Ulster squad additions

Trimble has started following Jacques Botes on Twitter if that means anything...?
#Geoffisbetterthantwitter

BelfastNI wrote:Trimble has started following Jacques Botes on Twitter if that means anything...?
#Geoffisbetterthantwitter

I would say that means a lot! Either that or he's messing with people intentionally, which knowing his personality, is quite likely!

Pete330v2 wrote:NOC hardly did well at Connacht when he wasn't even the first choice 10. He didn't do anything to suggest his game has improved and when he left I thought it was the last we'd see of that particular dead wood.

I don't understand the negative attitude towards NO'C on this forum. He's more than capable of playing at a decent level in the Pro12 especially behind a go-forward pack. He won't be asked to win games on his own (but neither will Jackson) - instead he will be required to serve as a link man between Pienaar and the centres. As long as NO'C makes his tackles, finds touch from hand and doesn't make a mess of things in general, he'll be OK.

Just ease up on the guy and give him a chance.

UlsterinKildare wrote:Just ease up on the guy and give him a chance.

Agree with that. Some of the things said about O'Connor in his previous time with Ulster were a disgrace. Not talking about this forum or any posters on here specifically, he just got an awful lot of abuse.

Fair comments UIK..... people are being harsh on NOC but my own opinion is that neither Jackson or NOC are yet good enough for a side with serious ambitions of winning silverware and being competitive in Europe... therefore I'm disappointed we didn't get anyone better and more experienced.

For me Humph is still better than both Jackson and NOC and by a distance too.

It's disappointing for us he decided to leave then. I was disappointed he decided to leave.

He played very poorly for much of the season (with his occasional flashes of brilliance becoming counter-balanced by more and more brainfarts and bad mistakes) and yet was given every chance to play himself back into form. And he didn't.

But then when he was demoted to the bench, the first sign of not being an automatic pick, he's looking for a new club and an early release from his contract? Thats certainly the way it seemed to me. I would say Humph played as poorly as Jackson did in the Final for us on any number of occasions, just so happens the Final of the Heineken Cup is a different level to the games Humph was selected for and Jacksons mistakes were punished- ruthlessly. I would even say his outing at Thomond Park wouldn't be much better than Jacksons in the Final.

All that said, I would be pleased if he had decided to say and fight for his place- and pleased if he won it back. I've always rated him when he's on form and I agree he's comfortably better than NOC. But the only reason why we're getting O'Connor back is because Humphreys decided to bail out on his contract a year early when he was given some competition for the 10 shirt. So forget Humph.

rodders wrote:Fair comments UIK..... people are being harsh on NOC but my own opinion is that neither Jackson or NOC are yet good enough for a side with serious ambitions of winning silverware and being competitive in Europe... therefore I'm disappointed we didn't get anyone better and more experienced.

For me Humph is still better than both Jackson and NOC and by a distance too.

rodders are Ulster going to be challenging for honours next season?
I know after the HC run it would be great to follow on from it but surely next season will be a year of transition with a new coach, a new 10 and a handful of new players iand the loss of players who were key to the run like Wannenburg and Terblanche is it a realistic ambition?

Ideally it would be great if everyone hit the ground running but the chances of it are slim especially when there are others out there ready to pounce and elevate themselves

It'll be tough for Ulster to punch above their weight again next season. Bowe will be a good signing but I think that Wannenburg was a better player than Wilson who is coming in. The team is very reliant on a very inexperienced flyhalf and with each passing season there are more and more fitness worries about Ferris.

I'm expecting to be challenging for trophies yes.

HEC and Rabo KO places are achieveable targets and once you are there then you reassess things.

I don't believe we have punched above our weight at all. We have one of the best starting XVs in Europe and the expectation should be there to be successful in every competition.

Stag it's something we've got to build slowly towards rather than count on at this stage. We've a new three year plan in place, thats an ambitious estimate of how long it will take us to reach our goals.

One good Cup Run doesn't mean we've 'arrived'. I think we're less likely to see a similar Cup Run this year but so long as we continue to steadily improve I'll be happy. I was interested to see that our CEO gave us 5/10 for our on-field performances last season. The people in charge know rightly that coming out on top in a number of tight games added an artificial gloss to our season. Clermont at home, Munster away or even Edinburgh in the semi where we didn't play well at all went against us, we'd look at our season differently.

I think we'll be a better team next season, but perhaps not as successful- so long as we are laying the foundations for our long-term success I'm happy.

What artificial Gloss?

I think we underachieved. We should have won our HEC group and that needs to be the first goal next season.

Up until xmas we dropped far too many points in the league. Treviso at home was a killer. Rabo play off qualification was well within our grasp, even with the HEC run.

We'll get nowhere if we talk ourselves down, the expectation should be to improve every season.

Interesting post Notchy

I think Notch has pretty much got it spot on in that at times we looked better than we were thanks to the result theres still a lot of workto be done, the ability to play against the big teams especially in attack.
Ulster can defend as well as anyone on their day as was shown against Munster and at times there was alot of luck on Ulsters side and the odd time against but when they played with a bit more openess they were exposed as they still have a fear of the bigger teams.

While there is a strong 1st XV below that there is a big drop and thats were the problem lies, an injury here, loss of form there or throw in a suspension and the season falls down around them. Next season will see more strength in depth but not by much and the young guys need game time and maybe the Pro12 needs to be sacrificed to an extent to allow them too. They may shine but there needs to be the thought that they wont but that the experience is more important than the short term gain of a better league position

I think you're being a tad harsh on Humphries there Notch, if Ulster didn't want him to go they could have refused to terminate his contract early and at least got some compensation money out of LI. Presumeably LI only came knocking once it was known Humphries was available as at the start of the summer LI were known to be targeting Geraghty and Ford, Ford turned them down and they were then forced to re-evaluate. I suspect Humphries felt annoyed at being dropped for the end of season run in, in favour of a 19 year old who if we're being honest isn't as good (understandably he's still developing).

Humphries will have plenty of competition for his shirt next season with Shingler, Homer and Geraghty all capable of playing 10 for LI.

Sam I think it was mentioned on here that there was a bit of a revolt in the playing ranks that he had become a liability defensivly and was adding to the workload there for the rest of the team and don't forget his own brother didnt want to offer him a long term deal.

While its not an ideal situation itll hopefully benefit Ulster in the long run

Not really him walking away though, more the club wanting to ditch him because he wasn't up to the defensive standard they wanted. Which is fine, clubs move players on all the time but it's not him walking out as said above. Seems a bit odd that Ulster didn't line up a replacement earlier though, I don't know much about this O'Connor chap but you guys aren't enthused by his pending arrival.

He should be alright at LI as they've just signed a massive former RL inside centre as a like for like replacement of Mapasua.

LI have offered him a 3 year deal Ulster werent going to offer him that, throw in the other players not being happy with his contributions and you get the current situation

O'Connor wont be a bad signing and Im one of the few who have no problem with his signing, Ulster are limited on who they can sign as they cant go NIQ and there arent many options when it comes to IQ 10s. It essentially came down to O'Conner, Staunton and Cusack and who was willing to be 3rd choice and not want big money for the privilage

They didn't line up a replacement because they expected Humphreys to be here next season. Now we're stuck.

We weren't going to keep him against his will though. I don't think thats our MO, similar to when we let Xavier Rush out of his contract. I think our policy on players who decide they don't want to be here anymore is to let them walk. They are no use to us now.

rodders wrote:What artificial Gloss?

I think we underachieved. We should have won our HEC group and that needs to be the first goal next season.

Up until xmas we dropped far too many points in the league. Treviso at home was a killer. Rabo play off qualification was well within our grasp, even with the HEC run.

We'll get nowhere if we talk ourselves down, the expectation should be to improve every season.

That artificial gloss. Our underachievement in the Pro12 and HEC group was covered up by a good run in the knockout stages.

In reality we know our performances in the Pro12 before Christmas weren't good enough. Our performances in our first two games against Clermont and Leicester weren't good enough either. Our last 4 games in the HEC group stages were pretty good.

Reaching our potential won't happen overnight. We fell short of it last season; we might fall short again next year. But I predict we'll be closer to our best next year regardless of how we stack up in the knockout games compared to this year.

If Ian Keatleys season long loan to Ulster goes ahead he will become the only player in history to have played for Leinster, Munster, Connacht, Ulster and Ireland! Interesting.

Are you making that up or is that a real thing?

He started at Leinster
Moved to Connacht
Moved to Munster
He played for Ireland on USA Tour
If he goes to Ulster he will have been at all of them.

No, I mean; is there a chance he could go to Ulster for a season or is that made up?

Oh you mean is he going not would he have done all that.

Basically, talks are in place. He is apparently eager to do so and Munster are eager for him to get game time but Ulster seem to prefer signing O'Connor on a permanent contract.

It could still happen but O'Connor joining is the more likely. Keats wont go if NOC does.

Interesting. I think O'Connor has been close to a done deal for a while mind you. I wonder what Pete thinks about this?

I would prefer Keatley to O'Connor if it was a longer term deal. But that would just mean we're in the exact same position next summer as we are this summer with the 10 shirt.

A two year deal for Keatley would be ideal, but can't see it. For me they should sign NOC.

Well if O'Connor is a done deal Keatley won't move. However I know that he has expressed dissatisfaction with the amount of rotation in Munster. Apaprently he needs to be playing regularly and feels that he could learn a lot at Ulster. Whos to know though. I know he was also looking at England for a while.

If Keatley did come here for a year, he could end up staying longer I suppose... what we need is back-up for a few years. O'Connor is just back-up. Keatley could offer competition to Jackson. But he needs to be available for more than one year to fit what Ulster need from their signing in that position. Two years at least.

Notch, Ulster were apparently open to a longer term deal but Munster will only let him go for next season. Word is that O'Gara won't be needed for Autumn and 6 Nations and Jackson (or Wallace) will be on standby with Madigan and Sexton.

Oof. That changes things a bit. If Jackson gets involved with Ireland we're in difficulties.

Then again, if he does, it means he'll have done well. But if Jackson is away in Irish training camps we need a better calibre of back-up.

Notch my understand is that it will be either Wallace or Jackson but not both.

Well thats fine. I suppose as Wallace gets older he might move closer to the scrum for Ulster. I still see him very much as an inside centre. If we're short at 10 though he might need to cover for us there.

Oh, and no way should Paddy Wallace still be being talked about as cover for Ireland at 10! 12 yes, he could still very much do a job at 12 if needed at test level but not 10.

On another note Notch how do you seen Nevin Spence fitting in with the team next season. He seemed to be the latest in the jack of all trades master of none mould covering winger and both centre spots

Hopefully he'll get a good run at 13 in the pre-season friendlies since Cave is touring with Ireland. So Cave will start his pre-season later and Spence may get a chance to stake a claim. I would like to see him covering that position and wing.

We do him no favours shoving him into the 12 jersey. Of course, the exciting thing is we have a new coach and which players will flourish and which players will falter under his regime remains to be seen. Barring the likes of Best, Afoa, Muller, Pienaar, Bowe etc. alot of the places in the team are up for grabs.

Your a bit light at 12 since Whitten left though. I agree with you but I think Spence will spend a lot of time there.

Luke Marshall; your time has come. Also expect Paddy Wallace to spend less time with Ireland.

Notch wrote:Expect Paddy Wallace to spend less time with Ireland.

<whispers> bloody hope so <whispers>

We'll see. Kidney mentioned him and D'Arcy as having a big role to play in the next year or two when he left them both out of the 22, but then he does this thing when he makes a selection where he mentions all the players in that position.

He managed to mention every single loosehead when Tom Court was ruled out. "Dave Kilcoyne, Paddy McAllister, Jack McGrath. Aren't we so lucky now we've such great options? And I'm not going to pick feicing any of them"

In regards to 10 wasnt the original sticking point for NOC that Ulster were only willing to offer him a one year deal? Maybe something in place for a years time?

Latest rumours from twitter, via Richard Mulligan (Sports Editor for the News Letter)

Nick Williams had a medical with Ulster. He failed said medical.

Of course, he goes on to say he's no "solid source"

I was playing golf again this week and again good talking to a friend of mine, a man 'in the know' so to speak. I'm not Geoff, I don't have inside info as much as he does as I don't get playing god every week. Anyway, Ian Keatley to Ulster is a non-starter as far as he knows. According to him under the terms Munster were talking about it isn't even being considered. A shame in my eyes. A good move for Ulster, for Keatley and JJ Hanrahan perhaps as well. It isn't going to happen as things stand. However the fact that a deal isn't done with Niall O'Connor who is desperate to come back by all accounts tells you that Ulster have other targets before they are going to settle on him.

Seems like Munster came to Ulster with a really good deal for Munster.

To be honest I don't think humph or Logan are anyone's mug although I will revise that if nick Williams ever signs.

I like Niall O'Connor, he seems like a perfectly pleasant and well rounded young bloke. My utter deflation about his (possible) return to Ulster is simply because I thought we were going to get someone an awful lot better. When you look at our starting XV alone for next season it oozes class and in some cases pure genius from 1 through to 15 apart from the 10 spot. Now Munster have Keatley, JJ and O'Gara, Leinster have Sexton and Madigan, we have a 19 year old who whilst he has 'potential' still remains a prospect and nothing else. I thoroughly expected us to be offered the NIQ 10 spot and was expecting to see a big name or at least an exciting one so when we weren't allowed a NIQ 10 and NOC's name came up I realised I was living in a fantasy. That is why I am moaning about Mr O'Connor's return and being a bit of a spoilt brat about it. I guess we can't expect big signings all the time but if we are to challenge at least for silverware next season we shouldn't have our eggs all in Jackson's basket. He has the potential to deliver and I think he will but should he be injured or get Ireland's call we're sunk.

I will still live in hope until Dr Dave comes back from holidays with Dan Carter

After reading a few conflicting opinions on Ian Humphries on here, I've come to a new theory. The team werent happy with iHumphs defense etc... iHumph felt he wasnt gaining much favour. At the same time Ulster had a contract and couldn't change that. He maybe also didnt want to make things difficult for big bro.

Is it possible that in iHumphs own head he felt what he was doing was falling on his own sword and doing those around him a favour? I think to say he wanted out is a bit harsh. i think he felt he would save others the awkwardness of letting him go and a year after it was obvious they wanted to let him go...

Likely?

Scotty, Shane Logan said the other week at the URSC AGM that the IRFU will not let us sign an NIQ 10. Seems like there is no NIQ 10 spot, at least not for us, despite their much vaunted new rules. The whole process on who can and can't be signed is as clear as mud. But, according to our CEO, we were always going to have to have Irish qualified 10s.

Notch wrote:Seems like Munster came to Ulster with a really good deal for Munster.

I can't believe you fell for another of Stag's "stories"

Notch wrote:Scotty, Shane Logan said the other week at the URSC AGM that the IRFU will not let us sign an NIQ 10. Seems like there is no NIQ 10 spot, at least not for us, despite their much vaunted new rules. The whole process on who can and can't be signed is as clear as mud. But, according to our CEO, we were always going to have to have Irish qualified 10s.

Clear as mud indeed Notch and as fair as a kangaroo court. Paddy Jackson will have Pienaar and Wallace to mentor him but a quality 10 would have brought his game on even more and taken a lot of pressure off him. I hope he can shrug off said pressure and show us all he's the real deal and get the feeling he just might. It's just the risk that I fear but maybe that's just me setting my hopes too high for Ulster's next season after seeing them reach the final of the HC. We can only wait and see I guess, it's going to be an exciting season that's for sure.

Pete330v2 wrote:

Notch wrote:Scotty, Shane Logan said the other week at the URSC AGM that the IRFU will not let us sign an NIQ 10. Seems like there is no NIQ 10 spot, at least not for us, despite their much vaunted new rules. The whole process on who can and can't be signed is as clear as mud. But, according to our CEO, we were always going to have to have Irish qualified 10s.

Clear as mud indeed Notch and as fair as a kangaroo court. Paddy Jackson will have Pienaar and Wallace to mentor him but a quality 10 would have brought his game on even more and taken a lot of pressure off him. I hope he can shrug off said pressure and show us all he's the real deal and get the feeling he just might. It's just the risk that I fear but maybe that's just me setting my hopes too high for Ulster's next season after seeing them reach the final of the HC. We can only wait and see I guess, it's going to be an exciting season that's for sure.

That is something we have all tended to do. I think we overachieved this year in the HC and our final league placing was just about right. Next season I would like a top four league position with hopefully a home semi-final. I'll wait until after tomorrows draw before deciding what we can expect in the HC.

I guess its not so much that we cant have an NIQ 10, its more that we can only have 1 NIQ halfback. Would that not be right? If we didnt have Pienaar, i suspect we might be allowed an NIQ 10.

If Pienaar is definatly leaving after his contract is up, then we will potentially be able to get an NIQ 9 or 10. But we WILL need an quality IQ option at either 9 or 10.

Will Jackson be a solid quality performer by then? Who knows. Will our academy options at 9 be ready to take over? Will Porter come back (and be good enough)?

I personally think that for the success of ulster's progression plan, it is VITAL that Paddy Jackson proves himself as a top level performer this year.

If we sign an IQ outhalf, we will want a short term contract because we will want to keep our options open if/when Pienaar leaves, and I think we know we may get the chance to and need to use our NIQ spot for a 10 when that time comes.

As for expectations, I just want to see HEC QFs and Rabo SFs. That will be plenty to keep me happy.