replacement cover at 8. What we'd all like is for Kelly Brown to be brought in at 8, where he has played before, but Cotter doesn't see him as part of his plans for this tournament, for some reason. I hope that he looks at Beattie's performance on video replay and thinks again.

Other Scots posters don't agree, but I thought that Tim Visser was very poor in a number of respects and if Maitland was fit, I would drop him back in. The rationale for giving him another chance is that he needs to respond with a big performance and he knows every inch of that Edinburgh pitch.

In terms of other issues, Dougie Fife looked a bit lost when he came on (he is just a youngfeller to be fair) and Peter Horne will be horribly underpowered against the likes of JD2 and Roberts. It's a game that is screaming for Sean Lamont to come back as a utility sub.

But without a sniff of irony, Wales fans have good reason to be nervous about this game. In our last 2 home games, we scored against and nearly beat the All Blacks and put 5 great tries on a full strength Pumas side.
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Post by bedfordwelsh Sun Feb 08, 2015 8:56 am

Wales seem to have two injury worries at the moment North and Lee. Now for me even putting his injury aside I wouldn't pick North at the moment so the big worry will be Lee given who the replacements are as well.

So our selection will come down to whether Gatland has the minerals to drop some of his stalwarts from the past few years.
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Post by Guest Sun Feb 08, 2015 9:44 am

Well, I'm always slightly nervous about playing Scotland like I am about playing any team. However, the best compliment I can give them is that this year I am seriously sh*ting it! I saw some really good things yesterday in France v Scotland. Often I think the Scots would put up a plucky forwards dominated performance where they try to squeeze the life and a win out of the opposition. I'm thinking the Aus away win in the rain, South Africa games, etc. - sorry Scotland fans if I'm not accurate in that. Happy to be corrected. Just say! But what I saw yesterday was much more invention. A 10 who was a live wire and kept the defence honest (I hate that saying! Thanks Jiffy!); still decent forwards willing and able to do the grunt; loose forwards scrapping for everything; backs able to score tries (or look like they could).

My great fear is that Gats will revert to type and play the sam...... What the hell am I on about! I KNOW what Gats will do. The exact same gameplan and style as the last 4 years. Same players, same tactics, same patterns. The only dynamic variable is the result - sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. IF we can get Roberts coming onto the ball flat and at pace then we may be able to cause problems. That allows JD2 on his shoulder for the offload, or some disorganisation in the opposition backline if roberts is brought down and we can recycle quickly. But all of this relies on good clearing out at the ruck. We weren't good enough on Friday. We were good in the firs half at the ruck on opposition ball, especially when they got isolated as we won a number of turnovers this way. But on our own ball we weren't great. England were strong over the ball and our clearing out was weak. There's nothing I detest more, nothing that looks more feeble than your players charging in to clear out and just sliding off the side of the opposition player, leaving him merrily jackaling the ball and/or slowing it down. Webb came in for a lot of stick on Friday, but he wasn't helped by the mess at his feet.

So, we need quick ruck ball. AWJ, Lee, Gethin (if he starts), Ball, Lydiate - these boys need more grunt, more work rate at the ruck on our own ball. Jenkins, Faletau, Warbs - they're all pretty effective on opposition ruck ball. But they've got to step up on our own ball.

Props - oh hell! Jarvis came on for Lee and, as expected, struggled. I'd give Lee another go if he's not injured. I think the occasion might have got to him - a bit of over arousal, so to speak, meaning he tired earlier than expected. Jenkins is marmite with the refs - either wins a load of pens or is penalised off the park. It seems odd how he yo yo's so much in this area so for me it's his technique which must have some dodgy elements to it that some refs are happy with and others are not. I'm never confident with it though. Should he start? If he can up his workrate around the park from Friday then yes, but otherwise James is a better scrummager with a lower workrate so would get my nod.

Backs - if we can get the above bits right - platform, fast ruck ball - then I think the backs will do ok even with out limited gameplan. But as I've said its so reliant on the collisions and the speed of ruck that if we get that bit wrong then we're f*cked - the old 'lack of plan b' that people talk about. 'But we didn't do plan A either' - yeah, shut it Gats! The only backs I'd change, as I said before the tournament, would be to being Liam Williams in. He has a bit of X factor about him and is in good form. England had some slippery characters the other night which was the difference in scoreline. Slower, stodgier players would not have score those tries. Williams has that. Very had to stop on the gainline as he's all arms and legs. But who drops out? I'm not a 1/2p fan boy but his kicking is useful (I'd be happy with Biggar's though to be honest). But Cuthbert is badly off form. North is at least in some form for club. So, if North is fit I'd go North, 1/2p on wing and Williams at FB. Switch out North for Cuthbert in case of injury with Amos on bench. Actually no - if North is OK then Amos comes onto the bench for Cuthert for me anyway. As he offers something different than the big wings.

But the backs' discussion is academic for me if we don't get the platform and quick ball from phase play. With it our backs are fine. Without it we're doomed. We just do not have backs Like Shane Williams anymore who can create something from nothing when we're going backwards.

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Post by BigTrevsbigmac Sun Feb 08, 2015 10:02 am

I admired the way Scotland played against France but I think they will come unstuck against the Welsh defence if they try to spread it and run as much.
Has the potential to be a cracker though.

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Post by bedfordwelsh Sun Feb 08, 2015 10:12 am

Griff,

I would love to be able to dis-agree with you and say that Gatland can't be stupid enough to stick with the same side but injuries aside there is a damn good chance he will and let 'them redeem themselves'.

Of course if he does and they don't then we will be played 2 lost 2 with an away trip to Paris next up.

Liam Williams showed more attacking intent in his cameo than either North or Cuthbert did in the whole game so please for the love of god start him. JD has little club form where as Doc as at least have club form even if he was poor Friday.

I have said for a long time now that Jenkins just can't cut it anymore but have been shot down everytime but he was very poor on Friday and I would start James or Evans maybe.

Our lineout again failed, we must have the worst stats of all the teams and against the Gray brothers it won't get any easier.
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Post by rumpelstiltskindoh Sun Feb 08, 2015 11:23 am

Wales-wise, it's time to throw away the comfort blanket of Warrenball and go for lots of offloading and mix up the tactics. At the moment, Lydiate, Roberts, and 1/2p at 15 dictate the Welsh style. So instead, we should start with Evans, Charteris, and Navidi or Tipuric in the pack; Sc Wms in the centre, Liam at 15.

Scotland might well win, but we have to (re-) start somewhere!

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Post by 123456789 Sun Feb 08, 2015 12:28 pm

Is it really likely that Gatland, who's notoriously stubborn, is likely to make many changes this close to the World Cup? I also think you're overestimating your problems you've lost one game, admittedly to a horrendous English team at home. Also the last time these two teams played without a card in the game was 2004, so we can expect a sin-binning or red-card to have an impact.

From a Scottish perspective, I think Beattie and Laidlaw ought to be looked at as they were the weak links in the Scotland team although both will be retained as the alternatives are either injured or have been left out. If Dunbar's injured we have to hope for a return from Scott or we are fecked, the same with Seymour. If we defend like we did against the French then we should be able to cope with the Welsh as, unless they pick Liam Williams, their attack was very linear and predictable. If Beattie doesn't pick up then Faletau will have a great time but I'm not too worried because he has the ability to match Faletau when he's up for it. I'm also expecting a big game from Hogg given how well he played yesterday and last year's debacle. The Grays will hopefully prove too athletic for Jake Ball although the Welsh back row is a lot more powerful than ours.
I'd go for:

1. Dickinson
2. Ford
3. Cross
4. Gray
5. Gray
6. Harley
7. Cowan
8. Beattie
9. SHC - it will be Laidlaw but I've never been impressed by him he's slow, small and takes too long to pass
10. Russell
11. Seymour
12. Dunbar
13. Bennett
14. Maitland
15. Hogg

16. Grant
17. Brown
18. Welsh
19. Hamilton
20. Watson
21. Laidlaw
22. Scott
23. Visser/ Lamont if Maitland's not fit


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Post by TJ Sun Feb 08, 2015 12:33 pm

Its funny the views on laidlaw. iu agree that last year he had lost confidence and was too slow but I thought he was perfectly competent yesterday. He is a limited player perhaps but he is very good at the basics, get to ruck, get the ball away. He only kicked 4 times yesterday.

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6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February Empty Re: 6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February

Post by 123456789 Sun Feb 08, 2015 12:38 pm

It's not that I thought Laidlaw played particularly badly yesterday I just don't think he's a great player, certainly not in the same league as Cusiter or Blair yet seems to have achieved untouchable status within the squad. I was at Murrayfield when he made his debut in 2010 and it was the result of an injury crisis and he only got on because Blair took a niggle and the game was gone. He seems to have more off games than on and I don't see why he has superior status to Cusiter, Pyrgos or SHC, he does the basics well but so does Pyrgos.

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Post by Exiledinborders Sun Feb 08, 2015 12:40 pm

BigTrevsbigmac wrote:I admired the way Scotland played against France but I think they will come unstuck against the Welsh defence if they try to spread it and run as much.
Has the potential to be a cracker though.
I agree but Vern Cotter is no fool. I assume he will follow England's tactics. Attack round the fringes and kick unless there is a clear scoring opportunity. If so will learn something about Finn Russell - whether he has the discipline to stick to a plan. I hope so.

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Post by TJ Sun Feb 08, 2015 12:51 pm

Cus is the best for sure - is he not broken again tho? - and Laidlaw is taking the place kicks

Against wales you can kick long and infield confident they will not run the ball back at you. I'd like to see Scotland continuing to mix it up and keep them guessing - chips over the top - basically you need to get the wales backs turning and running around and not sure if to sit deep or flat

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Post by bsando Sun Feb 08, 2015 12:54 pm

I've managed to wrangle a free ticket for this fixture. Are any Scottish or Welsh fans driving up to edinburgh from London or Cardiff for the game? Potentially looking for a lift, I can contribute fuel money/banter!

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Post by RDW Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:13 pm

The Scotland medical team provided the following player update after yesterday's RBS 6 Nations loss to France in Paris.
Wing Tommy Seymour sustained a hip injury in the 18th minute of the match and will require further assessment on his return to Edinburgh.
At this stage it is uncertain if he will be passed fit for this Sunday's round two RBS 6 Nations match against Wales at BT Murrayfield (kick-off 3pm).
There are a number of other players who also require management and assessment by the medical team early in the week, they include: Mark Bennett (leg), Geoff Cross (leg), Alex Dunbar (neck/shoulder), Robert Harley (leg) and Alasdair Strokosch (leg).

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Post by 123456789 Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:22 pm

Imagine if Dunbar, Bennett and Seymour are all out....

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Post by demosthenes Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:24 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:
The Scotland medical team provided the following player update after yesterday's RBS 6 Nations loss to France in Paris.
Wing Tommy Seymour sustained a hip injury in the 18th minute of the match and will require further assessment on his return to Edinburgh.
At this stage it is uncertain if he will be passed fit for this Sunday's round two RBS 6 Nations match against Wales at BT Murrayfield (kick-off 3pm).
There are a number of other players who also require management and assessment by the medical team early in the week, they include: Mark Bennett (leg), Geoff Cross (leg), Alex Dunbar (neck/shoulder), Robert Harley (leg) and Alasdair Strokosch (leg).

Oh my!!!

Bennett, Dunbar and Seymour injured? Here's hoping they are all, at least the centre's, just niggles.

And both Harley and Strokosch? Well we all know who should be called up, but will he be? At least we have till Sunday.

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Post by TJ Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:24 pm

123456789 wrote:Imagine if Dunbar, Bennett and Seymour are all out....

*closes eyes, sticks fingers in ears and goes lalalalalalalalalalal*

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Post by RDW Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:26 pm

Thats a fairly standard injury list after
an international - the majority will hopefully be fit.

Dunbar is my biggest worry - looked like stinger.

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Post by George Carlin Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:27 pm

123456789 wrote:Imagine if Dunbar, Bennett and Seymour are all out....
6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February Fes_fa11
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Post by demosthenes Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:36 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Thats a fairly standard injury list after
an international - the majority will hopefully be fit.

Dunbar is my biggest worry - looked like stinger.

Agreed, it's actually quite a short list, for an international. But, with our luck....

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Post by 123456789 Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:41 pm

When I saw squad update I thought Cusiter, Brown and Barclay were going to be called up but it was bad news instead

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Post by 123456789 Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:49 pm

I actually read something, I think around the last world cup, that it actually takes something like three weeks on average for the whole body to recover from an international rugby game, two weeks for a professional one and a week for the standard junior/ amateur game. Therefore the injuries are no surprise really, especially when you consider the junior recovery period. When I was at school there were weeks when I'd play a club match on sunday, train at school monday, train with club tuesday followed by training with the seniors, then play on wednesday for school, then train with school and club on the thursday, then have another school game on friday before drinking lots on the friday and saturday night which is known to hinder recovery.If the current pros were doing the same and then playing week in week out without sufficient recovery time before doing the same with internationals. Then you add in the fact that some play for the Lions and the World cup which tends to be at a higher intensity with more frequent matches. It's no wonder the we have so many early retirements now and so many poor performances following world cups and Lions tours.

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Post by englandglory4ever Sun Feb 08, 2015 1:51 pm

I was impressed with the France v Scotland game. Full of pace and commitment from both. That makes it very difficult to predict how they will go against Wales or any other side until we actually see it. Looking forward to next week after which we will know a lot more.

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Post by Exiledinborders Sun Feb 08, 2015 10:15 pm

Gethin Jenkins had yet another shocker. I acknowledge he was a great player but he is a liability now.

I do not watch much Pro12 rugby (I watch AP) so I am not that aware of alternatives. Is there no one better?


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Post by Guest Sun Feb 08, 2015 10:18 pm

Exiledinborders wrote:Gethin Jenkins had yet another shocker. I acknowledge he was a great player but he is a liability now.

I do not watch much Pro12 rugby (I watch AP) so I am not that aware of alternatives. Is there no one better?


Yet he was very good in the Autumn internationals about 12 weeks ago. So what do you do?!

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Post by Guest Sun Feb 08, 2015 10:21 pm

Griff wrote:
Exiledinborders wrote:Gethin Jenkins had yet another shocker. I acknowledge he was a great player but he is a liability now.

I do not watch much Pro12 rugby (I watch AP) so I am not that aware of alternatives. Is there no one better?


Yet he was very good in the Autumn internationals about 12 weeks ago. So what do you do?!

Just to add: what I do know is that when he's written off (like over the summer) then he tends to come good (like in the autumn). He's been written off now after this game. If he's picked next week I expect him to have a stormer!

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Post by The Saint Sun Feb 08, 2015 10:24 pm

Griff wrote:
Exiledinborders wrote:Gethin Jenkins had yet another shocker. I acknowledge he was a great player but he is a liability now.

I do not watch much Pro12 rugby (I watch AP) so I am not that aware of alternatives. Is there no one better?


Yet he was very good in the Autumn internationals about 12 weeks ago. So what do you do?!

He's been good for Blues too. But most fans agree that Rob Evans should either be starting or on the bench. Personally I think Jenkins is much better off the bench and I don't rate James; so Evans it is.

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Post by Guest Sun Feb 08, 2015 10:28 pm

Just saying that 'had another shocker' is a bit inaccurate as he was good in the AIs (the last time he played for wales). Some posters seem to live off lazy stereotypes!

He had one mare where he got on the wrong side of the ref. I forget the game. But the very next game he was winning penalties left right and centre. That showed he wasn't past it, just got a rof who didn't agree with his scrummaging. Interpretation and ref variation is a whole other argument though.

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Post by Exiledinborders Sun Feb 08, 2015 10:42 pm

Griff wrote:Just saying that 'had another shocker' is a bit inaccurate as he was good in the AIs (the last time he played for wales). Some posters seem to live off lazy stereotypes!

He had one mare where he got on the wrong side of the ref. I forget the game. But the very next game he was winning penalties left right and centre. That showed he wasn't past it, just got a rof who didn't agree with his scrummaging. Interpretation and ref variation is a whole other argument though.
There has been more than one game where he got on the wrong side of the ref. I think he has a reputation with refs for hinging.

I said in my earlier posts that I was not aware of alternatives because I watch AP. I now realise that I regularly see Paul James who always looks solid to me.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Sun Feb 08, 2015 11:01 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Thats a fairly standard injury list after
an international - the majority will hopefully be fit.

Dunbar is my biggest worry - looked like stinger.

If Matt Scott is fit then it's probably an injury we could survive. The potential injuries to Harley, Cowan and Bennett scare me more due to the replacements. A back row of Strokosch, Blake and Beattie would be eaten alive, and infuriate most Scotland fans when you consider that Brown, Barclay and Hogg are all fit and in form!!

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Post by George Carlin Mon Feb 09, 2015 6:28 am

I wouldn't be too worried about Gethin. Every prop who is a cap centurion has a bad day with a ref or gets their backside handed to them by a younger man having a good game. I've seen it happen to Os du Randt, so nobody is immune. Jenkins against Cross is a pretty even match up. I suppose that means we will have Jon Welsh on the bench, which I don't have a problem with although I wish Willem Nel was SQ by now.

Injury problems are the stock in trade of a Scotland fan's life. Our first XV is clearly now intensely competitive but other than a few areas like lock, where the quality is stacked up, we always risk large swirling gaps in quality surfacing. Not that Wales don't have that problem too in some areas.

From a cycloptic Scots perspective, hopefully Gats will live up to his reputation as a single minded and supremely confident selector and just pick exactly the same 23 as last time. I don't want to play against Liam Williams - the try he pulled out of thin air against Glasgow a month ago just reminded me of that. I also know Scott Williams is playing well and JD2 really is not, so again, long live the status quo.  Very Happy
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Post by bedfordwelsh Mon Feb 09, 2015 8:08 am

GC,

I am and have been for sometime worried about Jenkins, yes he's been playing well for the Blues but he's just not up to it at this level IMO.

Watching Scrum V last night I agreed with Alfie that we should pick and out and out scrummager first rather than an excellent all round the field player that Jenkins HAS been and who can scrummage.

That said and with news that North has been cleared to play on the weekend I don't expect hardly any changes for Scotland with Gatland given them the chance to redeem themselves. If they don't then I will say now it will be the wooden spoon battle for us with Italy on last day.
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Post by RDW Mon Feb 09, 2015 8:33 am

I'm flabbergasted that North has been cleared to play, but I do hope he genuinely is fine as opposed to the management being stubborn after their gross mis-management of a clearly concussed player on Saturday. I'm sure that's not the case though.

If he is actually fine then he must have a thick skull - that was two clear blows he got, and most worryingly in the second one I'm not sure if he was even hit in the head, yet he was still knocked out!

Why the need to keep him on the pitch and play him again this week? On his day he's a world class player but Liam Williams is an outstanding replacement, and if North is worrying about a head knock (even subconsciously) then he's not going to be as effective - that was plain to see on Saturday.

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Post by LondonTiger Mon Feb 09, 2015 8:36 am

bedfordwelsh wrote:Watching Scrum V last night I agreed with Alfie that we should pick and out and out scrummager first rather than an excellent all round the field player that Jenkins HAS been and who can scrummage.

Who though? James is a long way below what he once was and at times has really struggled in the AP. Lydiate out would be my only enforced change to your pack. The Williams boys coming in, my changes to your backs.

Scotland, for all their confidence, lost as well. Yet again they apparently created opportunities but failed to finish them off. We have heard that for a few years now. Perhaps (as with England who also say the same) they do not have the required skill level to execute the attacks with sufficient precision to actually score?

If both teams play at their best (as demonstrated in past internationals) Wales will win. Sure Scotland fans say they can be better - but until they actually do it we can all just wait for that.

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Post by bedfordwelsh Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:03 am

LT,

For me James is still the better technical and stronger scrummager but we have Rob Evans in the squad so why not use him.

Agree with Lydiate but he still does the job that's asked of him he only missed one tackle all game so for him to be dropped it would require a change in style maybe and I don't think Gatland will do that.
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Post by George Carlin Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:08 am

LondonTiger wrote:
bedfordwelsh wrote:Watching Scrum V last night I agreed with Alfie that we should pick and out and out scrummager first rather than an excellent all round the field player that Jenkins HAS been and who can scrummage.

Who though? James is a long way below what he once was and at times has really struggled in the AP. Lydiate out would be my only enforced change to your pack. The Williams boys coming in, my changes to your backs.

Scotland, for all their confidence, lost as well. Yet again they apparently created opportunities but failed to finish them off. We have heard that for a few years now. Perhaps (as with England who also say the same) they do not have the required skill level to execute the attacks with sufficient precision to actually score?

If both teams play at their best (as demonstrated in past internationals) Wales will win. Sure Scotland fans say they can be better - but until they actually do it we can all just wait for that.
Things are different from last year (and previous years) LT. The final pieces of the puzzle have been added to the backline in the shape of Alex Dunbar and Mark Bennett and you only need to look at the Glasgow v Bath match this season to know how good a combination that is. Add to that Tommy Seymour and a rejuvenated Stuart Hogg and you have a cutting edge.

Scotland didn't lose because they didn't take their chances. They lost because of simple penalty mistakes and by having a relatively lightweight set of forward replacements in comparison to the 21 and 23 stone monsters that France brought on. We will always suffer most through injuries to our first XV, but you needn't worry about the aggregate quality any more.

Other indicators? In last year's autumn internationals, we scored a couple of average tries. In this season's three games, we scored 11 very good ones. We'll give England a game this time.
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Post by RDW Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:09 am

Welsh fans certainly shouldn't panic. You played below par and lost to an England team with their tails up, but you're not a bad team over night.

Remember Scotland don't have the overwhelming power up front that England used to great effect, and we've tended to struggle to contain your big runners in the past (although our defence has been much better). You've got one of the best defences in the championship and, although we had some good individual moments of brilliance from the likes of Hogg and Bennett, it all counts for nought if we don't get any points from it.

We are always on the wrong side of the penalty count for some reason, and 1/2P will punish us for that.

Wales are certainly favourites for this one, but Scotland can win.  Given we've only won 8 of the last 41 6N games, you can see why I have my pessimism!

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Post by George Carlin Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:23 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:
Wales are certainly favourites for this one, but Scotland can win.
That's pretty much it in a nutshell. We might toast your bread of heaven. But we need to stop your big fatties first. Very Happy
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Post by LondonTiger Mon Feb 09, 2015 9:58 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:Wales are certainly favourites for this one, but Scotland can win.  Given we've only won 8 of the last 41 6N games, you can see why I have my pessimism!

I was starting to feel that the consensus on here was to view Scotland as favourites. Of course Scotland can beat Wales for the first time since 2007 and only second time since 2003 as they are an improved side. But there seems to be an expectation of a win from many posters.

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Post by RDW Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:02 am

LondonTiger wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:Wales are certainly favourites for this one, but Scotland can win.  Given we've only won 8 of the last 41 6N games, you can see why I have my pessimism!

I was starting to feel that the consensus on here was to view Scotland as favourites. Of course Scotland can beat Wales for the first time since 2007 and only second time since 2003 as they are an improved side. But there seems to be an expectation of a win from many posters.

Really? Haven't seen it so far from many Scottish posters...indeed from a quick scan on this thread I've not seen any Scottish posters say we are favourites. It's the welshies that are trying to downplay their chances so far!

A lot will come down to injuries - if Dunbar is injured and Matt Scott isn't fit yet we are well and truly fecked.

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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:04 am

Wales play a horrible one dimensional game that had my dad roaring at the telly on Friday night. I can't remember Wales getting over the gain line in the second half.

Furthermore the English scrum dominance was a victim of it's own success for Wales' try.

I wonder how long it will be before the Welsh lads are in open rebellion against Gatlandball and take matters into their own hands?

Finally on Wales everyone is giving pelters to the Welsh coaching staff in terms of the North concussion, to be honest the player has to assume a bit of responsibility too. He must have known he was concussed and should have let the coaching staff know.

Onto Scotland, I was happy with our performance however we had oppertunities to win the game against France and didn't take them.

Russels only bad decision was his drop goal attempt. A bit more patience and perseverance taking the ball through the phases would have seen us get over the line I think. We had France on the rack for large phases of the game and didn't persevere with our good field position.

Parity in the Scrum against France in Paris is quite remarkable for a Scotland team these days, we shouldn't ignore that. Also shutting the French out is also something we haven't been able to do for a very long time.

Fife had a good game despite his inexperienced outburst.

Beattie and Visser have no excuses. Visser was beyond awful. If you aren't going to get the ball to him you would be better putting Lamont on the wing. At least he makes his tackles. Beattie got himself yellow carded for collapsing the French Maul. He's lucky he wasn't binned earlier. Whats the chances of Dozer Denton being fit for Sunday?

Wales gameplan is brutal and crude. However it has served them well against Scotland in the past. It's a must win game for either side. I just hope that the barrowload of injuries we have on our plate can be dealt with and we can at least keep our backline and backrow intact.
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Post by TJ Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:08 am

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Finally on Wales everyone is giving pelters to the Welsh coaching staff in terms of the North concussion, to be honest the player has to assume a bit of responsibility too. He must have known he was concussed and should have let the coaching staff know.

........................

If you have concussion you don't usually realise 'cos your brain ain't working right. adrenaline also makes you want to get up and go out again. This is why it should never be up to the player

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Post by RDW Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:10 am

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:. Whats the chances of Dozer Denton being fit for Sunday?


Denton said on Twitter he's targeting the Italy game.

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Post by George Carlin Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:28 am

LondonTiger wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:Wales are certainly favourites for this one, but Scotland can win.  Given we've only won 8 of the last 41 6N games, you can see why I have my pessimism!

I was starting to feel that the consensus on here was to view Scotland as favourites. Of course Scotland can beat Wales for the first time since 2007 and only second time since 2003 as they are an improved side. But there seems to be an expectation of a win from many posters.
Stop. You're killing me. 6N Round 2: Scotland v Wales, 15 February Hyster10
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Post by LondonTiger Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:37 am

To be fair only just come on this thread. On other ones we have welsh fans demanding the coaches and entire team be sacked as they are the worst team in the 6Ns and TJ screaming that Scotland will win the championship.

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Post by George Carlin Mon Feb 09, 2015 10:52 am

LondonTiger wrote:To be fair only just come on this thread. On other ones we have welsh fans demanding the coaches and entire team be sacked as they are the worst team in the 6Ns and TJ screaming that Scotland will win the championship.

It's the 6 Nations, Tiger. What do you honestly expect from these boards?

The Mod Team is all on Smirnoff and sedatives at the moment.
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