Australia vs Argentina: Teams announcement and more.

Australia coach Robbie Deans named the following team on Tuesday to play Argentina in the Rugby Championship at Skilled Park on the Gold Coast on Saturday.
Australia:
15-Berrick Barnes, 14-Dominic Shipperley, 13-Adam Ashley-Cooper, 12-Pat McCabe, 11-Digby Ioane, 10-Quade Cooper, 9-Nick Phipps, 8-Radike Samo, 7-Michael Hooper, 6-Dave Dennis, 5-Nathan Sharpe (captain), 4-Kane Douglas, 3-Ben Alexander, 2-Tatafu Polota Nau, 1-Benn Robinson
Replacements: 16-Stephen Moore/Saia Fainga'a, 17-James Slipper, 18-Scott Higginbotham, 19-Liam Gill, 20-Brett Sheehan, 21-Anthony Fainga'a, 22-Kurtley Beale.

Pumas coach announced the following team:
Pumas:
Rodrigo Roncero, Eusebio Guiñazú, Juan Figallo; Manuel Carizza, Patricio Albacete; Julio Farías Cabello, Juan Manuel Leguizamón, Juan Martín Fernández Lobbe; Martín Landajo, Juan Martín Hernández; Horacio Agulla, Santiago Fernández, Marcelo Bosch, Gonzalo Camacho; Lucas González Amorosino.
Replacements: Agustín Creevy, Juan Pablo Orlandi, Tomás Leonardi, Leonardo Senatore, Nicolás Vergallo, Martín Rodríguez Gurruchaga y Juan Imhoff.

The most prominent change in the Pumas is Nicolás Vergallo by Martin Landajo.
Martin Landajo is an amateur player who play in Argentina (Club Atletico San Isidro) .
What is the reason for this change?
Nicolas Vergallo output slows the ball, so in this way he "freeze" the game and allows Pumas to build better defense and take a breath, however Martin Landajo has an output more dynamic and this reflects the intent of the Pumas play more offensive. It will be a game more open and dynamic.
I think deserve to watch the game.

Thought Higginbotham might be starting given his excellent performance off the bench against SA.

Hoping Hooper can build upon his brilliant outting last week.

Anyone know anything about this Douglas guy in th second row? Don't think I've seen him play....

Barnes at fullback. Interesting to say the least.

Since Barnes is hell bent on kicking anything that comes his way at least the damage will be minimal at 15.

True, do you think that means a conservative kick-style territory game plan?

I reckon unless Cooper has a blinder this could be a boilover.

Deans is clearly expecting a kicking duel with Barnes at fullback, however in saying that he's most probably going to need a wig by the end of the year the way Beale is playing

I'd say it's more a case that we need a goal kicker on the field somewhere and since he can't be trusted in the frontline not to butcher our attacking moves with useless, inopportune left-foot grubbers, stick him out the back where he's supposed to kick.

Full Credit wrote:I'd say it's more a case that we need a goal kicker on the field somewhere and since he can't be trusted in the frontline not to butcher our attacking moves with useless, inopportune left-foot grubbers, stick him out the back where he's supposed to kick.

Fair enough. And he's OK under the high ball too.

The Wallabies really need JOC back at 12.

bluestonevedder wrote:Thought Higginbotham might be starting giving his excellent performance off the bench against SA.

Hoping Hooper can build upon his brilliant outting last week.

Anyone know anything about this Douglas guy in th second row? DOn;t think I've seen him play....

Douglas plays at the Waratahs Bluestone. He’s a pretty big unit at 202/122 and I thought he started to learn how to use it better this year although he is far from a dominant force. He’s played 3 years s15 - the first being good, the second rubbish, and the third his best. Compared to Timani, he will carry less, but is an option in the lineout. I’m happy they went for him as the replacement.

Useless trivia contribution – his little, older brother plays in the NRL and was 18th man for 2010 NSW SOO.

Looking at that lineup and with the massive injuries Aus have had, I reckon Argentina sneak this by 2 points and end Deans' job

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

Full Credit wrote:I'd say it's more a case that we need a goal kicker on the field somewhere and since he can't be trusted in the frontline not to butcher our attacking moves with useless, inopportune left-foot grubbers, stick him out the back where he's supposed to kick.

Fair enough. And he's OK under the high ball too.

The Wallabies really need JOC back at 12.

+1 Hell, they should bring Giteau back at 12

Beale really needs to go away and get his head right, I'm surprised he's still even in the 22. He's packed on a few, lost pace and worst, lost confidence. I'm surprised the boks didn't try to pressure him with more up and unders since everytime he tries to take a bomb in traffic lately he coughs it up.

I reckon Aus will sneak this.
When their backs are against the wall and people are doubting them that's when they come right back as we saw last week.

boomeranga wrote:

bluestonevedder wrote:Thought Higginbotham might be starting giving his excellent performance off the bench against SA.

Hoping Hooper can build upon his brilliant outting last week.

Anyone know anything about this Douglas guy in th second row? DOn;t think I've seen him play....

Douglas plays at the Waratahs Bluestone. He’s a pretty big unit at 202/122 and I thought he started to learn how to use it better this year although he is far from a dominant force. He’s played 3 years s15 - the first being good, the second rubbish, and the third his best. Compared to Timani, he will carry less, but is an option in the lineout. I’m happy they went for him as the replacement.

Useless trivia contribution – his little, older brother plays in the NRL and was 18th man for 2010 NSW SOO.

Thanks Boomeranga, appreciate the info. He's a heck of a unit mind!

Ah Barnes and Dennis are still in there!

Can't believe those two are still getting picked. Cooper is actually a pretty good kicker and to be honest if Oz are looking to get in to a kicking duel with Argentina then they can say goodbye to the last of their fans.

Deans is slowly destroying this Oz team.

ChequeredJersey wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

Full Credit wrote:I'd say it's more a case that we need a goal kicker on the field somewhere and since he can't be trusted in the frontline not to butcher our attacking moves with useless, inopportune left-foot grubbers, stick him out the back where he's supposed to kick.

Fair enough. And he's OK under the high ball too.

The Wallabies really need JOC back at 12.

+1 Hell, they should bring Giteau back at 12

Agree with that and they need whathisname the scrum half that left as well.

Some credit has to go to barnes with 6 from 6 goals where M Steyn missed two droppies and at least one penalty, effectively the difference in the end. Couple of those were kicked ignoring the obvious cramp.

Oz wouldn't generally have that % normally. Against argie goalkicking will be crucial given a largely defensive match looms.

Oz have got some of their swagger back and cooper is gaining confidence. If beale and ioane join him who knows what can happen.

So, Barnes is their best player then? I've been saying this since before the summer when people were busy talking about Beale and Cooper. Both have been average to say the least. Barnes is consistent and a very intelligent player, possibly a bit underrated in the SH.

Morgannwg wrote:So, Barnes is their best player then? I've been saying this since before the summer when people were busy talking about Beale and Cooper. Both have been average to say the least. Barnes is consistent and a very intelligent player, possibly a bit underrated in the SH.

Did anybody actually say Barnes is their best player?

Since the summer up to now, him and Genia have been their best/most consistent players.

i think Argentina have a real chance to play 10 man and beat the Aussies here. We know how superb their pack can be and with no Pocock they should gain parity at least. If Hernandez kicks well and they don't let Aussie backs into the game - no Genia either- this could be an upset

Arg by 5

He kicked the goals. Oz have lost several close matches when someone couldn't do that. Its just part of the equation as oz havnt had a consistent goal kicker...since...Eales?

I think Barnes is a consistently slightly above average player. Injuries to Cooper and JOC have meant Barnes has started a lot. In a past the erratic Giteau and now erratic Beale have given Barnes more opportunies.
Barnes is not the best at any of the positions for Aus but he doesn't let the team down too much as a versatile sub.

I reckon Cooper is going to come right soon. With ACC back in the right place at 13 the team is better. Cooper is also an adequate goal kicker if Barnes is off.

Looks a pretty smart team selection to me given the form of the various options and the players available, and the thoroughly predictable style of play from the opposition. Moving Beale was essential given his form and confidence, and Barnes is a good footballer.

If I have a criticism it is that I'm not really sure what Dennis does on the rugby field, and I rate Higginbotham, but obviously Deans likes him as an impact player, and presumably wants him to fulfil that role again.

Still struggling to understand the widespread condemnation of Deans. I still think he's a good coach and has done a pretty good job with Australia. The only team that has been better than Australia in the last few years is New Zealand, and they are going through a particularly purple patch. Not sure MacKenzie would have done better.

Guess you're right, funnyExile, I too have been guilty of whinging bout Deans, but really he's had some tough breaks. A big section of his backs have been crooked at various times, sometimes all the same time! No real forwards coming thru, I think he's done as good as he can juggling the players round to fill a side for matches.

Saying that I think he may have tried to make the side play a bit too conservatively. At the mo I think he is doing as good as anyone else with the players he's got available.

funnyExiledScot wrote:
Still struggling to understand the widespread condemnation of Deans.

Simple really. since 2008 his record is coached 63 won 37, lost 25 at 58.7% and includes losses to all four home unions (Scotland twice), Samoa and a 14 from 17 loss record against NZ.

That is on par with Eddie Jones as the worst for ages with the rest being in the 60's and 70's.

If he were to leave now he wouldnt be leaving the team in a better position than he got it- for me the mark of a good coach.

I'll look forward to watching how Oz deal with the aggressive nature of the Argie defence, SA and ABs have struggled to make headway up the field. Reckon it may depend on who gets early points and momentum. If Argie get a roll on, I'd back them to defend a lead with their lives. But Oz will have gained much confidence from last week's game and you could see what the win meant.

Think Barnes' inclusion is not such a bad call, he won't be doing any running out of his 22 into brick walls, safety first in the danger zone. Argie in a rare excursion in the ABs 22 showed they could retain possession and rumble it up and dot down.

Looking forward to this match, I think it is going to be interesting.

Argies will target this match, but somehow I expect the Aussies to pull another one through.

I just have a sneaky suspicion the Argentinians won't be able to pull off 80 minutes.

I hope it is a good one, as I ain't going to watch my team slog around for another 80 minutes.

Taylorman wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:
Still struggling to understand the widespread condemnation of Deans.

Simple really. since 2008 his record is coached 63 won 37, lost 25 at 58.7% and includes losses to all four home unions (Scotland twice), Samoa and a 14 from 17 loss record against NZ.

That is on par with Eddie Jones as the worst for ages with the rest being in the 60's and 70's.

If he were to leave now he wouldnt be leaving the team in a better position than he got it- for me the mark of a good coach.

Were Australia winning the Tri-Nations when he took over? What about all the young players he's brought through?

I'm not defending his every decision, but over the piste I think he's done a good job of developing the team, bringing through young players (not always an easy transition) and maximising resources. I do not think he can be entirely held accountable for the Australian rugby system, and it's failure to produce top class players (forwards in particular). No coach can transform that in 4 years. And yet....the Aussie scrum actually holds its own these days, without a single world class prop or lock.

As I said, I don't endorse all his decisions, and I thought the Wallaby tactics against NZ in the second fixture this year were wrong, but then again half his preferred backline were injured or chronically off form. International coaches can only work with what they are given. He's brought through some very talented players and had some success. They are the number 2 ranked team in the world and reigning tri-nations champions. Yes, NZ are better, but Henry and now Hanson had far more to work with than Deans. NZ has much better systems in place for developing players and bringing through talent. A good question is whether there are teams with better playing resources that are less successful that Australia? In my view England, France and South Africa fall into that category.

What is Deans smoking? Why doesn't he just leave Barnes at 12 and AAC at 13? In my opinion, it has been the Wallabies' best centre pairing since Giteau and Mortlock were in form and playing well. It's especially stupid given that McCabe has played a lot more rugby at fullback than Barnes. I really don't see the argument for including Fa'ainga on the bench instead of Harris, either.

If Deans expects Argentina to kick the ball away a lot and plays into their game plan, the Wallabies could end up in serious trouble. I would have expected to see Argentina beat Australia at least once but the Wallabies looked much stronger last weekend. Should be an interesting game.

I think Australia will win but I don't think it'll be particularly comfortable or that Deans will be able to take much from it. Just another clunky low skill level game from them.

What ever happened to the Australia that could beat NZ and put 50 on France in 30 mins?

Well to be fair that team is injured or out of form.

Let's recap: Beale out to get back into some form and fitness, JOC, Mitchell, Genia, Palu, Horwill, Pocock, Kepu all out injured. Cooper has yet to regain full form and with Genia out, that won't happen soon.

Find me any team in world rugby that can live with that loss of key players and maintain anything near a similar performance to their peak. Maybe the ABs and even then it wouldn't be pretty.

aussies gonna lose!!! it will be tight but i reckon the argie forwards might just blow them away

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Well to be fair that team is injured or out of form.

Let's recap: Beale out to get back into some form and fitness, JOC, Mitchell, Genia, Palu, Horwill, Pocock,

Kepu all out injured. Cooper has yet to regain full form and with Genia out, that won't happen soon.

Find me any team in world rugby that can live with that loss of key players and maintain anything near a similar performance to their peak. Maybe the ABs and even then it wouldn't be pretty.

Add in retirements to Mortlock and Giteau

I boosted this from another website but here's the current injured Wallaby 15.

1. Kepu
2. Moore
3. Palmer
4. Timani
5. Horwill
6. Elsom
7. Pocock
8. Palu
9. Genia
10. Lealiifano
11. Tomane
12. Horne
13. O’Connor
14. Vuna
15. Mitchell

Subs: Turner, Ma’afu, Mcalman, Hodgson

It's been a pretty horrendous run of luck that's for sure. For a side that struggles for depth at the best of times I'm surprised the guys are putting in as good a effort as they have. Anyway gents, I'm off to tonight's game. It's beautiful weather here on the coast today, none of that Wellington rubbish.

If Wales had an injury list like that we'd literally be f#$%ed

So there is depth in Australia. The A's did well last week though but we need to really dominate proceedings tonight.

Enjoy yourself FC. Let's hope we have smiles later on.

(Sydney Uni just won the Shute Shield 15-14. Southern were leading well into the 2nd half but persistence paid off when Uni clawed their way back after being down 14-3)

Thanks mate. I wasn't planning on going but heard there were a few seats still available and couldn't pass up the wobblies first ever game on the coast.

I'd be more concerned if the weather was wet and miserable but hope the good conditions play into our hands a bit more.

Full Credit wrote:I boosted this from another website but here's the current injured Wallaby 15.

1. Kepu
2. Moore
3. Palmer
4. Timani
5. Horwill
6. Elsom
7. Pocock
8. Palu
9. Genia
10. Lealiifano
11. Tomane
12. Horne
13. O’Connor
14. Vuna
15. Mitchell

Subs: Turner, Ma’afu, Mcalman, Hodgson

It's been a pretty horrendous run of luck that's for sure. For a side that struggles for depth at the best of times I'm surprised the guys are putting in as good a effort as they have. Anyway gents, I'm off to tonight's game. It's beautiful weather here on the coast today, none of that Wellington rubbish.

Fortunately not all those are first choice starters, but it looks similar to our situation, the reality is the All Blacks have no challenge in this year's rugby championship.

Looking at the injury lists of SA and OZ, it must be the most lopsided ever in the history of this tournament.

Biltong wrote:

Full Credit wrote:I boosted this from another website but here's the current injured Wallaby 15.

1. Kepu
2. Moore
3. Palmer
4. Timani
5. Horwill
6. Elsom
7. Pocock
8. Palu
9. Genia
10. Lealiifano
11. Tomane
12. Horne
13. O’Connor
14. Vuna
15. Mitchell

Subs: Turner, Ma’afu, Mcalman, Hodgson

It's been a pretty horrendous run of luck that's for sure. For a side that struggles for depth at the best of times I'm surprised the guys are putting in as good a effort as they have. Anyway gents, I'm off to tonight's game. It's beautiful weather here on the coast today, none of that Wellington rubbish.

Fortunately not all those are first choice starters, but it looks similar to our situation, the reality is the All Blacks have no challenge in this year's rugby championship.

Looking at the injury lists of SA and OZ, it must be the most lopsided ever in the history of this tournament.

Especially, because it is the first edition of this tournament

Argie

Keep plugging away mate, your going to be a visitor to the tri nations for a long time yet.

Problem for Argentina is that their strength is their disruption play and pack power, the Aus team is depleted but their breakdown work is going ok.

Tight game but I'll go Aus by 5... hope I'm wrong!

Just hope see good rugby. Good luck both teams

Good luck too Argie. Let's hope it's a good match.

Argie

I just want to point out I'm not one for the game having to be free flowing constantly, I'm enjoying the Argy games, they are very disruptive at the breakdown, offer a lot of brute force and Bosch I think is a cracking player, in every game he looks to give his outside shoulder away, yet every player who tries to take it ends up floored or in touch, very confident player, I wish he could get some creative man beside him to put him into better situations.

Pause? o.O I thought that mess of a word was gone?

I thought that C,T,P.... E was gone. We've bee playing Crouch, Touch, Set.

Argy have to capitolise now on this!!!

Why they kicked to goal I'm not sure, I wouldve gone for the lineout in the 22 and run a wide set play.

Coleman wrote:Pause? o.O I thought that mess of a word was gone?

I thought that C,T,P.... E was gone. We've bee playing Crouch, Touch, Set.

Only where the new season has started. The 4Ns is played under the old laws.

If Argies score next this'll be a tough day for Aus, Argies seem to thrive on protecting a lead, they struggle to chase.