Munster v Scarlets - Sunday

by Chunky Norwich Wed 14 Dec 2011, 12:06 pm

First topic message reminder :

Keith Earls has been included in the 29 strong Munster squad named this morning for the Heineken Cup round four game at Thomond Park Stadium on Sunday (12.45).

Earls came through the squad training session in UL yesterday and if he does likewise in tomorrow's run could be a contender for a place in the match day squad with Tony McGahan adding "We've to wait and see, he's been out of action for three to four weeks, so we'll have to see how he gets on in training for the rest of the week."

Munster Squad (29): Marcus Horan, Wian du Preez, Stephen Archer, John Hayes, BJ Botha, Denis Fogarty, Damien Varley, Donncha O'Callaghan, Donnacha Ryan, Paul O'Connell, Mick O'Driscoll, Ian Nagle, Billy Holland, Denis Leamy, Niall Ronan, James Coughlan, Tommy O'Donnell, Tomas O'Leary, Conor Murray, Ian Keatley, Ronan O'Gara, Johne Murphy, Denis Hurley, Scott Deasy, Simon Zebo, Will Chambers, Lifeimi Mafi, Danny Barnes, Keith Earls.

by Red Right Thu 15 Dec 2011, 12:52 pm

DOD wrote:
BlueMuff wrote:
Chunky Norwich wrote:
Red Right wrote:they can be exposed if the Scarlett's can deliver enough quick ball.

They couldn't last week, for one reason or another......... That is key.

Munster will just do exactly what they did on Saturday. And exactly what they've been doing for the last 10 years.

Being very aggressive at the breakdown and flooding men in when there is a sniff of a turnover?

The exact same arguement was being made about leinster 4-5 years ago. It is sometjhing that is achievable......probably not in one season mind!!

by Sin é Thu 15 Dec 2011, 1:37 pm

Chucky, you'll be interested in these comments from McGahan Smile

Scarlets coach Nigel Davies last weekend attached himself to Jim Mallinder's earlier protests about Munster's dark treachery at the breakdown. Vilification as a form of flattery.

"Look at the Scarlets strongly and the way they take the defending players out as they are coming through," responds McGahan robustly.

"They have done that very successfully this campaign and they did it very successfully last weekend, by taking out your trailers or your breakdown support coming in. They take them out.

"Everyone has their own way of doing things. That's where you trust the referee and his touch judges to make sure they look at that. Having ascendancy in those areas certainly leads you to be getting that call with the referee."

As the side's dramatically improved discipline this term has demonstrated, Munster have regained their once pre-eminent knack of knowing just how to judge every referee, a crucial tactic they seemed to ignore for much of the last campaign.

"That's what you're looking for each week because every referee has a different interpretation; you look at the penalties from the scrum and penalty tries," he says.

"You look at us in contrast, in our game with the Ospreys for example, you've three penalties and a dominant scrum on the line, but when the front-row goes over it's a penalty.

"You saw last weekend there was a penalty try after repeated infringements with Alain Rolland. So, there's different interpretations of all those moments, whether it's the scrum, the line-out or the breakdown.

"You're going to come up against different interpretations of what's allowed and what isn't and you have to act accordingly and act very quickly, especially in the Heineken Cup."

Providing they don't slip up now, that experience looks like it will be a rather more lengthy one than last year.

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/heineken-cup/mcgahan-lsquoi-donrsquot-have-any-good-feelings-in-heineken-cup-weeksrsquo-2964969.html

by Chunky Norwich Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:24 pm

No George North - shafted by the disgusting WRU once again.

No Iestyn Thomas either

by munkian Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:28 pm

Chunky Norwich wrote:No George North - shafted by the disgusting WRU once again.

No Iestyn Thomas either

You sure about North ? Thought he'd recovered

by Chunky Norwich Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:28 pm

He's crocked.

The WRU have broken him.

by munkian Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:29 pm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/16170273.stm

George North has boosted the Scarlets ahead of their crucial Heineken Cup Pool One trip to Munster on Sunday.

Very Happy

by Chunky Norwich Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:31 pm

munkian wrote:http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/16170273.stm

George North has boosted the Scarlets ahead of their crucial Heineken Cup Pool One trip to Munster on Sunday.

That was 2 days ago

by munkian Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:33 pm

Hasn't he played more games for Wales than the Scarletss due to injury ?

So technically, the Turks crocked him censored

by Smirnoffpriest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:34 pm

:15 Rhys Priestland 14 Liam Williams, 13 Scott Williams 12 Jon Davies, 11 Sean Lamont, 10 Stephen Jones, 9 Gareth Davies, 1 Rhodri Jones, 2 Matthew Rees (capt), 3 Rhys Thomas, 4 Lou Reed, 5 Damian Welch 6 Rob McCusker, 7 Johnathan Edwards, 8 Ben Morgan

Replacements: 16 Ken Owens, 17 Phil John, 18 Deacon Manu, 19 Sione Timani, 20 Kieran Murphy, 21 Tavis Knoyle, 22 Gareth Maule, 23 Viliame Iongi.

From Scarlets website - No North (shafted and injured by the WRU 2 seasons in a row) so Liam is at 14 and Priestland is at FB.

Whats wrong with Iestyn? This doesn't look good.

Also worried about Edwards giving away too many penalties as he hasn't looked good this season - though I suppose with Shingler and Turnbull out there wasn't much option

by Chunky Norwich Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:36 pm

munkian wrote:Hasn't he played more games for Wales than the Scarletss due to injury ?

So technically, the Turks crocked him

All his injuries come with Wales. Who flog him to death. Wales played him against New Zealand when he was injured. what happens? 3 months out.

WRU have no spine, backbone or conscience.

They disgust me, and have now ruined the Scarlets chances to get a lethal attacking weapon on the pitch in the most important double hearder for 4 years.

by Guest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:37 pm

He's got flu I heard Priest, Rhino dragon posted it on here a couple of days ago.

Starting with Rhodri Jones, MASSIVE ask for him, with only Phil John to replace him. And i thought they'd go Rhys FB, and Stevo 10, that's our best attacking threat now that we don't have Georgie.

2 seasons in a row though getting injured playing for Wales in a pointless match and missing key Scarlets games. Gutted isn't even the word.

Georgie and Iestyn are 2 of our best best players, they are a huge loss.

I was feeling a smidgen confident before, not so much now. Big call bringing Reed straight back in as well, he's not been on form this season. I do like our backrow though.

by Smirnoffpriest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:41 pm

munkian wrote:Hasn't he played more games for Wales than the Scarletss due to injury ?

So technically, the Turks crocked him

I know ur saying that toungue in cheek but after playing for the Scarlets 4 times, he was called up to Wales, got injured in the SA game but Gats played him in every game, even the AB game so afterwards his body was in such a mess he need his shoulder reconstructed - he then made it back in time to play in the 6N's then was recovering before managing to play 3 games for the Scarlets before the end of the season and the WC Warm-up games, the WC and then has been recovering before playing coming straight into the Scarlets side to face Castres and Saints before getting injured again. He was then thrown into the needless Oz game to get injured again until we find ourselves in the current situation.

Great player management I have to say

by Smirnoffpriest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:50 pm

Ohh thanks rugbydreamer - I've seen his comment now (after you mentioning it :P) I somehow missed this thread till just now when I was going to create my own.

Agree it's good to see Rhys at FB and Jones at 10 - Rhys didn't look with it last game - which is hardly suprising after the WRU Sh-eet all over us for that game.

I didn't see Reed there - that is worrying and a big ask - our scrum which I thought did really well when allowed to function by the ref last game now looks very very week, with a Massive game needed by Rhodri Jones, and without the power of Timani behind him. And Edwards is going to need to step it up big time!

It's typical - we had a good chance to have almost won the group by beating Munster twice (before anyone jumps down my throat - I said a chance) which would have set us on an amazing roll, brought fans and publicity to PYS and given the whole of Welsh rugby a boost - instead the WRU have wrecked it for a cheap game which has knackered all the best players in Wales and potentially damaged the preperations for the 6Ns as well as severly damaged the regions European asperations!

by Guest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:54 pm

Yep exactly, the good old WRU.... Munster v Scarlets - Sunday - Page 2 3181402168

Our players need to step up and try their best to get the win regardless though. With an actual weeks training behind them, our backs should at least be a more gelled unit this time out, so fingers crossed their game flows better then last week.

I can only think we've gone for Reed because technically he's better in the scrum and that will help Rhodri. Then we can bring on the more experienced Phil John later, with the grunt of Timani behind him.

Our front 5 is week though (again!), which is a shame, coz the rest of our team is looking really good.

by Smirnoffpriest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 12:59 pm

It's is a shame - couldn't agree more at least our bench looks pretty decent - especially when you consider the injuries.

Hopefully our pack will compete well enough to give us enough go foward ball to cause them trouble (and not concede too many points at the same time) - but I get the feeling that we'll be continually penalised by Pearson at the scrum and ROG will just keep the board ticking over Sad

by Guest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 1:01 pm

That is a worry Priest. We tactically have to play this perfectly, and look more to a territorial game, which is one of the beneftis of us having Rhys as a kicking option at FB.

Both he and Stevo need to be right on their kicking game though. No missed kicks to touch anymore please!

by Smirnoffpriest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 1:14 pm

and also no missed pens/drop goals! Maybe we should sign Gethin Jenkins from the Blues for his kicking ability...

by Londonwelsh Fri 16 Dec 2011, 1:50 pm

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/16170273.stm

North is out. Massive blow for Scarlets.

by ME-109 Fri 16 Dec 2011, 1:53 pm

Munster: D Hurley; J Murphy, K Earls, L Mafi, S Zebo; R O'Gara, C Murray; W du Preez, D Varley, BJ Botha; D O'Callaghan, P O'Connell capt; D Leamy, N Ronan, J Coughlan; Replacements: D Fogarty, M Horan, S Archer, D Ryan, T O'Donnell, T O'Leary, I Keatley, D Barnes.

Earls back in as centre, gives us a stronger attacking options in the back. Looks like it will be his position for the season given the strenght in depth of the back three. Leamy for POM and DOC for D Ryan the only other change....hopefully Leamy can keep a lid on it.

by **rodders** Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:04 pm

Good to see Earls back, I wonder if it might have been a safer bet to ease him back on the wing rather than throw him straight in at center? Is Chambers injured?

Any reason why Hurley and Murphy were switched? Wasn't Murphy at 15 and Hurley on the wing a few weeks ago, or did I imagine that?

by ME-109 Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:07 pm

Yes but Hurley played FB last week. Its all interchangable in the back three these days anyhow

by **rodders** Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:10 pm

Yeah I noticed that last week, I'm just wondering why they switched. Murphy was playing very well at the back and Hurley is the faster of the two and more natural winger (I think). It seemed to work last weekend though with both involved Ronans try.

by gowales Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:10 pm

Seems to me like its Gatland pushing the players too far when they're injured. And apart from the Australia game i dont understand why people are blaming the WRU. Charteris, Roberts and now North all being pushed too the limit, I know we don't have much strength in depth but we cant force these guys to play when they're injured.

by ME-109 Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:13 pm

I think Hurley is a better defender and FB is his natural position (whatever that means).

by Comfort Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:23 pm

i find it strange Earls is back for this, and in the centre, he usually takes a few games to find any form/sharpness from what I've seen of him.

Still, its a strong team, it will be tough for Scarlets to get anything out of this game.

by ME-109 Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:35 pm

Comfort wrote:i find it strange Earls is back for this, and in the centre, he usually takes a few games to find any form/sharpness from what I've seen of him.

Still, its a strong team, it will be tough for Scarlets to get anything out of this game.

Considering the injuries we have and inexperience if he can walk on one leg he is probably better than most of what we have at the moment.

by valjester Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:37 pm

DOD wrote:I think Hurley is a better defender and FB is his natural position (whatever that means).

Hurley can actually catch the high ball sometimes, unlike murphy who had a bit of a nightmare against Castres under the high ball.

Earls back at 13 is a big call, as has been said he normally takes a game or two to get back to match fitness, but he has the ability to play well there.
And if he was close to making it last week, an extra week of full training probably has him as close to being ready as possible.

by Thomond Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:46 pm

I don't like Earls being there .Ryan has been playing well too so I don't know why he was dropped. Bit of a strange one but sure.

by Irish Curry Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:47 pm

Its good to see Earls but like alot of other people have said putting him at 13 is risky and not something I wouls have done. That said it means Zebo gets more gametime so theres two sides to the coin.

by Guest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 2:49 pm

guys, am going to merge this with the Munster v Scarlets thread if you don't mind. Makes more sense to keep everything in one place

by ME-109 Fri 16 Dec 2011, 3:46 pm

Thomond wrote:I don't like Earls being there .Ryan has been playing well too so I don't know why he was dropped. Bit of a strange one but sure.

I thought Ryan had a poor enough game against The Scarlets last week. Wasnt half as abrasive as in previous games. At the moment himself and DOC are interchangable and both do a great job

by ME-109 Fri 16 Dec 2011, 3:48 pm

rugbydreamer wrote:guys, am going to merge this with the Munster v Scarlets thread if you don't mind. Makes more sense to keep everything in one place

Its like having our own Politburo....

by Guest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 3:51 pm

DOD wrote:
rugbydreamer wrote:guys, am going to merge this with the Munster v Scarlets thread if you don't mind. Makes more sense to keep everything in one place

Its like having our own Politburo....

by Thomond Fri 16 Dec 2011, 6:57 pm

My main problem with Earls is he is not a centre but I doubt he is fully fit either.

by ME-109 Fri 16 Dec 2011, 7:50 pm

Currently thomond he is the best centre we have and I believe we have seen the last of earls on the wing for Munster for some time

by rhino-dragon Fri 16 Dec 2011, 8:24 pm

I will apologise now for being right about Iestyn. It is a bit worse than flu and he was in bed all day yesterday for his birthday. Hoping to be back for next week though. Sadly to late admittedly.

by red_stag Fri 16 Dec 2011, 8:29 pm

IMO Earls is back too soon.

However if he is playing this week I'm glad its at 13.

by ME-109 Fri 16 Dec 2011, 8:56 pm

red_stag wrote:IMO Earls is back too soon.

However if he is playing this week I'm glad its at 13.

I think we have seen the last of Chambers and we will see more of Earls in the centre for some time

by asoreleftshoulder Fri 16 Dec 2011, 9:01 pm

DOD wrote:

I think we have seen the last of Chambers and we will see more of Earls in the centre for some time

I think thats good for Munster but not for Earls,it's a pity but sometimes players have to sacrifice themselves for the team.

by Smirnoffpriest Fri 16 Dec 2011, 9:12 pm

Thats a shame about Iestyn - maybe we should buy him a cake and a lemsip to help him beat the cold!

by ME-109 Fri 16 Dec 2011, 9:20 pm

asoreleftshoulder wrote:
DOD wrote:

I think we have seen the last of Chambers and we will see more of Earls in the centre for some time

I think thats good for Munster but not for Earls,it's a pity but sometimes players have to sacrifice themselves for the team.

Depends on your point of view, he is a good centre and will probably play there for Ireland. He is a better player than the other possibilities to replace bod

by Thomond Fri 16 Dec 2011, 9:30 pm

DOD, he is a bit light for a centre and bar a few games in our 09 season he has never wowed there. Chambers contract was only 6 months wasn't it? He did decent here but he seemed to be on a different wavelength to our backs at times. That tells you how poor our backs are though.

by asoreleftshoulder Fri 16 Dec 2011, 9:31 pm

DOD wrote:
asoreleftshoulder wrote:
DOD wrote:

I think we have seen the last of Chambers and we will see more of Earls in the centre for some time

I think thats good for Munster but not for Earls,it's a pity but sometimes players have to sacrifice themselves for the team.

Depends on your point of view, he is a good centre and will probably play there for Ireland. He is a better player than the other possibilities to replace bod

When was the last time he played in the centre,a once off match for Ireland v Russia I think,O'Malley and Cave are both playing there regularly and Spence is another good candidate.Imo all 3 have more potential as centres than Earls and O'Malley should be the front runner to replace BoD at the minute since he's playing centre and playing well.Earls shouldn't get the shirt unless he performs better over the next few months.
The real reason I say it's bad for Earls is because I rate him so highly as a winger,he's a pure finisher.I don't think there is another Irish player that could have scored the try he did against Wales at the WC and if you move him to the centre you reduce the number of times he gets into positions like that.I think with a good run of games in the 11 shirt he would eclipse BoDs try scoring record (he may still beat it anyway)

by Rory_Gallagher Fri 16 Dec 2011, 9:48 pm

DOD wrote:
asoreleftshoulder wrote:
DOD wrote:

I think we have seen the last of Chambers and we will see more of Earls in the centre for some time

I think thats good for Munster but not for Earls,it's a pity but sometimes players have to sacrifice themselves for the team.

Depends on your point of view, he is a good centre and will probably play there for Ireland. He is a better player than the other possibilities to replace bod

*facepalm*

Really? I would love to know why you seem to think he is a better player than the other possibilities. Have you seen any other 13s for Ireland, who have actually been performing there this year? Earls hasn't even been playing at 13 or at all lately.

by ME-109 Fri 16 Dec 2011, 10:03 pm

Thomond wrote:DOD, he is a bit light for a centre and bar a few games in our 09 season he has never wowed there. Chambers contract was only 6 months wasn't it? He did decent here but he seemed to be on a different wavelength to our backs at times. That tells you how poor our backs are though.

For both Munster and Ireland given the quality of the backs he is too good a player to be left on the wing. The plan always has been for him to play centre, its where he played all his Ireland A games and when he switched there for Ireland over the last couple of years he has done well scoring a few tries from that position. He will play the rest of the HC campaign with Mafi and we will see from there but I imagine that is what Kidney is thinking as well.

by Crassus Sat 17 Dec 2011, 1:53 am

DOD wrote: For both Munster and Ireland given the quality of the backs he is too good a player to be left on the wing.

To be honest, I totally disagree with this sentiment. Were players like Campese, Robinson, Williams or Habana too good to be left on the wing? In Irish rugby, alot people seem to be of the opinion that the wing is for players who aren't good enough to be fullbacks or Centres, which is a ridiculous attitude. Earls' best position is on the wing imo, and I think he should be left play there instead of moving him around constantly.
from the back three of

by MMC Sat 17 Dec 2011, 11:31 pm

Coughlan has been ruled out of tomorrow's game with a dead leg. Ryan goes to 6, Leamy to 8, MOD to cover from the bench. That hurts us a bit in the pack. Our backrowers are dropping like flies...

by Artful_Dodger Sat 17 Dec 2011, 11:42 pm

How long is O'Mahony out for?

by MMC Sat 17 Dec 2011, 11:48 pm

2 weeks I think. It was a hairline fracture. Personally I'd prefer to see him given longer and to only have him return in January.

by eirebilly Sun 18 Dec 2011, 9:05 am

Am i the only one who actually feels that this will be another close fought match?

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