Ireland v Wales 24/02/2018 14:15

by Noble-Surfer Tue Feb 20, 2018 11:20 pm

First topic message reminder :

So, Wales have gone with Dan Biggar, Liam Williams & Leigh Halfpenny for the game against Ireland. George North & Gareth Anscombe drop to the bench, and Rhys Patchell & Josh Adams drop out of the match day squad. Not bad decisions in my opinion, though I think I might have had Patchell on the bench over Anscombe... and possibly switched Halfpenny & Williams- I just think Williams offers more threat from fullback than Halfpenny does.

Wales Team:
Halfpenny (Scarlets); L Williams (Saracens), S Williams (Scarlets), Parkes (Scarlets), S Evans (Scarlets); Biggar (Ospreys), G Davies (Scarlets); R Evans (Scarlets), Owens (Scarlets), Lee (Scarlets), Hill (Dragons), AW Jones (Ospreys capt), Shingler (Scarlets), Navidi (Cardiff Blues), Moriarty (Gloucester).

Replacements:
Dee (Dragons), W Jones (Scarlets), Francis (Exeter Chiefs), B Davies (Ospreys), Tipuric (Ospreys), A Davies (Scarlets), Anscombe (Blues), North (Northampton).

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/43127349

Ireland Team:
Kearney; Earls, Farrell, Aki, Stockdale; Sexton, Murray; Healy, Best (capt), Porter; James Ryan, Toner; O'Mahony, Leavy, Stander.

Replacements: Cronin, McGrath, John Ryan, Roux, Conan, Marmion, Carbery, McFadden.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/43152956

by Guest Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:31 am

majesticimperialman wrote:
The Oracle wrote:
majesticimperialman wrote:
The Oracle wrote:Don’t forget Wales have 3 of the Lions ‘Geography 6’ in the squad, 2 starting!

Be afraid. Be very afraid!

I am sure Ireland will be quaking in their boots about that.

I was being sarcastic, obviously. Are you for real Maj?!

Should of realised.

by Pot Hale Wed Feb 21, 2018 8:27 am

majesticimperialman wrote:
The Oracle wrote:
majesticimperialman wrote:
The Oracle wrote:Don’t forget Wales have 3 of the Lions ‘Geography 6’ in the squad, 2 starting!

Be afraid. Be very afraid!

I am sure Ireland will be quaking in their boots about that.

I was being sarcastic, obviously. Are you for real Maj?!

Should of realised.

Should have realised. Tsk tsk.

by NoCuthbertUpsetsMe Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:51 pm

The Patchell argument is flawed. Most of his star performances for the Scarlets came at 15. Playing international rugby at 10 is a different matter.

It was Scotland after all. Maesteg could have beaten Scotland. Patchell had his chance at 10 and blew it.

Most pundits and coaches would rate Biggar as world class. For me Priestland is still the 2nd best. We have had our best run against Ireland for 40 years in the past few years. Great wins in 2015 6N, 2015 warm-up, a draw in 2016 and an absolute battering in 2017.

Prior to 2015 we saw exceptional performances from Priestland in 2011 and 2012.

People have a short memory. If Wales had Biggar, Liam and Halfpenny available in Twickenham, we'd probably have seen a Welsh victory. This young inexperienced side held England at home to just 12 points and they didn't score anything after 20 mins! That is rather incredible.

Gatland's picked a great side for the weekend and the bench looks scary. Anscombe was incredible in Twickenham and will be a more than capable plan B with North.

There's always the 2nd options of moving Biggar to 12 and North to 13. A lot of potential options in the 2nd half to expose Irish injuries / weaknesses.

by munkian Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:58 pm

Biggar is the most complete 10 we have and a big game winner.

He's easily the best choice to win against Ireland.

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 8:48 pm

munkian wrote:Biggar is the most complete 10 we have and a big game winner.

He's easily the best choice to win against Ireland.

Pity he wasn't used for the England game then.

by Guest Wed Feb 21, 2018 8:58 pm

SecretFly wrote:
munkian wrote:Biggar is the most complete 10 we have and a big game winner.

He's easily the best choice to win against Ireland.

Pity he wasn't used for the England game then.

Same for Phil Bennett too. Pity. Whistle

by **LondonTiger** Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:07 pm

The Oracle wrote:
SecretFly wrote:
munkian wrote:Biggar is the most complete 10 we have and a big game winner.

He's easily the best choice to win against Ireland.

Pity he wasn't used for the England game then.

Same for Phil Bennett too. Pity.

Well Biggar was injured, Bennett merely old.

Thought of the old-timer stepping up reminds me of a possibly apocryphal tale about Don Bradman

Interviwer: So Don, how do you think you would fare against modern fast bowlers
Bradman: Oh I would probably have averaged about 70
Interviewer: (Expressing surprise as the Don's career average was 99.94) Really they are that good now?
Don: Well, you see, I am almost 80 and my reflexes are not what they once were.

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:10 pm

The way this talk is going. Wales are probably on the 'Radge' Level of confidence right now. They need to get on the plane, ensure the bus driver doesn't do the tourist route to the stadium Whistle

- and otherwise just turn up to win handily.

Ireland - we're either going to get our pants taken down and have our asses publically whipped by Gats and his crew (utter humiliation again Sad

)... or it's going to be another Wales v Scotland game.

by munkian Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:14 pm

Its hardly Radge levels, we have historically done well against you in Dublin and Biggar has won plenty of big pressure games in Ireland.

by NoCuthbertUpsetsMe Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:15 pm

Look how high Wales' confidence was in 2014 off the back of Lord Howler's 2013 championship.

Dublin 2014 was the worst performance of the Gatland era along with Croke-earls Park 2010.

As happy as I am with the Squad I think Ireland will sneak it. However Ireland scraped a win over a poor French team and weren't tested by ltaly. So could work out for us.

Glad England and Ireland have had the easier games first.

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:17 pm

Correct (Munkian). Radge levels of confidence. Not Radge levels of score predicting but you're all pretty confident it'll be an easy trip.

Good going. Nothing wrong with that - and it might indeed be another Wales notch on the pistol handle.

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:22 pm

NoCuthbertUpsetsMe wrote:Look how high Wales' confidence was in 2014 off the back of Lord Howler's 2013 championship.

Dublin 2014 was the worst performance of the Gatland era along with Croke-earls Park 2010.

As happy as I am with the Squad I think Ireland will sneak it. However Ireland scraped a win over a poor French team and weren't tested by ltaly. So could work out for us.

Glad England and Ireland have had the easier games first.

Yep. Ireland still don't know what they have. Wales have a better understanding of what they have after the England game. They can do some real analysis. Ireland were poor against France and but for the well worked get-out-of-jail drop, it was really a loss in terms of performance overall.

So yep. Ireland and the players will be nervous. This will be the first full on test of their mettle and they won't have the excuse of first game out away from home in Paris.

All I'm hoping for is that much like Wales have usually done in 6N, Ireland started with less intensity than they mean to end the contest and I'm hoping they've guided their conditioning work down that channel too. We always knew the last three games were bang, bang, bang - the toughest.

by Guest Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:24 pm

SecretFly wrote:The way this talk is going. Wales are probably on the 'Radge' Level of confidence right now. They need to get on the plane, ensure the bus driver doesn't do the tourist route to the stadium - and otherwise just turn up to win handily.

Ireland - we're either going to get our pants taken down and have our asses publically whipped by Gats and his crew (utter humiliation again )... or it's going to be another Wales v Scotland game.

Where is this Radge level confidence? I haven’t read it. Apart from in that post just now by Gwlad (in his new guise).

by Guest Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:25 pm

SecretFly wrote:Correct (Munkian). Radge levels of confidence. Not Radge levels of score predicting but you're all pretty confident it'll be an easy trip.

Good going. Nothing wrong with that - and it might indeed be another Wales notch on the pistol handle.

This is utter horse sh*t!

by Guest Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:30 pm

I’ve just read the whole thread again. I can see no one that has predicted a wales win (apart from TightHEAD). No one really making predications at all.

by NoCuthbertUpsetsMe Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:31 pm

Well I am off to France vs Italy in Marseille followed by an entire Saturday of Guinness, Entrecote and rugby Smile

Should be in Dublin, but fancied a change.

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:33 pm

Is it a crime to be confident? We're going to have a battle about the definition of confidence?

The Welsh seem pretty confident over all. That's my reading - and despite the red lines over my name for a perfectly reasonable comment about Bigger - I'll keep to my readings about what I feel is a largely confident mood of a win throughout most of the Welsh commentary so far.

by Guest Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:36 pm

SecretFly wrote:Is it a crime to be confident? We're going to have a battle about the definition of confidence?

The Welsh seem pretty confident over all. That's my reading - and despite the red lines over my name for a perfectly reasonable comment about Bigger - I'll keep to my readings about what I feel is a largely confident mood of a win throughout most of the Welsh commentary so far.

Not on this thread, Fly. It’s just not there.

by LordDowlais Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:37 pm

Ireland should win this one, they are favourites for a reason. If Wales put in the same performance as thy did against England then it could get twitchy for them, but Ireland at home will be far too strong in my opinion, no matter what our record there is.

I reckon Ireland will win this by 10+.

by Guest Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:37 pm

On the Biggar comment, you realise he was injured for the England game? Couldn’t have been picked.

by Scottrf Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:39 pm

NoCuthbertUpsetsMe wrote:As happy as I am with the Squad

You'll be even more Glad, with a win inside you.

by TightHEAD Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:40 pm

All the love for Bigger's return is great to see, but the feeling from these boards previously was that he needed to be dropped.

Why the change of heart?

Patchell ripped apart Scotland and Anscombe bossing the midfield came so close to beating England.

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:51 pm

The Oracle wrote:On the Biggar comment, you realise he was injured for the England game? Couldn’t have been picked.

No, I didn't realise that. I'm too interested in Ireland's prep to be fully in tune with Welsh injuries. Besides, I'd still say that Patchell was favourite pick right up to that England game. Would Biggar have gotten in if fit? Only Gats will know.
Anyway, my comment was invalid. So be it. I still say to the red line expert (whoever he may be) to leave it out. We could all play that game... and things would get real messy real quick.

by Collapse2005 Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:01 pm

LordDowlais wrote:Ireland should win this one, they are favourites for a reason. If Wales put in the same performance as thy did against England then it could get twitchy for them, but Ireland at home will be far too strong in my opinion, no matter what our record there is.

I reckon Ireland will win this by 10+.

I'm not so sure. I think the teams are evenly matched now that Furlong is out. I'm sure Gatland will have something up his sleeve too.

I have no idea how to predict this game. The bookies have Ireland by 10 points but I cant see it really.

In fairness Ireland at home rarely lose but Wales are the one team that tends to do well there.

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:13 pm

Ireland could win by 10. I haven't thought about scores yet but it could happen. But we could also lose by ten if we let Wales generate a head of steam, let them out of the blocks by over kicking to what is a serious counter-attacking side.
So if Ireland win by ten or more, they'll have to play a perfect Joe Schmidt game of incremental scoring backed up by a marathon tight and stingy defensive display.

Wales won't sit back. They say Ireland are predictable - but so too are Wales. They have the instinct to chase a game for great swathes of the 80. They'll come at Ireland and try to run our less.... ahem athletic ... players off their feet to create gaps they can exploit.
Ireland have to hold onto possession - even if it is stagnant boring phaseplay possession, resist the urge to overkick (Murray - I'm looking at you) and try to get lineouts/steals in handy positions. I think it was said about last year's stats that Ireland use the lineout most for their more 'creative' plays.

by Collapse2005 Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:15 pm

At least we don't have to endure 80 minutes of Wayne Barnes. Maybe that's why the bookies have Ireland as favorites this time?

Ireland have won 5 from 6 games Glen Jackson has reffed where as our record with Barnes is abysmal.

by **LondonTiger** Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:17 pm

It is hard to tell where both sides are at.

Before an easy win over Italy that really told us bugger all, Ireland had dominated possession against France and from memory did not create a single decent try scoring opportunity. They have to offer much more in attack.

Wales took ful advantage of Scottish errors and looked good offensively. At Twickenham it was largely a defensive rearguard but some serious inaccuracies in attack (and yes a TMO call) left them scoring only in 3s. Will the changes made by Gatland remove those mistakes and help them score points, or will it disrupt the patterns of play they are trying to achieve.

Purely on 6Ns form I would make this a very close game, Wales easily able to win, but Ireland having home advantage. Injuries do weaken the team in green and they will need to play better than they have so far to secure a win.

Am I talking myself into a circle here?

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:22 pm

LondonTiger wrote:It is hard to tell where both sides are at.

Before an easy win over Italy that really told us bugger all, Ireland had dominated possession against France and from memory did not create a single decent try scoring opportunity. They have to offer much more in attack.

Wales took ful advantage of Scottish errors and looked good offensively. At Twickenham it was largely a defensive rearguard but some serious inaccuracies in attack (and yes a TMO call) left them scoring only in 3s. Will the changes made by Gatland remove those mistakes and help them score points, or will it disrupt the patterns of play they are trying to achieve.

Purely on 6Ns form I would make this a very close game, Wales easily able to win, but Ireland having home advantage. Injuries do weaken the team in green and they will need to play better than they have so far to secure a win.

Am I talking myself into a circle here?

A circle is the only way to approach it, Tiger. From an England perspective, Eddie will be curious to see what Ireland really has under the tank this season too And he'll be delighted that Wales are turning up to 'motivate' a huge improvement (needed!) from Ireland. So whatever the outcome of the game, Eddie will have a better fix on just what Ireland will be capable/or incapable of bringing to that last round.

by munkian Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:29 pm

Collapse2005 wrote:At least we don't have to endure 80 minutes of Wayne Barnes. Maybe that's why the bookies have Ireland as favorites this time?

Ireland have won 5 from 6 games Glen Jackson has reffed where as our record with Barnes is abysmal.

Because Barnes actually refs the breakdown...

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:31 pm

munkian wrote:
Collapse2005 wrote:At least we don't have to endure 80 minutes of Wayne Barnes. Maybe that's why the bookies have Ireland as favorites this time?

Ireland have won 5 from 6 games Glen Jackson has reffed where as our record with Barnes is abysmal.

Because Barnes actually refs the breakdown...

For one half he does, and then for the other half he doesn't. So he's a fair man.

Back to the Ireland v Wales game....

by TightHEAD Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:38 pm

Wayne Barnes is the best Ref in the world.

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:40 pm

By a mile! Along with Nigel, whose influence probably stretches out to include the Moon too,

by TightHEAD Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:44 pm

Did you see him on that comedy show 'Nige', Well, I think it was a comedy!

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:34 pm

So anyway.... to try to kick life back into this curiously already mucho jaded thread Headscratch

.......... Gatland wants his players to attack three Irish players specifically - Sexton, Murray and Stander. He feels that if the two playmakers can't get their playmaking duties done then that's a platform for Wales to work from (an obvious truism with evidence in last year's game). But given that Joe Schmidt knows all about last year, will it work again? How will Ireland counter the extra attention on his 10 and 9 this time round? And Stander - big direct ball carrier for Ireland, slice him down over and over and there is that aspect of Ireland's game negated too. Another truism of sorts but is it still relevant considering Ireland have more impactful mobile players now spread out a little more?

I still think Gatland hopes that Ireland will rely too much on kicking. I hope instead that we crank up the blunderbuss impact stuff and just see which side genuinely has the love and desire to be the last men standing in a possession holding le crunch game up the middle. A dirty and bloody and boring game for the neutrals.... a schidt kicker and just see which side has the endurance.

by carpet baboon Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:51 pm

You know what. Forget this mutual respect balls.
Ireland will destroy Wales.
Biggar was playing gash before he had 5 weeks out and injured so can't see him being anywhere near his best, and with him between unfamiliar 9 and 12 who's natural game is not the game he plays I see a nightmare day for Dan.
You pack while good will not be good enough, to many of our guys are under pressure for the starting spot to play anything below amazing.
Our backs will be on fire and leave your poor Welsh boys crying into there leek embroidered hankies

Sorry Welsh men, this weekend is not your weekend. Prepare to be manshamed

by SecretFly Wed Feb 21, 2018 11:58 pm

That's more like it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Respectfully speaking, that is............... Whistle

by BamBam Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:01 am

Don't worry about the Welsh chaps, they're used to being manshamed after the weekend before last

by TightHEAD Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:07 am

I didn't realize Bundee Aki was a Kiwi.

by SecretFly Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:10 am

TightHEAD wrote:I didn't realize Bundee Aki was a Kiwi.

It's the O'Kiwi line of the family. But I understand your point, Tight, he does look more Galwegian in features.

by munkian Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:10 am

TightHEAD wrote:I didn't realize Bundee Aki was a Kiwi.

You mean he's NOT from Donegal ? Shocked

by Collapse2005 Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:14 am

munkian wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:I didn't realize Bundee Aki was a Kiwi.

You mean he's NOT from Donegal ?

Don't think there has ever been an Irish rugby player from Donegal. Except Dave Gallagher but he played for NZ.

by SecretFly Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:18 am

Collapse2005 wrote:
munkian wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:I didn't realize Bundee Aki was a Kiwi.

You mean he's NOT from Donegal ?

Don't think there has ever been an Irish rugby player from Donegal. Except Dave Gallagher but he played for NZ.

Another of the O'Kiwis - they get around a bit.

by munkian Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:19 am

Collapse2005 wrote:
munkian wrote:
TightHEAD wrote:I didn't realize Bundee Aki was a Kiwi.

You mean he's NOT from Donegal ?

Don't think there has ever been an Irish rugby player from Donegal. Except Dave Gallagher but he played for NZ.

Hey, it boasts the most picturesque rugby club in Ireland

by Noble-Surfer Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:34 am

I think Wales need to stop Ireland getting the ball to the like of CJ Stander & Tadhg Beirne- if they have room to get a bit of steam/ run onto a short offload, they will be hard to stop, and will make ground through the tackle. The number of Scarlets' players in the Welsh team will hopefully mean that they are aware of and prepared for the threat that Beirne will offer at least... I can see this game being quite an arm wrestle...

by geoff999rugby Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:49 am

Well stopping the ball getting to Tadhg Beirne shouldn't be too difficult laughing

by SecretFly Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:52 am

Tadhg Beirne has been a disappointment for Ireland so far. It's almost like he isn't even on the field. Shoddy performance levels from him. Will need to improve his attitude.

by Collapse2005 Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:00 am

geoff999rugby wrote:Well stopping the ball getting to Tadhg Beirne shouldn't be too difficult

He will get a cap at some point Id say. There haven't been too many ex Clongowes players to get capped for Ireland.

Eoin Reddan (only one year)
Brian Carney
Kearney x2
Darcy
McFadden

by Guest Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:00 am

Noble-Surfer wrote:I think Wales need to stop Ireland getting the ball to the like of CJ Stander & Tadhg Beirne- if they have room to get a bit of steam/ run onto a short offload, they will be hard to stop, and will make ground through the tackle. The number of Scarlets' players in the Welsh team will hopefully mean that they are aware of and prepared for the threat that Beirne will offer at least... I can see this game being quite an arm wrestle...

Tell me you're joking?!

by SecretFly Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:03 am

Scarlets destroyed Beirne. A shadow of the player he is for them when in a green shirt. They've overworked him.

by BamBam Thu Feb 22, 2018 2:14 am

I think the use of .... through Noble-Surfer's post has been missed by a couple

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