PGA Tour: Boston TPC Party: Notes from the Ballwasher

First topic message reminder :

1).After Sunday's thriller on Long Island, the boys move up the Interstate towards Boston and the TPC Boston for the Dell Technologies Championship, Round 2 of the FedeX Cup Play-Offs. The crowds will be larger and louder than last weekend, but anyone's guess as to whether they will see a better finish than the Jordan/Dustin Duel. Best of the year? Ahead of Garcia and Rose??
Last year Mickelson's duels with Stenson and Garcia spoiled us, but the Northern Trust was certainly pretty good.

2).With so many ructions, actual and speculated, to the Tour schedules, it's becoming increasingly tricky to discern fact and fiction but there is enough chat to suggest this could be the end of the four-tournament Play Off structure, with the Boston date being the likeliest to miss out. If this tournament, the former DeutscheBank Championship, is not replaced, it seems likely that the Tour Championship will be brought forward a week, or possibly two, for 2018. Bound to be scuttlebutt on this as tournament coverage starts in earnest this week. And: Remember, the Dell action begins on Friday and runs through Monday, Labor Day in these here parts.

3).As compelling as last week's Northern Trust finale was, there was muttering among the twittering pros about the value of #18 at Glen Oaks as a play-off hole.
Wes Bryan tweeted:
"If you fly it 315 yards then you have a 100-yard wide fairway on 18 . . . . . . It's a shame that it ended because of a long drive contest in the play-off."
Whilst Poults echoed that:
"Shame play-off hole had to be the worst hole of the golf course . . . . 18th hole suited five guys in the field. Congrats DJ, unlucky Jordan."
All of which makes DJ's play in regulation down the right-hand side of the fairway, well into the rough and blocked out, even more bizarre.

4).In all the chatter about the role of caddies, it's difficult not to like DJ's partnership with his brother - in their case, the caddie's role seems to be not much more than carry the bag and listen to Dustin talk his options through. No sense of anything other than self-recrimination, no regrets, from DJ; just go find it and hit it again. Seems to suit him well, perhaps a refreshing contrast to the interminable debates between Spieth and Greller?
Watching the contrast between Furyk/Fluff and Rory/JP earlier this year was instructive.
Furyk double-checked every yardage personally, engaged Fluff in virtually every single shot however long or short. But never any sense that 100% responsibility laid w/Furyk.
Whilst Rory seemed to leave all the yardages to JP, left him out almost 100% around and on the greens.

5).pga.com listed the most difficult courses on Tour this season (prior to the Play-Offs):
9).TPC San Antonio (Valero Texas Open)
8).Bay Hill
7).Colonial
6).Erin Hills (US Open)
5).TPC Sawgrass (Players)
4).TPC Avenel (Quicken Loans)
3).Birkdale
2).Augusta National
1).Quail Hollow (PGA)
No explanation as to whether there's some calibration for quality of fields, say for San Antonio, Colonial & Avenel, but interesting nevertheless.

6).Dustin Johnson and Rory will both be going for their league-leading fifth Play-Off win this week.
Others with multiple wins are:
3: Woods
2: Vijay Singh, Villegas, Mickelson, Stenson, Horschel, Day. Which means that 56% of Play Off events have been won by just 8 golfers.

7).This week sees the first of four web.com Tour Finals (WTF's) tournaments with the top 25 aggregate money-winners not otherwise exempt earning Tour cards for 2017/2018.
We'll keep track of these events, especially the Europeans led by Seamus Power.
But other notables include:  
Ben Crane, Mahan, Scott Hend, Ishikawa, Summerhays, Tringale, Johnson Wagner, Uihlein, and Robbie Castro who finished 22nd in last year's FedEx ranking, with all the exemption bennies that bestowed. That's the second time he's pulled that trick, tough to do!

8).It looks as if the venue for the Houston Open, the GC of Houston, has been comprehensively inundated by Hurricane Harvey. Quite how extensive the damage might be can only be guessed at, but now Houston has a schedule spot without a sponsor and, quite possibly, a home course. New Orleans was similarly afflicted after Katrina, but they relocated to English Turn for one year, keeping an event which was thought at the time to be therapeutic to the community. Hoping Houston, the City and the tournament, can bounce back following the devastation - best wishes to robopz and anyone reading in SE Texas, SW Louisiana. Shovelling three feet of snow somehow doesn't feel quite so bad.

9).The top 70 in FedEx Points following the Dell Technologies Championship move on to Chicago in two weeks' time. Snedeker, Holmes and Piercy have already hung up their clubs for the season - others at risk of bowing out this week include:
Ryan Moore, Bubba, Adam Scott, Rafa C-B, and Branden Grace.

Whilst at the close of play on Monday, the first ten players for each Presidents Cup Team will have been identified:
For the US, DJ, Spieth, Thomas, Berger, Fowler, Koepka, Kisner are assured of a place. They're followed by Kuchar (#8), Reed, Hoffman, Chappell, Harman, Dufner, Woodland.
International: Matsuyama, Day, Scott, Louis, Charl, Leishman, Grace, Vegas, Si Woo Kim (all look certs), with Hadwin vulnerable in 10th place.
Two Captain's choices each to be named later.

10).And, in Europe, the first points-scoring event for the Ryder Cup gets underway in the Czech Republic on Thursday. If the RC Team was to be picked today, I'd go with the current Top 12 eligible on the R2D:
Fleetwood, Sergio, Rahm, Rafa, Noren, Molinari, Rose, Fish, Rory, Wiesberger, Pieters, Stenson. They're followed by Jordan Smith and Alex Levy (would love to see him take the "next step").

The US have been accumulating points already and the leading 12 hoping to continue to MAGA are:  
Koepka, Thomas, Spieth, Kooch, DJ, Fowler, Harman, Reed, Haas, Hoffman, ZJ, Chappell.

The last four FedEx Play-Off tournaments have been won by Rory, DJ, Rory, DJ . . . . . .. Rory's already won twice at TPC Boston and   he keeps this sequence going.

He should change his name to "Die Trying".

I blame Leadbetter, he was introducing these "heir's" to Tiger's throne every few months at one stage.

Not to mention a little blame for Callaway and others who lobbed gazillions at him.

Daily tickets for the Walker Cup is $75 per day.

This is an amateur event

Shame on the USGA.

Probably to keep the riff raff out of LA CC, a foretaste of what's to come when they take the US Open there in 2023.

Hoping that Sea Island escapes relatively unscathed this coming week as Irma approaches. GPB, Did you see the twitter entries I posted on the Anything Goes thread? I find that sort of thing irrationally cool!

Still hoping to hear that robo and related robos have all avoided the worst of Harvey.

Robo is doing OK and posting on another board. My Father has evacuated his mid Florida House and at his wife's son house in the panhandle. If they must evacuate from there, I will probably drive down to see him

The last WTF tournament got canceled last year, in Jacksonville. I presume they will make every effort to play there this year.

That's good. All the best to all.

Also good news from PGA Tour HQ is that all 70 eligible runners and riders have signed up for the BMW at Chicagoland's Conway Farms.

Haven't examined the WTF field for Boise yet, but Hend & Romero are playing a rigorous schedule: Ohio, Switzerland, Idaho.
Southgate going again . . . . . .

A couple of South Floridians have bugged out of Palm Beach County and attending the US Open semifinals.

King Louis was in Kevin Anderson's entourage and Tiger will be supporting Rafa in the 2nd semifinal.

King Charl was there also, Saffers sticking together!

Woods must have switched his bromance from Roger . . . . like his Raider jacket anyway.

50p for anyone who names the last South African Slam finalist....

Not Cliffie?

Or maybe Kriek??

I'm off to check.

Ah ha!

Curran?

Kevin Curren it was.

Anyone watching the Walker Cup? Thought this guy Champ was the next big thing, 6 over in the singles of the live scores are correct. Looking like a good close tournament so far.

Haven't watched any of the WC but this is looking like a thrashing; had thought GB&I had a competitive looking team going in, but it hasn't exactly turned out that way . . . . . . . .

kwinigolfer wrote:Haven't watched any of the WC but this is looking like a thrashing; had thought GB&I had a competitive looking team going in, but it hasn't exactly turned out that way . . . . . . . .

Thrashing has morphed into an annihilation. Not representative of the GB&I form coming in, but this result doesn't lie. Oof.

When I posted yesterday it was 2-2 with the singles looking almost completely even; then seemingly every GB&I player on the course contrived to go miles over par on their back nine, and that was that for the weekend. Oh well.

In other news did anyone see the Challenge Your event this weekend? First time using their modified stableford system, won't give away the finish but Oscar Lengden might be a name to keep an eye on...

I saw the Lengden finish on princedrac's twitter feed. Impressive.

Very disappointing from LA - last-minute change of captain can't have helped, but that's a comprehensive capitulation. Tables have turned, what can be done to restore the balance? No clue! But good to see MFitz increase his experience of the winners enclosure; he needs to step it up in the biggest events now.

kwinigolfer wrote:But good to see MFitz increase his experience of the winners enclosure; he needs to step it up in the biggest events now.

The RtD Championship is not one of the "biggest events"? Lee Westwood weeps as that is his biggest OWGR rated win in his career.

GPB wrote:

kwinigolfer wrote:But good to see MFitz increase his experience of the winners enclosure; he needs to step it up in the biggest events now.

The RtD Championship is not one of the "biggest events"?  Lee Westwood weeps as that is his biggest OWGR rated win in his career.

One step behind the Majors and WGC's which is what I was getting at.


I wonder how East Lake fared as the storm moved thru Georgia - looks like it's veering away from Chicago, so whether for the Beemer should be good, certainly for Rounds 1 & 2.

It must get very tedious watching every tournament through the prism of where each golfer is from. It's so one dimensional, I wonder if appreciation of quality of play and performance ever come into it.

Be_the_ball wrote:It must get very tedious watching every tournament through the prism of where each golfer is from. It's so one dimensional, I wonder if appreciation of quality of play and performance ever come into it.

Lessons of life from an Irishman?

pedro wrote:

Be_the_ball wrote:It must get very tedious watching every tournament through the prism of where each golfer is from. It's so one dimensional, I wonder if appreciation of quality of play and performance ever come into it.

Lessons of life from an Irishman?

Not really Pedro, just an observation. It must be very limiting viewing all golf through Ryder Cup or Pres Cup affiliations/Tours. Personally I don't really care where anyone's from, im just interested in watching quality golf and good competition. Kwini seems to have to field a never ending conveyor belt of questions/comments that are essentially "my favourite player is better than your player" type stuff. All very juvenile. He has the patience of Job.

Be_the_ball wrote:

pedro wrote:

Be_the_ball wrote:It must get very tedious watching every tournament through the prism of where each golfer is from. It's so one dimensional, I wonder if appreciation of quality of play and performance ever come into it.

Lessons of life from an Irishman?

Not really Pedro, just an observation. It must be very limiting viewing all golf through Ryder Cup or Pres Cup affiliations/Tours. Personally I don't really care where anyone's from, im just interested in watching quality golf and good competition. Kwini seems to have to field a never ending conveyor belt of questions/comments that are essentially "my favourite player is better than your player" type stuff. All very juvenile. He has the patience of Job.

Ha, this cracked me up. Nice one btb

One thing that struck me is actually it seems to be some of the Irish posters on here who are the most one eyed, especially where Harrington is involved. I understand rooting for a local boy but as you say it must be really limiting.

I will be rooting for Int'l team in the Prez Cup in a couple of weeks. Actually I am rooting for the game of golf because I think the Int'l team really needs to win a couple of these matches to make it a competition.

Always here to please Raymondo, always here to please!

Personally I realised on here a long time ago that everyone tends to "get stick" in equal measures, Harrington only one of many, no Golfer or Nationality is safe. Ok maybe David Howell, he seems to be universally acceped as a nice chap.

Good for you GPB, though I wouldn't be putting any money on it

It's OK, B_t_b, I hope I'm just as opinionated!

Though alternative arguments seldom get much attention . . . . .

Presidents Cup a big mis-match I should think, unless Day, Grace & Scott can rediscover some form - they go seven deep and that can work in Ryder Cup, when the guys play as a team, but not in Pres Cup.

GPB wrote:I will be rooting for Int'l team in the Prez Cup in a couple of weeks.  Actually I am rooting for the game of golf because I think the Int'l team really needs to win a couple of these matches to make it a competition.

Maybe make it Septics v ROW? The Presidents Cup is a dog with fleas, so it needs a revamp.

super_realist wrote:

GPB wrote:I will be rooting for Int'l team in the Prez Cup in a couple of weeks.  Actually I am rooting for the game of golf because I think the Int'l team really needs to win a couple of these matches to make it a competition.

Maybe make it Septics v ROW? The Presidents Cup is a dog with fleas, so it needs a revamp.

The folks in South Africa and Australia might feel the same way about the Ryder Cup. Just because it has little interest in Europe does not mean the Prez Cup does not have merit.

And they accuse Americans of being jingoistic.

Fact is it isn't well followed or televised, no matter how you try to dress it up, it simply doesn't generate anything like the interest the Ryder Cup does, mostly because there is no camaraderie between International players. They have nothing in common.

The RC is one of the biggest events in global sport. The Presidents Cup doesn't even register. You can't just gerrymander a competition and say it has value. Hardly anyone bothers with it, and not just those of us in Europe. It's like the Seve Trophy. No one cares about that either. That and the PC are just tinpot competitions with about as much meaning as an Autumn Rugby international, which is basically a friendly with a token trophy.

It's hard to see the RoW get anything but trounced, they would have to play out of their skins just to be competitive at the moment. I've alway felt the Seve trophy was a training match for up and coming Captains, there's certainly no needle or bragging rights involved. I'll still probably watch both tho

I think the Internationals missed the boat when Greg Norman went home to Australia in 2011, loaded his team with Aussies, ramped up the hype, then came out firing blanks.
Some of the Asians turned up late, hardly knew some of their teammates, and the Internationals were five points down halfway through Saturday.
They should have squeaked a win or half in Korea, but their best players, Matsuyama apart, seem to have regressed since then.
And now they've cow-towed to commercial shenanigans and avoided going back to S.Africa until after Ernie Els has lost relevance as a galvanising figure. Hopefully they'll go there in 2023 but they'll probably take Asian dollars/yen instead.

Basically a good idea, set up by the Tour who promptly played 3 of the first 4 events in Virginia. Great. A thumping in a fortnight would confirm its irrelevance.

IMO, the Presidents Cup will get watched by more people than the Ryder Cup.

Despite adding Euros to the Ryder Cup almost 40 years ago, I don't think many people are watching in France, Germany, Spain, and Sweden.

FTR, I don't think it is getting that much coverage in South Africa, Australia and Argentina and Venezuela, I think the numbers are comparable to "continental Europe". And I think the number of Asian eyes watching in Japan and Korea (and now India) will be larger than in GB&I.

The PGATour is watched by a lot of people in Asia. probably as many or more than Europe.

Be_the_ball wrote:It must get very tedious watching every tournament through the prism of where each golfer is from. It's so one dimensional, I wonder if appreciation of quality of play and performance ever come into it.

This is a great point and what I am about to say should probably not be aired in public but here goes. Certain posters over defensiveness about European players eventually soured relationships on here. I tend to like golfers based on what little we know about their personalities, how good they are, manner in which they play/win and a few personal intangibles. Nothing to do with what RC team they could play for. It just so happens that Lee, Garcia, Poulter, Harrington, Seve, Sulli, Howell etc don't really do it for me in terms of supporting a guy playing golf. I am often left feeling that my popularity would increase massively if I just posted as a Euro fan boy.

McLaren wrote:I am often left feeling that my popularity would increase massively if I just posted as a Euro fan boy.

Regardless of what you did differently it would increase massively.

I wouldn't worry about popularity on a Golf forum Mac. Everyone has different favorites for different reasons it's only when ppl clam up and refuse to engage that the board dies, people from different parts of the world have a more nuanced view of different players for different reasons. Take Paul Casey as an example, I'm convinced that Shot_rock believes that PC's not popular on this board because he dropped his Euro Tour status and all the RC fallout, where for me its because he comes across as a conceited plonker with a constant grin that would put a Cheshire cat to shame. He said in a BBC interview years back that he expected a couple of green jackets by the end of his career. That type of carry on is what turns me off him.

Around Lee & Padraig, I must see something different to you. There's an interview of Harrington walking off the 18th at Carnoustie in 07 and he's asked to sum up his win and he says something like He's having trouble taking it in as he feels he was never "destined" to win majors, that he was a "worker". Some people appreciate that about Harrington, he set himself an enormous goal and against popular "wisdom" achieved it 3 times. Thats probably something you don't see or value Mac, for your age and position in life it may not mean anything to you, and thats fine.

Lee I like because he's had an interesting career, in majors he's gone 10 rounds with George Foreman and he's still coming out for the next bell. He did have the natural talent, but had that spell where he dropped way down the world rankings then fought his way back to No 1. That takes guts.

Much better to argue your point than go off in a huff. When you've been on this board long enough you get a broader view of where people are coming from, and when something is said for the purpose of inciting a hilarious reaction

Be_the_ball wrote:I wouldn't worry about popularity on a Golf forum Mac. Everyone has different favorites for different reasons it's only when ppl clam up and refuse to engage that the board dies, people from different parts of the world have a more nuanced view of different players for different reasons. Take Paul Casey as an example, I'm convinced that Shot_rock believes that PC's not popular on this board because he dropped his Euro Tour status and all the RC fallout, where for me its because he comes across as a conceited plonker with a constant grin that would put a Cheshire cat to shame. He said in a BBC interview years back that he expected a couple of green jackets by the end of his career. That type of carry on is what turns me off him.

Around Lee & Padraig, I must see something different to you. There's an interview of Harrington walking off the 18th at Carnoustie in 07 and he's asked to sum up his win and he says something like He's having trouble taking it in as he feels he was never "destined" to win majors, that he was a "worker". Some people appreciate that about Harrington, he set himself an enormous goal and against popular "wisdom" achieved it 3 times. Thats probably something you don't see or value Mac, for your age and position in life it may not mean anything to you, and thats fine.

Lee I like because he's had an interesting career, in majors he's gone 10 rounds with George Foreman and he's still coming out for the next bell. He did have the natural talent, but had that spell where he dropped way down the world rankings then fought his way back to No 1. That takes guts.

Much better to argue your point than go off in a huff. When you've been on this board long enough you get a broader view of where people are coming from, and when something is said for the purpose of inciting a hilarious reaction

Hear, hear.

Don't worry I won't go off in in a huff, my pea brain hatin` comments will keep coming.

McLaren wrote:
Certain posters over defensiveness about European players eventually soured relationships on here.   I tend to like golfers based on what little we know about their personalities, how good they are, manner in which they play/win and a few personal intangibles.  Nothing to do with what RC team they could play for.  

I think BtB makes a really good point. I agree with your observation Mac, I also share your opinion on what makes a golfer likeable (although the outcomes are different).

McLaren wrote:
I am often left feeling that my popularity would increase massively if I just posted as a Euro fan boy.

No it wouldn't, you're unpopular because you're a d!ck.


Only joking. Sorry  


(not sorry)

McLaren wrote:Don't worry I won't go off in in a huff, my pea brain hatin` comments will keep coming.

I don't mean you go off in a huff Mac, I just mean generally.

GPB wrote:Matthew Southgate missed the cut in the Webbie tournament.

By Four shots.

He is #20 in the 2017 Race to Dubai Standings.

And now he's going to the BIG TOUR!

Indeed...good for him!

He finished T5 in a tournament of PGATour misfits and the best of the developmental tour.