Gwent Dragons 2015/16 thread

[PhilBB]

First topic message reminder :

I don't need to address anything, I am one fan with an opinion the same as you and any other fan.

Sure, but here I am trying to understand your opinion yet, sadly, you won't address a key element of it.

Previously you wrote: "Only sad, narrow minded parochial people stuck in the amateur era mindset would see gwent as something in direct competition to newport." so I wrote a detailed, honest and clear answer as to why that insult is misplaced.

It's misplaced because one club is carrying all of the risk but with only 50% ownership.

Do you think it fair that one club carries all of the financial risk, without total ownership, for a "Gwent" team? Sure, you don't need to address the question but, in all fairness, it will speak volumes if you don't address it.

[Guest]

It isn't pathetic, but it is a pretty poor show considering we fell behind before a lot of their better players came on. I had a feeling that unless we started well and built a score that their bench would be too strong and that proved to be the case.

I also agree that we are worse than last season. Results seem to be backing that up. Even our wins this season are worse than what they were last season. I really do wonder where our next win is coming from under this management, as they probably won't even have the luxury of a good Challenge Cup run this season to ease the pressure (all teams seem to have named strong squads). It might be as bad as waiting till the Cardiff Blues game on Boxing Day before we might get another win.

[VinceWLB]

That was an Ulster team missing a lot of 1st choices players. Dragons beat a much stronger Ulster team last 2 seasons. They scrapped by both Italian teams at home. They have gone backwards imo. Positives were Shaun Knight who is a good backup to Brok Harris and Ollie Griffiths who will be a star. Dragons need to convert Fairbrother to LH as Phil Price doesn't cut it at this level.

[GavinDragon]

That's not a bad shout re fairbrother.

The gameplan has stagnated. Our scrum, lineout and forward play is ok. The trouble is that that is the gameplan. Need an attack coach who can join up the dots

[Luckless Pedestrian]

The tactics were poor but the commitment was there bar the soft try.

Can't fault the commitment, but that won't win you many games if it's not matched by rugby nous and a cutting edge.

We'd got it back to 13-12 and gave a dumb penalty away, then the restart didn't go 10 and from the resulting scrum penalty, they kicked another three. I'm not a fan of the coaches, but there's not much they can do about errors like that.

Ulster weren't great, but they didn't need to be. It's a familiar tale.

[Cardiff Dave]

.

Castre 32 - 29 Newport GD
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/match/ERUP3859889

[GavinDragon]

Did you mean to quote me then Dave?

[Cardiff Dave]

Did you mean to quote me then Dave?

Yep.

[GavinDragon]

I can see what you were quoting from me?

[Cardiff Dave]

I can see what you were quoting from me?

Be proud of Newport RFC is what I want to say.

[GavinDragon]

I am, they are a great Gwent club with a fantastic history and thanks to them (and more to the point messrs Brown and Hazell) we have a fantastic facility in which top flight rugby in Gwent can flourish. Not to mention the players they have produced for the dragons like ollie griffiths and tyler morgan

[Guest]

I am, they are a great Gwent club with a fantastic history and thanks to them (and more to the point messrs Brown and Hazell) we have a fantastic facility in which top flight rugby in Gwent can flourish. Not to mention the players they have produced for the dragons like ollie griffiths and tyler morgan

[mikey_dragon]

Have you read what Wales online are saying about our Leon Brown?

[GavinDragon]

Yes. I think it may be a bit premature. He was under a bit o pressure in the scrum at the weekend and the lad is only 19. That being said he is dynamic

[Cardiff Dave]

I am,

Glad about that.

[mikey_dragon]

Yes. I think it may be a bit premature. He was under a bit o pressure in the scrum at the weekend and the lad is only 19. That being said he is dynamic

I thought so too. Though it should be noted that the top championship teams are very strong up front in comparison to other teams in the B&I cup, our scrum and maul would have been better if we had a bigger back 5.

[Cardiff Dave]

Europe not a level playing field, says Dragons coach Lyn Jones
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/wales/34924156

Can't listen to this as my sound has packed in for some reason.

[mikey_dragon]

It's pretty obvious after reading the title. He spoke about the money and overseas player policy (or lack of) in France.

[Cardiff Dave]

It's pretty obvious after reading the title. He spoke about the money and overseas player policy (or lack of) in France.

Does that mean he wants more cash pumped into the Drags to buy more foreigners?

[munkian]

It's pretty obvious after reading the title. He spoke about the money and overseas player policy (or lack of) in France.

Does that mean he wants more cash pumped into the Drags to buy more foreigners?

I assumed it was more about a tournament squad cap

[GavinDragon]

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/14130951.Wales_ace_Faletau_in_talks_over_dual_deal_and_Dragons_stay/

[bedfordwelsh]

Good news and let's hope they get it all sorted this time, for those who know him he has always been a big family man and staying in Wales close to family etc will always be a big draw for him.

[mikey_dragon]

Hope he stays. Also is there any chance of us getting back Jonny Evans? Fourth choice at Bath now so not a good move for him. He could be No.2 choice with us and if his good form returns perhaps become first choice.

[GavinDragon]

I would say our biggest priorities are a backs coach and/or 10, a second row and a loose head

[mikey_dragon]

Agree, but it would still be nice to get Jonny back.

[GavinDragon]

I think Sarel and Charlie are on two year deals as was Jonny, so unless someone is going to take Charlie off our hands I can't see it happening.

And don't forget golden boy Luc

[GavinDragon]

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/14133399.Faletau_turns_down_Dragons_stay_to_sign_for_Bath/

well that glimmer of hope lasted long

[bedfordwelsh]

What a complete an utter feckin shambles the whole lot has been good old WRU royally screw things up again.

[mikey_dragon]

Try and remember that this offer first came about three years ago - fair play to him for resisting that amount of cash for so long. If it's silverware he wants them I hope he can get some with Chokers RFC.

[mikey_dragon]

What a complete an utter feckin shambles the whole lot has been good old WRU royally screw things up again.

The offer of a NDC was made. There's a few internationals outside of Wales which the two east regions could do with - I'd like to see the union act on that.

[GavinDragon]

I place the blame solely at the Dragons board. Can't blame the WRU for buying themselves time to try and negotiate a NDC and sending the correct message out about playing in Wales. Perhaps they underestimated just how cheesed off TF was playing at the Dragons. And who can blame him? I think the most revealing thing about his statement was his excitement that he would get to play under DE again. A man that Uncle Lyn let go after a third of a season when we were playing some decent-to-watch rugby.

Yet again we start to see some light, hope that the youngsters we have developed could be held onto and supplemented by some gnarly forwards to give us the platform to play some rugby, only to allow a man whose game plan would look old fashioned in the 90's continue at the helm.

[mikey_dragon]

Yeah I kind of miss when we could score a few tries. Like you said recently we could do with some coaches (ta-ra Lyn and a good backs coach), along with some front 5 players and perhaps a 10 who can also slot in at 12. This Leon Brown (TH) it continuing to get good reviews - perhaps he'll be promoted within a year.

Have you guys heard what they're doing to the U18 players in Gwent BTW?

[GavinDragon]

Agreed, and I don't buy this 'if we have Dixon, Tyler and Amos we would score more' it doesn't matter who you have at 12, 13 and 11 if your first instinct is to kick the ball away. And I am not saying that we should run from everywhere I am not, the AB's kick a lot of ball when it isnt on. But whenever we turn over the ball or receive a poorly kicked ball, our first instinct is to kick it back rather than getting their heads up and seeing if there are any opportunities/miss matches/gaps to exploit.

Not heard anything. What do you know?

[bedfordwelsh]

What a complete an utter feckin shambles the whole lot has been good old WRU royally screw things up again.

The offer of a NDC was made. There's a few internationals outside of Wales which the two east regions could do with - I'd like to see the union act on that.

MD,

Am aware of that and aware he missed the deadline to sign (surely that could have been adjusted) but was more on about not letting us at least try and get some money out of it by letting him go now as was the chance.

[mikey_dragon]

Yeah true, although Amos can pretty much run it from anywhere! We still need a new strategy. We also need cover as our pack is like butter without Stanko, Harris and Landman.

What I've been told is that the U18 coaches aren't very good. Some of the academy boys really dislike the head coach. Also if you want to be in said academy you either need to be at Cross Keys College or Newport High School (formerly Bettws, now in the big leagues). One lad I spoke to didn't want to leave Llanwern High School, so found himself out of the academy. It's nice to see that area of Newport do well in rugby, considering it's always been a strong catchment area for football and become better than Caerleon, Bassaleg, etc.; but surely they should be looking to strengthen rugby across the city rather than lump all the best players into two areas.

Keys and Newport High are in that college's league BTW, the one that is aired on S4C.

[mikey_dragon]

What a complete an utter feckin shambles the whole lot has been good old WRU royally screw things up again.

The offer of a NDC was made. There's a few internationals outside of Wales which the two east regions could do with - I'd like to see the union act on that.

MD,

Am aware of that and aware he missed the deadline to sign (surely that could have been adjusted) but was more on about not letting us at least try and get some money out of it by letting him go now as was the chance.

I'm not really a fan of selling out player in that manner, and would have preferred that we re-signed him. Perhaps they thought he would reconsider after further talks.

[GavinDragon]

Well, on the basis that we probably have the biggest catchment of players, yet never seem to win the regional champs at either 16's or 18's (I think the last time we won was 2008 with a team featuring, ironically, toby faletau along with Jason Tovey Adam Hughes et al), I can't say I am surprised by that statement.

So what do the Blaenau Gwent boys do? I know Coleg Gwent has a site in Ebbw Vale, but if the rugby team train at Cross Keys that must be a pain for them to get to?

Do they actually state that you have to be in one of those colleges? I can't imagine a lad who is on for straight A's at A level at Bassaleg being told he must move.

[mikey_dragon]

I'm not sure, but when I was there the Pontypool side of Coleg Gwent sent their few players over to Keys - it wasn't really a viable solution though so we didn't see much of them, but maybe they still do it. I was also under the impression that those colleges in Pool and Ebbw Vale have a lot less on their curriculum and is more of a college for mechanics, electricians, plasterers, etc. Keys also has the pedigree and like Newport High now has the best facilities - so that could be a factor in having players go over there. I'm not sure of the Blaenau Gwent lads but I'll ask around.

You're correct and seeing as Bassaleg were always pretty good you might think they're exempt - I'll have to ask for some clarity on that too.

[Stone Motif]

I place the blame solely at the Dragons board. Can't blame the WRU for buying themselves time to try and negotiate a NDC and sending the correct message out about playing in Wales. Perhaps they underestimated just how cheesed off TF was playing at the Dragons. And who can blame him? I think the most revealing thing about his statement was his excitement that he would get to play under DE again. A man that Uncle Lyn let go after a third of a season when we were playing some decent-to-watch rugby.

Yet again we start to see some light, hope that the youngsters we have developed could be held onto and supplemented by some gnarly forwards to give us the platform to play some rugby, only to allow a man whose game plan would look old fashioned in the 90's continue at the helm.

The WRU aren't blameless. This time to negotiate business is looking like a crock given how quickly he rejected the NDC offer. Looks to me Toby was adamant he was off to Bath and the board did the right thing if those were the circumstances. It's clear that between this and the Scott Williams debacle these NDCs aren't worth sh1t. You probably have a point on the Lyn effect though.

[mikey_dragon]

Just two examples out of the 17 then stone? And Scott is still expected to sign btw.

[Stone Motif]

Just two examples out of the 17 then stone? And Scott is still expected to sign btw.

Let's not try to be clever by making out there aren't tiers of these contracts. The nonsense around who is caught by Gatland 'so law is damming enough, without the fact that they just helped make the financially weakest pro team poorer by a six figure sum and one of their uber-rich English competitors better off by the same amount.

[mikey_dragon]

Just two examples out of the 17 then stone? And Scott is still expected to sign btw.

Let's not try to be clever by making out there aren't tiers of these contracts.  The nonsense around who is caught by Gatland 'so law is damming enough, without the fact that they just helped make the financially weakest pro team poorer by a six figure sum and one of their uber-rich English competitors better off by the same amount.

Sounds as if they helped do their best to help keep Faletau at the Dragons (the best option) but failed. I guess you can only try your best! So the two wildcards are Roberts and Faletau.

[Stone Motif]

Just two examples out of the 17 then stone? And Scott is still expected to sign btw.

Let's not try to be clever by making out there aren't tiers of these contracts.  The nonsense around who is caught by Gatland 'so law is damming enough, without the fact that they just helped make the financially weakest pro team poorer by a six figure sum and one of their uber-rich English competitors better off by the same amount.

Sounds as if they helped do their best to help keep Faletau at the Dragons (the best option) but failed. I guess you can only try your best! So the two wildcards are Roberts and Faletau.

Sounds to me like they should have tried harder, or else they had no chance of getting him on an NDC and should have let us cash in.

[Steffan]

While I am looking forward to seeing Faletau play in the Aviva next year and the Dregons missing out on the cash is highly amusing was the Pieman ever really interested in signing him? Surley some deal could have been reached between Cardiff and the WRU. You get the impression though that he was always going to Bath one way or another

[GavinDragon]

Yea actually stone fair point re the board. At least they saw the writing on the wall and tried to cash in

[mikey_dragon]

Just two examples out of the 17 then stone? And Scott is still expected to sign btw.

Let's not try to be clever by making out there aren't tiers of these contracts.  The nonsense around who is caught by Gatland 'so law is damming enough, without the fact that they just helped make the financially weakest pro team poorer by a six figure sum and one of their uber-rich English competitors better off by the same amount.

Sounds as if they helped do their best to help keep Faletau at the Dragons (the best option) but failed. I guess you can only try your best! So the two wildcards are Roberts and Faletau.

Sounds to me like they should have tried harder, or else they had no chance of getting him on an NDC and should have let us cash in.

Try harder? They don't have that much money. But I guess you could say if NDCs weren't given to the likes of King, Baker and Rhodri Jones then there might be some extra money sitting pretty.

[Steffan]

Try harder? They don't have that much money. But I guess you could say if NDCs weren't given to the likes of King, Baker and Rhodri Jones then there might be some extra money sitting pretty.

Plus they look to be putting all their eggs in the Leigh Halfpenny basket. Getting him back in Wales is a way of 'showing we mean business'

While Faletau is is one of Wales top players he does not have the marketability that WRU are looking for that Halfpenny does. Goodness knows how much he will be on if he does come back to Wales

[Stone Motif]

Just two examples out of the 17 then stone? And Scott is still expected to sign btw.

Let's not try to be clever by making out there aren't tiers of these contracts.  The nonsense around who is caught by Gatland 'so law is damming enough, without the fact that they just helped make the financially weakest pro team poorer by a six figure sum and one of their uber-rich English competitors better off by the same amount.

Sounds as if they helped do their best to help keep Faletau at the Dragons (the best option) but failed. I guess you can only try your best! So the two wildcards are Roberts and Faletau.

Sounds to me like they should have tried harder, or else they had no chance of getting him on an NDC and should have let us cash in.

Try harder? They don't have that much money. But I guess you could say if NDCs weren't given to the likes of King, Baker and Rhodri Jones then there might be some extra money sitting pretty.

WTF are we playing all these extra internationals for then?

Interesting you mention Baker, just shows that Wales most consistent player, who is never injured,and the only realistic choice for his position, can't get a contract off Gatland but that ginger waste of space can.

[Stone Motif]

Try harder? They don't have that much money. But I guess you could say if NDCs weren't given to the likes of King, Baker and Rhodri Jones then there might be some extra money sitting pretty.

Plus they look to be putting all their eggs in the Leigh Halfpenny basket. Getting him back in Wales is a way of 'showing we mean business'

While Faletau is is one of Wales top players he does not have the marketability that WRU are looking for that Halfpenny does. Goodness knows how much he will be on if he does come back to Wales

A complete and utter nonsense if true.

[Steffan]

Try harder? They don't have that much money. But I guess you could say if NDCs weren't given to the likes of King, Baker and Rhodri Jones then there might be some extra money sitting pretty.

Plus they look to be putting all their eggs in the Leigh Halfpenny basket. Getting him back in Wales is a way of 'showing we mean business'

While Faletau is is one of Wales top players he does not have the marketability that WRU are looking for that Halfpenny does. Goodness knows how much he will be on if he does come back to Wales

A complete and utter nonsense if true.

Perhaps they will assign him to the Dragons as compensation...

[Stone Motif]

Try harder? They don't have that much money. But I guess you could say if NDCs weren't given to the likes of King, Baker and Rhodri Jones then there might be some extra money sitting pretty.

Plus they look to be putting all their eggs in the Leigh Halfpenny basket. Getting him back in Wales is a way of 'showing we mean business'

While Faletau is is one of Wales top players he does not have the marketability that WRU are looking for that Halfpenny does. Goodness knows how much he will be on if he does come back to Wales

A complete and utter nonsense if true.

Perhaps they will assign him to the Dragons as compensation...

Would only be fair, being as Hazell has gone public to state that this little episode has cost us in the region (no pun intended) of £400k

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