1st QF Wales v Argentina - Stade de Marseille

Wales: 15. Liam Williams, 14. Louis Rees Zammit, 13. George North, 12. Nick Tompkins, 11. Josh Adams, 10. Dan Biggar, 9. Gareth Davies, 1. Gareth Thomas, 2. Ryan Elias, 3. Tomas Francis, 4. Will Rowlands, 5. Adam Beard, 6. Jac Morgan (capt), 7. Tommy Reffell, 8. Aaron Wainwright.

Replacements: 16. Dewi Lake, 17. Corey Domachowski, 18. Dillon Lewis, 19. Dafydd Jenkins, 20. Christ Tshiunza, 21. Tomos Williams, 22. Sam Costelow, 23. Rio Dyer.

Argentina: 1 Thomas Gallo, 2 Julian Montoya (c), 3 Francisco Gómez Kodela, 4 Guido Petti Pagadizabal, 5 Tomas Lavanini, 6 Juan Martin Gonzalez, 7 Marcos Kremer, 8 Facundo Isa, 9 Tomas Cubelli, 10 Santiago Carreras, 11 Mateo Carreras, 12 Santiago Chocobares, 13 Lucio Cinti, 14 Emiliano Boffelli, 15 Juan Cruz Mallia.

Replacements: 16 Agustín Creevy, 17 Joel Sclavi, 18 Eduardo Bello, 19 Matias Alemanno, 20 Rodrigo Bruni, 21 Lautaro Bazan Velez, 22 Nicolas Sanchez, 23 Matías Moroni.

Referee: Jaco Peyper TMO: Marius Jonker

Assistant referees: Karl Dickson (England) and Andrea Piardi (Italy)

I agree somewhat Risca, I'm surprised by Lake & Lewis's inclusions but apart from that it's as expected for me.

With regards to Basham, I think it was a toss up between Tshiunza & Reffell starting & that's probably fair.

Disclaimer : The ill informed speculation below is my own and can be attributed to no one else. Any bias is purely intentional and from an Irish perspective.

I expect Wales to win this one. Not comfortably, but a win none the less. The Gatland magic of making a team more than a sum of its parts has started to show fruit, and I think Wales are on a slow upward trajectory. The WRU appears to have done major harm to the game at all levels, but the international team seem to have passed rock bottom and are valiantly trying to work their way back up despite the "suits in charge".

Argentina seem uneasy under Cheika, and to be honest are underperforming. Almost a reverse Gatland situation.

Whoever wins will get walloped in the semi-final by Ireland (or God-forbid the Blackness).

Unclear wrote:Disclaimer : The ill informed speculation below is my own and can be attributed to no one else.  Any bias is purely intentional and from an Irish perspective.

I expect Wales to win this one.  Not comfortably, but a win none the less.  The Gatland magic of making a team more than a sum of its parts has started to show fruit, and I think Wales are on a slow upward trajectory.  The WRU appears to have done major harm to the game at all levels, but the international team seem to have passed rock bottom and are valiantly trying to work their way back up despite the "suits in charge".

Argentina seem uneasy under Cheika, and to be honest are underperforming.  Almost a reverse Gatland situation.

Whoever wins will get walloped in the semi-final by Ireland (or God-forbid the Blackness).

I've read a few interviews and seen a few videos with players and it seems that Gatland has simply created a nice environment for the players. Lots of them have talked about the family environment, having family there with them, doing family events, etc. Seems like players are really happy in camp. That's half the battle I think at these tournaments. Time together certainly helping too. Being through hell together in the fitness camps is bound to build cohesion too. The rest of it on the pitch is then made a bit easier I suppose. We've not played a very top team yet of course, so it could all come to nothing against Argentina (who themselves are not firing, as you say). But he's got the dressing room by the sounds of it.

And then keeping to a simple game plan (a la most Gatland teams) is easier for a team looking to turn performance around rather than learning Harlem Globetrotter stuff. I'll be honest though, everyone is talking about the return of Gatlandball but we've played some nice stuff. People talk as if it's 2012 peak Gatlandball returning, but I've seen some nice running and some nice moves, sniping from scrum half (Davies mainly), cross field kicks, breaks through the middle at times, some nice variation. Scored 4 nice tries vs Fiji that got ignored in the maelstrom of anger at the ref. Nice moves v Aus, especially the opening try on 2 minutes. Certainly not not the crash ball from 12 (Jamie Roberts) every move which was the hallmark of Gatlandball in the past. Gatlandball v2 anyone?!

I'd like to think Wales will win this one and although Argentina won't be a walkover I don't think it will be too hard for them either.

Wales are a more consistant side and so more likely to play better than Argentina who are a bit erratic.

I suppose the only thing Wales need to watch out for is that every so often Argentina pull out a really top drawer performance from no where and look like absolute world beaters.

However assuming that doesn't happen should be a comfortable Wales win. Good luck to our URC bretheren and I hope we meet you in the Semi's

I think the dual opensides thing isn't that effective any more, but remains to be seen with this back-row. You could argue we've been doing that already seeing as Waino started out as a 7. We used to always produce some good No.8's but aside from Faletau haven't done so for a while. I also think we can cope with our loss a bit better than Arg can cope with the loss of Matera.

Wales to win on form, but a bit concerned just in case Arg pull out the type of performance that can beat the All Blacks away from home.

Both line-ups and match officals are now in the top post.

neilthom7 wrote:I'd like to think Wales will win this one and although Argentina won't be a walkover I don't think it will be too hard for them either.

Wales are a more consistant side and so more likely to play better than Argentina who are a bit erratic.

I suppose the only thing Wales need to watch out for is that every so often Argentina pull out a really top drawer performance from no where and look like absolute world beaters.  

However assuming that doesn't happen should be a comfortable Wales win.  Good luck to our URC bretheren and I hope we meet you in the Semi's

This is what worries me about this match, and the fact they haven't been great so far only adds to the trepidation. Also, I have a soft spot for the Pumas so I don't like us being the side that potentially knocks them out. It was bad enough being the bad guys against Fiji.

I didn't notice until the Argus said yesterday, that Bertranou is dropped. So I don't even get the consolation of a Dragon playing a part in knocking Wales out.

Good luck today Wales.
Hopefully we play you next weekend

Wales by 18 for me.

Thought the slip had put paid to that but fantastic by Biggar.

You don't often see the refs subbed. But oh no. Dickson.

Karl Dixon taking over. Will be interesting.

Great score from Biggar

Dickson for ref!

Christ, we can't escape Dickson. What a freak incident.

Been an interesting start. Lots of Argentine possession, but they look very unstructured.

Numbers on the Welsh shirts look a bit crap.

These commentator teams just don't work.  Poor overall selections.  Plus saving some money by using fewer commentator teams and having them in studio is like something from the 1990s.   They can't convey any sense of the games at all.  Just white noise (except for the commentators whose voices are like a gassy meal).

Biggar bloody lucky there that there's no head contact.

Argentina look woeful. They're just chucking the ball about without any structure at all

Odd question but didn't an international team get fined for numbers coming off their shirts a few years ago?

Very poor quality stuff. Wales have lost their last three line-outs. Knock-ons galore from both sides.

Slap by the Welsh prop. And then the inevitable Lavivnini.

Lavanini is a liability.

He absolutely doesn't wrap. That's a yellow. And then they've never checked anything after that. poor.

That’s an awful decision

Hilarious officiating. He wrapped.

Adams is a very lucky boy that's a gutless cheap shot. He should be in the bin for that.

No wrap and very lucky not considered high

Dickson doing his best to let Wales off that one, pretty obvious yellow. Cheap shot.

Maine man wrote:Lavanini is a liability.

I mean yes but at the same time you can't let the opposition produce nasty cheap shots like that and none of the forwards get stuck into them about it. If it had been the other way round there's no chance the Welsh players just stand there and politely ask sir to review.

What happened to pyper, I missed the first 20 odd mins

A british referee for a british team.

I will never look at a kentucky breakfast wrap the same way

neilthom7 wrote:What happened to pyper, I missed the first 20 odd mins

He got aknock on the calf

Peyper did something to his calf, so it's probably his World Cup over.

10-6 HT. Wales not making enough of their dominance after the try. They need to sort the line-out out, that's causing them issues. Argentina are being classic Argentina, in that they've got an unstructured attacking game, but are making a few too many errors. They're also dropping off a few too many tackles.

The Adams non-card is a classic World Cup-only call. If it had been a bog standard autumn/summer international then it's ten minutes in the bin every day.

thebandwagonsociety wrote:A british referee for a british team.

Believe me we'd love to disown him ....

Old Man wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:What happened to pyper, I missed the first 20 odd mins

He got aknock on the calf

I have the sound off, but I thought it looked like a pulled muscle. Was there contact? Didn't watch it closely. But had a laugh when I saw Dickson would replace him.

doctor_grey wrote:

Old Man wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:What happened to pyper, I missed the first 20 odd mins

He got aknock on the calf

I have the sound off, but I thought it looked like a pulled muscle.  Was there contact?  Didn't watch it closely.  But had a laugh when I saw Dickson would replace him.    

He was behind the Argentinian ruck and got hit from behind by one of the forwards

doctor_grey wrote:

Old Man wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:What happened to pyper, I missed the first 20 odd mins

He got aknock on the calf

I have the sound off, but I thought it looked like a pulled muscle.  Was there contact?  Didn't watch it closely.  But had a laugh when I saw Dickson would replace him.    

He got bumped around in a little tangle with players a few mins before he came off. Looked like he got hit, tried to jump out the way and tweaked his calf. He said “my calf is gone” and then came off.

Have to admit I'm struggling to see how deliberately sticking the shoulder into someone isn't a yellow ...

Also can't help thinking Wales should be further ahead with all the errors Argentina are making. I think they'll still win it comfortably in the end though as they have more control and should make it count in the 2nd half.

Agree, Argentina just doesn't look cohesive and making too many errors, unless they do something spcial Wales can just remain calm and keep doing what they are doing

Surely a tackle off the ball by Agentina on r-z.

Wales also not looking great

Dislike that law about people being outside the 10 on kicks then being able to challenge. But even more so when the ref forgets that the player has to also be actively retreating and not just stood still.

Argentina have bucked their ideas up a bit and Wales have got a bit sloppy but I still think Wales will be more composed in the final stages of the match and take the win ...

Really nice snipe.

There you go - a pointless penalty by Argentina when they are in a good position ultimately leads to a try for Wales ....

Anyone know why Sanchez isn’t playing 10? He was a much much better player last week for Argentina.