Scotland's 2018 Summer Tour: Darien Scheme 2.0

First topic message reminder :

Sunday 10th June 2018

Canada Vs Scotland

Sunday 17th June 2018

America Vs Scotland

Saturday 23rd June 2018

Argentina Vs Scotland



With an eye on the summer tour, whilst also keeping in mind the season isn't over for either of our pro teams - who would you "rest" for the summer tour and who would you bring along in their place?

I'd leave Russell, Price, WP Nel, Hogg, Dunbar, Barclay and Huw Jones purely because those guys have had extremely long seasons, are coming back from long term injuries and/or rarely (if ever) get a full pre-season with their clubs under their belts.

Dunbar is made of glass and could probably do with a summer of conditioning, same with WP Nel

Hogg, Jones and Russell have all had long seasons (lions tours/southern hemisphere seasons) and look a bit jaded.

Price is just off form and could do with some down time.

Barclay is getting on - would not like to injure our captain against America/Canada

With a world cup next year giving all of these guys a full pre-season could pay off in the long term.

Would also allow Townsend to have a closer look at Kinghorn, SHC/Horne (ideally take both and tell Fowles to f3ck off), Grigg, Chris Dean/Johnston/Bennett, Fagerson/Berghan/Mccalum, Bradbury.

Thoughts?

They tweeted it but have since removed the tweet - maybe pressed the button too early!

RDW_Scotland wrote:They tweeted it but have since removed the tweet - maybe pressed the button too early!

Ah, eagled eyed!

Some top quality SRU comms management, there.

Gilchrist probably the best choice in McInally absence. Hoggy would have been worth a shout but never easy to captain a side from FB.

RDW_Scotland wrote:Grant Gilchrist announced as captain.

NOOOOOOOOO!!!

*I mean it's a good choice, but as soon as an Edinburgh player is named Scotland captain they pick up an injury. Could be doing without that.

Scotland team to play Canada at the Commonwealth Stadium, Edmonton
Saturday 9 June (kick-off 7pm local time, Sunday 2am UK time) – live on BBC

15. Blair Kinghorn (Edinburgh) – 2 caps

14. Lee Jones (Glasgow Warriors) – 8 caps
13. Chris Harris (Newcastle Falcons) – 2 caps
12. James Lang (Harlequins) – uncapped
11. Byron McGuigan (Sale Sharks) – 3 caps

10. Ruaridh Jackson VICE CAPTAIN (Glasgow Warriors) – 32 caps
9. Sam Hidalgo-Clyne (Scarlets) – 9 caps

1. Allan Dell (Edinburgh) – 10 caps
2. Fraser Brown VICE CAPTAIN (Glasgow Warriors) – 31 caps
3. Simon Berghan (Edinburgh) – 8 caps
4. Ben Toolis (Edinburgh) – 9 caps
5. Grant Gilchrist CAPTAIN (Edinburgh) – 22 caps
6. Magnus Bradbury (Edinburgh) – 2 caps
7. Jamie Ritchie (Edinburgh) – uncapped
8. David Denton (Leicester Tigers) – 39 caps

Substitutes

16. George Turner (Glasgow Warriors) – 2 caps
17. Jamie Bhatti (Glasgow Warriors) – 8 caps
18. Murray McCallum (Edinburgh) – 1 cap
19. Lewis Carmichael (Edinburgh) – uncapped
20. Luke Hamilton (unattached) – 1 cap
21. Ali Price (Glasgow Warriors) – 16 caps
22. Adam Hastings (Glasgow Warriors) – uncapped
23. Mark Bennett (Edinburgh) – 20 caps

Well that's a bizarre one!

Definitely a Toonie selection there. Shame we don't get to see Hastings start - interested to see how Rhubarb gets on back in his original position.

Lang - from unknown to starter, let's hope he doesn't have a Harris debut.

Very pleased to see Kinghorn given a chance in his best position. I think Maitland, Kinghorn and Hogg provide excellent options for FB (and Taylor if he's fit).

Good to see Ritchies form being rewarded - he needs to make the shirt his now so we have some healthy competition.

How many vice captains do we need though!? I think we'll soon have an on-pitch game council soon enough.

Edinburgh lock Grant Gilchrist will captain Scotland against Canada at the Commonwealth Stadium in Edmonton this Saturday in the absence of injured hooker Stuart McInally (9 June, kick-off 7pm local time, Sunday 2am UK time) – live on BBC.

McInally has failed to recover sufficiently from the calf strain he sustained on the eve of the squad’s departure for the summer tour, meaning clubmate Gilchrist – who captained Scotland against Argentina and South Africa on the 2014 tour – will skipper the side.

Head Coach Gregor Townsend has selected two debutants for the match, with Edinburgh flanker Jamie Ritchie and Harlequins centre James Lang set to earn their first senior international honours in the opening Test of the 2018 Summer Tour.

Former Scotland U20 captain, Ritchie, has made 48 appearances for his club since he signed senior professional terms aged just 17. He will partner clubmate Magnus Bradbury and David Denton (Leicester Tigers) in the back-row.

Ritchie and Lang are two of four potential debutants named to face the Canadians, with Edinburgh forward Lewis Carmichael joined on the bench by Glasgow Warriors stand-off Adam Hastings.

Scotland Head Coach, Gregor Townsend, said: “The coaches and I have enjoyed working with the players this week in Vancouver and are pleased with how they have performed in training, getting through a lot of technical, tactical and conditioning work.

“We’ve now arrived in Edmonton where we will be putting the finishing touches on our preparation and aim to put a marker down at the beginning of this three-Test tour, against a side which has, historically, been a very tough side for Scotland over the years – especially on home soil.

“A number of opportunities have been given to players to play their way into our thinking on this tour and beyond and we look forward to seeing them take to the field this Saturday.”

Blair Kinghorn – whose two caps to date have come on the wing – has been handed his first international opportunity in his more familiar role of full-back, where he plies his trade for Edinburgh.

He is joined in the back-three by wings Lee Jones (Glasgow Warriors) and Byron McGuigan (Sale Sharks), while experienced stand-off Ruaridh Jackson partners Scarlets scrum-half Sam Hidalgo-Clyne at half-back.

Props Allan Dell and Simon Berghan pack down either side of Glasgow Warriors hooker Fraser Brown, while Ben Toolis joins captain Gilchrist in the second-row to complete the pack.

The North American Tests against Canada on Saturday 9 June (kick-off 7pm, Sunday 2am UK time) and USA on Saturday 16 June (kick-off 8pm, Sunday 2am UK time) will be shown live on the BBC, with the final Test against Argentina on Saturday 23 June (kick-off 4.40pm, 8.40pm UK time) aired on Channel 4.

Scotland team to play Canada at the Commonwealth Stadium, Edmonton
Saturday 9 June (kick-off 7pm local time, Sunday 2am UK time) – live on BBC

15. Blair Kinghorn (Edinburgh) – 2 caps

14. Lee Jones (Glasgow Warriors) – 8 caps
13. Chris Harris (Newcastle Falcons) – 2 caps
12. James Lang (Harlequins) – uncapped
11. Byron McGuigan (Sale Sharks) – 3 caps

10. Ruaridh Jackson VICE CAPTAIN (Glasgow Warriors) – 32 caps
9. Sam Hidalgo-Clyne (Scarlets) – 9 caps

1. Allan Dell (Edinburgh) – 10 caps
2. Fraser Brown VICE CAPTAIN (Glasgow Warriors) – 31 caps
3. Simon Berghan (Edinburgh) – 8 caps
4. Ben Toolis (Edinburgh) – 9 caps
5. Grant Gilchrist CAPTAIN (Edinburgh) – 22 caps
6. Magnus Bradbury (Edinburgh) – 2 caps
7. Jamie Ritchie (Edinburgh) – uncapped
8. David Denton (Leicester Tigers) – 39 caps

Substitutes

16. George Turner (Glasgow Warriors) – 2 caps
17. Jamie Bhatti (Glasgow Warriors) – 8 caps
18. Murray McCallum (Edinburgh) – 1 cap
19. Lewis Carmichael (Edinburgh) – uncapped
20. Luke Hamilton (unattached) – 1 cap
21. Ali Price (Glasgow Warriors) – 16 caps
22. Adam Hastings (Glasgow Warriors) – uncapped
23. Mark Bennett (Edinburgh) – 20 caps



2018 SUMMER TOUR
Saturday 9 June: Canada v Scotland
Commonwealth Stadium (kick-off 7pm, Sunday 2am UK time) – live on BBC

Saturday 16 June: USA v Scotland
BBVA Compass Stadium (kick-off 8pm, Sunday 2am UK time) – live on BBC

Saturday 23 June: Argentina v Scotland
Estadio Centenario (kick-off 4.40pm, 8.40pm UK time) – live on Channel 4

Good squad. Ritchie will have a lot of breakdown work to do, as Bradbury and Denton aren't famous for doing the unseen stuff. Nice balance of new and existing faces, but the squad is very light on caps overall. Big chance for Jackson at 10, looking forward to seeing Lang play.

- First choice 5 in the squad to start. Young guys to come off the bench. Certainly looking for impact around the park from them

- Bradbury and Ritchie both get a chance to lay down a marker to be starting back-rowers into next year. Barclay's injury means 6 and 8 are up for grabs. Hamilton will get an opportunity later in the tour to start. If Denton offloads twice (once can be assumed to be an attempted knock-on) and passes a few times, that will be a huge improvement.

- Bit surprised to see such an inexperienced backline. Was looking for a second guy with more than 10 caps (Horne or Bennett) to start. He has put his faith in Lang being up to speed fairly quickly. Harris is solid defensively for Newcastle so should help Lang if he has got the Scotland concepts down

- Jackson had started putting in consistent performances at 10 when fit but Gopperth/Cipriani got ahead of him at Wasps. I think he is the closest to a Russell-lite Scotland have. Hope he can put his hand up to push Horne and Hastings for the second fly half spot

- Kinghorn has a huge opportunity here to push Maitland permanently to wing. Want to see his defense to have improved and his kicking from hand to be a bit more consistent. L Jones and McGuigan will both be able to support him as guys who played full back to a decent standard

I think Bradbury has gotten better at doing the unseen stuff as Cockers has been playing him at 6 for most the season (since his ban) and I think he's improving at making a nuisance of himself. Both of whom will offer ball carrying, which if you compare to the 6 nations is night and day. As will Ritchie to be fair.

I'm slightly concerned by a our centre pairing as Harris has been shocking when he's played for Scotland, and Lang is totally untested. I really hope they surprise me and shine, but it's a bit of a risk. I really hope Harris turns his form around at international level as clearly there is a talented player there (given Newcastle fans rate him and Toonie keeps calling him up) so hopefully in what should be a slightly easier game, he'll get comfortable in the shirt.

Other than that though, the team looks good.

EWT Spoons wrote:I think Bradbury has gotten better at doing the unseen stuff as Cockers has been playing him at 6 for most the season (since his ban) and I think he's improving at making a nuisance of himself.  Both of whom will offer ball carrying, which if you compare to the 6 nations is night and day.  As will Ritchie to be fair.

I'm slightly concerned by a our centre pairing as Harris has been shocking when he's played for Scotland, and Lang is totally untested.  I really hope they surprise me and shine, but it's a bit of a risk.  I really hope Harris turns his form around at international level as clearly there is a talented player there (given Newcastle fans rate him and Toonie keeps calling him up) so hopefully in what should be a slightly easier game, he'll get comfortable in the shirt.

Other than that though, the team looks good.

My friend, a harlequins fan, at least knew who Lang was and thought he was fairly decent - so considering his limited appearances that's relatively reassuring for me. Harris at least can't play any worse than he has done, and I'm happy with Bennett coming on if he has another shocker - Harris would then be consigned to the Nick de Luca - "but he plays well for his club" - pile. Let's hope he surprises us all in blue.

I hope Denton can put a case forward for himself as we really need an 8 who can break the line. If he's improved his hands and interplay then I would be happy for him to be our main option at 8 going forward.

Looking forward to watching on Sunday morning (definitely not staying up until 4am for a game against Canada!)

[quote="NeilyBroon"]

EWT Spoons wrote:

I hope Denton can put a case forward for himself as we really need an 8 who can break the line.

I think the future belongs to Bradbury and Fagerson - they're both much more rounded players in attack and defence.

RDW_Scotland wrote:So using my highly scientific bibs v non-bibs method based on the latest pictures from training, the team is starting to fill in:

1 Dell
2 Brown
3 Berghan
4 Toolis
5 Gilchrist
6 Bradbury
7
8 Denton

9 Horne (although price was seen without a bib too!)
10
11
12
13 Harris
14
15 Hogg

so we've learned that the bib factor is relevant to forwards, for backs, not so much!

His bibness picked the pack correctly (clearly missed Ritchie at the bottom of a ruck somewhere). In all honestly its about the strongest pack we could send out with it basically being Edinburgh but no McInally through injury (and Mata is Fijian)

Rhubarb at 10 is a bit of a shocker. I'd have gone with Hastings myself and had Jackson on the bench to come on to clam things down if needed.

Our centres look to be our weak point though. All eyes will be on them to see how they get on.

Fun fact - the entire starting pack play or used to play for Edinburgh!

That backline is pretty mad.

Fundementally he has put out a very strong pack, which if it can't steam roller the Canadians, we might as well give up and go home now.

I guess that gives a chance to an inexperienced and experimental back line to get a chance to gel with some decent ball.

SHC gets his chance first to lay down his marker, you would expect Horne to get his next week.

Jacko gets a chance to show that he can still play at FH, you never know, he may be getting some game time for the Warriors in that role next year as well.

Lang surprisingly goes straight in, I have watched him play a few times and been impressed, so am happy to let us see if he can step up.

Harris is surely in the last chance saloon. He has not done well with his chances so far, though probably fair to say he was playing on the wing for his first cap, not his preferred position. He has played well for the Falcons, especially good defensively. Hope he can settle and give himself a chance.

Am a little bit surprised Hoggy not involved at all, but very happy to see Kinghorn get a start at FB, I think he may move to the wing next weekend though.

Jones and McGuigan get the nod as the only out and out wingers on tour, can they push themselves up the pecking order?

It is always fun predicting a Toonie selection, I don't think anyone would have got it all right!

Father Dougal could have predicted that back line. Mainly because it's pretty much the back line he would have chosen.

Leander wrote:

NeilyBroon wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:

I hope Denton can put a case forward for himself as we really need an 8 who can break the line.

I think the future belongs to Bradbury and Fagerson - they're both much more rounded players in attack and defence.

Not sure how you've managed to make it look like I said that.

I despair for people who can't master something as simple as the quote function.

And you can quote me on that.

EWT Spoons wrote:

Leander wrote:

NeilyBroon wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:

I hope Denton can put a case forward for himself as we really need an 8 who can break the line.

I think the future belongs to Bradbury and Fagerson - they're both much more rounded players in attack and defence.

Not sure how you've managed to make it look like I said that.

Whoever said it is obviously very insightful. A truly remarkable armchair pundit.

Can't argue with that EWT, the quote function never lies

NeilyBroon wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:

Leander wrote:

NeilyBroon wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:

I hope Denton can put a case forward for himself as we really need an 8 who can break the line.

I think the future belongs to Bradbury and Fagerson - they're both much more rounded players in attack and defence.

Not sure how you've managed to make it look like I said that.

Whoever said it is obviously very insightful. A truly remarkable armchair pundit.

Edinburgh are da best

You said it!

Ah, I appear to have started a thing. Sorry.

I've come across the transcript for the team selection meeting

SRU - So Gregor, the team! lets start off with the forwards

Toonie - Edinburgh

SRU - Sorry don't you mean Scotland?

Toonie - Yeah, but Edinburgh *whispers* have you seen how pi$h the Glasgow forwards have become since I left?

SRU - Ohhhhhhhhhhhkay............ Right. So you've gone with a very conservative approach and kept the forwards that are teammates together. You'll be doing the same with the backs then?

Toonie - Smeg no!

SRU- sorry?

Toonie - It's tombla time *plays some South American dance music

SRU - here we go. Ok, so you're mixing the backs up?

Toonie- Sure am. First up, scrum half is Sam HC

SRU - But he's Edinburgh too

Toonie - ah but he's getting a Weegie at standoff

SRU - Ahhh so you're going with Hastings at 10?

Toonie - Smeg no! Tombla time lads! At 10 we have............... Rhubarb

SRU - ..............

Toonie - Do you want to have a shot a picking 12?

SRU - Pete Horne?

Toonie - Smeg no! Tombola time lads! At 12 we have......... Lang!

SRU - Who?

Toonie - Exactly!

SRU - I'm not sure who you're going to pick at 13

Toonie - Neither do I!

*South American dance music gets turned up

Toonie - And the winner is..................... Harris

At this point the Transcript ends and we're assuming the delegates from the SRU gave in and went to the pub!

Smeg no and the winner is....Tigertattie.

Its a good thing we're playing Canada with that backline, any serious international side would tear that apart. Having said that I can understand all of the selections except Lang and Jackson. This close to a world cup we should be looking for options who could realistically break through into the side, and without coming over all FES that means they need to be players who are at least already established at club level. Lang is foetus level experience and is far from being a club regular, and with no guarantees that will change next season so I don't see how he can be a realistic world cup option. Give him time to see if he can make it at Quins first.

While Hastings isn't vastly more experienced at club level we at least know that's likely to change next season with Finn being away, so for me Hastings is a realistic world cup option and should be starting as he could really use a run of games at this level.

TheMildlyFranticLlama wrote:Its a good thing we're playing Canada with that backline, any serious international side would tear that apart. Having said that I can understand all of the selections except Lang and Jackson. This close to a world cup we should be looking for options who could realistically break through into the side, and without coming over all FES that means they need to be players who are at least already established at club level. Lang is foetus level experience and is far from being a club regular, and with no guarantees that will change next season so I don't see how he can be a realistic world cup option. Give him time to see if he can make it at Quins first.

While Hastings isn't vastly more experienced at club level we at least know that's likely to change next season with Finn being away, so for me Hastings is a realistic world cup option and should be starting as he could really use a run of games at this level.

I mean, there's always next week. And the week after.

tigertattie wrote:I've come across the transcript for the team selection meeting

SRU - So Gregor, the team! lets start off with the forwards

Toonie - Edinburgh

SRU - Sorry don't you mean Scotland?

Toonie - Yeah, but Edinburgh *whispers* have you seen how pi$h the Glasgow forwards have become since I left?

SRU - Ohhhhhhhhhhhkay............ Right. So you've gone with a very conservative approach and kept the forwards that are teammates together. You'll be doing the same with the backs then?

Toonie - Smeg no!

SRU- sorry?

Toonie - It's tombla time *plays some South American dance music

SRU - here we go. Ok, so you're mixing the backs up?

Toonie- Sure am. First up, scrum half is Sam HC

SRU - But he's Edinburgh too

Toonie - ah but he's getting a Weegie at standoff

SRU - Ahhh so you're going with Hastings at 10?

Toonie - Smeg no! Tombla time lads! At 10 we have............... Rhubarb

SRU - ..............

Toonie - Do you want to have a shot a picking 12?

SRU - Pete Horne?

Toonie - Smeg no! Tombola time lads! At 12 we have......... Lang!

SRU - Who?

Toonie - Exactly!

SRU - I'm not sure who you're going to pick at 13

Toonie - Neither do I!

*South American dance music gets turned up

Toonie - And the winner is..................... Harris

At this point the Transcript ends and we're assuming the delegates from the SRU gave in and went to the pub!

The Toony tombola would make a pretty good drinking game, write squad names on a ping pong ball, shove them in a bucket and see if you get a hit when the team is announced.

Llama, the backline have proven themselves capable enough at their respective clubs, only Harris has had an absolute stinker at international level recently and I reckon Jackson's defence will be a lot better than it has been historically at 10 because of his FB experience with Glasgow and Scotland. I don't think they're as incompetent as you make out and would probably give most teams a decent enough challenge even though they are very much second choice in most areas.

Who knows, Lang might have an absolute stormer, I remember Ashe being an unknown factor before he toured and made an impact (though now he's permanently injured).

Nice to see in the interviews Townsend takes responsibility for throwing Harris in it for that game against Wales, I think he'll have a lot more to show us, I just hope he doesn't feel like he has to force it to prove himself.

Give Lang a chance.

He may well get more opportunities at Quins this year with Roberts finally moving on. Unfortunately they were always going to pick their marque player even when he was not playing very well.

12 is in many ways the position we are most struggling with, no-one has really nailed it down so far in the Toonie era. You would imagine that it might have had Taylor's name all over it, except he is always injured and Dunbar seems to be going down the same route. Horne blows hot and cold as well and has been found wanting against better teams and bigger runners from time to time.

He may well come good in Argentina and hopefully next season but we do need a bit more depth. Johnson will add to that.

Lang is in many ways a similar player to Taylor, he is big and can truck it up and seems to have decent hands, hopefully he can defend as well.

I can see why Toonie is trying to widen the net a bit and if he is going to experiment, then now surely is the time to be doing it.

BigGee wrote:Give Lang a chance.

He may well get more opportunities at Quins this year with Roberts finally moving on. Unfortunately they were always going to pick their marque player even when he was not playing very well.

12 is in many ways the position we are most struggling with, no-one has really nailed it down so far in the Toonie era. You would imagine that it might have had Taylor's name all over it, except he is always injured and Dunbar seems to be going down the same route. Horne blows hot and cold as well and has been found wanting against better teams and bigger runners from time to time.

He may well come good in Argentina and hopefully next season but we do need a bit more depth. Johnson will add to that.

Lang is in many ways a similar player to Taylor, he is big and can truck it up and seems to have decent hands, hopefully he can defend as well.

I can see why Toonie is trying to widen the net a bit and if he is going to experiment, then now surely is the time to be doing it.

Agree with this, I think the world cup might just be out of Dunbar's reach unless he can string a season together. I'm hoping Taylor recovers but I'm worried about him having to retire midway through next season, migranes after hard tackles is not a good sign and in a way I'm glad he's not playing on Saturday (Sunday).

Up and coming we have Paddy Kelly of course though he's yet to really feature for Glasgow - I wonder if he'll get a chance next season, he was pretty handy for the U20s as I understand it but hasn't really featured since.

Johnson will be a big help. I think Dean is due an opportunity too as he could provide good cover.

Didn't Mark Bennett play at 12 at one point? Or am I being thick?

I'm certainly excited to see what Lang can do - he reminds me of Jimmy Copperth in terms of style. Strong, good runner, agile with a bit of pace and good skills. He has all the raw materials to be a top modern 12 but needs gametime.

Hopefully he'll get that with Quins next season.

Bennett has filled in at 12 on occasion but he's rarely started there. He's definitely more of a 13 IMO,

Paddy Kelly has been injured most of this season, I think. Dean and Johnson are both good options - Dean's improved enormously in the last 12 months. There's also Matt Scott back in the shop window at Edinburgh.

Toonie is clearly keen on a distributor at 12, so that narrows down the probables.

With the style that Scotland play now we need our 12 to have a decent passing game. We also need someone who is a competent defender.

Hopefully Lang can put his hand up and it makes perfect sense for him to get a run out against Canada. The forward pack is as strong as we could put out and should gave the backs the best platform they can get to show what they can do.

Sure Jacko was an odd pick but I think this is because putting Hastings in there too would see a crazy low number of caps running around in the backs with Lee Jones being the most capped player with all 8 of his caps.

Hastings will get a run out against the Yanks I'm sure. I can see Horne and Hastings starting that with Price on the bench. Then everyone will have had some game time for Toonie to pick a team for the pumas.

This is very much a development squad and tour with an eye on the world cup. We're desperate for a couple of centres to really put their hands up as Taylor and Dunbar are depleting the world of sellotape at a rapid pace.

It's also worth noting that Lang is touted as a 10/12 just like wee grumpy Farrell and those players are pretty valuable. If Lang can play both then he'll make a stonking bench option at least for the world cup.

Jackson at FH is a pretty decent choice. He has 20 or so caps at FH and has improved since those early days. Horne may start against Argentina with Hastings starting the USA game. Gives them all a shop window for Rennie as well

As for 12, Lang is a strange choice. Johnson and Dean are both breaking through, and Scott is coming back to fitness. Certainly getting Dean a few caps now before Johnson qualifies (and needs a few caps) would make more sense. Toonie has put his faith in Lang in a game that is going to be quickly forgotten behind a pack that should steamroll the Canadians.

Hazel Sapling wrote:As for 12, Lang is a strange choice.

Not for me. Bringing him into the camp, getting him a cap, getting him used to the way we play, the structures etc, and having a look at him actually on the field. All very important ahead of the WC.

Plus, I suspect he is exactly the type of 12 that Townsend wants to select for Scotland. Other than Horne, we don't have many like him.

Leander wrote:

Hazel Sapling wrote:As for 12, Lang is a strange choice.

Not for me. Bringing him into the camp, getting him a cap, getting him used to the way we play, the structures etc, and having a look at him actually on the field. All very important ahead of the WC.

Plus, I suspect he is exactly the type of 12 that Townsend wants to select for Scotland. Other than Horne, we don't have many like him.

oh dear! Don't tell me you're one of these types that think Pete Horne is an international class rugby player???

tigertattie wrote:

Leander wrote:

Hazel Sapling wrote:As for 12, Lang is a strange choice.

Not for me. Bringing him into the camp, getting him a cap, getting him used to the way we play, the structures etc, and having a look at him actually on the field. All very important ahead of the WC.

Plus, I suspect he is exactly the type of 12 that Townsend wants to select for Scotland. Other than Horne, we don't have many like him.

oh dear! Don't tell me you're one of these types that think Pete Horne is an international class rugby player???

Well, he does have caps. So...

Seriously, though, he does have weaknesses, but brings a lot to the team. Takes a lot of pressure of Russell if he's having a bad day, 'frinstance.

Fluffed 3-on-1 aside, Horne certainly looked international-class against England. It's possible to overstate the point (and watch me do it right now), but I don't think we'd have won without Pete.

Taylor (and hopefully Lang) offer something that Horne does not, a physical threat that also has decent handling.

Pete Horne has had some great games for Scotland but a few shockers as well and has never quite convinced Toonie that he is the man going forward. He often tends to be the match day squad for his versatility, rather than his ability to hold down one position.

He is certainly a handy guy to have in the squad though, but I doubt he would have got so many caps if everyone else had been fit at the time.

Pete certainly deserves plaudits for his England performance, but he was also truly awful against Ireland! As Biggee says that's the problem with him - he's always got a shocker in him at international level.

Horne furra lineee seems to have a weird talent of making the guys around him play better. A very elusive runner and a thinking rugby player.

He also never drifts out of games - tries very hard and has made the most of his talents.

Our under 20s lost to England last night meaning we face a relegation playoff. We stuck in well but England were just a couple of steps above us both physically and in terms of rugby ability. The English pack were ginormous - most of those players wouldn't look out of place in the full pro game. Their second rows were huge!

We'll have Japan, Georgia and Ireland in the bottom 4 so it is going to be a bit of a fight to not get relegated!

I watched the second half of the game when I got home from work. In a way it was the same as the last two games but worse, they just got blown away by the power of the English pack.

They are going to struggle now to stay in the competition, need to win one of the last two games. I don't think that was our strongest team though, I imagine Redpath realised that was a game we could not win and planned accordingly.

Hope they do stay up, there is the core of a good side in that team and some of them will be available for the next year or two, with a very good crop of U18 coming up as well.

The Irish will be feeling the strain as well, having lost all three of their games to. It is going to be a bit of a dogfight.

Our pack didn't do too badly given the size mismatch, especially in the first half, but the defence in the backs was really poor, especially out wide. Their 14 got a lot of joy from powder puff tackling from our wingers and fullback.

Their winger was pretty impressive though, quite a specimen as well.

I would not have fancied trying to tackle him at full pelt!

BigGee wrote:Their winger was pretty impressive though, quite a specimen as well.

I would not have fancied trying to tackle him at full pelt!

So it wasn't Admin Boy running about out there?

tigertattie wrote:

BigGee wrote:Their winger was pretty impressive though, quite a specimen as well.

I would not have fancied trying to tackle him at full pelt!

So it wasn't Admin Boy running about out there?

Bit harsh!

RDW_Scotland wrote:

tigertattie wrote:

BigGee wrote:Their winger was pretty impressive though, quite a specimen as well.

I would not have fancied trying to tackle him at full pelt!

So it wasn't Admin Boy running about out there?

Bit harsh!

true true.

or to apologise?

tigertattie wrote:

BigGee wrote:Their winger was pretty impressive though, quite a specimen as well.

I would not have fancied trying to tackle him at full pelt!

So it wasn't Admin Boy running about out there?

To be fair, I don't think any of the 606ers would have done much better than you bud, even Jimbo "GloboGym" Pip or 21stC "Chainsaw" Schitzoid!

Anyone planning on getting up/staying up/or have a favourable time difference, for the Canada game?