British & Irish Lions Squad 2017

First topic message reminder :

Scottrf wrote:Lawes was better than AWJ every week in the 6 Nations and isn't injured yet he's the strange call

AWJ is a leader and well respected by his peers as well as being a former winning Lions test captain.

Lions players aren't just based on how well they did in the six nations, they are picked on how well the coaches think they will gel into the squad.

You need leaders on and off the pitch.

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

Unintentional? Too hard for some? What a keyboard warrior.

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

When Quade Cooper kneed Richie McCaw in the head, the New Zealand public was outraged and proceeded to boo Cooper in public for years afterwards. Difficult to take it seriously when the same supporters claim bygones should be bygones for their own offences.

Lets be honest how many English fans would rather see NZ v England this Summer instead of this out of date 19th Century Tour concept?

Rugby Fan wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

When Quade Cooper kneed Richie McCaw in the head, the New Zealand public was outraged and proceeded to boo Cooper in public for years afterwards. Difficult to take it seriously when the same supporters claim bygones should be bygones for their own offences.

One...was it intentional? Yes. Two...did McCaw moan? No.

Think you'll find in BODs case the answers are reversed.

Sure, Cooper was a weak fan thing, same as Irish fans with Dublin. It happens. But you don't hear McCaw complaining.

ebop wrote:I thought Tana apologised, didn't he?

Not that rugby players are known for apologising after such incidents given the nature of the game. Was BOD so special that he warranted one where others don't (as per the norm).

I realise that is the culture of NZ rugby, but not here. Players certainly do apologise after such incidents, as they should. Often they do so on the pitch as well. Unless your name is Keith Earls.

Rugby Fan wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

When Quade Cooper kneed Richie McCaw in the head, the New Zealand public was outraged and proceeded to boo Cooper in public for years afterwards. Difficult to take it seriously when the same supporters claim bygones should be bygones for their own offences.

 It really annoys me when this booing occurs, it makes us look look like a bunch of morons, but I must also say that very few did it last year and being in the crowd I hardly noticed it, but later when you watch the game on TV it was much more pronounced.

Taylorman wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

When Quade Cooper kneed Richie McCaw in the head, the New Zealand public was outraged and proceeded to boo Cooper in public for years afterwards. Difficult to take it seriously when the same supporters claim bygones should be bygones for their own offences.

One...was it intentional? Yes. Two...did McCaw moan? No.

Think you'll find in BODs case the answers are reversed.

Sure, Cooper was a weak fan thing, same as Irish fans with Dublin. It happens. But you don't hear McCaw complaining.

This can be quite easily simplified to the following:

Foul play against NZ player - outrage by NZ fans/press is justified

Foul play by a NZ player on anyone else - doesn't count, stop whinging

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

Taylorman wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

When Quade Cooper kneed Richie McCaw in the head, the New Zealand public was outraged and proceeded to boo Cooper in public for years afterwards. Difficult to take it seriously when the same supporters claim bygones should be bygones for their own offences.

One...was it intentional? Yes. Two...did McCaw moan? No.

Think you'll find in BODs case the answers are reversed.

Sure, Cooper was a weak fan thing, same as Irish fans with Dublin. It happens. But you don't hear McCaw complaining.

This can be quite easily simplified to the following:

Foul play against NZ player - outrage by NZ fans/press is justified

Foul play by a NZ player on anyone else - doesn't count, stop whinging

 Just one little problem, you need to know what foul play is.

aucklandlaurie wrote: Just one little problem, you need to know what foul play is.

Sure, I agree. So, let's get a straight answer from you, for a change. Is dropping someone on their head so that they almost break their neck foul play?

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote: Just one little problem, you need to know what foul play is.

Sure, I agree. So, let's get a straight answer from you, for a change. Is dropping someone on their head so that they almost break their neck foul play?

 No.

And yet again, I haven't heard a retraction/apology from you after being quite clearly wrong (and abusive to those who thought otherwise) regarding foul play after the Ireland game. I certainly do agree that our perception of foul play is very different.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:And yet again, I haven't heard a retraction/apology from you after being quite clearly wrong (and abusive to those who thought otherwise) regarding foul play after the Ireland game. I certainly do agree that our perception of foul play is very different.

 You never will get an apology or retraction, one player got cited and banned for a week (which goes to show how minor that event was) and the other had his citing dismissed because the allegations against him were groundless.

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote: Just one little problem, you need to know what foul play is.

Sure, I agree. So, let's get a straight answer from you, for a change. Is dropping someone on their head so that they almost break their neck foul play?

 No.

Classy. Although, I will assume you are being facetious. If I may do the same, I am currently booking my flight to NZ this summer to drop a couple of Kiwis (smaller than me of course) on their necks, given that it is an entirely legal act. 

Hey, if you've got a problem with that, toughen up. Life can be a tough old ride.

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:And yet again, I haven't heard a retraction/apology from you after being quite clearly wrong (and abusive to those who thought otherwise) regarding foul play after the Ireland game. I certainly do agree that our perception of foul play is very different.

 You never will get an apology or retraction, one player got cited and banned for a week (which goes to show how minor that event was) and the other had his citing dismissed because the allegations against him were groundless.

Typical coward who can't face his mistakes.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote: Just one little problem, you need to know what foul play is.

Sure, I agree. So, let's get a straight answer from you, for a change. Is dropping someone on their head so that they almost break their neck foul play?

 No.

Classy. Although, I will assume you are being facetious. If I may do the same, I am currently booking my flight to NZ this summer to drop a couple of Kiwis (smaller than me of course) on their necks, given that it is an entirely legal act. 

Hey, if you've got a problem with that, toughen up. Life can be a tough old ride.

 Are you coming down for the tour? we should catch up.

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

ebop wrote:I can't wait for BOD to wind himself up into a tizz and get all emotional and irrational all over again

Only a Kiwi would call getting pissed off over a broken collar bone and 13 months out of the game irrational. Kiwi logic.

... and yet go into a strop because they were not allowed do their pre match dance routine after the anthems against Wales!

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote: Just one little problem, you need to know what foul play is.

Sure, I agree. So, let's get a straight answer from you, for a change. Is dropping someone on their head so that they almost break their neck foul play?

 No.

Classy. Although, I will assume you are being facetious. If I may do the same, I am currently booking my flight to NZ this summer to drop a couple of Kiwis (smaller than me of course) on their necks, given that it is an entirely legal act. 

Hey, if you've got a problem with that, toughen up. Life can be a tough old ride.

 Are you coming down for the tour? we should catch up.

Can't say I'm interested in doing so. Also, I will assume better that this isn't a thinly veiled threat of some sort from another keyboard warrior.

Sin é wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

ebop wrote:I can't wait for BOD to wind himself up into a tizz and get all emotional and irrational all over again

Only a Kiwi would call getting pissed off over a broken collar bone and 13 months out of the game irrational. Kiwi logic.

... and yet go into a strop because they were not allowed do their pre match dance routine after the anthems against Wales!

 If the Haka is so bad why dont you guys get it banned?

It looked like a threat,


I was recently banned for highlighting a swear word by another poster. Lets hope the MODs are watching!

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote: Just one little problem, you need to know what foul play is.

Sure, I agree. So, let's get a straight answer from you, for a change. Is dropping someone on their head so that they almost break their neck foul play?

 No.

Classy. Although, I will assume you are being facetious. If I may do the same, I am currently booking my flight to NZ this summer to drop a couple of Kiwis (smaller than me of course) on their necks, given that it is an entirely legal act. 

Hey, if you've got a problem with that, toughen up. Life can be a tough old ride.

 Are you coming down for the tour? we should catch up.

Can't say I'm interested in doing so. Also, I will assume better that this isn't a thinly veiled threat of some sort from another keyboard warrior.

 Well Im sure you will have a great time and, you will learn a lot.

If you read the first few words, I'm not interested. Now, why don't you go for a wee lie down or something? I understand the internet can be tough.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:If you read the first few words, I'm not interested. Now, why don't you go for a wee lie down or something? I understand the internet can be tough.

 Thats not very nice, I was only trying to be civil make you feel welcome.

A 60 year old NZ fan on an anonymous rugby forum trying to use some weird intimidation tactics against another rugby fan on the other side of the planet. I hope I make better life choices.

Anyway, gotta go. Let's catch up later when you calm down a bit.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Can't say I'm interested in doing so. Also, I will assume better that this isn't a thinly veiled threat of some sort from another keyboard warrior.

I've never met laurie, but I've had some robust discussions with him. One thing I'm sure of though is this: if he offers to meet up then he means it in good faith.

Rugby Fan wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Can't say I'm interested in doing so. Also, I will assume better that this isn't a thinly veiled threat of some sort from another keyboard warrior.

I've never met laurie, but I've had some robust discussions with him. One thing I'm sure of though is this: if he offers to meet up then he means it in good faith.

 Rugby fan, you hold a fantastic appreciation of the game, and if you were ever heading down this way, without hesitation I would pm either phone/email to arrange a meet, it would be my pleasure.

This thread has gone to absolute excrement.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:This thread has gone to absolute excrement.

Just about sums up the whole lions thing

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Sin é wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

ebop wrote:I can't wait for BOD to wind himself up into a tizz and get all emotional and irrational all over again

Only a Kiwi would call getting pissed off over a broken collar bone and 13 months out of the game irrational. Kiwi logic.

... and yet go into a strop because they were not allowed do their pre match dance routine after the anthems against Wales!

 If the Haka is so bad why dont you guys get it banned?

Please no - where's the petition to keep the Haka?

It is an absolute must for rugby enjoyment.
- it is the only time on the pitch facing the ABs that a player is guaranteed not to get a shoulder to the head or be spear tackled
- the ABs need the Haka to get fired up otherwise they risk losing - causing their fans to become even more intolerably boorish
- it reaches out to parts of society that bypass rugby - especially the sticking out tongue and throat slitting

Vote remain! No to Hakaxit

The Great Aukster wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Sin é wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

ebop wrote:I can't wait for BOD to wind himself up into a tizz and get all emotional and irrational all over again

Only a Kiwi would call getting pissed off over a broken collar bone and 13 months out of the game irrational. Kiwi logic.

... and yet go into a strop because they were not allowed do their pre match dance routine after the anthems against Wales!

 If the Haka is so bad why dont you guys get it banned?

Please no - where's the petition to keep the Haka?

It is an absolute must for rugby enjoyment.
- it is the only time on the pitch facing the ABs that a player is guaranteed not to get a shoulder to the head or be spear tackled
- the ABs need the Haka to get fired up otherwise they risk losing - causing their fans to become even more intolerably boorish
- it reaches out to parts of society that bypass rugby - especially the sticking out tongue and throat slitting

Vote remain! No to Hakaxit

We've learned a lot about voting up there. First Scotland votes no to Independence, then Brexit stuns everyone, now they want to redo both all over again?

Geez, between that and the characters from Deliverance voting Donald in, the north really don't know how democracy really works. Here's a hint...it starts with...ticking the right box!

Is there a petition to extend the distance teams have to stand from the Haka so as not to offend or intimidate the poor hard done by ABs?

Oh blimey I forgot we have to watch that charade before the games, plus the poor players will have to put up with Kiwi's doing it in front of them time and time again at school visits etc.........

Taylorman wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

When Quade Cooper kneed Richie McCaw in the head, the New Zealand public was outraged and proceeded to boo Cooper in public for years afterwards. Difficult to take it seriously when the same supporters claim bygones should be bygones for their own offences.

One...was it intentional? Yes. Two...did McCaw moan? No.

Think you'll find in BODs case the answers are reversed.

Sure, Cooper was a weak fan thing, same as Irish fans with Dublin. It happens. But you don't hear McCaw complaining.

Did BOD moan?  In agony since he had a broken collarbone by one of the most dangerous acts in rugby most of us have ever seen. Another fine example of Kiwi hypocrisy. Did NZ moan about sore tummies when they lost to England or was that in 1995 when they lost to SA I don't recall?

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

aucklandlaurie wrote: Just one little problem, you need to know what foul play is.

Sure, I agree. So, let's get a straight answer from you, for a change. Is dropping someone on their head so that they almost break their neck foul play?

 No.

Classy. Although, I will assume you are being facetious. If I may do the same, I am currently booking my flight to NZ this summer to drop a couple of Kiwis (smaller than me of course) on their necks, given that it is an entirely legal act. 

Hey, if you've got a problem with that, toughen up. Life can be a tough old ride.

 Are you coming down for the tour? we should catch up.

Can't say I'm interested in doing so. Also, I will assume better that this isn't a thinly veiled threat of some sort from another keyboard warrior.

 Well Im sure you will have a great time and, you will learn a lot.

What do you think he'll learn in NZ?

New Zealand have never lost without being hit by sickness. Quite a coincidence. Not bad losers though.

Gwlad wrote:

Taylorman wrote:

Rugby Fan wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

When Quade Cooper kneed Richie McCaw in the head, the New Zealand public was outraged and proceeded to boo Cooper in public for years afterwards. Difficult to take it seriously when the same supporters claim bygones should be bygones for their own offences.

One...was it intentional? Yes. Two...did McCaw moan? No.

Think you'll find in BODs case the answers are reversed.

Sure, Cooper was a weak fan thing, same as Irish fans with Dublin. It happens. But you don't hear McCaw complaining.

Did BOD moan?  In agony since he had a broken collarbone by one of the most dangerous acts in rugby most of us have ever seen. Another fine example of Kiwi hypocrisy. Did NZ moan about sore tummies when they lost to England or was that in 1995 when they lost to SA I don't recall?

Yes fair call, there's a familiar pattern that seems to emerge every time...starts with the latest debacle, then BOD, then McCaw, then 95. We're all a fairly predictable lot I agree.

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

What a load of horse crap, they picked him up off the ball and drove him into the ground, Umaga and Mealamu are scumbags.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsXJyDHFKn0

Clearly was intentional, clearly was dangerous and 12 years on it is clearly irrelevant. Seems a fairly futile debate drawn down the lines of which team you supported on the day.

Still sickening to watch, and even more sickening that some "fans" from New Zealand do not recognise it as one of the most disgusting acts on the rugby pitch. I thought Munster fans were incapable of criticising their own, but they look like saints in comparison.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Still sickening to watch, and even more sickening that some "fans" from New Zealand do not recognise it as one of the most disgusting acts on the rugby pitch. I thought Munster fans were incapable of criticising their own, but they look like saints in comparison.

Clearly you have not been to cork or limerick for a game. Munster supporters do nothing but criticise their own. We just don't like anybody else doing it.

aucklandlaurie wrote:

Sin é wrote:

GunsGermsV2 wrote:

ebop wrote:I can't wait for BOD to wind himself up into a tizz and get all emotional and irrational all over again

Only a Kiwi would call getting pissed off over a broken collar bone and 13 months out of the game irrational. Kiwi logic.

... and yet go into a strop because they were not allowed do their pre match dance routine after the anthems against Wales!

 If the Haka is so bad why dont you guys get it banned?

I don't mind the haka. I find it amusing though that you got so upset when asked to perform it before the anthems rather than after.

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

What a load of horse crap, they picked him up off the ball and drove him into the ground, Umaga and Mealamu are scumbags.

Perhaps...and BOD's a moaner- a serial one. Cant have it both ways Hammer.

Taylorman wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

What a load of horse crap, they picked him up off the ball and drove him into the ground, Umaga and Mealamu are scumbags.

Perhaps...and BOD's a moaner- a serial one. Cant have it both ways Hammer.

Nor can you , moaning about food poisoning or a forward pass by comparison with being double spear tackled into the ground to the tune of a fractured collar bone and what could have been a tragedy kind of sums the whole Kiwi nature up. Kiwis love to moan when it suits them and then put down anyone else who has a justifiable grievance.

Taylorman wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

What a load of horse crap, they picked him up off the ball and drove him into the ground, Umaga and Mealamu are scumbags.

Perhaps...and BOD's a moaner- a serial one. Cant have it both ways Hammer.

How is that having it both ways, BOD moans about a couple of scumbags trying to end his career so what?

Fact is, he broke his collarbone

What's with all this 'what if' nonsense?

That Irish guy that kneed McCaw in the head. What an absolute scumbag thug. Bet he didn't apologise.

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

Taylorman wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Yeah I just think some people shouldn't play this game. It's just too hard for some. can't take it, don't play it. Simple. Understand it went unpenalised, understand he was hurt, and understand it was unintentional.

A few things conspired at the same time to result in a near worst case scenario, none if it intentional. Unfortunately it happens.

What a load of horse crap, they picked him up off the ball and drove him into the ground, Umaga and Mealamu are scumbags.

Perhaps...and BOD's a moaner- a serial one. Cant have it both ways Hammer.

How is that having it both ways, BOD moans about a couple of scumbags trying to end his career so what?

You see thats where you get carried away.
Did Tana and Keven meet and decide...Hey, how about we try and end BODs career today? No, unless you have proof that they did other than an emotionally fuelled view of the tackle.
Are they actually scumbags? No. They had a moment. Tana is crdited for saving a players life by preventing his tongue from being swollen. A scumbag may not have done that perhaps.
Mealamu is credited with doing countless projects and services to his community over the years- thousands of hours where he's helped wider family and the youth of South Auckland.

So no, sorry, stop being over emotive. It was an unfortunate moment that can happen in rugby- and much worse does. That they didnt apologise isnt great but that probably wasnt helped by BODs persistent raising it over the years, tweeting and withdrawing them, using the media to promote his cause. he did the same with Gats in 2013 when he should have just...said nufg and respected the decision to put a winning side onto the field. But nope. Away he went...

ebop wrote:Fact is, he broke his collarbone

What's with all this 'what if' nonsense?

That Irish guy that kneed McCaw in the head. What an absolute scumbag thug. Bet he didn't apologise.

When Cooper made contact with McCaw's head it was his own fault, he should have got his head out of the way.

Likewise when McCaw is sitting in a ruck and has his head at knee height and Higginbotham catches him, He then reacts by grabbing Higginbotham's leg.

Mealamu and Umaga, absolute scumbags? If the cap fits.

Good post Tman

This may be quite hard for Kiwi brains to understand, but if you lift a player up, tip him over and then drive him into the ground on his head, then that is a rather obvious intentional act. Whether they were trying to cause serious injury/end his career is a matter for debate. If you truly believe that the incident was accidental or even just reckless, then I really don't know what else to say.

But hey, maybe you do have brains:

http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/170852

Tana and Kevan didn't but Quade did? Whatever system you have to prove the one did but the two didn't I suggest you patent it.