Abraham v Ward: Has Abraham Really Learned His Lesson?

Abraham v Ward is coming up in May and unless Abraham has learned from his last two fights, I can only invisage a UD for Ward.

Abraham is known as a perennial slow starter. In Germany, he would usually give his opponant the first 3 or 4 rounds and he figures out there style, or they gas and he then takes over. Its ok doing this at Euro level but this is sucide at World level.

He got away with it against Taylor due to his lack of stamina (although he was up on the cards, I thought the fight was closer then the score cards suggest). But at the elite level, boxers train to fight 15 rounds and have much better stamina.

He rallied late against Dirrel only to be DQ'd as he hit him whilst down through frustration. And Froch never let up from the 1 to the 12 as we expected him to.

Ward hasnt got the best chin and has been down a few times in his short career.

He needs to be on song from round one to stand any chance against Ward.

Predictions?

I like ward and reckon he will win by late stoppage. Too fast and skilled for AA. But, one punch again can change all that.

Ward to headbutt and elbow his way to a UD

Reborn-DeeMcK-Reborn wrote:Ward to headbutt and elbow his way to a UD

It will be hard to do this with Abraham's shell like defense.

As Dee has alluded to, with Abraham giving away three or four inches in height, I'd expect him to cop a load of head butts as he attempts to pressure Ward, and unless he's added some more lateral movement since the Froch bout I think the American takes an unspectacular UD here.

Going against the grain, I used to rate Abraham, and have been a wee bit perplexed at his fall from grace over the last twelve months. Down at 160 lb (and in his first taste of Super-Middleweight against Taylor) he looked the part; genuine knockout power, great chin and fit as a fiddle, consistently throwing punches right until the end. There actually seemed to be a fair amount of method in his style too, mixing up his head hunting with a strong body attack and feinting in order to create openings.

However, that sort of variation seems to have totally disappeared these days, and he's been looking clueless against the jab. I don't think he can box Ward at range, but if he can play Ward at his own game and rough him up on the inside early on then maybe he has a chance. That said, Ward does seem to get away with murder and Abraham looked a broken man after the Froch defeat.

Ward by UD, for me.

Bit harsh to suggest AA only beat Taylor because he gassed when A) he clearly wasn't gassed and B) AA was ahead on the scorecards quite comfortably (and not just on the German scorecards!)

I thought the Dirrell fight might have given AA more urgency in the Froch fight, but instead he looked just as reluctant and got picked off at range, and quite easily as well. I expect Ward to do the same, but give him no chance of stopping AA

Expect to see anything other than a destructive KO win for Abraham go down as 120-108 x3 for Ward. zzzzzzzzzzz

BALTIMORA wrote:Expect to see anything other than a destructive KO win for Abraham go down as 120-108 x3 for Ward. zzzzzzzzzzz

Its about time those German based boxers got a taste of their own medicine.

I predict that when Ward can't find a way through Abes high guard with his sweetly timed lunging headbutts he'll resort to repeatedly kicking AA in the knackers. Which won't go unpunished by the ref. In the middle of a round Ward will distract the ref, WWF style, as one of his cornermen runs up the steps and clouts AA across the head with the corner stool.

The commentators blabber about how great Ward is throughout and "didn't see" anything wrong with a few roughhouse tactics.

Why cant I see the lastest posts!

Soldier_Of _Fortune wrote:Why cant I see the lastest posts!

Surely a reply wont help you? But if you can see this your account says 'BANNED'.

Soldier_Of _Fortune wrote:Why cant I see the lastest posts!

Posting from work????

After two straight defeats, its rare for a fighter to comeback in the third. Confidence is a big issue and it saps a competitors powers, a bit like a bad run of results in football. Dirrell, Froch and Ward are all of roughly equal ability - stands to reason that Ward should be the favourite. There are no strong areas in Dirrell and Froch that Ward is partcularly lacking in, or obvious areas of weakness. Plus, Ward is full of confidence right now and has the self belief.

azania wrote:

Soldier_Of _Fortune wrote:Why cant I see the lastest posts!

Posting from work????

Yep! Why whats the problem?

Is the fighting in Germany, Ward can't fight in Wardtown again, is this Super Six a super fix?

I think it depends on how Ward appraoches the fight. There is a farily comprehensive blueprint on how to beat AA out there and the tactics employed by Froch and Dirrell are not rocket science.

If Ward can just jab and move then he should win as AA doesnt really have the footwork of speed to get in range and his shell gaurd makes it difficult to for him to get his punches off quickly. He doesnt seem to have to much variation either. I was disappointed in him against Froch for just staying with a clearly losing tactic. He made itso easy Froch. After a few rounds of zero success why not try hanging back and luring Froch in? Froch isnt hard to entice into a slugfest so if AA had decided not to just walk into his jabs and make Froch come to him more he might have had more success finding range. He also needed to accept that his high gaurd was severelly limiting his movement.

My one concern from a Ward point of view is he liks to be an inside fighter. He may well have enough size and skill to rough up and outpoint AA on the inside but its putting hmself in range of AA biggest strength - power. If you take range away from AA then as Froch and Dirrell showed - hes pretty average. But if Ward is going to spend most of his time up close and personal then there is a risk of him being caught.

manos de piedra wrote:I think it depends on how Ward appraoches the fight. There is a farily comprehensive blueprint on how to beat AA out there and the tactics employed by Froch and Dirrell are not rocket science.

If Ward can just jab and move then he should win as AA doesnt really have the footwork of speed to get in range and his shell gaurd makes it difficult to for him to get his punches off quickly. He doesnt seem to have to much variation either. I was disappointed in him against Froch for just staying with a clearly losing tactic. He made itso easy Froch. After a few rounds of zero success why not try hanging back and luring Froch in? Froch isnt hard to entice into a slugfest so if AA had decided not to just walk into his jabs and make Froch come to him more he might have had more success finding range. He also needed to accept that his high gaurd was severelly limiting his movement.

My one concern from a Ward point of view is he liks to be an inside fighter. He may well have enough size and skill to rough up and outpoint AA on the inside but its putting hmself in range of AA biggest strength - power. If you take range away from AA then as Froch and Dirrell showed - hes pretty average. But if Ward is going to spend most of his time up close and personal then there is a risk of him being caught.

Maybe AA knows that there is a blueprint on him. He may change his style and become more aggressive from the get go.

azania wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:I think it depends on how Ward appraoches the fight. There is a farily comprehensive blueprint on how to beat AA out there and the tactics employed by Froch and Dirrell are not rocket science.

If Ward can just jab and move then he should win as AA doesnt really have the footwork of speed to get in range and his shell gaurd makes it difficult to for him to get his punches off quickly. He doesnt seem to have to much variation either. I was disappointed in him against Froch for just staying with a clearly losing tactic. He made itso easy Froch. After a few rounds of zero success why not try hanging back and luring Froch in? Froch isnt hard to entice into a slugfest so if AA had decided not to just walk into his jabs and make Froch come to him more he might have had more success finding range. He also needed to accept that his high gaurd was severelly limiting his movement.

My one concern from a Ward point of view is he liks to be an inside fighter. He may well have enough size and skill to rough up and outpoint AA on the inside but its putting hmself in range of AA biggest strength - power. If you take range away from AA then as Froch and Dirrell showed - hes pretty average. But if Ward is going to spend most of his time up close and personal then there is a risk of him being caught.

Maybe AA knows that there is a blueprint on him. He may change his style and become more aggressive from the get go.

If he could he most probably would have for Froch, as the blue print was set as far back as Dirrell. I think if he was capable of adapting we would've seen something in the Froch fight.

John Bloody Wayne wrote:

azania wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:I think it depends on how Ward appraoches the fight. There is a farily comprehensive blueprint on how to beat AA out there and the tactics employed by Froch and Dirrell are not rocket science.

If Ward can just jab and move then he should win as AA doesnt really have the footwork of speed to get in range and his shell gaurd makes it difficult to for him to get his punches off quickly. He doesnt seem to have to much variation either. I was disappointed in him against Froch for just staying with a clearly losing tactic. He made itso easy Froch. After a few rounds of zero success why not try hanging back and luring Froch in? Froch isnt hard to entice into a slugfest so if AA had decided not to just walk into his jabs and make Froch come to him more he might have had more success finding range. He also needed to accept that his high gaurd was severelly limiting his movement.

My one concern from a Ward point of view is he liks to be an inside fighter. He may well have enough size and skill to rough up and outpoint AA on the inside but its putting hmself in range of AA biggest strength - power. If you take range away from AA then as Froch and Dirrell showed - hes pretty average. But if Ward is going to spend most of his time up close and personal then there is a risk of him being caught.

Maybe AA knows that there is a blueprint on him. He may change his style and become more aggressive from the get go.

If he could he most probably would have for Froch, as the blue print was set as far back as Dirrell. I think if he was capable of adapting we would've seen something in the Froch fight.

I agree. There seems to be a propensity of assuming only one boxer enters a fight with a game plan (damn I have that term - game plan - its not a game).

Is "plan of action" any better?

John Bloody Wayne wrote:Is "plan of action" any better?

That sounds like a committee meeting.

The Arthur Abraham community meeting to fix the chruch roof: "Lets all wander around with our arms over our faces until the other village gets tired and we can steal their roof!"

John Bloody Wayne wrote:The Arthur Abraham community meeting to fix the chruch roof: "Lets all wander around with our arms over our faces until the other village gets tired and we can steal their roof!"

Abrahamis a very one dimensional fighter can't see him changing his style now he's just been found out at the top level Froch absolutely destroyed him. Only see 1 winner in this fight I have been very impressed with Ward in what has been a relatively short career I fancy the yank to win the super 6 think he might just be to good for Froch who I think will see off Johnson should be a decent end to a tournament that hasn't really hit the heights due to withdrawals and the fact their is no Bute in the tournament.

prettyboy1304 wrote:Abrahamis a very one dimensional fighter can't see him changing his style now he's just been found out at the top level Froch absolutely destroyed him. Only see 1 winner in this fight I have been very impressed with Ward in what has been a relatively short career I fancy the yank to win the super 6 think he might just be to good for Froch who I think will see off Johnson should be a decent end to a tournament that hasn't really hit the heights due to withdrawals and the fact their is no Bute in the tournament.

I reckon Ward will be one of the best within 18 months...if not the best.

azania wrote:

prettyboy1304 wrote:Abrahamis a very one dimensional fighter can't see him changing his style now he's just been found out at the top level Froch absolutely destroyed him. Only see 1 winner in this fight I have been very impressed with Ward in what has been a relatively short career I fancy the yank to win the super 6 think he might just be to good for Froch who I think will see off Johnson should be a decent end to a tournament that hasn't really hit the heights due to withdrawals and the fact their is no Bute in the tournament.

I reckon Ward will be one of the best within 18 months...if not the best.

Totally agree with that very impressive think when the super six is finished a fight with Bute would be very good.

I'm more interested in seeing how Ward comes when he has a ref who won't let him headbutt his opponents into submission.

BALTIMORA wrote:I'm more interested in seeing how Ward comes when he has a ref who won't let him headbutt his opponents into submission.

Very harsh it it's not headbutting it's leaning in with your head the force of the impact comes from the opponents head movement. Very smart actually.

prettyboy1304 wrote:

BALTIMORA wrote:I'm more interested in seeing how Ward comes when he has a ref who won't let him headbutt his opponents into submission.

Very harsh it it's not headbutting it's leaning in with your head the force of the impact comes from the opponents head movement. Very smart actually.

Which I would construde as cheating. Hopefully Abes turtle shell defense will prevent this from happening.

Ward has been impressive but I do think he's been overrated to a certain degree. Beat Kessler with dirty tactics really and Green is was not relavent anyway.

Think this will be a good indicator to see how good he really is.

prettyboy1304 wrote:

BALTIMORA wrote:I'm more interested in seeing how Ward comes when he has a ref who won't let him headbutt his opponents into submission.

Very harsh it it's not headbutting it's leaning in with your head the force of the impact comes from the opponents head movement. Very smart actually.

Leaning in with your head, aka leading with your head: isn't this supposedly an illegal tactic? It's somewhat akin to sticking your foot out and hoping your opponent walks into it. I'm still of the opinion that Ward has benefited from being protected and fighting at home all the time. He's Showtime's key interest in the Super 6, or so it would seem. Regardless of how skilled he may be, until he fights away from home and stops behaving like a billy-goat, I'm not convinced.

Shutout UD for Ward, with Abraham being too frightened to throw punches with any consistency.

For some reason I cannot stand Ward, to be fair everyone has a fighter for reason they do not like and Ward is mine.

I hate the way he fights dirty and what probably fuels my dislike is when you hear him in interviews the interviewers never mention his dirty tactics and it just winds me up!

I think he's boring to watch as well and yet they want to make him star, surely not a good thing for boxing if he becomes a poster boy!

Back to the fight - I think Ward will win easily, I like Abraham and although knew he was one-dimensional, i thought he was very good at it and his power and chin would help him more than it has lately.

I paid for the Froch fight was was almost in disbelief how uncompetitive it was (much credit to Froch for this).

I would love to see nothing more than Ward sparked out but think he's a level above him and like others have the said the confidence levels in both at complete opposites.

Ward by Wide UD

Soldier_Of _Fortune wrote:

azania wrote:

Soldier_Of _Fortune wrote:Why cant I see the lastest posts!

Posting from work????

Yep! Why whats the problem?

Think it has something to do with the work's firewall, i get it all the time it's no good, especially for threads like the quiz one were answers can come thick and fast, the only way i know to get around it is if you have posted on a thread, wait till someone posts after you, then pretend to write another post and it will let you see the updated comments before you hit send, it means sometimes you will leave random comments like 'dgfvr' but works 99% of the time for me. As long as you have posted on the thread and you're not the last one to do so this method should work.

I really don't like Ward - he's a stay-at-home fighter who has a fair bit of talent but resorts to home advantage and dirty tactics when he could be really impressive.

This fight is likely to be extremely dull and a UD for Ward or maybe a cuts of injury stoppage for either fighter.

Mr Bounce wrote:I really don't like Ward - he's a stay-at-home fighter who has a fair bit of talent but resorts to home advantage and dirty tactics when he could be really impressive.

This fight is likely to be extremely dull and a UD for Ward or maybe a cuts of injury stoppage for either fighter.

I think Ward knows he needs to be a bit more exciting and his tactics might not be so dull for the AA fight. I do think he wins a wide UD or maybe even a stoppage. The super 6 finishes this year and afterwards he needs to negotiate a TV deal for himself and think he knows he needs to start giving the paying public a bit more for their money. I do agree with the hometown fighter comment though but if the super 6 goes the way most people expect with a Froch vs Ward final it would be intersting to see how he copes because it would probably be in Vegas.