UK General Election 2017 Thread

[Muscular-mouse]

First topic message reminder :

Ok guys what are your predictions, how will you be voting and who do you want to win.

[GSC]

Corbyns been invited on as well hasn't he.

[CaledonianCraig]

Corbyns been invited on as well hasn't he.

Has he?

But point stands. There is so much the Tories have done and been given an easy ride by the BBC (in particular). The tax credit thing with the r*** clause in it - vile. I've heard virtually nothing about it on the news though. The Tory MP's who were involved in scandals (15 wasn't there) and we virtually heard nothing about it or had any Tory pushed on the issue on the news. The pathetic state of the NHS. Yes it gets reported but don't ever see the Tories getting rounded on about it. The multiple backtracked in promising one thing then doing the other (no snap election then there was). The embarrassing budget man sausage-up that had a key part of it having to be scrapped a few days later as the figures didn't add up. Heck Abbott got slaughtered for such a thing and she isn't even in the government.

[GSC]

They got tore a new bumhole for the tax increase thing.

[CaledonianCraig]

They got tore a new bumhole for the tax increase thing.

Look at the BBC report today on the news website about latest NHS stats. It basically reports the short-comings and has a Tory quoted spouting off about investment and that is it. Not one word questioning the Tories handling (or mis-handling as the case is) of the whole issue but a Tory boasting about investment.

[TRUSSMAN66]

Life isn't fair...Trump had no ground game and 90 percent of the media against him.....

What has Corbyn got going for him....

1. He's a conviction politician..
2. He has huge attendances at his rallies..
3. The Tories haven't mastered social media yet.
4. Fairness is a good message..
5. In 4 weeks time he can rest all he likes on a nice beach.
6. He has 27 percent rain..sun..or hail.

So we try to accentuate the positive...

1. Have more rallies..
2. Flood social media..
3. Take the media out of the equation..

Trump was 200/1......

May has a rating under 50 percent...Cameron polled around 57...She has u turned more in six months than Blair did in 10 years..

Students are voting Corbyn and Students enthusiasm like we saw with Bernie is a catchy beat....

Use it...Get people who never vote because it is futile off their ass...

Four weeks.. prove all the cynical..bitter..morons wrong.

While there is life there is hope..

Still voting Green though. . .But I'm open to persuasion.

[GSC]

His campaign comes across as a bit naive. Seems determined to brush Brexit under the campaign despite it being probably the hottest topic. Seems to be turning up in places that are either likely safe or unattainable when I see him on the news

[TRUSSMAN66]

You're right he lacks direction...

Also I forgot to add that Trump was hugely charismatic...His name was golden and he was a succesful businessman..

But I got on a role in my last post and didn't want to break the spell..

Corbyn has an audience of more than 27 percent and he has got plenty of holiday time in 4 weeks...

Scorched earth and see what happens is my advice.

[navyblueshorts]

It really does seem crystal clear that the BBC have a strong pro-Tory bias. Giving showtime to May on The One Show and not calling the Tories into question over plenty of stuff and going overboard on every miniscule thing Labour does that is even slightly in error.

The BBC is leftist (if you're pro-Brexit, for example) and pro-Tory? Laughable and illustrative that people see what they want to see. Could it be that the BBC is actually doing what it's meant to do and be as impartial as it can?

[navyblueshorts]

Corbyns been invited on as well hasn't he.

Has he?

But point stands. There is so much the Tories have done and been given an easy ride by the BBC (in particular). The tax credit thing with the r*** clause in it - vile. I've heard virtually nothing about it on the news though. The Tory MP's who were involved in scandals (15 wasn't there) and we virtually heard nothing about it or had any Tory pushed on the issue on the news. The pathetic state of the NHS. Yes it gets reported but don't ever see the Tories getting rounded on about it. The multiple backtracked in promising one thing then doing the other (no snap election then there was). The embarrassing budget man sausage-up that had a key part of it having to be scrapped a few days later as the figures didn't add up. Heck Abbott got slaughtered for such a thing and she isn't even in the government.

Oh get off it! It's not a r.a.p.e. clause at all....unless you're SNP.

[Derbymanc]

Got no idea what the tax credit clause thing is so looks like everyones ignored it.

The scandals are always over the news and wasn't it the BBC pushing about the expenses and constantly bringing up the duck house crap (don't get me started on expenses, it's a frickin joke)

the state of the NHS is ALWAYS being brought up and it's the tories that are rounded on for it by all and sundry, Backtracked promises if memory serves wasn't they laughed off about every programme due to that. Abbot deserves to get slaughtered every time, horrible horrible person and her figures really really didn't add up.

As Navy says, the BBC tries to report just the news (ie whats happened, and unlike sky etc tends not to have too much 'debate' or opinion pieces on it (opinion and debate shows not withstanding obviously). If it was properly pro Tory i would expect most of the comic shows etc not to constantly rip the mick either

[TRUSSMAN66]

The Chairman of the BBC used to work in the Conservative cabinet office..

The political editor Nick Robinson used to be Chairman of the young Tories.....And statistics show more Tories go on the channel more than Labour.

Don't be naive..

[Pr4wn]

Andrew Neil is chairman of the Spectator, Kamal Ahmed came from the Telegraph, John Humphrys is a notorious right-winger, especially when it comes to welfare.

Not to mention that the overwhelming majority of BBC Chairmen over the last 50 years have been Conservatives.

[superflyweight]

I have no major problems with the BBC. They get accused of bias from all sides so they must be striking the balance pretty well. Think they would do a lot better though without the pressure and accusations of bias and could become more editorial.

The only thing they do that annoys me is the insistence on the using the term "so called ISIS". Does it really matter whether anyone calls them ISIS, Islamic State, Daesh, or a Bunch of Lunatic Bastards? You're not legitimising them because you call them Islamic State. You're just using the widely accepted term. Adding "so-called" is just mealy-mouthed and stupid.

[GSC]

I assume they put out requests for comments to all relevant parties and Corbyns office are notoriously slow at responding.

[CaledonianCraig]

Corbyns been invited on as well hasn't he.

Has he?

But point stands. There is so much the Tories have done and been given an easy ride by the BBC (in particular). The tax credit thing with the r*** clause in it - vile. I've heard virtually nothing about it on the news though. The Tory MP's who were involved in scandals (15 wasn't there) and we virtually heard nothing about it or had any Tory pushed on the issue on the news. The pathetic state of the NHS. Yes it gets reported but don't ever see the Tories getting rounded on about it. The multiple backtracked in promising one thing then doing the other (no snap election then there was). The embarrassing budget man sausage-up that had a key part of it having to be scrapped a few days later as the figures didn't add up. Heck Abbott got slaughtered for such a thing and she isn't even in the government.

Oh get off it! It's not a r.a.p.e. clause at all....unless you're SNP.

So you are perfectly fine with a woman who has gone through the psychological and physical nightmare of being r.a.p.e.d being forced to admit to and recollect the details of event to claim money for child? Really? EVERY party barring Tories have voiced their disgust at it in Scotland and even Ruth the Mooth is starting to backtrack on it.

[superflyweight]

Corbyns been invited on as well hasn't he.

Has he?

But point stands. There is so much the Tories have done and been given an easy ride by the BBC (in particular). The tax credit thing with the r*** clause in it - vile. I've heard virtually nothing about it on the news though. The Tory MP's who were involved in scandals (15 wasn't there) and we virtually heard nothing about it or had any Tory pushed on the issue on the news. The pathetic state of the NHS. Yes it gets reported but don't ever see the Tories getting rounded on about it. The multiple backtracked in promising one thing then doing the other (no snap election then there was). The embarrassing budget man sausage-up that had a key part of it having to be scrapped a few days later as the figures didn't add up. Heck Abbott got slaughtered for such a thing and she isn't even in the government.

Oh get off it! It's not a r.a.p.e. clause at all....unless you're SNP.

So you are perfectly fine with a woman who has gone through the psychological and physical nightmare of being r.a.p.e.d being forced to admit to and recollect the details of event to claim money for child? Really? EVERY party barring Tories have voiced their disgust at it in Scotland and even Ruth the Mooth is starting to backtrack on it.

The real heart of the matter is whether or not you agree with capping working tax credits at two children. The SNP have the power to scrap the cap and render the entire issue null and void in Scotland.

[Derbymanc]

Is that even if it's on record Craig? - first time i've heard of it and if that's the case then it's terrible

[Derbymanc]

There should be a cap at 2 children with exceptions on a case by case basis. should include kids from other relationships too (would have meant we wouldn't have been eligible but we made the choice).

[TRUSSMAN66]

So the kids suffer then if Mummy and Daddy are irresponsible......

Who is going to judge on a case by case basis ???.....How much would that cost ???.....Cheaper paying the money..

[CaledonianCraig]

Is that even if it's on record Craig? - first time i've heard of it and if that's the case then it's terrible

Yes as far as I know. If a mother wants to claim for a child born through r.a.p.e then they need to fill out the form disclosing this (bad enough being r.a.p.e.d in the first place) the victim then has to admit to such a stigma. Originally, Ruth the Mooth thought she could downplay it but in Holyrood EVERY party has lambasted it and she is now backtracking.

[CaledonianCraig]

So the kids suffer then if Mummy and Daddy are irresponsible......

Who is going to judge on a case by case basis ???.....How much would that cost ???.....Cheaper paying the money..

I am not sure how 'mummy' is irresponsible for being r.a.p.e.d.

[Hammersmith harrier]

So the kids suffer then if Mummy and Daddy are irresponsible......

Who is going to judge on a case by case basis ???.....How much would that cost ???.....Cheaper paying the money..

It's a balancing act again, with everything you have those that manipulate or abuse the system and I'm all for clamping down on those people.

[Hammersmith harrier]

So the kids suffer then if Mummy and Daddy are irresponsible......

Who is going to judge on a case by case basis ???.....How much would that cost ???.....Cheaper paying the money..

I am not sure how 'mummy' is irresponsible for being r.a.p.e.d.

Breathe Craig, completely different point being made.

[TRUSSMAN66]

So the kids suffer then if Mummy and Daddy are irresponsible......

Who is going to judge on a case by case basis ???.....How much would that cost ???.....Cheaper paying the money..

I am not sure how 'mummy' is irresponsible for being r.a.p.e.d.

Me neither I'm just pointing out I am not a fan of tax credits being denied struggling families......I probably missed your post as they tend to be SNP party broadcasts..

[GSC]

I'd honestly rather a few people cheated the system than have people genuinely in need of help be rejected.

[TRUSSMAN66]

So the kids suffer then if Mummy and Daddy are irresponsible......

Who is going to judge on a case by case basis ???.....How much would that cost ???.....Cheaper paying the money..

It's a balancing act again, with everything you have those that manipulate or abuse the system and I'm all for clamping down on those people.

I agree with the sentiment...... But unfortunately the kids get penalised...

[Pr4wn]

I'd honestly rather a few people cheated the system than have people genuinely in need of help be rejected.

This.

[Hammersmith harrier]

I'd honestly rather a few people cheated the system than have people genuinely in need of help be rejected.

I'd rather they didn't but I have zero time for benefit cheats, it is they not governments screwing the poor.

[superflyweight]

I'd honestly rather a few people cheated the system than have people genuinely in need of help be rejected.

This.

It's a necessary feature of providing a fair and workable Welfare system.

[CaledonianCraig]

I'd honestly rather a few people cheated the system than have people genuinely in need of help be rejected.

This.

It's a necessary feature of providing a fair and workable Welfare system.  

Spoken like a true Tory. Bet you back Fox Hunting too.

[CaledonianCraig]

By the way we keep hearing this BS about the Tories being the stable option to deal with Brexit. What a joke. All the financial connotations that will entail and yet they can't even do a simple budget without a major flaw in it.

[GSC]

You quite the wrong post there Craig

[superflyweight]

P.S. I'd be more likely to vote SNP if they did use their powers to disapply things like this in Scotland. But they don't!

[superflyweight]

I'd honestly rather a few people cheated the system than have people genuinely in need of help be rejected.

This.

It's a necessary feature of providing a fair and workable Welfare system.  

Spoken like a true Tory. Bet you back Fox Hunting too.

You've completely missed by point. I was agreeing with GSC. But you go ahead and continue with name calling.

[CaledonianCraig]

P.S. I'd be more likely to vote SNP if they did use their powers to disapply things like this in Scotland.  But they don't!

Do you or I know the legal binding of it given it is a Westminster ruling passed just over a month ago? Not sure myself and if can be overthrown then watch this space.

[CaledonianCraig]

I'd honestly rather a few people cheated the system than have people genuinely in need of help be rejected.

This.

It's a necessary feature of providing a fair and workable Welfare system.  

Spoken like a true Tory. Bet you back Fox Hunting too.

You've completely missed by point.  I was agreeing with GSC.  But you go ahead and continue with name calling.

 

Come on tell me what is fair about a r.a.p.e.d woman having to recount such an ordeal. Jeez and is it really in the best interest of welfare given the distress a r.a
p.e victim will go through over this.

[superflyweight]

It can be - we could make tax credits available to anyone with more than 3 kids. UK Gov pays for first two, we would pay for any others.

[CaledonianCraig]

It can be - we could make tax credits available to anyone with more than 3 kids.  UK Gov pays for first two, we would pay for any others.  

Well as I say watch this space on that one.

[superflyweight]

I'd honestly rather a few people cheated the system than have people genuinely in need of help be rejected.

This.

It's a necessary feature of providing a fair and workable Welfare system.  

Spoken like a true Tory. Bet you back Fox Hunting too.

You've completely missed by point.  I was agreeing with GSC.  But you go ahead and continue with name calling.

 

Come on tell me what is fair about a r.a.p.e.d woman having to recount such an ordeal. Jeez and is it really in the best interest of welfare given the distress a r.a
p.e victim will go through over this.

You've really missed my point. I don't think the tax credits should be capped at two children and I believe that welfare should be provided for the benefit of the most and shouldn't be curbed because some people take the piss.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's not the views of a Tory.

[ShahenshahG]

Yup - If you don't help people because a couple of them might be chancers - no one would ever get the help they need. Witness the refugees.

[Crimey]

I'd honestly rather a few people cheated the system than have people genuinely in need of help be rejected.

As I said only a couple of weeks ago, it's baffling that people can in good conscience think differently.

[CaledonianCraig]

I'd honestly rather a few people cheated the system than have people genuinely in need of help be rejected.

This.

It's a necessary feature of providing a fair and workable Welfare system.  

Spoken like a true Tory. Bet you back Fox Hunting too.

You've completely missed by point.  I was agreeing with GSC.  But you go ahead and continue with name calling.

 

Come on tell me what is fair about a r.a.p.e.d woman having to recount such an ordeal. Jeez and is it really in the best interest of welfare given the distress a r.a
p.e victim will go through over this.

You've really missed my point.  I don't think the tax credits should be capped at two children and I believe that welfare should be provided for the benefit of the most and shouldn't be curbed because some people take the piss.  

Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's not the views of a Tory.  

So we agree the current rule just passed in Westminster is flawed?

Apologies to you no it isn't if you see the flaws in this new ruling.

[superflyweight]

We're in agreement, Craig.

[CaledonianCraig]

We're in agreement, Craig.  

Fair enough. Apologies again. 

[superflyweight]

No problem.

[Pr4wn]

Phew! Exhausting, isn't it, Super?

[superflyweight]

I am now in need of a pint!

[navyblueshorts]

Corbyns been invited on as well hasn't he.

Has he?

But point stands. There is so much the Tories have done and been given an easy ride by the BBC (in particular). The tax credit thing with the r*** clause in it - vile. I've heard virtually nothing about it on the news though. The Tory MP's who were involved in scandals (15 wasn't there) and we virtually heard nothing about it or had any Tory pushed on the issue on the news. The pathetic state of the NHS. Yes it gets reported but don't ever see the Tories getting rounded on about it. The multiple backtracked in promising one thing then doing the other (no snap election then there was). The embarrassing budget man sausage-up that had a key part of it having to be scrapped a few days later as the figures didn't add up. Heck Abbott got slaughtered for such a thing and she isn't even in the government.

Oh get off it! It's not a r.a.p.e. clause at all....unless you're SNP.

So you are perfectly fine with a woman who has gone through the psychological and physical nightmare of being r.a.p.e.d being forced to admit to and recollect the details of event to claim money for child? Really? EVERY party barring Tories have voiced their disgust at it in Scotland and even Ruth the Mooth is starting to backtrack on it.

Your description of that is nonsense and you know it. At least I would hope you do. Still, nothing like popular soundbites eh?

[navyblueshorts]

Corbyns been invited on as well hasn't he.

Has he?

But point stands. There is so much the Tories have done and been given an easy ride by the BBC (in particular). The tax credit thing with the r*** clause in it - vile. I've heard virtually nothing about it on the news though. The Tory MP's who were involved in scandals (15 wasn't there) and we virtually heard nothing about it or had any Tory pushed on the issue on the news. The pathetic state of the NHS. Yes it gets reported but don't ever see the Tories getting rounded on about it. The multiple backtracked in promising one thing then doing the other (no snap election then there was). The embarrassing budget man sausage-up that had a key part of it having to be scrapped a few days later as the figures didn't add up. Heck Abbott got slaughtered for such a thing and she isn't even in the government.

Oh get off it! It's not a r.a.p.e. clause at all....unless you're SNP.

So you are perfectly fine with a woman who has gone through the psychological and physical nightmare of being r.a.p.e.d being forced to admit to and recollect the details of event to claim money for child? Really? EVERY party barring Tories have voiced their disgust at it in Scotland and even Ruth the Mooth is starting to backtrack on it.

The real heart of the matter is whether or not you agree with capping working tax credits at two children.  The SNP have the power to scrap the cap and render the entire issue null and void in Scotland.        

Good point, but they somehow haven't suggested that have they? Wonder why?

[navyblueshorts]

Is that even if it's on record Craig? - first time i've heard of it and if that's the case then it's terrible

Yes as far as I know. If a mother wants to claim for a child born through r.a.p.e then they need to fill out the form disclosing this (bad enough being r.a.p.e.d in the first place) the victim then has to admit to such a stigma. Originally, Ruth the Mooth thought she could downplay it but in Holyrood EVERY party has lambasted it and she is now backtracking.

You know what? I have no problem with payments like this but I expect them to go to those that are entitled to them. If they have to check a box on a form, so be it. They don't have to tell anyone the details, or relive anything. If it's recorded as being real, it'll be on record, have a crime number etc etc.

I may be entirely wrong as I can't put myself in the position, but if it was me and I'd been r.a.ped, I'd want it to be those with real cause to have the entitlement to this sort of payment. It would annoy the Hell out of me if shysters were claiming for this sort of thing as a way to rip off money from those deserving of it.

[Sponsored content]