Alain 'Colm Pierre' Rolland

by Guest Wed 12 Oct 2011, 10:31 pm

Wales just beat his Mums team and now hope to beat his Dads team,
WHY can't we have a ref with a Welsh Dad who is Welsh speaking? or would that be favouritism?

The French lads all speak English just like the Welsh lads.

Every game this guy refs is a dull low scoring bore fest,Wales v Samoa two teams who love to run but he just seemed clueless.

Wales are going to struggle.

by aucklandlaurie Wed 12 Oct 2011, 10:33 pm

Perhaps Walsh is Welsh?

by Huwball Wed 12 Oct 2011, 10:36 pm

I agree completely... look at the grief that was generated by Nigel!

We quite often suffer at the hands of Nigel in ospreys v turks - he's from that side of the Loughor bridge.

You would think after all the bad press about the SA v Samoa game, they would put someone completely neutral in. Perhaps this is to appeal to the Samoans to play nice next time we play them Wink

I'm sure he nearly always does us in the 6N, and the last 3 times we've lost.

Lets hope he lets a free flowing game develop Hug

by ME-109 Wed 12 Oct 2011, 10:36 pm

I really hope you arent being serious view. Its a poor excuse. How about another view. For once the French in a big game against a British team wont have a British ref babbling on in a foreign language or shouting loudly in English (cos we all know those Frenchies understand if you shout loud enough at them) about some obscure technical offense he has remembered that will clear him of any bias.

by slartibartfast Wed 12 Oct 2011, 11:26 pm

Rowland is a bit naf at scrum time, tends to be a "one penalty each" merchant, so that's one advantage Wales had gone out of the window.

On a serious note, I thought we would have had a SH ref? And Aus NZ a NH one?

by Guest Wed 12 Oct 2011, 11:28 pm

Yep his break down can be a lottery to he can be to quick or to slow.

by wales606 Wed 12 Oct 2011, 11:37 pm

I wanted Joubert Sad

, he is bound to get the final now though.

If only SA had gone through, the refs would of had to switch semis.

by slartibartfast Wed 12 Oct 2011, 11:40 pm

I bet Warbuton will be yellow carded.

by slartibartfast Wed 12 Oct 2011, 11:40 pm

hangon... i feel someone's about to post "Wales getting their exuses in early"....

by Guest Wed 12 Oct 2011, 11:46 pm

Not excuses,i still think we will beat the French but its going to be even harder with him in the middle

by ME-109 Thu 13 Oct 2011, 12:05 am

Hilarious . Blaming the ref before the game. Rolland is completely fair. Its funny that its the brit teams when playing France particularly blame him.

by Pot Hale Thu 13 Oct 2011, 12:12 am

No, it's largely a Welsh complaint that's been made many times before.

And the French are equally aggrieved in that they think Rolland will favour his Celtic cousins, so that about evens it up.

Neither side likes him. Which is a good place for a ref to be in.

by Sin é Thu 13 Oct 2011, 12:16 am

slartibartfast wrote:Rowland is a bit naf at scrum time, tends to be a "one penalty each" merchant, so that's one advantage Wales had gone out of the window.

On a serious note, I thought we would have had a SH ref? And Aus NZ a NH one?

But Rolland is a SH ref. He won 3 international caps for Ireland in that position. Probably why he understands how to ref a scrum Wink

by maestegmafia Thu 13 Oct 2011, 12:17 am

It doesnt matter who the ref is if you go out there and tackle hard, win the ball you can and with it play some rugby...

Luckily we have been doing that every game.

by Pot Hale Thu 13 Oct 2011, 12:23 am

Spot on, magnacarta. Wales keep doing what they've been doing and they'll put Bill in their locker.

by paddy Thu 13 Oct 2011, 2:43 am

I agree with the OP here ,to avoid any controversey the IRB should have picked a SH ref for this match, especially given Rolland being half French. In the Wales/Samoa match he allowed the Samoans to go off their feet, and take Welsh players out off the ball and enter rucks illegally.
And as for making excuses before the game, we don't need to, we've reached the semi final stages in the Rugby World Cup and win or lose our boys can hold their heads up high.

by Otagolad Thu 13 Oct 2011, 4:11 am

paddy wrote:I agree with the OP here ,to avoid any controversey the IRB should have picked a SH ref for this match, especially given Rolland being half French. In the Wales/Samoa match he allowed the Samoans to go off their feet, and take Welsh players out off the ball and enter rucks illegally.
And as for making excuses before the game, we don't need to, we've reached the semi final stages in the Rugby World Cup and win or lose our boys can hold their heads up high.

The only SH ref they could have chosen was Joubert as both Walsh and Lawrence could be accused of bias by the losing side in the Wales v France game on the basis that he (Walsh/BL) was making decisions to ensure the winning team that went through to play Aus/NZ was the best one for Aus/NZ to face (likely Wales Very Happy

). The same issue occurred in the QF between Aus and SA where Lawrence shouldn't have got that game as the winner would be playing his team (in all likelyhood and correct as it turned out).

That really only left Roland and Joubert as available refs and it was luck of the draw as to which one got which game.

by doctornickolas Thu 13 Oct 2011, 6:51 am

French speaker or not, he is just a poor ref.

Him and Barnes are the 2 refs I can't stand Wales getting as they always hit us hard.

Which means we are going to have to be extra careful as he will penalise us for anything he can and the French are kicking well.

We need to keep the Frenchies in their own half if we can.

by Gatts Thu 13 Oct 2011, 6:58 am

doctornickolas wrote:French speaker or not, he is just a poor ref.

Him and Barnes are the 2 refs I can't stand Wales getting as they always hit us hard.

Which means we are going to have to be extra careful as he will penalise us for anything he can and the French are kicking well.

We need to keep the Frenchies in their own half if we can.

Going to be tough.

You don't kick away possession to France of all teams, so that means using touch if we are going to use a territorial kicking game, or using a very quick defensive line under the high ball to close French down and force them to kick. French lineout is strong.
I think Jamie will carry for us and also be used as a decoy

by red_stag Thu 13 Oct 2011, 8:06 am

He isn't half French. His Dad is French. He is Irish.

Rolland is born in Ireland, has lived in Ireland his whole life, has played for Ireland national team and has always refereed as a Leinster and Irish referee.

I have no doubt there are lots of referees whose Dads are from other countries.

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 13 Oct 2011, 8:24 am

slartibartfast wrote:Rowland is a bit naf at scrum time

It's Rolland, not Rowland! If his surname was Rowland, his dad would be Welsh!

But either way, he himself would be Irish.

by Boyne Thu 13 Oct 2011, 9:12 am

His French isn't even that good. I met him in Dublin airport one day and asked him for his autograph.

I am Irish.. (but my ma's French but I actually speak it).... he was more like an English speaker who speaks good French.

Pull an English speaking reff aside and teach them specific vocab for reffing and you would have all Intl refs speaking French to his standard in 3 months.

Look at how Trappatoni's English has improved!!!! OK bad example....

But he is a good ref and not biased at all.

by Guest Thu 13 Oct 2011, 9:24 am

Lets put it this way if you like. My mam is Welsh and my dad is English. I do not consider myself English in the slightest, not even a little bit. How are we to know Rolland doesn't feel the same way, and doesn't consider himself French at all?

Simple fact is we don't.

Now he isn't my fave ref, in fact I don't like how he ref's Wales' matches at all, but I don't for one second question his allegence at all. He is Irish and is professional enough not to let where his dad is from to affect how he officiates this match.

by slartibartfast Thu 13 Oct 2011, 9:34 am

luckless_pedestrian wrote:
slartibartfast wrote:Rowland is a bit naf at scrum time

It's Rolland, not Rowland! If his surname was Rowland, his dad would be Welsh!

But either way, he himself would be Irish.

I know that. have you ever seen grange hill?

by slartibartfast Thu 13 Oct 2011, 9:36 am

DOD wrote:Hilarious . Blaming the ref before the game. Rolland is completely fair. Its funny that its the brit teams when playing France particularly blame him.

There we go

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 13 Oct 2011, 9:45 am

slartibartfast wrote:
luckless_pedestrian wrote:
slartibartfast wrote:Rowland is a bit naf at scrum time

It's Rolland, not Rowland! If his surname was Rowland, his dad would be Welsh!

But either way, he himself would be Irish.

I know that. have you ever seen grange hill?

Well Alain Rolland's in better shape than that Roland! Laugh

by ME-109 Thu 13 Oct 2011, 10:08 am

View has questioned the Refs ability to ref the game without bias. That makes it fair game. As in all cases Wales and France need to play the ref and he will make clear what he expects, if either team cant do that and adapt then they will deserve to get penalised.

The English always complain about him because they were clueless in that they repeated the penalties and didnt adapt.

As another poster said what Wales need to do is play better than France and not worry about the ref.

Roland is fair, he hasnt had a great season this year but I dont see him being the difference between winning and losing.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Thu 13 Oct 2011, 10:13 am

You dont have to be French to hate the Welsh though Wink

by Guest Thu 13 Oct 2011, 11:12 am

I agree with DOD about adapting,
if Wales want to become serious contenders they must like all top teams learn to adapt to the Refs interpretation,
if they can't do that can we deny that they didn't deserve to be in the final?

by Guest Sat 15 Oct 2011, 12:30 pm

Well done Alain you did your Dad proud today.

by red_stag Sat 15 Oct 2011, 12:31 pm

Well done Warburton

by Davie Sat 15 Oct 2011, 12:44 pm

viewtothegym wrote:Well done Alain you did your Dad proud today.

Would you like some (French) cheese to go with that whine?

by welshy824 Sat 15 Oct 2011, 1:00 pm

davie can you blame welsh fans we had the game ripped out of our hands, warbs is a key player for us, i mena england wouldnt know about key or quality players as they dont have any but imagine that they did and they lost him for a tackle which at worst warrented a red card- how would you feel?

by TycroesOsprey Sat 15 Oct 2011, 1:03 pm

welshy it was a red, we could still have won it when he gave a penalty for halfpenny to kick when it should have been a penalty against charteris.

by greybeard Sat 15 Oct 2011, 1:04 pm

welshy824 wrote:davie can you blame welsh fans we had the game ripped out of our hands, warbs is a key player for us, i mena england wouldnt know about key or quality players as they dont have any but imagine that they did and they lost him for a tackle which at worst warrented a red card- how would you feel?

So why aren't you angry at Warburton for getting himself sent off?

by red_stag Sat 15 Oct 2011, 1:04 pm

Welshy it was very very clearly a red card. Being upset is one thing. Accusing a professional of cheating is another

by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Sat 15 Oct 2011, 1:05 pm

welshy824 wrote:davie can you blame welsh fans we had the game ripped out of our hands, warbs is a key player for us, i mena england wouldnt know about key or quality players as they dont have any but imagine that they did and they lost him for a tackle which at worst warrented a red card- how would you feel?

Welsh fans have every right to feel gutted. But calling the ref biased puts you in GreyGhost territory.

by english warrior Sat 15 Oct 2011, 1:08 pm

Rolland gives the impression of being cool and in charge, when in actual fact he's a panicker, who makes hasty and ill thought out decisions, such as the one with Warburton today.

he seems to feel that the crowd come to see him and today he got all their attention in what was a clean game overall. The worst that Warburton should have faced was a Yellow, but old over-reacter himself had to ruin the contest for the players and millions watching around the world.

As someone who dislikes the Welsh attitude to England and others i was initially behind France, but veered strongly behind Wales due to the sheer unfairness of this arrogant Tanker.

Hard luck Wales you deserved to win and would have done but for Mr Rolland. Well done!

by wrfc1980 Sat 15 Oct 2011, 1:13 pm

Altough I can understad the frustration with the refs decision Welsh fans need to park some of the blame firmly at Sams door. The tackle was not good and was clearly dangerous and could have eld to a broken neck. At best he was always going to give away a penalty and yellow card, at worst a red.

by Davie Sat 15 Oct 2011, 1:17 pm

welshy824 wrote:davie can you blame welsh fans we had the game ripped out of our hands, warbs is a key player for us, i mena england wouldnt know about key or quality players as they dont have any but imagine that they did and they lost him for a tackle which at worst warrented a red card- how would you feel?

I already answered this on another thread, but for your sake I'll repeat it (even though you don't really deserve it after the cheap and unwarranted shot at England in your question)

If this had happened to an England player, of course I'd be gutted. I'd also be furious.

Difference is that I'd be furious towards the stupidity of the tackler, not towards the referee who did his job

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sat 15 Oct 2011, 2:20 pm

For those who still dont know the laws of rugby heres that IRB memo again (and that includes Pienaar who really should know better):

In 2007, the IRB Council approved a Laws Designated Members Ruling which essentially made it clear that tackles involving a player being lifted off the ground and tipped horizontally and were then either forced or dropped to the ground are illegal and constitute dangerous play.

At a subsequent IRB High Performance Referee Seminar at Lensbury referees were advised that for these types of tackles they were to start at red card as a sanction and work backwards.

Unfortunately these types of tackles are still being made and the purpose of this memorandum is to emphasize that they must be dealt with severely by referees and all those involved in the off-field disciplinary process.

Attached is a recent decision of the Judicial Officer Jannie Lubbe SC, in which the differences between the application of the red card test by referees and judicial personnel is highlighted.

In our view, this decision correctly highlights that the lifting of players in the tackle and then either forcing or dropping them to the ground is dangerous and must be dealt with severely.

To summarise, the possible scenarios when a tackler horizontally lifts a player off the ground:

The player is lifted and then forced or “speared” into the ground. A red card should be issued for this type of tackle.
The lifted player is dropped to the ground from a height with no regard to the player’s safety. A red card should be issued for this type of tackle.
For all other types of dangerous lifting tackles, it may be considered a penalty or yellow card is sufficient.

Referees and Citing Commissioners should not make their decisions based on what they consider was the intention of the offending player. Their decision should be based on an objective assessment (as per Law 10.4 (e)) of the circumstances of the tackle.

BLAME THE LAWMAKERS NOT THE REF

by welshy824 Sat 15 Oct 2011, 3:02 pm

still ruined the match, and the final now- the problem is if we lost to france without any controversy then fair enough but this completely screwed up our game plan- ruined the game and certainly the final for me, france are going to take a battering.

by Standulstermen Sat 15 Oct 2011, 3:05 pm

I dont get how this has ruined the final. France are the most unpredictable team in the world. Having been at the millenium stadium 4 years ago i think they could turn it on in a weeks time and win it. They wont be favourites but i wouldnt be surprised

by **rodders** Sat 15 Oct 2011, 3:06 pm

welshy824 wrote:still ruined the match, and the final now- the problem is if we lost to france without any controversy then fair enough but this completely screwed up our game plan- ruined the game and certainly the final for me, france are going to take a battering.

France ruined the match by not wanting to play any rugby.

Warburton screwed up the welsh game plan by lifting Clerc into the air and then dropping him, an offence which is to be punished with a straight red, regardless of intent, as directed by the IRB.

by Thomond Sat 15 Oct 2011, 3:09 pm

Wales have only themsleves to blame. Failing to take 12-15 points in a semi won't get you anywhere. It was a red card.

by Guest Sat 15 Oct 2011, 3:11 pm

welshy824 wrote:still ruined the match, and the final now- the problem is if we lost to france without any controversy then fair enough but this completely screwed up our game plan- ruined the game and certainly the final for me, france are going to take a battering.

Why has it ruined the final? For me France v either NZ or Aus is a mouthwatering prospect.

Warburton "screwed up" your game plan" not the ref.

by red_stag Sat 15 Oct 2011, 3:11 pm

I havent seen this said but anyone else unimpressed by Rollands handling of the scrum.

by Standulstermen Sat 15 Oct 2011, 3:12 pm

Very much so stag.

by Guest Sat 15 Oct 2011, 3:29 pm

Yep Wales had two clear penalties near the French 22 in the last quater of the game from two very strong scrums but they were just told to play on although the whole French back row had broke off and went into defensive position, also Faletau break near the end quick ball ruck quick ball ruck,then the French 7 runs well beyond the off side line and stops Philips from getting to the ruck and play on was just called.

France made over double tackles of Wales had less possession and territory but only conceded six penalty's to Wales eight!!

says it all really

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sat 15 Oct 2011, 3:31 pm

viewtothegym wrote:
Yep Wales had two clear penalties near the French 22 in the last quater of the game from two very strong scrums but they were just told to play on although the whole French back row had broke off and went into defensive position, also Faletau break near the end quick ball ruck quick ball ruck,then the French 7 runs well beyond the off side line and stops Philips from getting to the ruck and play on was just called.

France made over double tackles of Wales had less possession and territory but only conceded six penalty's to Wales eight!!

says it all really

Says how biased you are in forgetting that one of those penalties against france was for Chateris delibertaly handling on the ground

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