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Pick the best XI you can to play a series across all three formats

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Pick the best XI you can to play a series across all three formats Empty Pick the best XI you can to play a series across all three formats

Post by king_carlos Sat Jan 16, 2021 2:53 am

A fun little hypothetical a friend sent me today. You are going to play a series of 5 Tests, 5 ODIs and 5 T20is but you can only pick one XI to play all three.

As it's hypothetical we aren't worrying about injuries.

For the sake of the below one I am imagining playing in England as I was discussing it with a ardent Essex fan but feel free to name the country the series would be played in.

1.Warner
2.Azam
3.Williamson (c)
4.Kohli
5.Smith
6.Stokes
7.Quinton de Kock (wk)
8.Jadeja
9.Starc
10.Cummins
11.Rabada

I think the openers gave me most grief. Balancing the Test and one day aspect is tough there. Azam opening in Tests is a risk but he is quality across all three formats. Root could arguably fill the same role as a makeshift Test opener with de Kock opening in the shorter forms.

The spin cupboard isn't the strongest at the minute. Ashwin would probably be my pick for Tests alone but Jadeja is a really good all round cricketer. Rashid Khan is the best in white ball cricket but has played very little red ball stuff sadly.

I briefly considered Shakib al Hasan as the all rounder for balance. He could bat at 7 with de Kock pushing up to 6. That would give more spin bowling in the shorter forms. Stokes is the better player so I went for him but a spin bowling all rounder might be better for balance given the side isn't short on batting or pace already!

Bumrah and Boult was a very close indeed pushing Starc and Rabada. There are a few pacers around at the minute that are quality across the formats. Archer with more time in international cricket may well join them.

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Post by Soul Requiem Sat Jan 16, 2021 3:00 am

I'd possibly select Al Hasan instead of one of the big three and have him bat in the middle order, not sure in a hypothetical short form team that you could get away with only five bowling options including Stokes.

Maybe Rohit instead of Azam opening too, if it's a team playing in England then anyone other than Warner.

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Post by king_carlos Sat Jan 16, 2021 3:51 am

Openers who have done well during Tests in England are in short supply at the minute to fair. Particularly ones who are useful across formats. I considered Iqbal who is a fun player to watch. Warner's ODI performances in England have been good it's worth noting.

I briefly considered Elgar to strengthen the Test side, whilst batting down the order in white ball stuff but his one series in England was solid without excelling back in 2017. It would weaken the one day side as well. A tough position to pick in at the minute.

Squeezing Shakib in would improve balance but for me would be for Stokes and having seen him pull off some obscene performances in recent years I just couldn't do it.

I don't think I'd drop any of Williamson, Kohli and Smith so it would be Babar to fit Stokes and Shakib in. That probably require de Kock opening which wouldn't be ideal whilst keeping in Tests.

As I type that I've just realised that Williamson probably has the best defensive technique to push up to opening though all that said. He's so good at 3 that I just typed his name in first then didn't contemplate anything else!

1.Warner
2.Williamson (c)
3.Kohli
4.Smith
5.Stokes
6.de Kock (wk)
7.Shakib
8.Jadeja
9.Starc
10.Cummins
11.Rabada

By pushing Williamson up to open that does look more balanced it must be said.

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Post by Soul Requiem Sat Jan 16, 2021 5:16 am

Has to be said it would be a relatively slow scoring limited overs team and would rely strongly on De Kock in the latter overs. It's a good test team but I'd expect England to beat that team comfortably over 50 overs.

Rohit since moving up the order has a ridiculous test record and is proven class in ODI's, next to impossible to balance the team without severely weakening the others.

You could in your latest team use Root as your sixth bowler but doesn't add the required explosiveness.

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Post by JDizzle Sat Jan 16, 2021 5:43 am

I don't think you can have an all format team and not pick Bumrah. Think I'd take him above pretty much every white ball bowler in the world, maybe bar Jofra. Would certainly get him in over Rabada or Starc for this team as I reckon he is probably better in red ball too if not as proven.

Think you could argue for Buttler in as keeper too. Especially if you have him batting 7. De Kock is a better Test player and Buttler is a better ODI player - and down the order in T20s I would take Buttler, whereas it is much closer if both opening. And if we were including guys who you could lure out of retirement, I would still take ABdV to keep wicket in my team over both of those guys! And I think it is probably slightly too early in all formats for this guy, but maybe in two years time when asked it could be a no brainer that you would take Pant here.

And it doesn't solve the batting being light, but a guy who has really come on in the last year or so in the shorter forms and it has always been a good player in Test is Jason Holder. And he is a bit more of a hitter than Shakib to come in at 7.

Warner
Williamson
Smith
Kohli
Stokes
Buttler (wk)
Holder
Jadeja
Cummins
Archer
Bumrah

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Post by KP_fan Sat Jan 16, 2021 6:51 am

1-Rohit
2-Warner
3-Williamson
4-Smith
5-Root
6-Kohli
7-Stokes
8-QDK
9-Jadeja
10-Cummins
11-Bumrah

Williamson, Root & Smith will fill in as my 5th bowlers
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Post by guildfordbat Sat Jan 16, 2021 6:55 am

Hi Carlos,

With some acknowledgement to the Essex fan you're discussing this with, I would consider replacing Jadeja with Simon Harmer. Especially if being played not just in England but at the People's Republic of Chelmsford! Smile

As for Elgar - maybe once, yes. However, I believe that ship has sailed.

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Post by Gooseberry Sat Jan 16, 2021 7:26 am

KP_fan wrote:1-Rohit
2-Warner
3-Williamson
4-Smith
5-Root
6-Kohli
7-Stokes
8-QDK
9-Jadeja
10-Cummins
11-Bumrah

Williamson, Root & Smith will fill in as my 5th bowlers


Stokes isn't very effective as a bowler in limited overs, certainly not in a team with relying on minimum 10/4 overs from absolute part timers. Most teams would want a 6th option better than Root/Williamson/Smith

QDK or Buttler at 8 is the sort of batting depth that even England would find excessive. Indeed theres an argument that far too often in white ball you end up underscoring by not having the finishers in for the death. At least one of Smith Root Williamson or Kholi has to go, and only one is an outright cheat with a modest T20 record.


The QDK Buttler argument is tough, would say that Buttler improving greatly in tests in recent times but QDK could be a cheeky answer for the openers issue.


1- QDK
2- Rohit
3- Williamson
4- Kholi
5- Root
6- Stokes
7- Sakib Al Hasan
8- Jadeja
9- Starc
10- Cummins
11 - Stuart Broad if he was picking the side or Bumrah

Babar and Warner could contest that opener spot and I do feel a touch frivolous trying to pass that off as a legitimately viable test pairing, but its only one of three formats and theres not many proper test openers who could get picked in a T20 side at all. Warner is a pretty odious individual who I don't want in my team, although purely on stats really deserves it but I dont want him punching Root in the middle of a game.

I would like to find a leg spinner but cant justify putting Rashid in due to his lack of test cricket.

Archer arguably deserves a mention but we need to wrap him in cotton wool and not risk overworking him in fantasy teams.

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Post by king_carlos Sat Jan 16, 2021 11:30 am

JDizzle wrote:I don't think you can have an all format team and not pick Bumrah. Think I'd take him above pretty much every white ball bowler in the world, maybe bar Jofra. Would certainly get him in over Rabada or Starc for this team as I reckon he is probably better in red ball too if not as proven.

Think you could argue for Buttler in as keeper too. Especially if you have him batting 7. De Kock is a better Test player and Buttler is a better ODI player - and down the order in T20s I would take Buttler, whereas it is much closer if both opening. And if we were including guys who you could lure out of retirement, I would still take ABdV to keep wicket in my team over both of those guys! And I think it is probably slightly too early in all formats for this guy, but maybe in two years time when asked it could be a no brainer that you would take Pant here.

Starc, Rabada, Bumrah and Boult was a very tight call picking 2 from 4. I really rate Bumrah but Rabada was nearly 200 Test wickets as well as a stellar one day record which tipped it for me.

I didn't consider ABdV due to his retirement from international cricket but if I had he'd probably be contending for one of the middle order spots rather than with de Kock. Were he a couple of years younger then I might have considered AB ahead of Smith for this side given he averaged over 50 in Tests along with a superior one day record. He's only played T20 since 2018 though, which is a shame.

I really think de Kock is outstanding. One of the best batsman in one day cricket, a dangerous Test batsman and a fantastic keeper. His keeping is sometimes underrated I think. I definitely wouldn't take Buttler's glove work ahead of him.

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Post by king_carlos Sat Jan 16, 2021 4:03 pm

guildfordbat wrote:Hi Carlos,

With some acknowledgement to the Essex fan you're discussing this with, I would consider replacing Jadeja with Simon Harmer. Especially if being played not just in England but at the People's Republic of Chelmsford! Smile

As for Elgar - maybe once, yes. However, I believe that ship has sailed.

Morning Guildford,

With 127, 31* and 95 in his last 3 Test innings old man Elgar might dispute you there!  Wink

I was thinking more Lords, Oval, Headingley, Old Trafford and Edgbaston to be honest but I have always liked the idea of a ODI at Chelmsford. The small boundaries would tempt some big hitting but there's usually enough in the pitches there.

Harmer is one of the most consistent first class spinners around for sure. It's shame he seems destined not to return to Test cricket. My dad, an Essex fan for his sins, made the interesting point that Harmer might make it too 1000 first class wickets if he sticks around in CC into his late thirties. It's a landmark that we wont see achieved many more times I think as the game evolves.

Anderson should make it to 1000 as he's currently on 975. Broad is on 811 currently so might do if he keeps going as long as Jimmy has. Both of them largely gave up one day cricket to get that longevity though.

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Post by Gooseberry Sat Jan 16, 2021 8:43 pm

If we are raiding the nursing homes for still active players then Dale Steyn walks into Dads Army.

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Post by KP_fan Sat Jan 16, 2021 9:11 pm

Gooseberry wrote:
KP_fan wrote:1-Rohit
2-Warner
3-Williamson
4-Smith
5-Root
6-Kohli
7-Stokes
8-QDK
9-Jadeja
10-Cummins
11-Bumrah

Williamson, Root & Smith will fill in as my 5th bowlers


Stokes isn't very effective as a bowler in limited overs, certainly not in a team with relying on minimum 10/4 overs from absolute part timers. Most teams would want a 6th option better than Root/Williamson/Smith

QDK or Buttler at 8 is the sort of batting depth that even England would find excessive. Indeed theres an argument that far too often in white ball you end up underscoring by not having the finishers in for the death. At least one of Smith Root Williamson or Kholi has to go, and only one is an outright cheat with a modest T20 record.


The QDK Buttler argument is tough, would say that Buttler improving greatly in tests in recent times but QDK could be a cheeky answer for the openers issue.


1- QDK
2- Rohit
3- Williamson
4- Kholi
5- Root
6- Stokes
7- Sakib Al Hasan
8- Jadeja
9- Starc
10- Cummins
11 - Stuart Broad if he was picking the side or Bumrah

Babar and Warner could contest that opener spot and I do feel a touch frivolous trying to pass that off as a legitimately viable test pairing, but its only one of three formats and theres not many proper test openers who could get picked in a T20 side at all. Warner is a pretty odious individual who I don't want in my team, although purely on stats really deserves it but I dont want him punching Root in the middle of a game.

I would like to find a leg spinner but cant justify putting Rashid in due to his lack of test cricket.

Archer arguably deserves a mention but we need to wrap him in cotton wool and not risk overworking him in fantasy teams.

If a decisions is made that on grounds of integrity....Smith & Warner aren't eligible...in favour of which there are plenty of arguments...then selection becomes easier.
there is one bowler/all-rounder too many in your 11...from which i would replace Shakib with Babar Azam...
Jadeja and Shakib are two of a kind....and both can bowl long spells...so you don't need both in the side

Stokes is more than Handy as a 5th bowler....in  many sides he will walk in as the 3rd seamer
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Post by guildfordbat Sat Jan 16, 2021 11:15 pm

king_carlos wrote:
guildfordbat wrote:Hi Carlos,

With some acknowledgement to the Essex fan you're discussing this with, I would consider replacing Jadeja with Simon Harmer. Especially if being played not just in England but at the People's Republic of Chelmsford! Smile

As for Elgar - maybe once, yes. However, I believe that ship has sailed.

Morning Guildford,

With 127, 31* and 95 in his last 3 Test innings old man Elgar might dispute you there!  Wink

I was thinking more Lords, Oval, Headingley, Old Trafford and Edgbaston to be honest but I have always liked the idea of a ODI at Chelmsford. The small boundaries would tempt some big hitting but there's usually enough in the pitches there.

Harmer is one of the most consistent first class spinners around for sure. It's shame he seems destined not to return to Test cricket. My dad, an Essex fan for his sins, made the interesting point that Harmer might make it too 1000 first class wickets if he sticks around in CC into his late thirties. It's a landmark that we wont see achieved many more times I think as the game evolves.

Anderson should make it to 1000 as he's currently on 975. Broad is on 811 currently so might do if he keeps going as long as Jimmy has. Both of them largely gave up one day cricket to get that longevity though.

Hi again Carlos - you make the mistake, my cyber friend, of judging Elgar on recent Test form and not when he last played for Surrey. Wink Slightly more seriously, he was off the boil in limited overs county games when I saw him live two or three years ago and that's what ruled him out of an all formats XI in my reckoning.

As you say, an interesting point made by your dad about Harmer possibly making it to 1,000 first class wickets.. He's a class act (referring to Harmer although I'm sure your dad is as well). Such a reliable bowler - you just know he's going to take wickets, the only question being how many. Economical too. Not sure what the future will hold for him or Kolpaks generally. It will certainly be incredibly tricky in future years for bowlers to take that many given the decreasing amount of county games and the use of central contracts to rest players.


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Post by king_carlos Sun Jan 17, 2021 3:23 am

guildfordbat wrote:Hi again Carlos - you make the mistake, my cyber friend, of judging Elgar on recent Test form and not when he last played for Surrey. Wink  Slightly more seriously, he was off the boil in limited overs county games when I saw him live two or three years ago and that's what ruled him out of an all formats XI in my reckoning.

As you say, an interesting point made by your dad about Harmer possibly making it to 1,000 first class wickets.. He's a class act (referring to Harmer although I'm sure your dad is as well). Such a reliable bowler - you just know he's going to take wickets, the only question being how many. Economical too. Not sure what the future will hold for him or Kolpaks generally. It will certainly be incredibly tricky in future years for bowlers to take that many given the decreasing amount of county games and the use of central contracts to rest players.
Full support from me there, a wise man trust what he sees with his own eyes. I'd still argue that I could have smacked Jeremy Snape's moon ball out the park having watched him in the very first year of T20 cricket. I'm fully aware that many quality professional batsman failed to do so and Snape played a big role in spin becoming a mainstay of the shortest form, but to my eye he was still just lobbing up freebies and I hit my first ever six that summer so form was with me. Laugh

Elgar's averages in one day cricket are strong to be fair but his strike rate sometimes lagged behind the modern game, particularly in latter years.

As far as I know Harmer is now an overseas player for Essex but not sure what that will mean for Peter Siddle with them.

Despite the Chelmsford affliction my dad is a class act I must say. I definitely lucked out in that regard. For all my jokes to him about Essex CCC I've had a great time whenever we've visited Chelmsford together.

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